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One week... and down she went.
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797 43 2017-4-13 16:17:02
JhnMjr
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Hello Folks,
I'm new to DJI and the Phantom, but not RC aircraft. I bought a Phantom 4 Pro for work a week ago today with the intent of using it to get arial video of some equipment we manufacture and also some photos of our facilities. Most use would be under 100 feet of altitude and within a 100 foot radious of the pilot.
Today, I was using it to get some still shots of one of our factories. It was hovering around 50 feet when suddently, without warning, it tiped to one side and spirialed stright to the ground where it crashed. At the time it happened, I wasn't making any movement on the sticks as I was about to take a photo. I've reviewed the flight record and don't seem to see much information. Within a second of it falling, I start getting a series of messages. I get several "Gimbal Roll Reached Movement Limit", a bunch of "GPS Position NoMatch" and one "Attitude too Large. Exit Rear Obstacle Sensing." about 20 feet before it hits.
There isn't much else that pops out to me as significant. I'm happy to upload the record if someone has interest in looking at it.


I have two questions... First, has anyone had or heard of this happening? and second, does anyone have a guess if this will be covered under warrenty? Up to this point, it has flown perfectly and without any incident.


I've already filled out the form online and the unit is flying overnight to DJI in California (with the help of UPS)   Hopefully it won't take long to get an assessment from them.


Thanks in advance for any suggestions and thoughts.


-John
2017-4-13 16:17:02
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DJI-Jamie
DJI team
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How close to the factory was it?
2017-4-13 16:40:47
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JhnMjr
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DJI-Jamie Posted at 2017-4-13 16:40
How close to the factory was it?

About 140 feet
2017-4-13 17:01:15
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Mark The Droner
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It would he helpful if you could upload your flight log to this site so we could analyze things further:  http://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer/Upload/

site credit:  msinger
2017-4-13 17:03:37
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JhnMjr
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Mark The Droner Posted at 2017-4-13 17:03
It would he helpful if you could upload your flight log to this site so we could analyze things further:  http://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer/Upload/

site credit:  msinger

Here it is.

http://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer/HX7YEQGKC81OCF0BY5O3/
2017-4-13 17:06:04
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DJI-Jamie
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Just to clarify, had you updated firmware recently or had any hard landings prior to this?
2017-4-13 17:12:51
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JhnMjr
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DJI-Jamie Posted at 2017-4-13 17:12
Just to clarify, had you updated firmware recently or had any hard landings prior to this?

I updated the firmware this morning just before flight. No prior hard landings at all. In fact, I've been amazed at how I can bring it down slowly to about 2 inches off the ground and then lightly touch it down. It's been stellar to this point.
2017-4-13 17:16:57
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Labroides
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JhnMjr Posted at 2017-4-13 17:06
Here it is.

http://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer/HX7YEQGKC81OCF0BY5O3/

There are no indications in the flight data of any of the usual suspect causes of incidents.
Everything looks fine and the Phantom just begins to fall with power still on at 3:12.7.
After 1.3 seconds at 3:14.0 it has already reached 6.1 m/sec vertical speed, well above the 3 m/s limit in the firmware.

It looks like you pulled the throttle down after that instead of pushing it forward to climb but what had already happened suggests that there was a malfunction anyway.

The GPS position nomatch messages are a common false alarm and don't mean anything.
The other messages are due to the Phantom tumbling as it fell.

This one's a case for DJI to investigate.
Good luck with that.
2017-4-13 18:31:30
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JhnMjr
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Labroides Posted at 2017-4-13 18:31
There are no indications in the flight data of any of the usual suspect causes of incidents.
Everything looks fine and the Phantom just begins to fall with power still on at 3:12.7.
After 1.3 seconds at 3:14.0 it has already reached 6.1 m/sec vertical speed, well above the 3 m/s limit in the firmware.

Thanks for the feedback. I'll post the outcome.
2017-4-13 19:18:03
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blackcrusader
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JhnMjr Posted at 2017-4-13 19:18
Thanks for the feedback. I'll post the outcome.

Not saying this has happened but the only time my drone crashed and spiraled into a tea hedge was when I lost a prop. Were all your props still attached when you found the drone?

My fault as was my second day of flying and prop not tightened properly in my case.
2017-4-14 00:08:45
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JhnMjr
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blackcrusader Posted at 2017-4-14 00:08
Not saying this has happened but the only time my drone crashed and spiraled into a tea hedge was when I lost a prop. Were all your props still attached when you found the drone?

My fault as was my second day of flying and prop not tightened properly in my case.

All four blades were still attached. Although one was broken half off. After some looking, I was finally able to locate the broken half and it had a small section broke off the tip. So it definitely was still attached as it came down and broke when it hit the ground. Had it had a slight crack and somehow separated while in flight causing the problem, it wouldn't have the tip broken off.

2017-4-14 06:26:13
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JhnMjr
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Does anyone have experience with how long repairs take? DJI received the P4P last Friday morning and it hasn't even been checked in yet. Perhaps the holiday weekend is slowing things down?

-John
2017-4-18 11:44:28
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hallmark007
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JhnMjr Posted at 2017-4-18 11:44
Does anyone have experience with how long repairs take? DJI received the P4P last Friday morning and it hasn't even been checked in yet. Perhaps the holiday weekend is slowing things down?

-John

10/15 working days.
2017-4-18 12:28:40
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DJI-Jamie
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JhnMjr Posted at 2017-4-18 11:44
Does anyone have experience with how long repairs take? DJI received the P4P last Friday morning and it hasn't even been checked in yet. Perhaps the holiday weekend is slowing things down?

-John

It does take a 1-2 business days for a unit to be checked into the facility. From there, it normally takes a week or so depending on what needs to be repaired. There is a minor backlog in the check in process, so you may see an slight extension in the overall turnaround time.
2017-4-18 15:31:16
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Ricko
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Mine just did this over water.
2017-4-18 16:12:53
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kubota344
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My P4P  did the same thing yesterday,   I have had it just over a month,  I was flying yesterday at 200 feet , about 150 - 200 feet away,  hovering and suddenly it flipped over and hit the ground,  sent it back this morning,  see what they say
2017-4-18 17:47:35
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budro594
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I experienced something similar yesterday.  I put my P4P up, everything was fully charged, wind was calm and I was in an open field.  P4P was traveling 11 MPH away and 4.5 MPH up when all of the sudden it failed at 212 feet away and 75 feet up.  It nosed forward and I watched the death spiral in horror.  At the scene of hte crash, all 4 props were broken, the gimbal was broken off, and the battery was disloged.  The flight log just stops at the point it went down.  I have tried to get the CSV file, but cannot figure out how to get it off of an iPad or iPhone.  Much like you John, my P4P is back enroute to LA for repair.  I've only had this since April 1.  Glad I wasn't over water.
2017-4-18 17:47:26
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JhnMjr
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budro594 Posted at 2017-4-18 17:47
I experienced something similar yesterday.  I put my P4P up, everything was fully charged, wind was calm and I was in an open field.  P4P was traveling 11 MPH away and 4.5 MPH up when all of the sudden it failed at 212 feet away and 75 feet up.  It nosed forward and I watched the death spiral in horror.  At the scene of hte crash, all 4 props were broken, the gimbal was broken off, and the battery was disloged.  The flight log just stops at the point it went down.  I have tried to get the CSV file, but cannot figure out how to get it off of an iPad or iPhone.  Much like you John, my P4P is back enroute to LA for repair.  I've only had this since April 1.  Glad I wasn't over water.

Interesting! This is starting to sound like a glitch in the system! I'm really getting interested in how this gets addressed!
2017-4-18 18:51:53
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JhnMjr
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Ricko Posted at 2017-4-18 16:12
Mine just did this over water.

Really!!??  Crazy!  This is starting to sound like a glitch in the system! I'm really getting interested in how this gets addressed!
2017-4-18 18:54:59
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HLew
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Mine did that around 300 feet however I was able to recover before it landed on the ground! I am not sure what happened either.
could it be the wind? That day was pretty calm only 4mph winds so my guess is no...
2017-4-18 19:28:34
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fans5ba4c294
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Well crap, now I'm nervous to fly mine!
2017-4-18 20:10:51
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RichJ53
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JhnMjr Posted at 2017-4-18 18:54
Really!!??  Crazy!  This is starting to sound like a glitch in the system! I'm really getting interested in how this gets addressed!

Is your FW up to date? .0509.  Did you do the IMU / compass calibrations afterward?  

I was flying over the river today with mine for about 18 minutes over 4000 feet distance / 220 feet high. All worked as it should ....

I am wondering why this happened?   Very sorry for your loss
Rich
2017-4-18 21:17:23
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Ricko
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JhnMjr Posted at 2017-4-18 18:54
Really!!??  Crazy!  This is starting to sound like a glitch in the system! I'm really getting interested in how this gets addressed!

Yep, perfect signal @ 50 metres  height. Video cache showed it dropped one prop arm down suddenly and lost signal before hitting the water. Luckily I was able to retrieve it (2 days later). Wasn't too keen on the swim given the sign nearby indicating swimming is not recommended due to strong currents and SHARKS.

I was extremely relieved and just as surprised to find it.  it was missing one prop and while it may have come off at impact, given the video I wouldn't be surprised if it came off mid air.
2017-4-18 21:34:54
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Ricko
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RichJ53 Posted at 2017-4-18 21:17
Is your FW up to date? .0509.  Did you do the IMU / compass calibrations afterward?  

I was flying over the river today with mine for about 18 minutes over 4000 feet distance / 220 feet high. All worked as it should ....

Latest firmware update. First flight with the new firmware. I calibrate the compass before every flight from a new location. Even If I walk to a new location.

It was flying beautifully with no indicator as to an issue. I am going to be nervous whenever flying over water I cant swim to the bottom of.
2017-4-18 21:44:54
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JhnMjr
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RichJ53 Posted at 2017-4-18 21:17
Is your FW up to date? .0509.  Did you do the IMU / compass calibrations afterward?  

I was flying over the river today with mine for about 18 minutes over 4000 feet distance / 220 feet high. All worked as it should ....

Hi Rich,
Yes, I had just updated 30 minutes before flight while I was preparing.
2017-4-19 06:14:15
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budro594
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JhnMjr Posted at 2017-4-18 18:51
Interesting! This is starting to sound like a glitch in the system! I'm really getting interested in how this gets addressed!

As am I.  I just got the information on how to download the flight logs from iTunes.  I'll get back to you when I know more.
2017-4-19 06:48:33
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budro594
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HLew Posted at 2017-4-18 19:28
Mine did that around 300 feet however I was able to recover before it landed on the ground! I am not sure what happened either.
could it be the wind? That day was pretty calm only 4mph winds so my guess is no...

The day mine did it the winds were dead calm. It was an absolutely perfect day to fly and I had flown 33 seconds on my first battery.  I was able to pull the logs and there is nothing...no warnings, no status messages.  Battery was at 97%, aircraft was traveling forward and up and it just went dead.  I had zero control on mine after this happened.  I'm glad you were able to recover yours!  

It broke the gimbal, the battery ejected, landed upside down, and broke all 4 props.  Ugh.   
2017-4-19 07:02:14
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budro594
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kubota344 Posted at 2017-4-18 17:47
My P4P  did the same thing yesterday,   I have had it just over a month,  I was flying yesterday at 200 feet , about 150 - 200 feet away,  hovering and suddenly it flipped over and hit the ground,  sent it back this morning,  see what they say

I feel your pain.
2017-4-19 07:03:36
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HLew
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budro594 Posted at 2017-4-19 07:02
The day mine did it the winds were dead calm. It was an absolutely perfect day to fly and I had flown 33 seconds on my first battery.  I was able to pull the logs and there is nothing...no warnings, no status messages.  Battery was at 97%, aircraft was traveling forward and up and it just went dead.  I had zero control on mine after this happened.  I'm glad you were able to recover yours!  

It broke the gimbal, the battery ejected, landed upside down, and broke all 4 props.  Ugh.

When did that happened? Do you have the latest update version as well?
2017-4-19 10:19:36
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fans614a70b4
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budro594 Posted at 2017-4-19 07:02
The day mine did it the winds were dead calm. It was an absolutely perfect day to fly and I had flown 33 seconds on my first battery.  I was able to pull the logs and there is nothing...no warnings, no status messages.  Battery was at 97%, aircraft was traveling forward and up and it just went dead.  I had zero control on mine after this happened.  I'm glad you were able to recover yours!  

It broke the gimbal, the battery ejected, landed upside down, and broke all 4 props.  Ugh.

In your case, it almost sounds like the battery wasn't fully seated. I've noticed I have to be very careful to seat the battery fully. You can get it to click in one side and not the other if not very careful.

In the other cases in this thread, spinning to ground for sure means loss of lift of one prop... Could be several causes, prop, motor, controller... Prop being most likely.
2017-4-19 11:05:43
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Floreto
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If this is a firmware bug will those that have installed it be alerted by DJI that there's a problem?
2017-4-20 12:33:22
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budro594
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fans614a70b4 Posted at 2017-4-19 11:05
In your case, it almost sounds like the battery wasn't fully seated. I've noticed I have to be very careful to seat the battery fully. You can get it to click in one side and not the other if not very careful.

In the other cases in this thread, spinning to ground for sure means loss of lift of one prop... Could be several causes, prop, motor, controller... Prop being most likely.

I have a checklist that I go through before flight and that is part of it.  I learned to follow checklists prior to flight a long time ago when I got my private pilots license.  A good friend of mine suggested I use the checklists also.   To the best of my recollection, it was properly seated and "clicked" in prior to flight.  
2017-4-20 13:22:20
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budro594
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HLew Posted at 2017-4-19 10:19
When did that happened? Do you have the latest update version as well?

I did not update to the latest firmware on 4/17/17 as I was not in a location where I could do it.  Not sure what version was loaded.
2017-4-20 13:23:21
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JhnMjr
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Getting a little frustrated. It's now been a full week since DJI received the P4P and I have zero update. Not even an acknowledgement they received it! When I check the status online, it's still listed as "To be received" and states that it'll take one business day to be checked in. The've had five. Is this how DJI operates?
2017-4-21 07:38:09
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Loadnabox
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JhnMjr Posted at 2017-4-21 07:38
Getting a little frustrated. It's now been a full week since DJI received the P4P and I have zero update. Not even an acknowledgement they received it! When I check the status online, it's still listed as "To be received" and states that it'll take one business day to be checked in. The've had five. Is this how DJI operates?

I just got mine back recently.  It took two months to go through the process.

I had a similar incident where they claimed it was a prop fly off which I'm reasonably certain was not the case (Same thing, all props accounted for at the scene of the crash)  I had no proof, they never returned my calls, gave me the run-around.

I eventually gave up and paid for the repair since I had little recourse, but I'm all too happy to discuss their disgusting treatment of customers.
2017-4-21 08:23:06
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JhnMjr
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Loadnabox Posted at 2017-4-21 08:23
I just got mine back recently.  It took two months to go through the process.

I had a similar incident where they claimed it was a prop fly off which I'm reasonably certain was not the case (Same thing, all props accounted for at the scene of the crash)  I had no proof, they never returned my calls, gave me the run-around.

It better not be two months! I have projects I need it for!
2017-4-21 13:11:25
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KM5RG-Robert
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Ricko Posted at 2017-4-18 21:44
Latest firmware update. First flight with the new firmware. I calibrate the compass before every flight from a new location. Even If I walk to a new location.

It was flying beautifully with no indicator as to an issue. I am going to be nervous whenever flying over water I cant swim to the bottom of.

Most pilots would agree that frequent compass calibrations are not needed and can be detrimental. It is generally accepted practice to get a good calibration and then leave it alone (unless it is needed after a firmware update).
2017-4-21 15:21:36
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Loadnabox
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JhnMjr Posted at 2017-4-21 13:11
It better not be two months! I have projects I need it for!

Two weeks of that was trying to dispute their claims, every time I called trying to add information or dispute I was promised a callback "within 48 hours" which wouldn't happen.  Repeat a few times and you have your two weeks.

It took a couple of week just for them to do the initial review and processing, a week to do the repair after being paid, and another two weeks for QA and flight test.

So, if you don't dispute you can shave that to a month and a half
2017-4-22 10:05:14
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JhnMjr
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Loadnabox Posted at 2017-4-22 10:05
Two weeks of that was trying to dispute their claims, every time I called trying to add information or dispute I was promised a callback "within 48 hours" which wouldn't happen.  Repeat a few times and you have your two weeks.

It took a couple of week just for them to do the initial review and processing, a week to do the repair after being paid, and another two weeks for QA and flight test.

Crazy! Thanks for the information.

They've had mine for a week and a half now and all I've got is an email a couple days ago that they're finally evaluating it.
It's hard to believe that their communication is so poor. If these units were $150 I could understand it, but when they're 10x that and some people use them for business, I think it's reasonable to expect more.
When I've called, it takes 30+ minutes on hold, only to get someone that doesn't know anything. I was told that repair is "in a different department" so they aren't able to find out anything but will call me back and update me. I've never received a call. It's sad.

Is this perhaps by design to force people into the DJI Care/Refresh plans? If I could be assured of getting reasonable communication and service by punching a plan, I most likely would. However, being new to DJI and only having their product for one week before it drove itself into the ground, I wasn't aware and had never been told.
If anyone has information on the DJI care/Refresh experience, please respond and let me know.

Thanks, John
4 days ago
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Eric13
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JhnMjr Posted at 2017-4-25 10:58
Crazy! Thanks for the information.

They've had mine for a week and a half now and all I've got is an email a couple days ago that they're finally evaluating it.

"Is this perhaps by design to force people into the DJI Care/Refresh plans?"

That's very unlikely and word from different users is that this plan doesn't speed up repair process.
It's just additional coverage.
My guess is with this drone hype (esp. Mavic) and people constantly crashing their ACs, DJI repair is hopelessly overworked.

I have my P4P in Germany at DJI repair for almost 4 weeks and since one week the status says "under repair".
And I was able to get them on the phone in no time!

You can face a repair process of up to two months - depending on country etc.
If you need a drone for business I recommend additional 2-3 as back up.

4 days ago
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