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Rob Hulford
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Would appreciate feedback here. I've purchased lenses for my Mavic. Today with low winter sun in the sky I chose to use Polarpro ND16/PL. ISO was set to 100ASA With a shutter speed around 120/1. The video is also a bit jerky, not smooth. Recording resolution was set to max at 4K.  I would welcome any feedback at all as to the quality or lack of quality with this short video.

Cheers Rob
2017-12-28
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A CW
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Nice vid but the main purpose of ND's are to achieve the 180 degree rule whereby the shutter speed needs to be double the frame rate. so 1/60th and not 1/120th. With a bitrate of 60MBPS on the Mavic 4K is very compressed too. You'll experience better quality footage in 2.7K.
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PolarPro
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Rob thanks for supporting our brand and choosing our filters!
What frame rate are you shooting at?

The shot going straight over the water looks great, If I were shooting I would have slowed that pan left a lot.

In general I like to keep my camera movements very slow while filming and speed them up in post if needed.

Happy to answer any other questions if you have them!
-Jeff from PolarPro


2017-12-28
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DJI Thor
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Rob, I think the video is nice. But the gimbal seems a little bit tilted. You can try to do a calibration or gimbal Roll adjust. Cheers.
2017-12-28
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Montfrooij
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I see no issues on my screen.
What framerate were you shooting?
In general try and make the shutterspeed about double the framerate (so 60fps would be 1/120s).
That's what these ND filters are useful for
2017-12-29
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Rob Hulford
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DJI Thor Posted at 2017-12-28 21:26
Rob, I think the video is nice. But the gimbal seems a little bit tilted. You can try to do a calibration or gimbal Roll adjust. Cheers.

HI Thor. YES !!  I did mention this a while back that I felt my horizon on my photos (and some videos) was not a completely flat 90o horizontal. I have not seen any warnings pertaining to calibrating the gimbal or Roll. Is it straight forward. i.e I presume you start up the mavic and RC and then perform a calibration within the DJI Go4 App ?
Also... if i may ask.. what is the function of the Gimbal Pitch smoothness 0-30 ? I presume the gimbal pitch speed is the rate at which you can raise and lower the gimbal. Is there a recommended default setting of say 25 ?
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Rob Hulford
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Montfrooij Posted at 2017-12-29 03:14
I see no issues on my screen.
What framerate were you shooting?
In general try and make the shutterspeed about double the framerate (so 60fps would be 1/120s).

Thanks for the feedback MF. To be honest Ive not been flying more than 4 months. And my camera settings have been experimental to a large degree. Since I started in early autumn we've moved into deep Winter and with the sun low in the sky illuminating the sides of trees/woodland forest. it presents me with a bit of a challenge knowing which settings to aim for.  I am familiar with the ISO and Shutter speed settings for the camera on the app, and the EV seems to self adjust.. is this correct ? When recording Video I can see the settings for video quality. 4K / 1080 etc.. Where exactly is the Frame rate setting FPS ?
2017-12-29
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Montfrooij
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Rob Hulford Posted at 2017-12-29 04:50
Thanks for the feedback MF. To be honest Ive not been flying more than 4 months. And my camera settings have been experimental to a large degree. Since I started in early autumn we've moved into deep Winter and with the sun low in the sky illuminating the sides of trees/woodland forest. it presents me with a bit of a challenge knowing which settings to aim for.  I am familiar with the ISO and Shutter speed settings for the camera on the app, and the EV seems to self adjust.. is this correct ? When recording Video I can see the settings for video quality. 4K / 1080 etc.. Where exactly is the Frame rate setting FPS ?

Depending on your camera mode EV will correct.
Just set it to M and you have to do it yourself (shutterspeed, iso)
Framerate is in the video setting tab.
Video size I believe.

https://forum.dji.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=118959
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Rob Hulford
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PolarPro Posted at 2017-12-28 15:47
Rob thanks for supporting our brand and choosing our filters!
What frame rate are you shooting at?

Thanks for replying Jeff. To be honest the shot over water was an experimental one. I wanted to fly out at around 2m high in sport mode to assess the effect. It proved difficult to judge the distance visually across the water and I didn't want to crash into trees on the other side of the lake so i climbed probably a little sooner than I would have wished. Also panning or flying left and right in sport mode results in much quicker turns and movements. So if I was to reshoot I would probably fly in normal mode and maybe have someone the other side signal to me when the drone was within about 10 meters to enable the climb up and over the trees.  

I bought your 3pack Jeff, consisting of three lenses NDL4PL /8PL and 16PL. Although the instructions suggest the NDL16PL in sunny conditions (overhead sun) what would you have gone for given the very low sun angle and how this means that the lake appears almost black whilst the trees ahead are almost over exposed ? I couldn't lengthen the shutter speed otherwise a true blue sky would have turned white.

Any advise appreciated.

BTW I love the way the lens fits so snuggly over the camera head.  Very well engineered IMO.

Cheers
Rob
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Rob Hulford
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A CW Posted at 2017-12-28 11:13
Nice vid but the main purpose of ND's are to achieve the 180 degree rule whereby the shutter speed needs to be double the frame rate. so 1/60th and not 1/120th. With a bitrate of 60MBPS on the Mavic 4K is very compressed too. You'll experience better quality footage in 2.7K.

HI A CW, thanks for replying. Would you say 2.7K is your rule of thumb for all video recording you make using the mavic ?  

For the record I'm using a reasonable spec'd Micro SD Card  -
A Sandisk Extreme PRO 32GB V30 HC1 U3 A1

Is 60MBPS the top speed setting on the Mavic ?
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Rob Hulford
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Montfrooij Posted at 2017-12-29 04:55
Depending on your camera mode EV will correct.
Just set it to M and you have to do it yourself (shutterspeed, iso)
Framerate is in the video setting tab.

Thanks Again Moontfooij,  I'll have a quick read up. Appreciate the reply.  
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Montfrooij
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Rob Hulford Posted at 2017-12-29 05:08
Thanks Again Moontfooij,  I'll have a quick read up. Appreciate the reply.

You're welcome!
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Montfrooij
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Rob Hulford Posted at 2017-12-29 05:06
HI A CW, thanks for replying. Would you say 2.7K is your rule of thumb for all video recording you make using the mavic ?  

For the record I'm using a reasonable spec'd Micro SD Card  -

Yes, Mavic is limited at 60mbps for the 4K videostream.
You will have to go to a Phantom 4 Pro / Advanced to get more (100mbps)
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A CW
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Rob Hulford Posted at 2017-12-29 05:06
HI A CW, thanks for replying. Would you say 2.7K is your rule of thumb for all video recording you make using the mavic ?  

For the record I'm using a reasonable spec'd Micro SD Card  -

Thats the perfect Micro SD card.
I tend to shoot in 2.7K with my MPP - I'll use 1080p if I need slow mo at 60 or 96p and occasionally 4K in low altitude flight in confined areas where detail in the resolution is important. For typical higher altitude landscape filming I'll shoot in 2.7K as the image is less compressed and this is noticeable in the image quality i.e. less digital artefact. The Mavic MBPS is selected by the camera automatically and is driven entirely by the resolution &/or frame rate.
Max video bitrate on the Mavic is 60MBPS in c4K/4K UHD and higher frame rates in lower resolutions. For good quality 4K you would ideally need at least 100MBPS such as the specs you'll get on the P4P and Inspire 2 X4S cameras. The 4K is useable on the Mavic but not great. 2.7K is the sweet spot for me.
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Rob Hulford
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A CW Posted at 2017-12-29 06:04
Thats the perfect Micro SD card.
I tend to shoot in 2.7K with my MPP - I'll use 1080p if I need slow mo at 60 or 96p and occasionally 4K in low altitude flight in confined areas where detail in the resolution is important. For typical higher altitude landscape filming I'll shoot in 2.7K as the image is less compressed and this is noticeable in the image quality i.e. less digital artefact. The Mavic MBPS is selected by the camera automatically and is driven entirely by the resolution &/or frame rate.
Max video bitrate on the Mavic is 60MBPS in c4K/4K UHD and higher frame rates in lower resolutions. For good quality 4K you would ideally need at least 100MBPS such as the specs you'll get on the P4P and Inspire 2 X4S cameras. The 4K is useable on the Mavic but not great. 2.7K is the sweet spot for me.

I confused myself with MBPS and FPS. I had a quick fly just now after calibrating the gimbal. Wind speed is a little high to truly test if the calibration worked. Steady 18mph gusting to 40mph..
Anyway the settings for 4K in PAL are 24FPS or 25FPS when looking in the app. And I think the same for 2.7K The slow mo settings you refer to at 1080p are 60/96 FPS ?

So in a scenario where I film  a 7 or 8 minute sunset video with nicely tinted cirrus clouds would you shoot in 2.7K using an ND16PL PP lens with an ISO of 100 and shutter speed of 1/60th ?  Am i missing anything obvious ?
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Rob Hulford
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DJI Thor Posted at 2017-12-28 21:26
Rob, I think the video is nice. But the gimbal seems a little bit tilted. You can try to do a calibration or gimbal Roll adjust. Cheers.



OK so full calibration carried out and completed. I still think the horizon isn't flat. How much is the horizon affected by wind or turbulence and should the gimbal compensate for that ?  I aimed the camera directly towards the wind.
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Rob Hulford Posted at 2017-12-29 06:14
I confused myself with MBPS and FPS. I had a quick fly just now after calibrating the gimbal. Wind speed is a little high to truly test if the calibration worked. Steady 18mph gusting to 40mph..
Anyway the settings for 4K in PAL are 24FPS or 25FPS when looking in the app. And I think the same for 2.7K The slow mo settings you refer to at 1080p are 60/96 FPS ?

MBPS is the bitrate and FPS is frames per second - the latter is also referred to as 'p'.
Yep - 60 and 96p is only offered at 1080FHD on the Mavic. 60 and 120p in 720HD. Max FPS in 4K and 2.7K is 30p but you'll need to reset your camera to NTSC if you want 30p rather than 25p. I live in the UK and use NTSC with no problems at all. Only artificial light causes image distortion due to the varying Hz frequency between NTSC and UK electricity.

With regards to your scenario, yes - I would shoot 2.7K. That would however be the wrong choice of ND filter for a sun set. An ND16 will reduce the shutter speed by around 1/1000th of a second so you may experience an underexposed image whereby the sun will be fairly good in the image but the rest of the image will be very dark and you may need to increase the ISO from 100 to balance out the exposure and the higher the ISO the more grain/noise you will get in the image. An ISO of 800, for example, would look terrible on the Mavic. An ND4 is typically the best filter for sun sets but that depends on the brightness of the sun. That explains why the lake in your footage looks jet black. I also wouldn't use a polariser unless filming over water/highly reflective surfaces though a PL will help to make the blues pop more but this can be enhanced in post anyway.
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Rob Hulford Posted at 2017-12-29 06:20
[view_image]

OK so full calibration carried out and completed. I still think the horizon isn't flat. How much is the horizon affected by wind or turbulence and should the gimbal compensate for that ?  I aimed the camera directly towards the wind.

Horizon tilt issues are notoriously bad on the Mavic in higher winds. That said I experience far less tilt issues with the platinum but the 8331 props and upgraded ESC's present a more stable flight anyway so thats probably why. You will get horizon tilts in winds of >10MPH in my experience - though when you pan the horizon will straighten out as the drone turns with the wind. As Thor said, you can adjust the gimbal roll mid air within the gimbal settings to straighten it out if you don't intend to yaw the drone and want a specific shot.
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Rob Hulford
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A CW Posted at 2017-12-29 06:38
Horizon tilt issues are notoriously bad on the Mavic in higher winds. That said I experience far less tilt issues with the platinum but the 8331 props and upgraded ESC's present a more stable flight anyway so thats probably why. You will get horizon tilts in winds of >10MPH in my experience - though when you pan the horizon will straighten out as the drone turns with the wind. As Thor said, you can adjust the gimbal roll mid air within the gimbal settings to straighten it out if you don't intend to yaw the drone and want a specific shot.

Brilliant tips. thank you. Appreciate both your replies. It really helps when you have guidance from those who have gone before you and have learnt tips that they are willing to share along with their knowledge.

BTW I was thiking of getting the 8331 props for my Mavic Pro. Assuming these will function OK and add a smoother quieter flight.
Cheers CW

Rob

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Rob Hulford Posted at 2017-12-29 04:59
Thanks for replying Jeff. To be honest the shot over water was an experimental one. I wanted to fly out at around 2m high in sport mode to assess the effect. It proved difficult to judge the distance visually across the water and I didn't want to crash into trees on the other side of the lake so i climbed probably a little sooner than I would have wished. Also panning or flying left and right in sport mode results in much quicker turns and movements. So if I was to reshoot I would probably fly in normal mode and maybe have someone the other side signal to me when the drone was within about 10 meters to enable the climb up and over the trees.  

I bought your 3pack Jeff, consisting of three lenses NDL4PL /8PL and 16PL. Although the instructions suggest the NDL16PL in sunny conditions (overhead sun) what would you have gone for given the very low sun angle and how this means that the lake appears almost black whilst the trees ahead are almost over exposed ? I couldn't lengthen the shutter speed otherwise a true blue sky would have turned white.

sometimes it can be difficult to expose for both the ground and the sky due to the lighting difference. The instructions are a very general assumption that a Sunny day will be an ND16. Its best to be precise and use the filter needed to get your shutter speed at double frame rate.

We have an app that makes it easy to figure out what exact filter to use for any given scene.
https://www.polarprofilters.com/pages/polarpro-app

Hope that helps! Here for any other questions you may have!
-Jeff from PolarPro

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captirwin
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Very interesting and informative thread.
Thanks to all contributors.
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1px0ff
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Agreed. I learned a lot from reading this thread. Thank you all!
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A CW
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PolarPro Posted at 2017-12-29 17:48
sometimes it can be difficult to expose for both the ground and the sky due to the lighting difference. The instructions are a very general assumption that a Sunny day will be an ND16. Its best to be precise and use the filter needed to get your shutter speed at double frame rate.

We have an app that makes it easy to figure out what exact filter to use for any given scene.

There are filters out there that accommodate for this exposure variance between landscape and sky in the same image - called graduated and solar filters rather than basic ND's. It would be very nice to see Polar Pro bring ND Grad's to the table for us Mavic owners to help this.
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Rob Hulford Posted at 2017-12-29 16:28
Brilliant tips. thank you. Appreciate both your replies. It really helps when you have guidance from those who have gone before you and have learnt tips that they are willing to share along with their knowledge.

BTW I was thiking of getting the 8331 props for my Mavic Pro. Assuming these will function OK and add a smoother quieter flight.

No probs and glad to help. The 8331 props do make a difference. Expect a slightly more stable flight, an extra minute of flight time and roughly a 30% noise reduction when used with the original Mavic Pro. 3 minutes extra and 60% lower on the Platinum. Just ensure you're on the latest FW.
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Rob Hulford
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A CW Posted at 2017-12-30 00:57
No probs and glad to help. The 8331 props do make a difference. Expect a slightly more stable flight, an extra minute of flight time and roughly a 30% noise reduction when used with the original Mavic Pro. 3 minutes extra and 60% lower on the Platinum. Just ensure you're on the latest FW.

Firmware  bang up to date. Is there any need to make any adjustment to the set up on the mavic when switching to the 8331 props ?
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Rob Hulford Posted at 2017-12-30 10:30
Firmware  bang up to date. Is there any need to make any adjustment to the set up on the mavic when switching to the 8331 props ?

No mate - just the FW update as using older versions of FW with the 8331's caused gimbal and vibration issues.
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Rob Hulford Posted at 2017-12-29 06:20
[view_image]

OK so full calibration carried out and completed. I still think the horizon isn't flat. How much is the horizon affected by wind or turbulence and should the gimbal compensate for that ?  I aimed the camera directly towards the wind.

You can fix this by adjusting the gimbal roll, it is in the same place as the gimbal calibration setting (Make sure you have the Grid Line option selected in the camera settings). Set the MP on a level flat surface, point the camera to an object you know to be a good horizontal line (IE: Fireplace Mantle, Window sill, ect...) then adjust the gimbal roll to match the horizontal plane.
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Rob Hulford Posted at 2017-12-29 04:45
HI Thor. YES !!  I did mention this a while back that I felt my horizon on my photos (and some videos) was not a completely flat 90o horizontal. I have not seen any warnings pertaining to calibrating the gimbal or Roll. Is it straight forward. i.e I presume you start up the mavic and RC and then perform a calibration within the DJI Go4 App ?
Also... if i may ask.. what is the function of the Gimbal Pitch smoothness 0-30 ? I presume the gimbal pitch speed is the rate at which you can raise and lower the gimbal. Is there a recommended default setting of say 25 ?

The gimbal smoothness is to adjust the gimbal’s response speed after Gimbal Dial is released. A greater value indicates a faster speed.
Gimbal Pitch Speed indicates the relation between how much Gimbal Dial is toggled and how much the gimbal moves.
And for your updated below, it is hard to say how much it might be affected by the wind. I recommend that you check it when you just power on the drone, don't take it off. If it does tilt, you can try to adjust the gimbal Roll. It will help.
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