Harps
lvl.2
Flight distance : 60958 ft
Canada
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DJI Mindy Posted at 4-24 23:56
We are sorry again for the experience with our support team, your concern has been forwarded to the management department for attention, the team will contact you, if you have further concern, please let me know.
From: <XXXXXXX>
Sent: April 25, 2019 5:56 PM
To: DJI Support
Subject: Re: [DJI Support] : RE Complaint case: CAS-2957883-Q5J2J9
Hello XXXX,
I am disappointed to say I still don’t see my main and only concern answered in this email either. Regarding the first/original reason cited as cause of crash by DJI’s crash analysis team, I have repeatedly asked for evidence to support DJI’s crash analysis team’s claim THAT THERE WAS NO DATA/VIDEO FEED DELAY BETWEEN THE DRONE AND RC. So far your last email and the multiple emails before that have not provided this? And this is all I am looking for as I am 100% confident that I did not cause the crash and the root cause of crash is Data/video feed delay between the drone and RC aka product malfunction. I will be repeating this information multiple times thru the email hoping someone will read it and provide this key piece of evidence.
Please read my replies to your statements from your last email below,
“I will try to answers every query you have from the email you sent us last April 10. This is when I check the flight that happened the last time you flew your drone.”
If you read my email again, you will notice I have asked DJI to provide evidence THAT THERE WAS NO DATA/VIDEO FEED DELAY BETWEEN THE DRONE AND RC atleast 5 times and yet I have not seen it addressed in your reply? Did you selectively decide not to read that part or simply do not have any evidence supporting DJI’s claim that there was no Data/Video delay between the drone and RC?
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“• Yes, the real caused of the incident that happened is the pilot pulled down the throttle stick and pushed forward the elevator stick. The record ended after that and according to the TOF height and positioning, the Aircraft fell into the water.
You may check this screenshot that obviously the pilot pulled down the throttle stick and pushing forward the elevator stick.”
Yes, the screen shot shows the pilot pulling down on throttle right before the crash and I have not denied this information ever. I have repeatedly informed DJI that the ONLY reason I was pulling down on the throttle was BECAUSE the screen showed me that the Drone is at high altitude. Per the data logs, I pulled throttle down at 14:06 to start bringing the drone down, then I let go of the sticks at 14:15 to see how high the drone is and pulled down on throttle again at 14:19. Again at 14:31 I let go of the sticks to see how high the drone is again and then pulled down again at 14:36 and the drone crashed into water at 14:43, which is within 7 seconds of my last check. Clearly I was being careful and checking on height and distance of the drone but the data presented was false/delayed and that’s what caused the crash. Just before the screen went blank (drone disconnected as a result of falling in water) the screen displayed an altitude of 30m or 50m. The ROOT cause of the crash is DELAYED DATA/VIDEO feed from Drone to RC. I STILL DON’T SEE ANY EVIDENCE OF YOUR CLAIM THAT THERE WAS NO DELAY. Please don’t waste my time by repeating same information without any evidence.
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“• For your question about the low battery, I've checked that before the incident happened, the application obviously provided you the warning to push the return to home now because the battery is low and enough only for return to home but the pilot ignored it and continue to fly until the incident happened. If the Pilot push the RTH button by that time, it will prevent the accident that happened.
Please see this screenshot at T=13:48 that showed the warning before the incident happened.”
You are right, the RTH was triggered at 13:48 and I cancelled. I always do as I like to fly the drone back my self as I never fly it more 500 m away. If you look at the flight log, at 13:57 (9 seconds after the RTH was triggered) I started bringing the drone towards me from 358.9m away with 23% battery. It was 113 meters away when it crashed into water and the battery was 20% at that time. It travelled 245M with 3% battery, so there was no way it did not have enough battery to travel another 113 meters and land safely. Your statement that the pilot ignored the message and continued to fly is false and irrelevant because I did not continue to fly, I started to bring the drone back home immediately (9 seconds) after the RTH was triggered.
This is statement from Aubrey's last email on April 8, 2019:-
"However, the remaining battery was not enough for the aircraft to return back home, which was the root cause of the accident.
As you can see on the below picture, the signal was strong and the aircraft was connected to 18 satellites for navigation to return but it failed to do so because the set altitude is too big, the RTH was cancelled when triggered and the battery was too low to trigger RTH again”
Per the statement above, clearly DJI changed the root cause for crash to battery being too low causing the crash, which is completely false and a failed attempt at throwing random confusing information at me to make me believe that this crash was my fault. And you are trying again to tell me that, me cancelling RTH caused the crash. Do you mind explaining how me cancelling RTH in this case caused the crash?
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“• Your concern has been escalated multiple times and provided you the result of the data analysis multiple times also. That's the reason I think that you're saying there's a contradicting issue on the result provided to you by the analysis team and Aubrey. I explained that on my statements above with the two screenshots.”
What I am saying is if my case was escalated multiple times then why have I not received ANSWER for my concerns. I HAVE REPEATEDLY ASKED FOR EVIDENCE THAT THERE WAS NO DATA/VIDEO FEED DELAY BETWEEN THE DRONE AND RC. Those screen shots do not explain or provide evidence of this. Those screen shots only repeat the same information over and over again and don’t explain anything. I think I am looking at this screen shot for the 10th time without any explanation how it proves that there was not data/video feed delay between the drone and RC.
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“• We filed a request to dispute the analysis and our analysis team reviewed it multiple times just to provide you the resolution you needed. There are different individuals who checked your flight records and I do also check it that's why I provided you the result from my own evaluation of the data.”
Are you telling me that multiple individuals have checked the flight records and read my emails and still did not bother answering the ONE question/concern I have been raising all along. PLEASE ASK ALL THOSE INDIVIDUALS TO KINDLY READ MY EMAILS AND PROVIDE EVIDENCE THAT THERE WAS NO DATA/VIDEO DELAY BETWEEN THE DRONE AND RC. I am not lying, if I caused the crash I would own up to it and pay to have it fixed. If DJI’s analysis team is claiming that I am lying and there was no DATA/VIDEO feed delay, then please provide evidence.
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“• When I checked the flight records, the flight continues and saw no lags on it. It clearly showed the warning to you but ignored it. If you want the video communication of the drone and RC, I will ask for it if possible to send it to you.”
Please show me where in flight logs it shows that there is no video or data feed lag? This is all I have been asking all along from day one. Nobody seems to read my emails before sending a cookie-cutter reply. Are you kidding me with the statement, “If you want the video communication of the drone and RC, I will ask for it if possible to send it to you.” , what reasons would DJI have to not send me this information? It is my drone’s information and nothing should stop DJI from sending it to me.
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“• As I've previously stated above, the low battery warning was already showed but the Pilot ignored it and continue to fly. The possibility to ignore it will cause the drone not to go back to home safely because the remaining battery after that may not be enough to return it to home.”
Again, did you actually see the flight log. I cancelled the RTH and within 9 seconds started flying it towards me. It had 23% battery at 13:57 when I started flying towards me and it travelled 245m consuming 3% battery and would have been back to home point easily consuming another 1-2% battery with 18-19% battery remaining. So quit saying I ignored RTH warning and kept on flying the drone. That is a FALSE statement.
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“• This is the solution we can provide you on this case to have your unit check and diagnose by our repair team but it will be a paid repair because of the result of the data analysis. We can offer a small amount of discount but I'm sorry we cannot provide you a free repair.
That was the final solution we can provide you and if you will not send the unit to us, I will close this complaint case as we can no longer do anymore.”
So are you saying you will close the case without providing any evidence that this crash was not caused by drone/RC malfunction? I am not asking DJI for a free repair, I am asking DJI to provide evidence that this was not a product malfunction and that the crash was solely caused by pilot error as I am 100% confident that the crash was caused by Data/Video feed delay aka product malfunction.
If it was my fault I will gladly pay for the repair but if it was caused by DJI’s product malfunction then DJI should be liable to repair it. SO I WILL NOT CONSIDER THIS CASE CLOSED UNTIL I SEE SOLID EVIDENCE THAT THERE WAS NO DATA/VIDEO FEED DELAY BETWEEN THE DRONE AND RC.
Finally, I have a request, please do not email me unless you are including this evidence as I am sick and tired of repeating myself.
Thank you
Harpreet
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From: XXXX (DJI Support) <support@dji.com>
Sent: April 25, 2019 3:01 PM
To: Randhawa.harpreet
Subject: [DJI Support] : RE Complaint case: CAS-2957883-Q5J2J9
##- Please type your reply above this line -##
Your request(#2088703)has been updated, please reply the email below.
XXXX (DJI Support)
Apr 26, 06:01 CST
Hi Harpreet,
Thank you for your response.
I will try to answers every query you have from the email you sent us last April 10. This is when I check the flight that happened the last time you flew your drone.
For your concern on this one: "I am surprised to read your last email. So far DJI’s Data analysis team has been saying the drone crashed as a result of Pilot pulling the throttle stick down now they are saying that the drone crashed as a result of Low Battery (per your statement in last email, “However, the remaining battery was not enough for the aircraft to return back home, which was the root cause of the accident”). Could you please explain how the cause of this incident changed from Pilot pulling the throttle down crashing the drone to Low battery causing the crash? Could you please ask the data analysis team to provide evidence for this new analysis? The Data analysis team is contradicting its own analysis now or maybe I should call it a story as I have not seen any evidence supporting their analysis so far. "
• Yes, the real caused of the incident that happened is the pilot pulled down the throttle stick and pushed forward the elevator stick. The record ended after that and according to the TOF height and positioning, the Aircraft fell into the water.
You may check this screenshot that obviously the pilot pulled down the throttle stick and pushing forward the elevator stick.
• For your question about the low battery, I've checked that before the incident happened, the application obviously provided you the warning to push the return to home now because the battery is low and enough only for return to home but the pilot ignored it and continue to fly until the incident happened. If the Pilot push the RTH button by that time, it will prevent the accident that happened.
Please see this screenshot at T=13:48 that showed the warning before the incident happened.
For your concern on this quote: "If my case was escalated twice why have I not received any data analysis showing there was no data and video feed lag between the Drone and RC. This has been my main concern from day 1 and so far DJI’s data analysis team has not provided any evidence from data logs supporting its analysis that there was no video and data feed delay between the drone and RC. I will only consider this dispute closed when DJI shows me this evidence along with explanation of how the provided evidence proves that there was no delay. I have been requesting this for over a month now and so far I have only received ambiguous and irrelevant replies."
• Your concern has been escalated multiple times and provided you the result of the data analysis multiple times also. That's the reason I think that you're saying there's a contradicting issue on the result provided to you by the analysis team and Aubrey. I explained that on my statements above with the two screenshots.
For this one: "1. Regarding your statement " Regretfully, the data analysis is an internal team and the only way to dispute the results is through an escalation dispute which has already been transmitted twice.”
This is not acceptable as whenever there is a dispute between two parties, the dispute resolution team has to be separate/independent from the team that denied the dispute in the first place. Thank you for confirming that the dispute was escalated to the same team twice and that there is no Customer dispute resolution team at DJI. Makes it easier for me to dispute this with local consumer protection agencies."
• We filed a request to dispute the analysis and our analysis team reviewed it multiple times just to provide you the resolution you needed. There are different individuals who checked your flight records and I do also check it that's why I provided you the result from my own evaluation of the data.
For your next query: "2. Regarding your Statement “I understand that you have checked the forums on this case but we cannot say that the same thing happened on your case as the team has already checked the flight and didn't see the lag.”
I have checked multiple threads on DJI’s forum and all are talking about the lag which DJI’s moderators have acknowledged as a glitch on the DJI Go4 app and have confirmed it was escalated to the DJI Engineers (See screenshot below and the link for this thread is https://forum.dji.com/thread-153010-1-1.html). Please see my previous email for more links for threads discussing this topic on DJI’s Forum. Like I have said on all previous emails/chats/calls to DJI, I have experienced this video and data transmission lag multiple times and have had to use RTH to bring the drone back. (However, in this incident, the drone was only around 300 Meters away in an open uninhabited area, so it did not cross my mind that the video and data could be delayed).
I am 100% positive that the same thing happened in this incident. If DJI’s Data analysis team disagrees then please provide evidence from data logs with an explanation of how the provided evidence proves that this did not happen in this case.
If DJI’s Data Analysis team is saying they have looked at the logs and did not see any lag between the drone and RC then please ask them to provide evidence for this from data logs. I have repeatedly asked for an analysis of data/video communication between the drone and RC but have not seen it addressed in any emails from DJI so far, instead, I keep getting irrelevant information to confuse me."
• When I checked the flight records, the flight continues and saw no lags on it. It clearly showed the warning to you but ignored it. If you want the video communication of the drone and RC, I will ask for it if possible to send it to you.
For this statement: "3. Regarding your statement,” There are many possibilities that will lead to the interruption of the flight record or the connection between the aircraft and the controller. For example, if there was obstacles or interference (visible & invisible), disconnection may happen. The direction of the antenna would also affect the remote connection, but that doesn't indicate the aircraft itself malfunctioned. Even after losing connection, the aircraft would do what it was designed to do to return home after losing connection. That's the reason why a return to home function was created. To have the unit return to home even after disconnection. However, the remaining battery was not enough for the aircraft to return back home, which was the root cause of the accident.
As you can see on the below picture, the signal was strong and the aircraft was connected to 18 satellites for navigation to return but it failed to do so because the set altitude is too big, the RTH was cancelled when triggered and the battery was too low to trigger RTH again”
In this statement you are saying there are many possible reasons for signal interruption and in the very next statement you are saying the signal was strong. I am confused here as to which statement is true and what signal you are referring to. Does the data log show there was interruption/interference between the drone and RC or does it shows the signal was strong and there was no interruption? Please pick the statement that is true per data log and provide evidence for it. Just to clarify again, there were no obstacles between RC and Drone and I am 100% positive there was no interference as no warnings popped up during the flight. I would have used RTH if I saw any interference warnings. It’s a green area over a lake and there are absolutely no obstacles. The Antennas were pointed towards the direction of the drone and the drone was only around 300 meter away. This drone is advertised with a maximum range of 4 kilometers, so I fail to understand why there was a video and data delay at merely around 300 meters (and less as the drone was travelling towards the RC) in an open uninhabited area? Clearly the aircraft malfunctioned. If DJI’s data analysis team is refuting this, then please ask them to provide evidence with explanation how the provided evidence is relevant to the claim.
In this case Return to home is irrelevant as the drone never disconnected from the RC. Like I have said every time I have contacted DJI, the reason for the crash is Video and data feed delay from the drone to the RC and yet I have not seen a single response from DJI showing evidence that the data and video feed was not delayed.
The picture you have attached does not show signal strength between the drone and RC, nor does it show there was no video and data delay. I have repeated this statement everytime I have contacted DJI and so far I have not seen a single reply explaining how this picture (or any other pictures DJI has sent) is the evidence that there was no data and video delay between the drone and RC. The drone does not connect to RC via Satellites so this information is irrelevant to the previous reason cited by DJI’s data analysis team for the crash. The Satellites are used to help the drone position and have nothing to do with video and data feed between the drone and RC.
So, I do not understand what RTH or cancelling RTH has to do with this incident. First reason RTH kicks in is when drone looses complete connection with RC, however in this case it was connected but the data and video feed was delayed. Also, data analysis team has claimed the RC was connected to the drone and the drone was responding to the stick commands (which I have not denied as that’s what happened, however the video feed and data presented on screen was definitely delayed) then why would RTH trigger or be a factor in this crash. In all previous communications data analysis team has claimed the cause of crash was pilot pulling throttle stick down crashing the drone into water and now they are claiming the drone crashed as the RTH could not trigger because the battery was too low and the RTH height was set too high. This is absurd and irrelevant. Why would RTH trigger when the RC is connected and the sticks are responding? Either ways, low battery was not cause of this crash as the drone had 20% battery at the time of crash and no “Critically Low battery” or “Drone auto landing” warnings kicked in before the crash plus the drone was merely 113 meters away from home point, it would have easily made it back to home point if the video and data feed was not delayed, which is what resulted in false information being presented to pilot causing the pilot to pull down on throttle thinking the drone is still high up which was the root cause of the crash and not the battery.
The other reason RTH kicks in is if the battery is just enough for the drone to return home. Per the flight logs it triggered at 13:48and I cancelled it. At 13:57 I started bringing the drone towards me from around 300 m away with 23% battery. It was 113 meters away when it crashed into water and the battery was 20% at that time, so there was no way it did not have enough battery to travel another 113 meters and land safely. Hence there was absolutely no reason for me to trigger RTH again, as at that time, I thought I was in complete command of the drone, which obviously was not true as my ability to navigate the drone safely was impaired by false information being presented to me as a result of the delayed video and data feed from drone. So clearly there is no relevance of RTH in this incident and this ambiguous/irrelevant information was sent to confuse me into believing that this crash was caused by pilot error.
Again the cause of crash was the delayed video and data feed which caused me to believe the drone was way higher than it actually was and that’s what caused me to pull the throttle down. Per the data logs, I pulled throttle down at 14:06 to start bringing the drone down, then I let go of the sticks at 14:15 to see how high the drone is and pulled down on throttle again at 14:19. Again at 14:31 I let go of the sticks to see how high the drone is again and then pulled down again at 14:36 and the drone crashed into water at 14:43, which is within 7 seconds of my last check. Like I have said each time I have contacted DJI before the only reason for me pulling down on the sticks was because the data/video presented to me was delayed. And like I told you on the phone and previous emails, this has happened multiple times with this drone in past and I have used RTH to bring it back. Since in this instance, the drone was only around 300 Meters from me I did not expect the data/video to be delayed so trusted it. Anyhow, this should not be happening on a $1000 drone advertised with a range of 4 kilometers in an open uninhabited area.
There are multiple threads on DJI forum discussing this problem, I sent you links to below threads in the last email and am copying it again below.
https://forum.dji.com/thread-163070-1-1.html
https://forum.dji.com/thread-153010-1-1.html
https://forum.dji.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=147692"
• As I've previously stated above, the low battery warning was already showed but the Pilot ignored it and continue to fly. The possibility to ignore it will cause the drone not to go back to home safely because the remaining battery after that may not be enough to return it to home.
On this one: "4. Regarding your statement, “I have also checked what can be further provided. But regretfully, the team has already concluded that it was not a product malfunction. What I can only offer now is to have the unit sent to the repair center then check what can be provided in the form of a discount once a quotation is provided.
I'm sorry if this will not meet your expectations but we already did our best to coordinate your concern. Should you accept it, please inform me so that I can process it. Otherwise, we will be closing the escalation.”
Again, if the data analysis team has concluded this was not a product malfunction then please provide evidence for this conclusion/claim. And I am not expecting anything from DJI at this point for the way DJI support has treated me by sending confusing and irrelevant information to avoid admitting that the product malfunctioned. I am respectfully demanding DJI to provide evidence from data logs showing there was no data and video feed delay between the drone and RC if data analysis team is claiming that pilot pulling down on throttle was the cause for crash or provide evidence for the analysis that the drone crashed as the RTH could not trigger because the battery was too low and the RTH height was set too high. And that DJI honor warranty repair in this case if it cannot provide evidence of pilot error and that the product did not malfunction in this incident."
• This is the solution we can provide you on this case to have your unit check and diagnose by our repair team but it will be a paid repair because of the result of the data analysis. We can offer a small amount of discount but I'm sorry we cannot provide you a free repair.
That was the final solution we can provide you and if you will not send the unit to us, I will close this complaint case as we can no longer do anymore.
Thank you for choosing DJI Products.
Best Regards,
XXXX
Manager, DJI Technical Support
Website: http://www.dji.com/support
Youtube: http://s.dji.com/Youtube-DJI
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