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DJI Speaks with fork tongue (geo-fence) guy
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1235 63 2018-7-31
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kowal63
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Dear Customer,




Thanks for your patience.


For your case CAS-2009512-Z2B2D9, we have finished the data analysis, and the result is as follows:
  1. The aircraft worked in GPS mode during the flight;
2. The aircraft took off in the  Authorization Zone then flew out of the Authorization Zone. The license  of permission expired at the middle of the flight, so the aircraft  cannot flew into the Authorization Zone;
3. At t=10:09, h=45 m, d=228 m,  battery 21%, RTH was triggered due to Low battery, but the aircraft  cannot flew into the Authorization Zone since the permission was  expired;
4. At t=11:23, h=45 m, d=144 m,  battery 12%, Landing was triggered due to Critically Low Battery, the  aircraft started to descend, then the flight record ended at t=13:41,  h=15 m, d=150 m.



According to the analysis, the incident was not caused by any malfunctioned factors. Please fly with caution.


We truly appreciate your support for  DJI. If you could not recover the product and consider to purchase  another one, we can offer you a 15% off coupon code for Spark (Lava  Red) without the remote controller, which can be used  during payment on DJI’s online store:
http://store.dji.com/product/spark


Please email me if you would like the  coupon code with the contents such as “I accept the offer”. And may I  know would you like to ship the aircraft to United States when placing  the order?


Should you have more questions about  the result of the data analysis, please reply to this email directly  within 15 calendar days. Then we will contact you via email in 2-3  working days.




Best regards,


Lydia
DJI Tech Support
http://www.dji.com/


another words....they are trying to say sucker......

2018-7-31
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Carmenvail
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Locking you in a geo fence wea a DJI system failure
2018-7-31
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S-e-ven
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DJI, this:
2. The aircraft took off in the  Authorization Zone then flew out of the Authorization Zone. The license  of permission expired at the middle of the flight, so the aircraft  cannot flew into the Authorization Zone
and this:
According to the analysis, the incident was not caused by any malfunctioned factors. Please fly with caution.

does not really end up, methinks!

That is, imho, a design mistake in your app/authorization process.
As long you can take off with authorisation in a nfz, you should be able to end the flight if flying out of that zone, in such short 10-16 minutes frame!
People can only take off in that 24h window, which is  ok.
But land/fly back in, IF IN THE AIR, should be minimum  granted up to 1 or 1.5 battery flighttimes later.

just my2c
2018-7-31
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kowal63
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S-e-ven Posted at 2018-7-31 05:32
DJI, this:
2. The aircraft took off in the  Authorization Zone then flew out of the Authorization Zone. The license  of permission expired at the middle of the flight, so the aircraft  cannot flew into the Authorization Zone
and this:

I feel like DJI kicked me in the B@lls,,,,,,,,,no way to treat customers
2018-7-31
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kowal63
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they released this update...the very next day after incident ....
2018-7-31
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MarkMN
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kowal63 Posted at 2018-7-31 06:54
[view_image]

they released this update...the very next day after incident ....

I agree with you that DJI has treated you unjustly in this matter, but just what do you think that update had to do with your situation?

Previously if you were using a wifi connection to the RC, and did not have a data plan on your phone it was impossible to update the GEO Zone database without connecting to a PC and using the PC app. I believe what they've done is simply cache the update so you can now do it with just your phone. Nothing at all to do with your problem.
2018-7-31
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towheaded-pilot1
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"2. The aircraft took off in the  Authorization Zone then flew out of the Authorization Zone. The license  of permission expired at the middle of the flight, so the aircraft  cannot flew into the Authorization Zone;"

Now we are locked within the unlocked geo-fence and cannot venture out without risking loss of drone? Wow.... this is scary. If the authorization zone is unlocked (24hours??), then it should stay that way.
2018-7-31
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S-e-ven
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MarkMN Posted at 2018-7-31 09:13
I agree with you that DJI has treated you unjustly in this matter, but just what do you think that update had to do with your situation?

Previously if you were using a wifi connection to the RC, and did not have a data plan on your phone it was impossible to update the GEO Zone database without connecting to a PC and using the PC app. I believe what they've done is simply cache the update so you can now do it with just your phone. Nothing at all to do with your problem.

I think so, too.
Next day is not a reaction time for one incidence like this.
Usually the reaction time is a bit longer, this update was in the pipeline before this sad diving of a Spark!
2018-7-31
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Mittens
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I don't unlock zones... but this is a system fault, not yours.. Unless there is some warning that pops up telling you, hey if you leave the zone we just gave you permission in, you cant come back..... other wise, I agree normal logic is you have 24 hour access... or at LEAST that power cycle of the remove and Drone it self... Check out some of my other threads.... take a stand and puch hard on them in chat and phone calls.
2018-7-31
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S-e-ven
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Mittens Posted at 2018-7-31 09:40
I don't unlock zones... but this is a system fault, not yours.. Unless there is some warning that pops up telling you, hey if you leave the zone we just gave you permission in, you cant come back..... other wise, I agree normal logic is you have 24 hour access... or at LEAST that power cycle of the remove and Drone it self... Check out some of my other threads.... take a stand and puch hard on them in chat and phone calls.

" or at LEAST that power cycle of the remove and Drone it self."

That is exactely my pov here, too.

Ok, it is a very special case.
Starting in the last 5 minutes of the permition and flying out of the nfz. OVER water.
But also just some time after DJI has changed the timeslot from 72h to 24, if I got that right.

But anyway: If DJI accepts an authorisation, they need to put a failsafe in: Either no starts in the 10-30 minutes before the end of the 24h (1 battery flight time), or starting till the end of the 24h, but still authorized till landing. There is usually nothing else possible, methinks.

I would try to get in contact with some admins, here.
The service is only callcenter with FAQ-folders.
Here there is a bit more to expect
2018-7-31
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kowal63
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Mittens Posted at 2018-7-31 09:40
I don't unlock zones... but this is a system fault, not yours.. Unless there is some warning that pops up telling you, hey if you leave the zone we just gave you permission in, you cant come back..... other wise, I agree normal logic is you have 24 hour access... or at LEAST that power cycle of the remove and Drone it self... Check out some of my other threads.... take a stand and puch hard on them in chat and phone calls.

I was talking to dji online chat....they are saying it is my fault.....they are saying the geozone activating during flight was my fault....i said at the very least they could write code that would at least RTH in an event like this.....over a crowd of people this could have turned out worse....
2018-7-31
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kowal63
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S-e-ven Posted at 2018-7-31 09:56
" or at LEAST that power cycle of the remove and Drone it self."

That is exactely my pov here, too.

I am not having luck with DJI they are now trying to say it was not their fault....i was helpless and they knew it...i told them if i was not using my phone with the RC and app...i could have taken a video of it going in...was not that far away....just over water and out of reach....this is no way to treat customers...i have a mavic pro and goggles too....i was getting excited about mavic pro 2 and the larger camera sensor ....my excitement for it is fading fast....smh....
2018-7-31
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Mittens
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I would push and start a new case every day, but who knows.
2018-7-31
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kowal63
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Mittens Posted at 2018-7-31 10:54
I would push and start a new case every day, but who knows.

I can't afford not to...i will be very active on social media and forums as well....i would not want this happening to anyone....not kool
2018-7-31
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kowal63
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this is where everything happened line of sight the whole time...
2018-7-31
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BrandonW77
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Yet another reason to avoid this firmware update.  What a mess.
2018-7-31
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DronerX
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How’s does one get permission to fly in an Authorization Zone?
2018-7-31
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DronerX
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Some how I fiigured it out yesterday and got  a one day permission, but today I can’t get the menu to pop up that allowed me to get the permission yesterday. What am I missing?
2018-7-31
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kowal63
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DronerX Posted at 2018-7-31 12:00
Some how I fiigured it out yesterday and got  a one day permission, but today I can’t get the menu to pop up that allowed me to get the permission yesterday. What am I missing?

you have to enter a debit/credit card number...or use cell phone to get a txt message sent to you..to re-enter
2018-7-31
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kowal63
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latest update....they are saying it was my fault....this is like a plane taking off and then making the airport disappear...messed up

Dear Customer,


Thanks for getting back to us.

We are sorry for the inconvenience caused and we do understanding your disappointment. However, the analysis result was based on your flight data. According to your flight data, the aircraft was controlled to take off in an Authorization Zone. When RTH was triggered, the permission for the Authorization Zone expired so the aircraft could not fly back home. For the incidnet flight record, you could also check that through your DJI GO 4 APP.

Should you have more questions, please feel free to let us know.

Thank you so much for your support. Have a nice day.


Best Regards,

Lydia
DJI Tech Support
http://www.dji.com/
2018-8-1
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Rbstansbury
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kowal63 Posted at 2018-8-1 04:02
latest update....they are saying it was my fault....this is like a plane taking off and then making the airport disappear...messed up

Dear Customer,


I would continue to purse this until DJI admits fault, been on these forums for a long time and have never seen such a crazy conclusion from DJI, this is not pilot error, this is 100% their fault and of course it would make no sense to sue over this but in a court of law you would win in less than 12 seconds flat!  Your story seriously makes me wonder if I will ever purchase another drone from a company that  in their wildest dreams could ever come to the conclusion they did in your case, then to offer 15% discount, wrong, wrong, wrong, a big slap in the face!  so sorry, I feel for you and hope DJI reconsiders this
2018-8-1
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kowal63
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Rbstansbury Posted at 2018-8-1 05:10
I would continue to purse this until DJI admits fault, been on these forums for a long time and have never seen such a crazy conclusion from DJI, this is not pilot error, this is 100% their fault and of course it would make no sense to sue over this but in a court of law you would win in less than 12 seconds flat!  Your story seriously makes me wonder if I will ever purchase another drone from a company that  in their wildest dreams could ever come to the conclusion they did in your case, then to offer 15% discount, wrong, wrong, wrong, a big slap in the face!  so sorry, I feel for you and hope DJI reconsiders this

I am as busy on all the social networks as i can....i do not want to see anyone go through this....i was completely helpless as i watched it hover in front of me about 25 feet away until battery expired and she went in.... so wrong
2018-8-1
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S-e-ven
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BrandonW77 Posted at 2018-7-31 11:48
Yet another reason to avoid this firmware update.  What a mess.

Has nothing to do with the new firmware! nfz is in all DJI fw's
2018-8-1
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Northwood
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Well, I totally agree that this is a design fault and almost totally DJI's responsibility.  However, flying in an authorization zone, if it were me, I would simply not do it.  A very short distance from an international border....  My sympathies all the same.
2018-8-1
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Rbstansbury
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Northwood Posted at 2018-8-1 08:11
Well, I totally agree that this is a design fault and almost totally DJI's responsibility.  However, flying in an authorization zone, if it were me, I would simply not do it.   My sympathies all the same.

after reading this thread, I'd never fly in an authorization zone either, evidently if you happen to fly out of the zone you have a good chance of losing drone which supposedly isn't dji's fault, I'd like to see a manual or documentation from dji that describes this scenario and possible outcome , my apologies if this documentation exists and I have missed it otherwise how can this not be dji's fault?
2018-8-1
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Mittens
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so what color are these zones?  I cant fly in a red zone period, but green and yellows I don't do anything the drone just flys?
2018-8-1
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kowal63
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Mittens Posted at 2018-8-1 08:52
so what color are these zones?  I cant fly in a red zone period, but green and yellows I don't do anything the drone just flys?



my yellow zone...i cannot takeoff without doing an online unlock
2018-8-1
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DJI Tony
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Hi, I apologize for the inconvenience and trouble caused. I will forward this concern to the corresponding team so that we can check for the best resolution possible. Again we are sorry for the bad experience.
2018-8-1
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kowal63
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DJI Tony Posted at 2018-8-1 10:15
Hi, I apologize for the inconvenience and trouble caused. I will forward this concern to the corresponding team so that we can check for the best resolution possible. Again we are sorry for the bad experience.

thanks......i already have the mavic pro and goggles...plus an osmo mobile also....i was very excited about the new mavic pro 2 with larger camera sensor....i cannot eat this loss...(spark) it was totally not my fault....thank you Tony
2018-8-1
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DJI Diana
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kowal63 Posted at 2018-8-1 10:20
thanks......i already have the mavic pro and goggles...plus an osmo mobile also....i was very excited about the new mavic pro 2 with larger camera sensor....i cannot eat this loss...(spark) it was totally not my fault....thank you Tony

Hi Leo, I was able to check your information using your case number above. We completely understand how you feel about the result. We are very sorry about this. We would like you to know that before we provide the final result to our valued customers, we made sure that our Data Analysis are fair enough about the investigation. The data analysis result was made by an independent technical team based on the flight records/data you’ve provided. Unfortunately, DJI cannot apply warranty service for the incident that was not caused by any malfunctioned factors. But in the other hand, 15% discount coupon for your next purchase is being offered to you. If you could not retrieve the drone and still want to purchase a new one, you can reply "I accept the offer" to send you the discount coupon. Once again, Sorry for the unfortunate experience and thank you so much for your understanding.
2018-8-1
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kowal63
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DJI Diana Posted at 2018-8-1 10:34
Hi Leo, I was able to check your information using your case number above. We completely understand how you feel about the result. We are very sorry about this. We would like you to know that before we provide the final result to our valued customers, we made sure that our Data Analysis are fair enough about the investigation. The data analysis result was made by an independent technical team based on the flight records/data you’ve provided. Unfortunately, DJI cannot apply warranty service for the incident that was not caused by any malfunctioned factors. But in the other hand, 15% discount coupon for your next purchase is being offered to you. If you could not retrieve the drone and still want to purchase a new one, you can reply "I accept the offer" to send you the discount coupon. Once again, Sorry for the unfortunate experience and thank you so much for your understanding.

so sad.....who treats customers this way? ..... wow...i had no way to get it back it locked up mid flight....
2018-8-1
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Mittens
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so DJI software, allows you to take off and not to land, and that's your fault and not DJI?

that's messed up
2018-8-1
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kowal63
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Mittens Posted at 2018-8-1 10:53
so DJI software, allows you to take off and not to land, and that's your fault and not DJI?

that's messed up

it is awful customer treatment.....so sad
2018-8-1
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DJI Diana
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kowal63 Posted at 2018-8-1 10:59
it is awful customer treatment.....so sad

You have our sincere apologies for the unpleasant experience with our customer support team, Leo. This concern has been forwarded to higher team to investigate and follow up, we will have someone to contact you soon about the next resolution, we are sorry again for the inconvenience caused.
2018-8-1
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kowal63
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DJI Diana Posted at 2018-8-1 11:50
You have our sincere apologies for the unpleasant experience with our customer support team, Leo. This concern has been forwarded to higher team to investigate and follow up, we will have someone to contact you soon about the next resolution, we are sorry again for the inconvenience caused.

thank you...i only want to be treated fair...i have had this spark for a year not a problem until this event....i don't even fly in double digit winds...10mph is my limit....very cautious
2018-8-1
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DJI Diana
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kowal63 Posted at 2018-8-1 12:07
thank you...i only want to be treated fair...i have had this spark for a year not a problem until this event....i don't even fly in double digit winds...10mph is my limit....very cautious

We completely understand and we are sorry again about the inconvenience. You will be contacted within 24 to 48 business hours.
2018-8-1
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Northwood
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This is a highly unusual situation, I dont think I have read anyone else having this issue, and I would not want it to happen to me, for sure..  I am glad that DJI is now escalating this.... to have to watch your drone hovering over water until the battery dies and not being able to return to land is crazy...  I am sure in the end they will do the right thing.  
2018-8-3
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kowal63
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Just got a call from DJI....they said tough luck....we will sell you another one for 15% off........hell of a way to treat customers......unreal....i was left helpless out over the water

only fellow drone owners will be able to figure this out

Wow! wow! wow! What a fight!

Let me re-enact last 3.5 minutes of your Spark's life:
9m 59 sec – Return home warning – battery low

10m 2 sec – you stop flying.

10m 9 sec – drone starts automatic RTH sequence tripped by low battery power. This is correct action.

10m 12 sec – automatic heading alignment in the direction of home point is completed – drone starts flying back but skims along geo-fence unable to penetrate it. It is not flying in the direction it is pointing to (home point) but rather along the geo-fence getting closer to home.

This is bad but consistent with behaviour observed in case https://forum.dji.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=152623

You are not providing any stick input – just waiting for Spark to do its job.

11m 21 sec – Spark is near closest point to home on the other side of the fence – its further progress along the fence would only take it further away. So it stops.

11m 22 sec – You switch to Sport mode thus cancelling RTH (which was useless anyways) but you do not touch sticks. Nothing happens since nothing can happen.

11m 24 sec – Spark initiates auto-landing due to critical battery level. Altitude 45 metres. You are not touching your sticks.

11m 28 sec – You start turning camera down – but still no directional input for drone.

11m 33 sec – Finally you decide to take control and start flying Spark – you cannot get through geo-fence – your actions are chaotic – Spark is going down.

11m 41 sec – You give up. Spark is 17 metres above water and landing with speed about 1 m/s.

11m 46 sec – You direct Spark to fly up. It obeys. You do it for half a second only and than watch in horror as Spark continues is journey down.

Few more chaotic stick movements follow but Spark is pretty much stuck and going down.

12 m 11 sec – 5 metres above water. You attempt to raise the elevation and you succeed. Battery is down to 6%

13 m 22 sec – You got Spark 53 metres up, you are facing roughly good direction and you are trying like crazy to fly home. Geo-fence stops you. Battery level is 0%. Doom is almost inevitable.

13m 31 sec – forced landing due to no power left.

Your Spark sinks while your right thumb is on full throttle forward in your direction but Spark is being stopped by geo-fence.

This was extremely well done and good fight. Congratulations!

I suspect that had you hit RTH again while Spark was stuck at the fence - it would have flown through it as was in case of 62+. However, I do not know for sure since 62+ case was slightly different - his geo-fence was not enforced airport geo-fence but rather geo-fence he set himself by setting max flight distance in DJI GO App. I strongly suspect that behaviour would be the same (that is - success) but I am not sure.

If you have warranty I would be very surprised if DJI would not honor it.

This is very clearly DJI design error which prevented you from safe landing despite quite heroic efforts.
DJI allowed you to operate within restricted space and yet, once you flew out, they did not allow you to come back. Very, very clear error on DJI part.

Good luck and please keep us posted on your success with DJI.
2018-8-3
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kowal63
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#Quick Reply Here#https://app.airdata.com/share/suPjeA/GENERALOverview
2018-8-3
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DJI Susan
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kowal63 Posted at 2018-8-3 15:01
#Quick Reply Here#https://app.airdata.com/share/suPjeA/GENERALOverview

Hi Leo, we've read your post on Facebook and responded as well. Upon checking the case status, the GEO was started around 2018-07-11 17:22:51 UTC and ended 2018-07-12 17:22:51 UTC. This is the UTC time, you may find the below screenshot to confirm. We sincerely suggest checking the end time before the flight. For your situation, we're sorry that we cannot offer you warranty service. Hope for your understanding.
GEO.png
2018-8-4
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