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H.265 VERY CPU Intensive!
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imwhitey
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I have a brand spanking new MacBook Pro (most recent release with Intel i7) and H.265 in 4K resolution is pretty much unplayable in Adobe Premiere Pro CC2018! Had to convert it to Apple ProRes 422 and then it was easy to work with! For this video below, I did this workflow method and then rendered back out to H.265 for uplaoding to YouTube and the workflow, whlle tedious, seems to have great results.

2018-8-29
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ibdunn
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I dumped my brand new macbook pro -2017 intel i7 16gb ram cause it couldn't handle the DJI 4k videos!!  I bought an MSI laptop Windows 10 - flawless power house -I've been mac forever but they aren't cutting it!!  Great video
2018-8-29
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El Diablo
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2018-8-29
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Chasing Light & Shadows
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El Diablo Posted at 2018-8-29 23:08
Used to edit videos in an iMac 5K until I discovered that my iPad Pro with Luma Fusion (20$ software) can do the same 3 times faster ;)

Does Lumafusion edit 4k h.265 ok? Will have to give it a go if it does.
2018-8-30
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El Diablo
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2018-8-30
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Chasing Light & Shadows
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El Diablo Posted at 2018-8-30 03:34
Although I haven't used that format yet (my Mavic 2 Pro is on the way), from their website it seems that it does:

What types of media are supported by LumaFusion?

Thanks, I'd already read that from their website, I was after some first hand experience cuz I heard the DJI h.265 is extra laggy for some reason. I'll give it a test once my drone arrives.
2018-8-30
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El Diablo
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2018-8-30
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Alessandro Garabaghi
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iMac Pro base model
h265 HGL is unplayable in PPCC2018

Proxy should be fine but still crazy. Will try in resolve later.
2018-8-30
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Chasing Light & Shadows
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El Diablo Posted at 2018-8-30 03:56
My iPad pro 12" is less than one year old, it is a powerhouse. I believe LumaFusion is quite optimized for editing 4K videos in a breeze, i am impressed so far.

I've got the 10" pro, it's unbelievable how well optimised it is.
2018-8-30
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Spraying_Mango
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I was having the same issues trying to edit .mov H.265 files on my MBP. Used Adobe Media Encoder to convert it to .mp4 files and it scrubs perfectly. Maybe it's just a .mov file issue with Adobe?
2018-8-30
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imwhitey
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Spraying_Mango Posted at 2018-8-30 05:04
I was having the same issues trying to edit .mov H.265 files on my MBP. Used Adobe Media Encoder to convert it to .mp4 files and it scrubs perfectly. Maybe it's just a .mov file issue with Adobe?

Hmm I will try some MP4 tests. Thanks for the heads up!
2018-8-30
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Fraggboy
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My 27" iMac is fine handling the H.265 files in FCPX (latest version).  You are able to downgrade the playback window for speed over quality.  3.8GHz i7 with 32GB memory.
2018-8-30
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gnirtS
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Not all the generations of i7 support HEVC acceleration.  It might be that.  No idea what generations crapple use.

Then again actual editing should use video card more than CPU.
2018-8-30
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Fraggboy
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gnirtS Posted at 2018-8-30 06:21
Not all the generations of i7 support HEVC acceleration.  It might be that.  No idea what generations crapple use.

Then again actual editing should use video card more than CPU.

Haha.. Crapple.  Just be honest with yourself, you can't afford 'perfection'.



J/K!  I don't want to stray off-topic.  Everyone has their opinion on what manufacturer is better..  To each their own. You are right, you need a dedicated video card which mine does.
2018-8-30
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Keule
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gnirtS Posted at 2018-8-30 06:21
Not all the generations of i7 support HEVC acceleration.  It might be that.  No idea what generations crapple use.

Then again actual editing should use video card more than CPU.

Hardware decoding of 8 bit HEVC files is supported by 6th generation Intel core (Skylake family) and
10 bit decoding is supported by 7th generation Intel core (Kaby Lake)
2018-8-30
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theothernt
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Some things to think about...

1. If you're recording in H.265, 10bit, 'normal' profile - I'm not sure there is any benefit over H.264, 8bit, 'normal' profile. The better compression and increased colour space are better used with D-Log or HLG which give you more freedom with color grading.

2. MOV and MP4 are the same (basically). They're container formats. MOV is older but MP4 is more widely used on Mac and PC these days. Stick with MP4.

3. As H.265 is relatively new, only the latest AMD & Intel CPUs support hardware encoding/decoding - so most operations will be longer. The same issues existed with H.264 many years ago. As you (and others) have stated, you can always convert to a less compressed format to work with - Apple ProRes or proxies

4. You can export as H.265 then upload to Youtube but it'll just convert it to another format (VP9 and H.264 depending on the platform, etc) so again, I'm not sure what the benefit there is.
2018-8-30
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eYeSkYeYe
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theothernt Posted at 2018-8-30 07:07
Some things to think about...

1. If you're recording in H.265, 10bit, 'normal' profile - I'm not sure there is any benefit over H.264, 8bit, 'normal' profile. The better compression and increased colour space are better used with D-Log or HLG which give you more freedom with color grading.

4. You can export as H.265 then upload to Youtube but it'll just convert it to another format (VP9 and H.264 depending on the platform, etc) so again, I'm not sure what the benefit there is.


This is simply not true.... of course both leading video sharing platforms (YT and Vimeo) do support H.265.



https://support.google.com/youtube/troubleshooter/2888402?hl=en

2018-8-30
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theothernt
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eYeSkYeYe Posted at 2018-8-30 07:28
4. You can export as H.265 then upload to Youtube but it'll just convert it to another format (VP9 and H.264 depending on the platform, etc) so again, I'm not sure what the benefit there is.


Those are a list of supported file formats for upload, not playback.

Google prefer to serve videos in royalty-free formats eg. VP8, VP9
2018-8-30
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eYeSkYeYe
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theothernt Posted at 2018-8-30 08:10
Those are a list of supported file formats for upload, not playback.

Google prefer to serve videos in royalty-free formats eg. VP8, VP9

Correct... nowadays YT emits primarily in VP8 or VP9. But VP9 is very close to HEVC/H.265 and miles in front of H.264. Even H.265 converted to VP9 should be far better than H.264 at any given bitrate and sample size.
2018-8-30
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theothernt
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eYeSkYeYe Posted at 2018-8-30 08:22
Correct... nowadays YT emits primarily in VP8 or VP9. But VP9 is very close to HEVC/H.265 and miles in front of H.264. Even H.265 converted to VP9 should be far better than H.264 at any given bitrate and sample size.

And I should have added to my original post, the OP can do whatever he wants, but using H.265 in certain ways will increase the workflow + processing time but not necessarily the quality.

As for YouTube, I'll have to search around and see if anyone has done any YouTube VP9 vs H.265 comparisons - but suspect YouTube will try and get away with as low a bitrate as they can!
2018-8-30
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Alex Batalov
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Nice Video!
2018-8-30
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Montfrooij
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Looks very good!
2018-8-30
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EdisonW1979
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Fraggboy Posted at 2018-8-30 06:46
Haha.. Crapple.  Just be honest with yourself, you can't afford 'perfection'.

Incorrect person responded to, sorry
2018-8-30
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EdisonW1979
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gnirtS Posted at 2018-8-30 06:21
Not all the generations of i7 support HEVC acceleration.  It might be that.  No idea what generations crapple use.

Then again actual editing should use video card more than CPU.

That is a very immature, and ignorant response...

Did you stop to think for a moment the reason H265 videos play / function like dog poop in PP CC2018 on Mac is because Adobe hasn't updated the encoders / decoders on the macOS version of their bloatware?

H265 media (both main and proxy) work BUTTERY SMOOTH when worked on with apps that have been optimized for the codec / platform, such as Final Cut Pro X 10.4.1...

I dumped that Adobe garbage long ago and am humming along beautifully on FCPX, H265 and all!
2018-8-30
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EdisonW1979
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Fraggboy Posted at 2018-8-30 06:08
My 27" iMac is fine handling the H.265 files in FCPX (latest version).  You are able to downgrade the playback window for speed over quality.  3.8GHz i7 with 32GB memory.

FCPX 10.4.1 has been fully optimized for HW encoding / decoding of H265, unlike Adobe who hasn't bothered to optimize PP CC2018 at all for the Mac, which is why armchair vloggers all over are wetting themselves roasting Mac's claiming they lag behind on video editing tasks, but completely fail to mention this important detail...

Gotta love the vlogging generation!
2018-8-30
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Fraggboy
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EdisonW1979 Posted at 2018-8-30 12:22
That is a very immature, and ignorant response...

Did you stop to think for a moment the reason H265 videos play / function like dog poop in PP CC2018 on Mac is because Adobe hasn't updated the encoders / decoders on the macOS version of their bloatware?

I was scratching my head for a minute, ROFL..
2018-8-30
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EdisonW1979
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Fraggboy Posted at 2018-8-30 12:24
I was scratching my head for a minute, ROFL..

Sorry, not enough caffeine running thru the veins today
2018-8-30
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Fraggboy
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EdisonW1979 Posted at 2018-8-30 12:24
FCPX 10.4.1 has been fully optimized for HW encoding / decoding of H265, unlike Adobe who hasn't bothered to optimize PP CC2018 at all for the Mac, which is why armchair vloggers all over are wetting themselves roasting Mac's claiming they lag behind on video editing tasks, but completely fail to mention this important detail...

Gotta love the vlogging generation!

Well stated!  I love FCPX.  1 payment, with lifetime upgrades.
2018-8-30
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Novadesigns
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Yep, this is very much an Adobe problem. I am currently using Premiere CC 2018, but am considering switching to FCPX as Premiere runs like a sick dog on my 10-core iMac Pro... here's a perfect example. I can load any of my H.265 mov files into Quicktime and they play full screen in real time and I can even scrub them with zero lag and my procs are running at less than 5%. Switch to Premiere and import that same file to the timeline and all my cores are maxed out, and the video stutters and lags even at 1/4 quality in a small display window.

If I transcode that same file to Apple ProRes, performance is massively improved. The processors throttle down to less than 10% and video plays smoothly even with Lumetri correction and full screen/full quality.

This has nothing whatsoever to do with the computer and is entirely the fault of Adobe and their bloated, overpriced software. I think I am ready to switch now.... ;)
2018-8-30
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Fraggboy
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Novadesigns Posted at 2018-8-30 16:04
Yep, this is very much an Adobe problem. I am currently using Premiere CC 2018, but am considering switching to FCPX as Premiere runs like a sick dog on my 10-core iMac Pro... here's a perfect example. I can load any of my H.265 mov files into Quicktime and they play full screen in real time and I can even scrub them with zero lag and my procs are running at less than 5%. Switch to Premiere and import that same file to the timeline and all my cores are maxed out, and the video stutters and lags even at 1/4 quality in a small display window.

If I transcode that same file to Apple ProRes, performance is massively improved. The processors throttle down to less than 10% and video plays smoothly even with Lumetri correction and full screen/full quality.

Wow!!  Running slow on your new iMac Pro is scary.  I wouldn’t hesitate and spend the money on FCPX!  You won’t regret it.  
2018-8-30
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HereForTheBeer
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if you have a mac, for the love of god, dont use adobe premiere...  use final cut pro ._.   

adobe is the worst company ever, they optimize slower than a snail's pace.. and most of everything is handled on the CPU side of things with adobe anyway.. so so slow compared to FCP
2018-8-30
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DRONE-flies-YOU!
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El Diablo Posted at 2018-8-29 23:08
Used to edit videos in an iMac 5K until I discovered that my iPad Pro with Luma Fusion (20$ software) can do the same 3 times faster ;)

Exactly. And can easily handle H.265 100Mbps DJI files no problem. Plus Apple Pencil... makes it fun.
2018-9-16
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DRONE-flies-YOU!
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Chasing Light & Shadows Posted at 2018-8-30 01:25
Does Lumafusion edit 4k h.265 ok? Will have to give it a go if it does.

Yes. In fact crazy good on iPad Pro 10.5. Feels like a super computer with LumaFusion.
2018-9-16
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A CW
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Impressive looking footage  
2018-9-16
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El Diablo
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2018-9-18
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Thriller
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DRONE-flies-YOU! Posted at 2018-9-16 22:38
Yes. In fact crazy good on iPad Pro 10.5. Feels like a super computer with LumaFusion.

Yes it's true. My 10.5 Ipad is very fast with LumaFusion and I can add Lut in few seconds but what about lens distortion? That feature is still missing isn't it?
2018-9-19
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spasov_konstantin
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theothernt Posted at 2018-8-30 07:07
Some things to think about...

1. If you're recording in H.265, 10bit, 'normal' profile - I'm not sure there is any benefit over H.264, 8bit, 'normal' profile. The better compression and increased colour space are better used with D-Log or HLG which give you more freedom with color grading.

Guys, there is no 10bit with H265 NORMAL colour profile, unfortunately only 8bit...
10 bit available only with D-Log and HLG
2019-2-3
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MrTitan
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As has been mentioned the issues with Mac 4K H265 rendering poorly is primarily an Adobe one (though software from other manufacturers may be slow too). As far as I know it’s to do with the way the software utilises Apples architecture. Final Cut Pro X (by Apple) is super speedy. Admittedly I have the 2.9GHz i9 with 32GB Ram and Vega 20, but even a 2016+ i7 MacBook Pro with 16GB ram and standard graphics card should process H254 4K video ok when using FCPX.
2019-2-3
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1cmathis
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I have an older iMac (2014) and have no problem editing H.265 in Final Cut Pro (10.4.5). IMO, Adobe sucks.
2019-2-3
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kazcow
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To add fire to the thread - Apple computers are badly made - period! Give me a ThinkPad anytime.

I do use iPhone/iPad's but I would never again buy any MacBook / Mac computer. Just to expensive to maintain and repair when something fails (and it will). I have 2 "older" MBP's that I'm holding on to as they are from the time when Apple cared slightly more about quality. I have spent hours at "Genius" service to get both fixed - and being told so many "non-truths" from Genius staff that if I had recorded it - it would have gotten millions of youtube views. Apple "Geniuses" have NO idea. Unfortunately they did not know that I design hardware for a living - so in each case I got quoted $1000-$2000 repair costs - which ended up with Apple having to pay for it as I could prove it was known issues and manufacture mistakes. One Genius "repair" was done so bad it then took out my LCD screen AND my "new" motherboard + a power supply after 30 minutes of turning it on.  

On a good ThinkPad (In the MBP price-range)  if something goes wrong - I call - and the service technician is ONSITE the next day - and tries to fix it there and then.

With Apple you "reserve" a time-slot with a Genius. That usually takes about a week before they have "time" for you. Then you go there and hand in your device. Then you go home. And 3-7 days later you get a repair estimate. If you accept then the device might be ready in 1-5 days. So about 1-4 weeks to get an Apple computer fixed plus all the travel time to and from the "Geniuses" plus the time you sit around waiting for them to turn up to your pre-arranged appointment time.  

My time is to valuable to use Apple Computers for a living. I just use my old MBP's to compile cross-platform apps.

And if you get bored or do not agree - just go and watch a few hours of Louis Rossmann Apple repair videos. That will vaccinate you from buying more Apple Computers. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCl2mFZoRqjw_ELax4Yisf6w

I DO WISH Apple would design some great computers with great quality hardware - as I love the design - and when they work they are nice to work on. And then have a PROFESSIONAL support setup so IF things go wrong - you can get going in a short time without having been treated like cattle in an Apple Store by the "Almighty" geniuses who are anything BUT.

/rant over....

Back to H265 -
But H265 10 bit usually requires a lot of horsepower and dedicated hardware to decode at a decent speed. I think NVidia has a table of which Graphics cards you need for 10 bit hardware accelerated editing. I think it starts at the Quadro 4000 level to edit 10bit. Else it defaults to software acceleration/cpu and then you are in for low frame rates unless you are using the latest CPU's.



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