nwhit Posted at 2017-7-20 14:07
In line with the bad battery batch theory, I did fly at the club field yesterday using all 3 batteries from the spark that had crashed. No problems from any of the 3 batteries, just like in previous flying except the one crash. I also flew with my new Fly-more spark that came with 2 batteries. No problems. The original spark came with the 1 battery, and we bought 2 other batteries from a local dealer. Those 2 batteries were, obviously, from a different production batch.

My thought is this: I have read a post where the person said it definitely was the individually purchased battery that failed and not the one that came with his spark. It is also possible that my crash happened with one of the later purchased batteries.

The same thing happened to my spark this morning!  Luckily it landed in the sand and there was very little damage.   I was using an extra battery that I had purchased separately from DJI.  Currently awaiting a response from DJI support...

would like to know whats causing this

https://qz.com/1037497/people-ar ... ing-out-of-the-sky/

This should help those looking for warranty on their lost spark. Good luck

My continuing pursuit of a full credit  follows. I'm amazed at the answers. Of course you can't see any data!, it powered off!!!

-----------
I certainly understand your position, however, I am very sure this is completely your problem. The Spark powered down and fell into a pond. This is not a pilot error. Although I appreciate your offer I still respectfully request a full credit to purchase a new Spark. May I draw your attention to recent reports of a known problem?

http://fortune.com/2017/07/25/dj ... falling-out-of-sky/

I really don't want to argue but I feel it well within my rights to disagree with your decision. If this was my fault I would gladly accept the consequences. Should you not do the same?

Thank you.

Jim

On Jul 25, 2017, at 12:03 AM, DJI Support_US <support.us@dji.com> wrote:

Hi Jim,


Thank you for getting back to us.

We also want to figure out what happened to the aircraft and whether it was power of or not, however we could not verify what happened from the existing record. The cause is inconclusive and it was not recorded in the flight file. It is not the engineers are incapable or we are unwilling to, but we really couldn't get it due to the lack of related data. What you claimed "simply powered off", it's not verified from the record.

Jim, we do understand that it’s difficult to accept the result and solution. If we could help to get higher discount or a replacement, there is no reason why I don’t do that for you. For this case, 30% off for Spark without remote is already the best offer for you based on the analysis result while obeying the warranty policy.

Please consider if you need the 30% off coupon offer and get back to us in a month if you need it. Thanks.

Have a nice day.


Best Regards,

Evelyn
DJI Tech Support
http://www.dji.com/

------------------- Original Message -------------------
From:
Received: 2017/7/24 0:15
To: DJI repair dept; DJI Support_US; support.usDJI
Subject: Re: CAS-803499-G7Y5B1 [CAS-803499-G7Y5B1] CRM:0430000000688

Please reconsider your resolution to my issue. The Spark simply powered off and fell in the pond. I respectfully request a full credit. Please let me know as soon as possible.

Jim

On Jul 23, 2017, at 4:59 AM, DJI Support_US <support.us@dji.com> wrote:

Hi Jim,


Thanks for your patience.

For your claimed case CAS-803499-G7Y5B1, we have already finished the analysis, and the result is as follows:

1.The aircraft worked in GPS mode, and responded to pilot command perfectly;
2.T=01:05, H=0 m, D=44.9 m, battery power 88%, the aircraft flew forward with a horizontal speed of 2.6m/s after the pilot pushed forward the pitch stick fully, then the flight record ended;
3. The subsequent flight situation was unknown, which could not determine the cause of the accident.

With the record ended without any sign of abnormality, we could not verify what happened afterwards.

We truly appreciate your support for DJI, and especially applied for a 30% off coupon for aircraft without charger and remote:
http://store.dji.com/product/spark

If you would like to accept the offer, please reply to my email for example “I accept the offer”. Should you have more questions, please feel free to let me know.


Best Regards,

Evelyn
DJI Tech Support
http://www.dji.com/

fansb31f1926 Posted at 2017-7-25 16:20
My continuing pursuit of a full credit  follows. I'm amazed at the answers. Of course you can't see any data!, it powered off!!!

-----------

These are the same exact responses (word for word) I got from this "Evelyn" also. Probably reading or copying and pasting from a script. Maybe its time to call. I really wanted a record of all conversations.

fansb31f1926 Posted at 2017-7-25 16:20
My continuing pursuit of a full credit  follows. I'm amazed at the answers. Of course you can't see any data!, it powered off!!!

-----------

Please keep us posted on the evolution of your case. I am in the exact same situation. Spark shutdown in flight and fell in a lake. I don't have an answer for my case yet (opened yesterday) but I fear that I will receive the same as you..  And I won't accept it either..

fansb31f1926 Posted at 2017-7-25 16:20
My continuing pursuit of a full credit  follows. I'm amazed at the answers. Of course you can't see any data!, it powered off!!!

-----------

My Spark should be arriving to support soon. I can't believe in the answers/excuses they are giving people. Of course the unit will not record any data of the crash, that is part of the bug and one of the ways to track it. It won't log anything if it is completely off, and how would we all purposely or even accidentally stop the logging mid air? That is impossible, unless the devices are faulty.

I am also speechless...They sold bad product to customers, blame customer for not being able to prove (which they did not create a method to prove it when aircraft shut-off), then customer has to pay 70% for buying a replacement that may also be faulty...

How widespread are these issues? I am about to buy Spark but after reading about these issues and the fact that they are not covered by warranty, I am having second thoughts.

Is it safe to buy Spark or is there a high possibility it will fall from the sky and I end up with a 600 euro brick?

Phuong Do Posted at 2017-7-25 23:08
I am also speechless...They sold bad product to customers, blame customer for not being able to prove (which they did not create a method to prove it when aircraft shut-off), then customer has to pay 70% for buying a replacement that may also be faulty...

I told them they have to take serious in this issue but they just said flight log cannot be analysis and ignore my complain.

My issue (power cut during flight) happened on 1 July, if they got alert and had the right direction to go, issues may not be spread widely.

Hmm.... I was considering to buy Spark for short up-and-go flights (in addition to my Mavic), but will apparently hold off for at least half a year now...

igorgaelzer Posted at 2017-7-25 23:01
My Spark should be arriving to support soon. I can't believe in the answers/excuses they are giving people. Of course the unit will not record any data of the crash, that is part of the bug and one of the ways to track it. It won't log anything if it is completely off, and how would we all purposely or even accidentally stop the logging mid air? That is impossible, unless the devices are faulty.

It doesn't need to record anything after power cut or crash, in your dat file it should record what made the spark suddenly lose power, so as you can see from others who have sent in their spark, they have been offered warranty, and hopefully you will to. Problem is still they won't tell those who have got warranty why this power cut happened.

They have all the data they need to tell us why this is happening, but the silence is deafening.

Good luck I hope they offer full warranty.

fansb31f1926 Posted at 2017-7-25 16:20
My continuing pursuit of a full credit  follows. I'm amazed at the answers. Of course you can't see any data!, it powered off!!!

-----------

The main problem for you is this, your AC was lost to water, inside your AC is your black box which will give the reason your AC cut power, unfortunately it's not in your log from the app, so they are saying that something sinister could have gone on here, and if they award warranty then how many others will try scamming or taking advantage.

Yes this may be wrong particularly for guys who are genuine like yourself, but that's the way they are trying to protect themselves.
You can see if AC is returned with dat file from black box they have offered warranty, and this must be hard to take because prior symptoms of which there were none, were exactly the same.

I think they should as a PR exercise offered warranty to all those including lost to water etc warranty, particularly if they know what happened and won't come out and share that problem has been resolved.

I wish you luck, hopefully a change of their decision on this will help those who have lost there spark through no fault of there own will be offered a better deal.

The main problem for you is this, your AC was lost to water, inside your AC is your black box which will give the reason your AC cut power, unfortunately it's not in your log from the app, so they are saying that something sinister could have gone on here, and if they award warranty then how many others will try scamming or taking advantage.

What kind of scamming or taking advantage are you talking about? Shouldn't they see from the app log if something "sinister" is going on?

Is it really so that if DJI Spark fails over water and the black box is not recoverable, it's not covered by warranty?

fansb31f1926 Posted at 2017-7-25 16:20
My continuing pursuit of a full credit  follows. I'm amazed at the answers. Of course you can't see any data!, it powered off!!!

-----------

Guess articles like this will help with your warranty case and deliver some pressure for a fix.

https://www.digitaltrends.com/co ... aways-investigated/

There are news articles all over the internet in regards to the "Spark falling from sky".  I wonder at what point DJI will issue a recall or brick all Sparks similar to the Karma debacle.

randox Posted at 2017-7-26 00:49
What kind of scamming or taking advantage are you talking about? Shouldn't they see from the app log if something "sinister" is going on?

Is it really so that if DJI Spark fails over water and the black box is not recoverable, it's not covered by warranty?

Well ok scenario you fly your spark over water over a guy on a boat hover he plucks it out of the air, turns it over power off, flight log finishes same as yours, scam.

But yes it is the non recovery of drone that seems to be stopping some who have lost there drone from getting warranty, coupled with the fact that dji may also say , flying was in an unsuitable environment i.e. Water.

hallmark007 Posted at 2017-7-26 04:54
Well ok scenario you fly your spark over water over a guy on a boat hover he plucks it out of the air, turns it over power off, flight log finishes same as yours, scam.

But yes it is the non recovery of drone that seems to be stopping some who have lost there drone from getting warranty, coupled with the fact that dji may also say , flying was in an unsuitable environment i.e. Water.

So because of that theoretical scenario, DJI doesn't have to honor warranty if their drone falls out of the sky? I wonder if that excuse would stick in a court of law.

Also, is it forbidden to fly DJI drone over water? Seems it's too risky to purchase a drone now if the manufacturer doesn't honor warranty.

This is their most recent reply as of this morning. Still remaining the same.

"Thanks for getting back to us.

Please be noted that there are many possibilities that will lead to the interruption of the flight record, and yes, the app could not record a file with no power, but it doesn't means that the record end is because the aircraft is power off. It can not be verified from the record. If a disconnection between remote/mobile device and the aircraft occur, the record will also come to an end.

We are not saying that you just wanna get another aircraft. We also want to solve your problem and figure out the cause of the incident and what happened afterwards, however the cause is inconclusive and we really could not get it through the existing record. Actually I've already contact our supervisor for further help, but she also need to offer solution based on the analysis result, and obey our warranty policy. The 30% off discount is already the best offer for you. We can understand your feelings and I've tried my best during the days to get higher discount for you, but I failed.

Sorry for the disappointment you experienced with our product. And please get back to us if you would like to accept the offer in a month.

Have a nice day.


Best Regards,

Evelyn
DJI Tech Support
http://www.dji.com/"

hallmark007 Posted at 2017-7-26 04:54
Well ok scenario you fly your spark over water over a guy on a boat hover he plucks it out of the air, turns it over power off, flight log finishes same as yours, scam.

But yes it is the non recovery of drone that seems to be stopping some who have lost there drone from getting warranty, coupled with the fact that dji may also say , flying was in an unsuitable environment i.e. Water.

I don't think your scenario works but I may be wrong. FLT record updates every .2-.3 seconds or so. The power to the entire craft has to be off (I believe) for the FLT record to stop transmitting. Does turning it upside down shut off motors or entire craft? I'm not sure. I'd try this experiment and post it if I still had my craft;)

My SPARK was 15ft above lake when it went down so possibly a houseboat or guy on a ladder could have got it. At least one AC that has posted on this thread was over 300ft high. That one would be hard to fake.

DJI chooses what data to send to the FLT record. It really is their fault and responsibility if not enough parameters are coming back from the craft to determine what happened. Hence, they should "sack up" and take responsibility for the tiny number of cases where the record is "inconclusive" (in their minds only).

Just my thoughts.

I just hope they fix the issue so that no one loses their craft or is afraid to fly going forward.

I promised I'd come back and give an update if things changed.
Mine was the drone that dropped from 120m into heavy brush and was recovered a couple of DAYS later to find it had broken an arm.
During the time that the drone was MIA, DJI dragged their feet. Once I finally located the drone (and made some noise on this forum) things picked up a bit.
Yesterday I received confirmation that they will be covering my power cut damaged drone under warrantee.
Hoping to have it back by the weekend, which will mean I've been without my drone for almost 4 weeks.

hfog Posted at 2017-7-26 07:01
I promised I'd come back and give an update if things changed.
Mine was the drone that dropped from 120m into heavy brush and was recovered a couple of DAYS later to find it had broken an arm.
During the time that the drone was MIA, DJI dragged their feet. Once I finally located the drone (and made some noise on this forum) things picked up a bit.

I think currently they are only warrantying the ones that were found after they dropped out of the sky. They are still only offering the ones that lost their drone 30% off a new drone. Throwing money at the issue won't fix that these things will probably continue to fall out of the sky. They are giving the vaguest of answers still.

randox Posted at 2017-7-26 06:35
So because of that theoretical scenario, DJI doesn't have to honor warranty if their drone falls out of the sky? I wonder if that excuse would stick in a court of law.

Also, is it forbidden to fly DJI drone over water? Seems it's too risky to purchase a drone now if the manufacturer doesn't honor warranty.

I don't know what your problem is , you ask why, you don't except my answer , I have made my feelings clear, don't ask the question if you don't like the answer.

Update on my Spark status.

My Spark fell from about 60m height about 2 weeks ago on 14th of July, it was a Friday. I've shipped the drone on Monday and it arrived at their center in Germany at the end of last week. I'm from Romania.
I've just received the good news:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/JGRZJewHIs3PGFEl2

No word about the SD card that fried on the impact and unfortunately the battery is stil MIA in some bushes so no clue on what caused the problem.  Anyways, an sd card is really cheap as for the battery, I'll probably buy another two of those.

The post sales services worked great for me, my concern is future usage of the device.
If they are going to repair it instead of replacing it with no explanation of the motive of the crash event, my trust in the drone is really low. Maybe the fault is still there.
For all I know, the drone could have smacked me in the head like a rock falling from a 20 story building, not talking about possible property damage or what else.
That thought alone will probably keep me from ever enjoying my drone again.

BriRi Posted at 2017-7-26 06:50
I don't think your scenario works but I may be wrong. FLT record updates every .2-.3 seconds or so. The power to the entire craft has to be off (I believe) for the FLT record to stop transmitting. Does turning it upside down shut off motors or entire craft? I'm not sure. I'd try this experiment and post it if I still had my craft;)

My SPARK was 15ft above lake when it went down so possibly a houseboat or guy on a ladder could have got it. At least one AC that has posted on this thread was over 300ft high. That one would be hard to fake.

But I think you realise, that their are reasons why dji don't offer warranty. I.e. Unsuitable environment, I'm just being devils advocate here, trying to explain the other side, I don't really care if people except my answer it's their entitlement.

I have said all along that dji should award warranty for lost drones. I don't believe those who don't except reasons why it might go other way are helping themselves.

hallmark007 Posted at 2017-7-26 11:09
But I think you realise, that their are reasons why dji don't offer warranty. I.e. Unsuitable environment, I'm just being devils advocate here, trying to explain the other side, I don't really care if people except my answer it's their entitlement.

I have said all along that dji should award warranty for lost drones. I don't believe those who don't except reasons why it might go other way are helping themselves.

I understand and wasn't trying to be argumentative.

I really don't know if its possible to shut off FLT record by snatching the SPARK out of the air or turning it upside down etc. Or would there be a blip of data recording the event before it ended?  It would be an interesting experiment to try.

I DO WISH DJI would stream more data in their FLT records so that they would have more to evaluate in case of lost craft from shut off, fly away etc.

New firmware for spark, batteries and remote today. Does not say anything about this problem, but since it is updating all batteries, perhaps it is related.

https://forum.dji.com/thread-106245-1-1.html

BriRi Posted at 2017-7-26 11:14
I understand and wasn't trying to be argumentative.

I really don't know if its possible to shut off FLT record by snatching the SPARK out of the air or turning it upside down etc. Or would there be a blip of data recording the event before it ended?  It would be an interesting experiment to try.

I think get all the guys together here who have had lost drones with same symptoms see if ye can make a collective case, do it through PM and try to get a moderator on your side.

I understand the whole thing is unfair everyone here is genuine and for the sake of half a dozen sparks to people who have been on the main good loyal customers, you can't fight everyone's battle but with the small numbers you have collectively you should be able to make a case. *offensive language removed by mod*

You will never know what was the cause as it was in a case of P3P stress cracks and RC changes.

DJI never admitted it was fautl (cracks), someone got after 2 flights, someone as me never, someone got replaced, but it was never explained. And as now it touched a small number of copters.

In my opinion - as i readed what You all wrote in few topics, and what i saw in 2 years on DJI forum - its rather hardware malfunction - its result of quality control.

What is happening probably:
- something is overheating and fuse is turning off all
- short circuit (may be caused by temperature in some board)
- no contact - also may be caused by a temp.
- vibration causes power loss

first two we cant fix, and nobody can, it can be only replaced, but DJI never admit it was faulty. Even if they find solution they will silenty improve production process, nothing more. Maybe they even did it already.

the third - i had few times a problem in my P3P with connectors - the fix was simple - a scratch a metal surface of connector by a something. The connectors was covered by i do not know what and caused no electric pass. After cleaning/scratching it backed to normal. Maybe similar situation is here and you just need to keep clean battery connectors, or even scratch them a little

the fourth - you may use some strip to keep battery on place. Vibrations may cause a loose of contact for a moment.

A person whose Spark fallen may make a test - put battery on bird, turn it on without props then use a little force on battery to make vibrations then observe it is possible to make quick power off by that action.
In other test - a person whose Spark fallen can clean battery connectors then try to hover by few battery charges on that same battery.

Even it is software failure, then you will never see it on changelog. DJI will never admit mistake because it will cause returns, costs, sues.

If You not figure out by Yourself then You will NEVER know what is going on.

Spark is a product with a lifecycle, probably one year. After one year nobody will care of you and your fear bout falling spark. There will be Spark 2.
You can think 'nooo, DJI will never do that!' Yes they will, and they did in a case of P3P stress cracks and few other things.

For testing it you do not need to fly and risk. You may just start engines without props.

hallmark007 Posted at 2017-7-26 04:54
Well ok scenario you fly your spark over water over a guy on a boat hover he plucks it out of the air, turns it over power off, flight log finishes same as yours, scam.

But yes it is the non recovery of drone that seems to be stopping some who have lost there drone from getting warranty, coupled with the fact that dji may also say , flying was in an unsuitable environment i.e. Water.

That wouldn't work.

First there are the sensors when someone's hand gets close. Then there's the rotation sensor to turn it off. If you push the battery button on the back, that's probably recorded to the app, and at the very least, a funky issue of the speed and direction of the drone in the air at that time would negate any of these claims - something would definitely not check out.

flying 126m up and 146m out The transmission signal lost and Never saw it again. Im on holiday in Malaysia and flying on small Island over water in 30 degrees C. Why is such an expensive equipment SO unstable???Trying RTH once signal was lost but nothing..........
Any help from dji??
Have Opened it with DJI waiting for The analasys to finish, should be today.........

DK Sparky Posted at 2017-7-26 17:51
flying 126m up and 146m out The transmission signal lost and Never saw it again. Im on holiday in Malaysia and flying on small Island over water in 30 degrees C. Why is such an expensive equipment SO unstable???Trying RTH once signal was lost but nothing..........
Any help from dji??
Have Opened it with DJI waiting for The analasys to finish, should be today.........

Sorry for your loss. Upload the flight log and post link here if you don't mind. A group of us have been looking at them trying to figure out what is happening.

Palomino Posted at 2017-7-26 14:06
That wouldn't work.

First there are the sensors when someone's hand gets close. Then there's the rotation sensor to turn it off. If you push the battery button on the back, that's probably recorded to the app, and at the very least, a funky issue of the speed and direction of the drone in the air at that time would negate any of these claims - something would definitely not check out.

You maybe right, so we can exclude, although I might try it out and examine logs, aircraft doesn't have to be flying, just hovering.

Realistically might not be possible , so hopefully dji might offer all those who have had power cut, WARRANTY.

It’s going to be interesting to see if anyone has the suddenly power loss problem after the recent firmware updates too the aircraft, controller and batteries!
Out of curiosity has anyone had this issue since the update?

MoFoFoUK Posted at 2017-7-27 06:27
It’s going to be interesting to see if anyone has the suddenly power loss problem after the recent firmware updates too the aircraft, controller and batteries!
Out of curiosity has anyone had this issue since the update?

it looks like there have been fewer cases posted at least.
I personally experienced the power loss problem (back from DJI repair already) and i think a battery level reading issue or a battery firmware issue is to blame.

Hence the firmware update, the battery firmware update that is mandatory (unlike on the previous firmware update), and the release notes that point towards a battery level readout update.

As a side note, my spark was repaired but has a brand new serial number....

Final Update:
It appears my case is coming to an end, the drone is being shipped back to me along with a replacement battery which should arrive in a few days. I have requested for an analysis of the data as to why it crashed but have not yet received one. Originally DJI wanted to have me use my refresh insurance but after I disagreed (because I believed the crash to not be pilot error) my case was escalated. After a few days it was determined that my drone would be covered under warranty. Although this process has been lengthy, DJI did correctly handle my case and I am satisfied with the result.

Timeline:
Drone Crash July/03/2017
Case Accepted    Jul/04/2017 12:49:26
Received   Jul/12/2017 18:25:29
Damage Assessed   Jul/19/2017 10:05:05
Free Of Charge   Jul/19/2017 10:05:37  
Repaired   Jul/25/2017 10:13:35
Product shipped   Jul/25/2017 18:52:03

Hopefully DJI handles everyone's cases in the same way, but it appears they are only honoring warranty if your drone was recovered like mine. For now my spark will not be flown out of sight or above water until DJI confirms a fix to this issue.

Happy flying,

Patrick

hallmark007 Posted at 2017-7-26 00:08
It doesn't need to record anything after power cut or crash, in your dat file it should record what made the spark suddenly lose power, so as you can see from others who have sent in their spark, they have been offered warranty, and hopefully you will to. Problem is still they won't tell those who have got warranty why this power cut happened.

They have all the data they need to tell us why this is happening, but the silence is deafening.

Thank you! Looks like they received my Spark today and I hope to hear good news from them soon.

I will say though DJI has done a good job by me so far. I posted on this forum about my spark cutting power mid flight and falling to the ground. Dji is going to warranty my spark and cover the damages. I was very satisfied with the outcome even though I was upset that I had my spark for only 1 week when this happened. I hope some of y'all get the same outcome guys.

Google dji spark falling out of the sky!   The verge.com did an article that reported about dji sparks cutting power and falling to the ground.

Patrick C Posted at 2017-7-27 08:16
Final Update:
It appears my case is coming to an end, the drone is being shipped back to me along with a replacement battery which should arrive in a few days. I have requested for an analysis of the data as to why it crashed but have not yet received one. Originally DJI wanted to have me use my refresh insurance but after I disagreed (because I believed the crash to not be pilot error) my case was escalated. After a few days it was determined that my drone would be covered under warranty. Although this process has been lengthy, DJI did correctly handle my case and I am satisfied with the result.

That's good, I'm glad it worked out for you. I just received their email back saying the following:

"Dear Customer, Unfortunately, damage that is not caused by a product malfunction or is out of the warranty period is not covered by DJI aftersales policy. We will either repair it or replace it with a product that's new or equivalent to new in both performance and reliability after payment has been received. For more information, please visit http://www.dji.com/service/policy DJI North America"

I'm going to call them tomorrow morning and disagree with the return they gave as well.