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Fly Away
1744 28 2017-8-16
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Dijkx
lvl.1
Flight distance : 56086 ft
Netherlands
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After a lot of flights without any problems, I nearly lost my Spark today. After doing a circle around a lighthouse in circle mode. The Spark shot away over the water and I had no control over it. I had a compass error and after a few minutes I gained control over my Spark and flew it back in Sports mode. I landed just before the battery died.



No compass errors or GPS errors when I started. Only after the circle mode was finished it flew away I used a RC.

2017-8-16
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hallmark007
Captain
Flight distance : 9812789 ft
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Ireland
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Flying around steel structures and rebar concrete, you are always risking the chance of magnetic interference, and there is a good chance this happened to you.
2017-8-16
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Lian82
Second Officer
Flight distance : 796775 ft
Italy
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mmhh i see a strange antennas on the tower...


no fly near at  Wind power plants, generate current and not too little.

I would never fly in those circumstances.
2017-8-16
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Dijkx
lvl.1
Flight distance : 56086 ft
Netherlands
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http://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer/PG2ZL9ALKSVPKZUB5OJ3/
2017-8-16
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Lian82
Second Officer
Flight distance : 796775 ft
Italy
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your drone is in your house now?

don't fly in this area in future,or i read here "lost my drone" from Dijkx
2017-8-16
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Charles Adams
First Officer
Flight distance : 3821312 ft
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This does appear to be environment related, and a good lesson for all.  This is not an environment I would choose to fly, as I fear that I might lose control of the drone.
2017-8-16
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hallmark007
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Although you may think your compass was not effected on the ground, this isn't always the case, you can easily pick up magnetic interference taking off from concrete reinforced with steel, and looking at where you took off from there is a good chance this is what happened, causing interference in your compass , as you can see from mag yaw and Imu heading problems, which forces your AC into Atti mode. Lucky you recovered and all is well.
Take a look a video below very similar situation.



2017-8-16
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Dijkx
lvl.1
Flight distance : 56086 ft
Netherlands
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I can imagine that there is magnetic interference but the drone should not fly away at a compass error. Only the compass readings where wrong at the time of the fly away, the GPS was stil fine the aircraft saw 19 satellites. Instead of flying away at a compass error it should stay where it is.  You can pick up magnetic interference everywhere, it is very dangerous when the aircraft flies away with 50 km/h. At the time of the fly away there I had no control with the remote anymore, it even did not record the right flight path in my logging.
2017-8-16
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Charles Adams
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Dijkx Posted at 2017-8-16 12:34
I can imagine that there is magnetic interference but the drone should not fly away at a compass error. Only the compass readings where wrong at the time of the fly away, the GPS was stil fine the aircraft saw 19 satellites. Instead of flying away at a compass error it should stay where it is.  You can pick up magnetic interference everywhere, it is very dangerous when the aircraft flies away with 50 km/h. At the time of the fly away there I had no control with the remote anymore, it even did not record the right flight path in my logging.

I'm definitely agreeing with you:  this is not expected behavior.  It just seems that with a lot of the fly aways there's been reports (or logs) of compass issues.  There's also been a couple of "drops".  This makes me wonder if the software isn't dealing with compass problems gracefully.
2017-8-16
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Dijkx
lvl.1
Flight distance : 56086 ft
Netherlands
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I opened a ticket at DJI and send them my flight logs. I hope they can explain why my drone flew away. And hopefully they can  improve the software.
2017-8-16
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LouisP
Captain
Flight distance : 41952 ft
United States
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Charles Adams Posted at 2017-8-16 12:51
I'm definitely agreeing with you:  this is not expected behavior.  It just seems that with a lot of the fly aways there's been reports (or logs) of compass issues.  There's also been a couple of "drops".  This makes me wonder if the software isn't dealing with compass problems gracefully.

I agree... compass errors and GPS errors should not cause the drone to do drastic things like fly away. I hope a future firmware update makes it behave a little better when it runs into these troubles.
2017-8-16
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fansd8e80c3c
lvl.1
Flight distance : 95502 ft
Brazil
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In order to rth the a.c. needs both, GPS and compass, without compass it don't know where it's heading, I already suggested dji to change behavior to have opti mode in the between
2017-8-16
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hallmark007
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Dijkx Posted at 2017-8-16 12:34
I can imagine that there is magnetic interference but the drone should not fly away at a compass error. Only the compass readings where wrong at the time of the fly away, the GPS was stil fine the aircraft saw 19 satellites. Instead of flying away at a compass error it should stay where it is.  You can pick up magnetic interference everywhere, it is very dangerous when the aircraft flies away with 50 km/h. At the time of the fly away there I had no control with the remote anymore, it even did not record the right flight path in my logging.

You first need to know how these AC works it's amazing that those who have problems with AC, first stop is to blame dji,

Why would a compass error disable GPS?
Orientation (compass data) and position (GPS data) are different but related.
When the Spark is moving and getting position information from the GPS that tells the Spark that it is travelling in a different direction from what it's getting from compass data, The Sparks programming can't work with the data conflict.
The solution is to drop data from one source and since the Spark can't fly without a compass but can without GPS, it's the GPS data that gets dropped.

There have been some compass problems with Sparks lately or your issue may have been related to something you did.
I'd be curious about when and where you calibrated it and where you launched from as these may be relevant factors.
You can also see the flight data to learn more and perhaps solve the mystery of your incident.
2017-8-16
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hallmark007
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fansd8e80c3c Posted at 2017-8-16 14:39
In order to rth the a.c. needs both, GPS and compass, without compass it don't know where it's heading, I already suggested dji to change behavior to have opti mode in the between

Actually it's gps that's knows where  A
C is going , if it was as easy as you said we never have a crash or flyaway.
2017-8-16
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hallmark007
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Charles Adams Posted at 2017-8-16 12:51
I'm definitely agreeing with you:  this is not expected behavior.  It just seems that with a lot of the fly aways there's been reports (or logs) of compass issues.  There's also been a couple of "drops".  This makes me wonder if the software isn't dealing with compass problems gracefully.


This is exactly the behaviour, this is a case of flying in an unsuitable location.Seriously do you actually think that compass is not an important part of your aircraft, if you choose to ignore this the most likely outcome is crash, pilot error we all need to take some responsibility here.
2017-8-16
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hallmark007
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LouisP Posted at 2017-8-16 13:26
I agree... compass errors and GPS errors should not cause the drone to do drastic things like fly away. I hope a future firmware update makes it behave a little better when it runs into these troubles.

You purchased the wrong drone if you think you have no responsibility for taking care of your aircraft not bothering to read your manual. You have taken up the wrong hobby, this is a hobby where we must learn and make the most of that knowledge, not a hobby where if something goes wrong we can run to Mummy crying.
2017-8-16
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Charles Adams
First Officer
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hallmark007 Posted at 2017-8-16 15:40
This is exactly the behaviour, this is a case of flying in an unsuitable location.Seriously do you actually think that compass is not an important part of your aircraft, if you choose to ignore this the most likely outcome is crash, pilot error we all need to take some responsibility here.

I definitely would not have flown here, and i agree that pilots have a responsibility to fly safely.  But the results seem quite unusual.  I guess one analogy would be that if I were to be speeding in my car (a law I should follow), I would still expect the antilock breaks to engage.  Or the horn to still function.

I personally don't think a compass complication should result in a fly away, even if caused by poor pilot judgement.

But I agree that pilots can mitigate most problems with proper location and flying within regulations.
2017-8-16
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DJI Thor
Administrator
Flight distance : 13602 ft
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You can contact our support to start a data analysis for your case, we will help to find out the reason for this. Here’s the link to contact us: http://www.dji.com/support
2017-8-17
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Adriano Araujo
First Officer
Flight distance : 731565 ft
Brazil
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Charles Adams Posted at 2017-8-16 19:02
I definitely would not have flown here, and i agree that pilots have a responsibility to fly safely.  But the results seem quite unusual.  I guess one analogy would be that if I were to be speeding in my car (a law I should follow), I would still expect the antilock breaks to engage.  Or the horn to still function.

I personally don't think a compass complication should result in a fly away, even if caused by poor pilot judgement.

I do not understand why a compass (or other system / subsystem) error should trigger a flyaway.

There are five different systems on Spark, and they do not seem to work in cooperation.

1 – Compass
2 – Accelerometers
3 – GPS
4 – Vision System
5 - Barometer

The Aircraft should work well with three, or even two. I really don´t understand why error on just one triggers a fail.

Let´s say:

1 -  you lose compass: You still have GPS (from which you can get heading). The AC can even RTH very, very, safely. I DON’T UNDERSTAND A COMPASS ERRO COMPROMISES THE FLIGHT

2 – you lose GPS: You still have Accelerometers, compass, and if not too high, vision system. The AC should not RTH, but it can use those subsystems to hover in place (not flying away), AND, yes, WITH ACELEROMETESR YOU can CONTERACT THE WIND, making it simple to control it back (as you still have connection)

With Accelerometers, it would even be possible to make what in aviation is called INS (Inertial navigation system). You know where you were when you lost GPS, and you know where you shoud RTH. Using accelerometers and compass, you can get really near launch place.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inertial_navigation_system

Just trying to figure it out. Bad software design? Not getting full potential of the system?
2017-8-17
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Charles Adams
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Adriano Araujo Posted at 2017-8-17 04:38
I do not understand why a compass (or other system / subsystem) error should trigger a flyaway.

There are five different systems on Spark, and they do not seem to work in cooperation.

If through these conversations we can get people to make better flight choices and simultaneously help DJI to improve the product, WIN/WIN!  I have no difficulties discussing possible aircraft problems/flaws even if pilot error may have been involved.

Your suggestions sound really awesome!  I wonder if they can "fit" in the spark.
2017-8-17
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Kyokushin
Captain
Flight distance : 296381 ft
Poland
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Adriano Araujo Posted at 2017-8-17 04:38
I do not understand why a compass (or other system / subsystem) error should trigger a flyaway.

There are five different systems on Spark, and they do not seem to work in cooperation.

Its not triggering a flyaway. Its just triggering atti mode.

AC will keep position on low altitude if it loose a GPS

Only GPS is keeping in position at higer altitude, nothing more, and if gps heading is different than compass heading then stabilisation is turned off because a drone do not know which one are correct.

In atti mode you have still gyro and baro stabilisation.
2017-8-17
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SparkPete
lvl.3
Flight distance : 83852 ft
Germany
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Kyokushin Posted at 2017-8-17 11:44
Its not triggering a flyaway. Its just triggering atti mode.

AC will keep position on low altitude if it loose a GPS

Still doesn't explain the loss of control for several minutes and why it flew away at high speed.

Spark should at least try to hover in place if it looses GPS and compass i.e. by leveling itself.
2017-8-17
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hallmark007
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SparkPete Posted at 2017-8-17 12:44
Still doesn't explain the loss of control for several minutes and why it flew away at high speed.

Spark should at least try to hover in place if it looses GPS and compass i.e. by leveling itself.

With no gps and no compass what will hold it in place?
2017-8-17
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SparkPete
lvl.3
Flight distance : 83852 ft
Germany
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If it lost GPS and compass it should still be able to stay level or at least run all propellers at speed.

It would drift with the wind but that is different from flying away at max. speed.
2017-8-18
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Chema_po
lvl.1
Flight distance : 92 ft
Spain
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My spark fly away phenomenon ocurred in gestural mode, no phone/radiocontrol.https://forum.dji.com/thread-109437-1-1.html
2017-8-18
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Kyokushin
Captain
Flight distance : 296381 ft
Poland
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SparkPete Posted at 2017-8-17 12:44
Still doesn't explain the loss of control for several minutes and why it flew away at high speed.

Spark should at least try to hover in place if it looses GPS and compass i.e. by leveling itself.

No. If it loose GPS then it will drif by the wind. There is only altitude stabilisation.

It just driffed and sometimes paniced user is helping in flyaway by pushing steers in wrong direction.
2017-8-18
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Dijkx
lvl.1
Flight distance : 56086 ft
Netherlands
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Maybe the place where I took off was not so smart, but I had no compass warnings at take off. I only had a compass error, the spark was only 30 meters away and  I also lost the connection with the RC. So I could not control it anymore.  Magnetic interference can occur everywhere even in places where you don't expect it, the Spark should never fly away, I had a very good GPS signal (16 Satellites). So I would like to know wat happened before I fly the spark again. So I hope DJI can clarify this fly away.
2017-8-20
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STech - Hathder
Second Officer
Flight distance : 459094 ft
Brazil
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Not a good place to fly a spark.
2017-8-20
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hallmark007
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Adriano Araujo Posted at 2017-8-17 04:38
I do not understand why a compass (or other system / subsystem) error should trigger a flyaway.

There are five different systems on Spark, and they do not seem to work in cooperation.

1/ if you lose your compass how do you know which way your facing?
2/ if you loose gps and your not to high for vision system (8 metres on spark) you know where you are when you lost gps.
Once you can see your drone you know where you are, if you have no gps you can still fly your aircraft you can still send signals to Imu accelerometers gyros by pointing the Aircraft in the direction you need to go , once you command aircraft in Atti mode to move forward backward up or down it's called flying.

While you put forward the need for INS to be incorporated into small unmanned drones we haven't seen this happen yet and whether it's cost or the technology is no better than is all ready there I don't know but I would think it's one or the other.

I'm sure redundancies in these small drones are a priority , and over time we will see them improved as they have with other dji drones which offer more redundancy than spark, but sometimes we must be real about what we are flying and how dji manage to keep the price at €500 and price is definitely a factor in the drone your flying.
2017-8-20
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