Thoughts?  P3 vs Goprohero4 4k?

Why isn't anybody giving reasons why they chose the P3 camera over the GoPro Hero4 Black? I don't have a P3 but can you adjust the FOV on the P3 camera from Wide, Medium, and Narrow? Narrow is 90 degrees FOV so no fisheye effect on the GoPro Hero 4 Black if you want. Can the P3 camera capture 120fps in full HD 1080P?

I uploaded a comparison between the two cameras.  Shot at the same time.  I had my P3 Pro hover and I used a gopro on a pole handheld underneath it.

The auto exposure and auto WB between the two is very different.  For auto settings I think the Gopro does better.  The gopro has a much wider lens but it distorts.  You can see side by side here, but the exposure differences are so dramatic you have to try and ignore them.  I did some level adjustment in the final scene to try and match the two better for an easier comparison but it's a pretty basic A/B between the 2 cameras looking at the same scene at the same time.

Both shot at 3840x2160/30p

fr0gburp3r Posted at 2015-5-7 12:04
Why isn't anybody giving reasons why they chose the P3 camera over the GoPro Hero4 Black? I don't ha ...

You have only one choice for lens width at 3840x2160/30p with either camera, Ultra Wide.  The other options on the gopro only exist for 2.7k and 1080p. Even at 1440p with the gopro hero4 black you only have the ultra wide choice.

And what Gopro calls 1440p is not the 2560x1440 that youtube and everyone else calls 1440p.  In gopro parlance 1440p is 1920x1440 for some reason.

It looks like the GoPro Hero4 Black has a better dynamic range.

I don't know" I have pro4  and I really think the P3 is much better

I agree that the exposure and white balance is different on the two camera which makes comparing them difficult.  So far, I like the GoPro Hero 4 Black better for the exposure settings.  I do like the Phantom 3 camera though because the fish-eye effect is gone.  I think I'll have to play with the white balance settings to see if I can make some improvements before post production.

Scott

Thanks for starting this post. I've been watching closely to see the footage folks get out of the Phantom 3.

I have minor concerns with what I've seen... dynamic range and aliasing in particular. I really like the image I get from the Hero4's 4K. It's fairly impressive (for a camera the size a fat match box) with the Protune and the Flat color profile. The biggest issue I'm wondering about (and it's the same in the vid above) is the slight "crispy look" and aliasing I see in the Phantom 3's footage. All the footage I've seen so far from the P3 has this "over sharpened" video crisp look. Really unappealing look IMHO. That said, does anyone know if the P3 camera has a sharpen setting like the Hero 4 does? All the footage I've seen really looks like it's been sharpened a bit too much. Or worse... that's just the way the camera shoots. I set this to low on the Hero 4. I can always sharpen with much more control in post as in-camera sharpening tends to exaggerate aliasing and artifacts.

Though it might be minor to some it's a deal breaker for me. The only reason I'm contemplating adding the P3 to my videography tool box is because of this camera and its non-fisheye view in 4K. With my Phantom 2/H3-3D setup for wide angle the addition of the P3 would cover the more traditional field of view shots so I'd have the best of both worlds. But... unfortunately I'm not overly excited by the footage that's been posted so far. I hope I'm wrong. Perhaps it's just that eveyone's been shooting with the camera set to some default "high sharpness" setting?

I think that if you shoot in LOG-color, even perhaps go -3 contrast and -3 in saturation in "Style" and then add in the contrast and color in post-production, you can easily match or top the dynamic range of the GoPro4 - and return the detail of the sky in the P3-footage.

FantomDK Posted at 2015-5-10 02:14
I think that if you shoot in LOG-color, even perhaps go -3 contrast and -3 in saturation in "Style"  ...

I agree.  You need to shoot in LOG mode to approximate the exposure & latitude of the GoPro.

However the Phantom 3 compares favorably and the lens on the P3 is superior.

What exactly are we comparing here?

The most fair comparison is what the cameras can do on quadcopters NOW in the hands of the average person.
This is where I feel the P3 shines. The ability to easily change the settings from the remote is very empowering. With the GoPro you are pretty much stuck with whatever you set it at on the ground.

The "best of" both cameras are probably quite similar, but flexibility wins out IMHO.

On the other hand if ALL my videos were very close in shots I'd probably choose the GoPro. But the whole idea of AP is to be up and away - so the P3 is far superior IMHO.

What outcome were you expecting with that question on a P3 forum? There's going to be a little bias being that everyone here spent over $1k USD and justifying their purchase is the natural thing to do. Try this poll in the P2 forum. You'll get opposite results.

rogeruzun@gmail Posted at 2015-5-7 12:29
I uploaded a comparison between the two cameras.  Shot at the same time.  I had my P3 Pro hover and  ...

Thanks for the test Roger!    I think there's no question the P3 camera is far superior.   

Worth saying I base nothing on AUTO modes on any camera.   The P3 image has dead straight lines and a really good starting point for grading.

Ultimately this is what the P3 and Inspire were designed for, elegant filming that gives you plenty of options in post.

When it comes to a "point-and-shoot" I think the GoPro is fantastic, especially for sports and selfie use.   

The are both Sony Camera's the Hero 4 & DJI's so very similar results, I believe they also use the exact same chip I've read it somewhere.

droneflyers.com Posted at 2015-5-25 06:32
The most fair comparison is what the cameras can do on quadcopters NOW in the hands of the average p ...

Someone should compare the Solo with GoPro control to the P3.  I realize the Solo is not shipping quite yet, but they are in several people's hands.  

Doesn't anyone else just use lens profiles to remove the fish eye effect of GoPro?  It isnt perfect, but with high res and cropping works well.  

Being able to fully control a GoPro settings dynamically in the air is pretty exciting to me.   

earldgrayjr Posted at 2015-5-26 04:34
Someone should compare the Solo with GoPro control to the P3.  I realize the Solo is not shipping q ...

To my knowledge there are no real Solos in the hands of regular folks and will not be any with gimbals for at least a month or so.

Can you fix some things in post? Of course - what percentage of buyers of these machines do you think do any post productions? That's a relatively technical task - plus, it's time consuming. Sure, if you are doing commercial work or a real artist with time on your hands, it's possible. But just like with smart phones, people want to take pics and vids and post them.

The GP has a very small lens and is designed for close in work. My guess is that it will take close up wakeboarding videos which are better than a P3. But for the majority of everyday use, I think the better lens and the specific design for aerial use will favor the P3 for most users.

It's worth noting that the GP4 on a Solo costs vastly more than a P3 - so that must be figured in. You are, in effect, getting the same or less for more $$$.

If this is not true it's up to 3DR and their users to prove it in the coming months.

droneflyers.com Posted at 2015-5-26 10:11
To my knowledge there are no real Solos in the hands of regular folks and will not be any with gim ...

I realize it is not for everyone, but there are changeable lense mods for GoPro.  I have several GoPro's and they have better color and low light.  Understood that post is not for everyone, but I also like the idea of not having a copter tied to a specific camera.   New cameras come more often than copters...

Look at your own pictures, especially after you fixed the p3 from being underexposed...  the mountains show a big difference in picture quality between the 2 cameras...    I own the gopro 4 black and run it on my F550 and the video I get with my pc is way better..  it's more crisp and way sharper

droneflyers.com Posted at 2015-5-26 10:11
To my knowledge there are no real Solos in the hands of regular folks and will not be any with gim ...

Not if you already own the GoPro...   And they give you a free xtra battery right now...

So... Assuming that...
Solo $1000
Gimbal $400
Total $1400

Vs

P3 W/Extra battery
$1100

Cheaper for sure, but not VASTLY cheaper....   If you need waypoints, follow,  or orbit, the Solo has that now...  And they have a 30 day no questions money back gaurantee, and a fly away gaurantee that includes your GoPro...

And then there is service....

earldgrayjr Posted at 2015-6-4 05:42
Not if you already own the GoPro...   And they give you a free xtra battery right now...

So... Ass ...

Solo doesn't have waypoints.

Already having a $400 or $500 camera doesn't count as free.

And, again, the only reason you are getting a free battery is that you can't do ANYTHING with the machine for 6 weeks or more. So you are buying a car without tires.

The basic comparison is like this.
Solo with GP Silver and Gimbal = $1800 (in August)
P3 Advanced = $999 (now or in August).

Another way of looking at it....
Crash the Solo into the drink - you are out $1800
Crash the P3 into the drink - you are out $1000

They are not in the same price category. That doesn't mean lots of people won't buy a Solo - lots of people buy cars at every price level and sometimes pay double for something similar due to other factors (nameplate, handling, etc.).

As it stands the Solo contains a lot of "ifs".
If they, against all odds, come out with a gimbal which is as good as DJI's and the entire Solo/GP/Gimbal system works together perfectly....then we can see what type of video and shot the public is getting and make a decision as to whether it's worth almost twice the price.

But let's not pretend that $800 doesn't make a diff to most consumers...nor should we think that most consumers are going to like fisheye once they get used to having a rectilinear view.

Some will, though. As they say in the car biz, there is a arse for every seat.

Here is a little sample of Phantom 3 at  work -

I have a Hero 4 Black.  I have a Phantom 3 Pro.  I think the Phantom camera has a few advantages.  

1. The Phantom 3 has a rectilinear lens. The requirement of  De-Fishing the Hero 4 image in 4K significantly reduces the effective resolution.  If you are using both at 1080P it's less of an issue.  But I do think the lens is better on the Phantom 3.

2. The exposure control over the Phantom 3 camera in flight is much easier.  The Phantom 3 is fully integrated into the flight controller.  It's really nice to be able to dial in the exposure with the control wheel and see the histogram live on the display.

3. Dynamic range is very similar.  If you shoot in "Log" mode the Phantom 3 has excellent cinematic dynamic range.  (The normal mode is way too contrasty and useless.)

I always shoot in Log mode with contrast and saturation dialed down. This gives me a nice flat look. The only concern I had with the image out-of-the-box was motion artifacts in 4K.  So I dial the sharpness all the way down as well and I never have any motion artifacts. The 60 mbit/s codec doesn't get stressed as much when the image is softer. Then I turn up contrast and sharpness in post - voila! Excellent cinematic results. I sometimes add a bezier warp filter in After Effects to compensate for the slight barrel/moustache distortion.

jimhare Posted at 2015-5-25 16:38
Thanks for the test Roger!    I think there's no question the P3 camera is far superior.   

Worth ...

Decided I *must* have something that will hold my GoPro. Really, I'm just kidding. In addition to the P3P and a Blade 350 I have a GoPro and a Chinese clone (which is, unfortunately, a classic example of you get what you pay for!).

On the one hand I really enjoy the flexibility of the GoPro. On the other hand, it appears that the Blade is not the only platform that doesn't like WiFi from the GoPro. Obviously, without the WiFi, the GoPro just becomes a "...set in on the ground and hope it's okay later..." type of venture.

From a non-professional aspect, the P3P (despite the currently buggy Pilot app) offers the best opportunity for an amateur to act like a professional.

You (I'm addressing this to Jim Hare) wrote a couple of weeks back, writing that users need to identify their goals. I did that - finally. It appears that I should have bought either the Blade or the Phantom, but not both. The obvious 3rd option would have been to wait on the 3DR.

Now that I've been "challenged" to identify my goals, I've decided to keep both quads. It appears that I'm destined to be a guy who pilots his quad around and sort of happens to be taking pictures/video while doing so. I did make an effort yesterday to do something that would have a professional look to it - it's a lot harder than I thought. Of course, some of the obstacles are the physical obstacles in my arena (mostly trees!) and flying with my heart in my throat, trying not to let my bird get very far away!

So my Blade might well be my bird of choice for routine flying, playing, videoing, etc. The CG02 camera is not too bad, the gimbal is pretty stable and the fish-eye isn't too bad (and I can process it out later anyway). If I come across an aspect that demands something far better, I'll break out the P3P, cross my fingers and shoot away.

My videos will amaze me, probably bore my wife (again) and, like my athletic endeavors, I'll continue to compete against - myself!

I'm still collecting all the hints and tips I find here - both for the Phantom and the photographic aspects. Just note that there's probably no need for National Geo to keep an eye on what I'm doing!

aburkefl@gmail. Posted at 2015-6-12 21:00
Decided I *must* have something that will hold my GoPro. Really, I'm just kidding. In addition to  ...

(despite the currently buggy Pilot app)

Which version of the app are you using?  IOS or Android?

I've used the IOS app on the Inspire and then the P3 for almost 4 months now and never had a single issue with it.  I'm on IOS, which gives the added advantage of the Overexposure Warning, which in my opinion is one of the most important features you can have for good exposure on the fly.

I know what you mean about heart in your throat.   Took me quite a while to get over my fear of losing the bird every time I flew.   Eventually I started trusting it and now fly over cliffs, over water, and far away.  Very liberating in a way!   The alternative is keep my Inspire and P3 safely at home on a pillow but what fun is that?   

jimhare Posted at 2015-6-13 08:26
(despite the currently buggy Pilot app)

Which version of the app are you using?  IOS or Android?

I'm using an Android device - I despise iTunes! I've had an iPad for quite some time, but it's too old and too big to use with the P3. Been toying with buying an older version of the Nexus tab that works with the app.

The other day I made a short video in the canals at a local park. My wife was stunned when she saw me flying over water, but I had to be honest and tell her that was the Blade and not the Phantom!

It might be my imagination, but it seems like the Yuneeq gimbal on the Blade provides smoother motion than the gimbal on the P3. Then again, maybe I've just gotten more comfortable with how to maneuver the Blade vs how to maneuver the Phantom.

It just seems logical that if I can get comfy with the P3P it has far greater potential (photographically speaking) than the Blade.

aburkefl@gmail. Posted at 2015-6-13 19:02
I'm using an Android device - I despise iTunes! I've had an iPad for quite some time, but it's too ...

If you're having any app problems whatsoever you can blame it on Android as the IOS app is perfect, as well as having the much needed overexposure warning.    I use the iPhone 6, love iTunes and have no problems at all.  

The gimbal on the P3 is incredible so you might be in the wrong mode if you're getting any kind of movement/shake whatsoever.    Really, you should see nothing but perfectly snooth motion on the P3.

jimhare Posted at 2015-6-13 19:26
If you're having any app problems whatsoever you can blame it on Android as the IOS app is perfect, ...

I should have clarified somewhat.

My complaint (and it's either very minor, or it's just my poor flying skills) is when turning the Phantom. I'm trying to get better at turning without stopping. In my opinion, the continuing motion is more pleasing and it's less "bumpy."

It *seems* very easy to turn while moving and keep it very smooth when I'm flying the Blade. By contrast, I find it very difficult (so far) to turn the P3 without making it seem too quick - you know, one of those things where the platform spins, the world spins by, seemingly out of control and the viewer either gets dizzy or wants to throw up!

Maybe the P3 gimbal is so fine-tuned that it requires even slower, smoother turn/rotation. As my fear of flying it diminishes, I'm hoping I'll get better with practice. Despite my perception of the Blade being smoother, it should be a no-brainer that the P3 is a much better platform. Consequently, I'm currently blaming the "problem" on my flying skills.

aburkefl@gmail. Posted at 2015-6-13 19:42
I should have clarified somewhat.

My complaint (and it's either very minor, or it's just my poor  ...

Ah yes.   I wouldn't classify that as a gimbal issue, more about fine control over the bird.

What some have done to improve this is to trim the gains on the sticks.   Obviously reduces power but will give you more control over fine movements.

jimhare Posted at 2015-6-14 05:33
Ah yes.   I wouldn't classify that as a gimbal issue, more about fine control over the bird.

What ...

This is a guess, but - I made a "run" with my P3 and didn't realize it was set for 1080 - don't remember the frame rate. It didn't look as jerky as I remembered from the last time. So I changed the format to 4K - the largest choice 4000x3000 whatever it is and 24 fps. This time it was a little more herky-jerky on the turns.
All the settings were on AUTO.

Is it possible that, as bright as it is in the middle of the day, that the shutter speed just can't handle that without filtering? By "slowing down" to 1080, would that alter the other auto settings sufficiently that motion looks a tad smoother?

It seems to look fine when flying pretty much in a straight line. I don't seem to see any "jello" or other movement. But, either rotating the P3 or turning causes what looks like "...turning too fast..." particularly when the fps is only 24 in the 4K mode.

aburkefl@gmail. Posted at 2015-6-14 06:49
This is a guess, but - I made a "run" with my P3 and didn't realize it was set for 1080 - don't re ...

You are actually talking about at least four different subjects at once.

The First is frame rate.   If you shoot 60FPS the motion is going to be smoother than 24.   There is a tradeoff because 24 looks cinematic but you need to control how fast your movement is, and 60 looks like a Mexican Soap Opera but is smooth to the eye.

The Second is computer power required to play large files.   Most computers will not play 4k h.264 smoothly, requires too much power.   So unless you are transcoding your files (rendering them into a CODEC easier for the computer to handle) then you can't base any results on what they look like when being played back.

The Third is piloting.  How did you fly during each shoot and what are the variables.

The Fourth is shutter speed.   Shutter can have a drastic effect on how stuttery or smooth a video looks.  If it has lot's of motion blur it's a lower shutter speed.  If it's very staccato in its movements then it's fast.


So plenty to unravel before coming to any conclusions here.  ;-)

Finally, AUTO is your enemy!  

jimhare Posted at 2015-6-14 07:12
You are actually talking about at least four different subjects at once.

The First is frame rate.  ...

LOL - leave it up to me to get four "strands" going at once!

Thanks Jim - most of what you wrote makes perfect sense but I have to admit I totally forgot about the 4K playback. I kept the individual "pieces" I shot earlier today - did some more after supper. I'll process the 4K into 1080 and take a peek, then compare (if I can) the original 1080 stuff with the down-processed 4K stuff.

I hear you about AUTO being my enemy. However, if I have to spend too much time in the "lab" processing stuff later, I'll end up getting more involved than I think I want to be! Remember? I'm the guy who decided I'm just taking home videos from a aerial platform! LOL

aburkefl@gmail. Posted at 2015-6-14 07:49
LOL - leave it up to me to get four "strands" going at once!

Thanks Jim - most of what you wrote  ...

LOL!   For someone who just wants to take home videos you seem to be delving very deep into the abyss!   

jimhare Posted at 2015-6-14 08:03
LOL!   For someone who just wants to take home videos you seem to be delving very deep into the ab ...

I think I've been drawn into that vortex thing that wrecks quads!

Well, sometimes I profess that I really don't care about something. But then I catch myself reading the manual!

I have a niece who says she suffers from CDO. That's someone who suffers so badly from OCD that they have to get the letters in the correct sequence! I think sometimes that affliction hits me and I discover that regardless of whether I really need to know something, or not, I try to find out any way!

aburkefl@gmail. Posted at 2015-6-14 08:11
I think I've been drawn into that vortex thing that wrecks quads!

Well, sometimes I profess that  ...

Ha ha!   That made me laugh out loud, well done!

All I can say is it's incredibly rewarding when you finally make your footage look like a million bucks.    I say follow your CDO and go the extra mile.   

Once you have the knowledge and experience it's just as easy to make something look great than it does to make it look ordinary and disappointing.  

Worth the effort, even if just to impress yourself and your friends!

I dont have the Hero4 but the Hero3 BE with a new non fisheye lens und i would prefer the P3 camera in terms of video quality, it shows more details, finer details compared to Gopro3 BE and there is one important factor which is the ISO range. When your goal is 1/60 shutterspeed with a gopro you have to use ND filters and since there is no manual mode you cant set ISO fixed to 100. That means the first thing the camera will do with an ND filter is it changes ISO above 100 and after that it changes shutterspeeds. Furthermore you can never know the exact shutterspeed it uses, it wont go down to 1/60 because of ISO is not set to 100. So with an ND32 filter you have maybe a 1/320 shutterspeed and ISO 400 and that is not what we want. So a gopro is not ideal for filming with multicopters. With the P3 i can set ISO to 100 all the time and can choose the shutterspeed. ISO400 or higher will show noise.

So Jim and others with multiple DJI copters; would you buy one Inspire or two Phantom 3 Professionals with spare battery for regular utility filming?

Comparing them is really difficult because they are really different cameras.

The gopro is made for another use, has a wide lense and a slightly better sensor than the p3 camera ( you can see the difference especially in low light conditions). However if you are looking to record profesionally, the p3 camera has a much more cinematic look because of it's lense.
So it really comes out for what kind of footage you are looking for. Oh and I have both and have tested everything that could be - .

I WAS VERY SUPRISED THAT I COULDNOT SET THE APPERTURE ON THE CAMERA OF THE PHANTOM 3. Imo a very spupid compromise of dji to exclude apperture setting in the app.
Every serious photographer or moviemaker for that matter wants to controle his apperture, but to my great suprise it is NOT POSSIBLE. Can anybody tell me what the reason behind this move is?
IMO SO STUPID, the question is: CAN IT BE CORRECTED?