DJI-BladeStrike Posted at 2018-9-8 06:51
Correct LUT and proper directions are incoming..

I would like to thank you for your post as well.. There's a correct and incorrect way to voice frustration that are productive. Unfortunately most on here are from people that pretend to understand things but clearly don't just from their replies. Then the engage with personal attacks.

Thank you very much indeed for these urgently needed words and I sincerely hope that this will be implemented!

DJI-BladeStrike Posted at 2018-9-7 18:28
They are using all available bandwidth for 10bit color depth. You do realize dlog-m requires post? Lens correction is just another step in your post workflow..

I2 ProRes has the same limitation.. Wouldn't you rather have 10bit color depth than in camera lens correction? I know most people that care for IQ would rather have 10bit.

Hello BladeStrike,

I'm relieved to see a senior DJI representative finally come into the forum to clarify this, and hopefully other matters, pertaining to the M2P...

Your explanation of the ISP in the M2P using all available bandwidth for 10-bit DLOG-M or HLG seems plausible and logical, and I'm willing to accept that as a limitation, similar to the Inspire 2, however I am still puzzled, as the ISP being used, the Ambarella H3 SoC:

https://www.dpreview.com/news/7601128262/ambarella-announces-h3-8k-soc-for-drones-and-video-cameras

Indicates it includes a hardware-based de-warping engine for fisheye and other such wide-angle lenses... Though I have not found any other documentation to this effect, that would seem to imply the H3 has dedicated hardware for distortion correction, regardless if it's capturing at the maximum 10-bit HEVC codec rates... Could you provide any more insight into this?

Also, my disdain in this situation is 1) that DJI has not mentioned this anywhere in their marketing or documentation (to my knowledge) and that to me signals false and/or misleading advertisement to the targeted demographic of this product, and 2) the DJI admins posting to this forum routinely put out canned, scripted and/or contradictory responses, which only goes to anger those owners who are experiencing issues and are "flying blind", pardon the pun.

IMHO, DJI would be VERY well served by providing far better customer support in regards to the knowledge and skills in the staff assigned to respond to customer queries in areas like this forum and their online support channels. As it stands, I have near zero faith in the support teams, and am RELIEVED to finally be able to speak with you, as from your postings on the DJI Facebook site, and now here, you seem very familiar with the situation, products, and are at depth in your responses.

To that end, are there any estimated timelines you could offer to indicate when DJI might be releasing things like DJI-sanctioned LUT's for the DLOG-M and HLG colour profiles, and perhaps official guidance on the barrel distortion of the M2P lens so proper profiles can be calibrated and created for this product?

Thank you again for your response!

An accurate LUT would be great. 3rd party ones are OK but as they don't have access to the gamma tables and so on its all reverse engineering and some subjective personal bias into the "look".  A proper LUT would help massively.

Incidentally, the "Film Poets" distortion correction tool should be pretty accurate for now - they've explained elsewhere they actually took the DJI correction from the normal profile and applied it as an effect.  They're working on HQ now (i guess might take longer as theres no crop image normal profile to take it from).

The barrel distortion isn’t present in the live stream when viewing/recording on the controller so some correction is being done on the fly. I find it hard to believe that the M2P doesn’t have the processing power on board to correct the 10bit files. Even though it’s possible to correct the disrortion in post, it’s unnacceptable to have to do so. This is an unfinished product DJI. The M2P is a fantastic drone in most ways but you’re asking a lot of your customers to accept this issue indefinitely. I can only hope that the info above is incorrect and tgat you’re working on a fix.

hallmark007 Posted at 2018-9-7 12:25
It seems strange you would take this decision, for what simply takes seconds to correct in post, if your shooting in these profiles you have no choice to go to finish your work in post , it is also not uncommon for this to happen in Cameras and by that I mean much more expensive cameras. But if you looking for a drone at this price to do all you want you may have serious problems finding one.
I wish you luck but I would seriously rethink before sending back, we also don’t know for sure that it won’t be fixed in future FW, some mixed messages coming forward at the minute.

But DJI have neglected to mention this AT ALL in any of their promotional and/or marketing material. It's shady business practice. And it can be done in camera, btw.

DJI-BladeStrike Posted at 2018-9-8 06:51
Correct LUT and proper directions are incoming..

I would like to thank you for your post as well.. There's a correct and incorrect way to voice frustration that are productive. Unfortunately most on here are from people that pretend to understand things but clearly don't just from their replies. Then the engage with personal attacks.

If that's true, I'm more exited on the product. But you must understand people's reactions when they get different answers for thw staff and are ultimatly told "Do it yourself."

But I'm happy to hear a fix in form of a LUT are coming. :-)

Rieder Posted at 2018-9-9 09:27
But DJI have neglected to mention this AT ALL in any of their promotional and/or marketing material. It's shady business practice. And it can be done in camera, btw.

I’m not to sure that companies advertise quirks in their products, I have many tech products with quirks and none came explaining what these were, but you migh have a look at video below, you will see it may not be possible to correct this through FW.

EdisonW1979 Posted at 2018-9-8 12:59
Hello BladeStrike,

I'm relieved to see a senior DJI representative finally come into the forum to clarify this, and hopefully other matters, pertaining to the M2P...

Using the i2 as an example you can understand that when pushing the hardware limits with certain features, encoding to certain formats,  other features do become unavailable. This is due to things like thermal, memory and cpu overhead. Same happens on the i2 when encoding to prores, there's just not enough pipeline bandwidth to accomplish in-head lens correction. The i2 even has additional hardware, called the cine engine, an addition to its onboard SOC.

I'm sorry for some of the incorrect responses but please understand that when a product is new the standard support staff are also still learning the new product. Still, no excuse though.

I've been told the LUT should be available shortly. I've also been told that more color profiles will be available but that will take a little longer.

Please give this fine craft some time. as you can see the basics are solid. DJI has always shown that its willing to add many additional features over a crafts life span. The original mavic had far less features than it does today when it was first released.


Thank you for your support!

DJI-BladeStrike Posted at 2018-9-9 12:49
Using the i2 as an example you can understand that when pushing the hardware limits with certain features, encoding to certain formats,  other features do become unavailable. This is due to things like thermal, memory and cpu overhead. Same happens on the i2 when encoding to prores, there's just not enough pipeline bandwidth to accomplish in-head lens correction. The i2 even has additional hardware, called the cine engine, an addition to its onboard SOC.

I'm sorry for some of the incorrect responses but please understand that when a product is new the standard support staff are also still learning the new product. Still, no excuse though.

Hello BladeStrike,

Thank you for your continued responses to my messages, it’s most appreciated!

The responses from DJI staff I was referring to do not just occur with new products such as the M2P/Z, but has been repeatedly occurring with most every other product, hence my previous statement regarding canned responses. Thankfully, one of your admins by the alias DJI Mindy did provide a coherent, well-informed response to one of my warranty policy queries, so I was thankful to see at least some DJI support staff do not use canned responses and can address customer concerns eloquently.

I do hope DJI will show more love to the Mavic 2 line than they have to the Mavic Air, which I currently own, as that drone hasn’t seen any updates to correct multiple reported issues in several months now, despite more and more reports of the same issues surfacing every day.

I am contemplating the purchase of a Mavic 2 Pro and selling my MA, but one thing that has been holding me back has been DJI’s support, or lack thereof with the Mavic Air. Your participation in these discussions has, at least partially, renewed my faith in DJI’s commitment to their products, but I’m hoping DJI will show their other, neglected products, such as the MA, some love as well. I’m sure I speak for all Mavic Air owners experiencing issues that they feel the same way!

I look forward to seeing DJI release an official LUT, and perhaps lens calibration, for the M2P, and if they’ll heed customer concerns about missing or problematic features in as little time as possible, and continue responding to customer concerns as you have in a prompt and concise manner.

Looking forward to hearing more from you and DJI on the progress of these matters!

Cheers

DJI-BladeStrike Posted at 2018-9-7 18:28
They are using all available bandwidth for 10bit color depth. You do realize dlog-m requires post? Lens correction is just another step in your post workflow..

I2 ProRes has the same limitation.. Wouldn't you rather have 10bit color depth than in camera lens correction? I know most people that care for IQ would rather have 10bit.

DJI-BladeStrike,

First, let me say 'Thank You' for a proper response from the DJI Staff and throughout this thread.  I work for a large organization as well so understand it takes time to train everyone on new products.  

Secondly, let me say I personally am more interested in having the "10bit color depth" in my image and as you've stated some post-production editing is going to be needed regardless.  Clearly, I can't speak for everyone but clearly the intent of this thread was to provide an 'easy' solution to this problem while waiting for a LUT to be provided (hopefully there's one for Adobe Premiere Pro CC (2018)) as that's what I use personally.  

Again,  thank you for the professional response.  

DJI-BladeStrike Posted at 2018-9-9 12:49
Using the i2 as an example you can understand that when pushing the hardware limits with certain features, encoding to certain formats,  other features do become unavailable. This is due to things like thermal, memory and cpu overhead. Same happens on the i2 when encoding to prores, there's just not enough pipeline bandwidth to accomplish in-head lens correction. The i2 even has additional hardware, called the cine engine, an addition to its onboard SOC.

I'm sorry for some of the incorrect responses but please understand that when a product is new the standard support staff are also still learning the new product. Still, no excuse though.

Thank you.

DJI-BladeStrike Posted at 2018-9-8 06:51
Correct LUT and proper directions are incoming..

I would like to thank you for your post as well.. There's a correct and incorrect way to voice frustration that are productive. Unfortunately most on here are from people that pretend to understand things but clearly don't just from their replies. Then the engage with personal attacks.

What if I want to use my usual LUT is it possible to apply several LUT:s in FCPX?
Or I apply the anti distortion LUT and generate new files then apply my usual LUT?
Sincerely

Swedrone Posted at 2018-9-10 06:42
What if I want to use my usual LUT is it possible to apply several LUT:s in FCPX?
Or I apply the anti distortion LUT and generate new files then apply my usual LUT?
Sincerely

LUT is just for color, distortion you can fix a bit with Alex4D Wide Angle Fix plugin

DJI-BladeStrike Posted at 2018-9-8 06:51
Correct LUT and proper directions are incoming..

I would like to thank you for your post as well.. There's a correct and incorrect way to voice frustration that are productive. Unfortunately most on here are from people that pretend to understand things but clearly don't just from their replies. Then the engage with personal attacks.

> Correct LUT and proper directions are incoming..

Is there an ETA? Or could you at least say what range we are speaking about? Days? Weeks? Months?

Lio Posted at 2018-9-21 00:00
> Correct LUT and proper directions are incoming..

Is there an ETA? Or could you at least say what range we are speaking about? Days? Weeks? Months?

Already out. Check the MP downloads page for the lut and manual which explains how to correct the distortion

totalitarian Posted at 2018-9-24 14:02
Already out. Check the MP downloads page for the lut and manual which explains how to correct the distortion

Having trouble finding a manual where it explains how to correct the distortion. I got the LUT though...

Cloud Surfer Posted at 2018-9-26 11:45
Having trouble finding a manual where it explains how to correct the distortion. I got the LUT though...

https://dl.djicdn.com/downloads/ ... ser+Manual_v1.2.pdf

page 39

Please understand! For my side working as a support, you have to understand that every single piece of gear has its limitations. I was thinking the same as you, before I started working as a support and with the time I understood more about how the things work. There are some limitations that can not be overrided...

EdisonW1979 Posted at 2018-9-7 11:06
If I could upvote your post x1000 I would!

DJI's "revised" stance on this is mind-boggling, and insulting! Here they advertise their latest, best-in-class drone with Hasselblad, and it generates images with distortion rivalling a GOPRO???

Reading this thread for the first time. Agree with every comment posted by Increasingly disgruntled..... Here comes the interesting word..... CUSTOMERS.  Yes, CUSTOMERS. Totally disgusted by the "tough ... Buster, fix it yourself" attitude. DJI clearly has the lens profile for this: AND the MAV2 Zoom camera, otherwise the JPG's wouldn't be corrected by the onboard software. How hard is it to release the LCP to ADOBE and LENSFUN so that us busters CAN fix it for ourselves in post with the pro-quality DNG files. This has already been done with the "Hasselblad", but absolutely nothing for the ZOOM FC2204 that captures horizons that bananas would be jealous of. Or maybe DJI draws the line concerning customer care at taking payment.

EdisonW1979 Posted at 2018-9-7 10:07
Excuse me??? SOLVE IT BY THEMSELVES??? What kind of stance is that to take with your customers???

"We put out something half-baked, and can't be bothered to correct it, so go fix it yourself"

disagree.  If you are not able to post processing your video u should not use dlog mode. Dlog is for who need to have total control of post processing video.

DJI-BladeStrike Posted at 2018-9-9 12:49
Using the i2 as an example you can understand that when pushing the hardware limits with certain features, encoding to certain formats,  other features do become unavailable. This is due to things like thermal, memory and cpu overhead. Same happens on the i2 when encoding to prores, there's just not enough pipeline bandwidth to accomplish in-head lens correction. The i2 even has additional hardware, called the cine engine, an addition to its onboard SOC.

I'm sorry for some of the incorrect responses but please understand that when a product is new the standard support staff are also still learning the new product. Still, no excuse though.

please let us to have total image  control on post.

fans980d1304 Posted at 2018-9-7 11:23
There's already a Mavic 2 Pro correction preset available for free to Premiere Pro and FCPX users - https://geni.us/DistortionCorrection

It's the same thing.

The problem with this method is that the width of the distortion correction cannot be changed.  The distortion 'circle' is static in the center of the screen.  It doesn't make the distortion customizable enough to accurately correct for the M2P lens distortion.

I don’t understand the issue here.  I have to correct lens distortion on every lens I use.  On every drone I use.  From Canon to Nikon to Tamron to Sigma.  DJI to Parrot to Yuneec.  Of course GoPro’s and multiple 360’s.

How is this a surprising thing?

Francis Posted at 5-8 09:58
disagree.  If you are not able to post processing your video u should not use dlog mode. Dlog is for who need to have total control of post processing video.

I post-process ALL my footage using Final Cut Pro X, so I am perfectly capable, and know how to take advantage of, D-LOG footage.

My point is, most other cameras in this class offer internal distortion correction. Not having this on a drone of this class is very disappointing as it means we now have to worry about doing even more to the footage in post, which consumes more time, and also incurs an encoding penalty in the finished video production as the distortion correction must be applied after the fact.

Felix Le Chat Posted at 5-8 05:57
Reading this thread for the first time. Agree with every comment posted by Increasingly disgruntled..... Here comes the interesting word..... CUSTOMERS.  Yes, CUSTOMERS. Totally disgusted by the "tough ... Buster, fix it yourself" attitude. DJI clearly has the lens profile for this: AND the MAV2 Zoom camera, otherwise the JPG's wouldn't be corrected by the onboard software. How hard is it to release the LCP to ADOBE and LENSFUN so that us busters CAN fix it for ourselves in post with the pro-quality DNG files. This has already been done with the "Hasselblad", but absolutely nothing for the ZOOM FC2204 that captures horizons that bananas would be jealous of. Or maybe DJI draws the line concerning customer care at taking payment.

If you use any software package you will have the option to fix distortion, if what you say is the norm or it can be easily fixed with some FW update. Then can you tell me why the need to add this fix to all SW packages ? My thinking on this and I’m certain it’s the same for those using similar cameras for pro and semi pro expect this, in fact most pros will always check this in post no matter what camera is used.
Also as Francis has everyone who uses d-log will be further processing their work, and if you didn’t check for distortion then it would show an almost Amateurish approach. Fixing distortion applies with every camera for every videographer/photographer and those who don’t check for it are not as serious as they think they are.

No cameras particularly those with fixed lens offer 100% free of distortion and photographers are well aware of this, and just like tilted horizon is something all drone users will check when editing distortion is no different.

I think the problem here is that this distortion is new to those who are equally new to photography, they’re not used to it but don’t realize it’s easier to fix than tilted horizon, particularly when others make such a big deal about it.

HCL Posted at 2018-9-7 10:58
Okay ... let's have a look at your explaination:

Actually, It's a normal phenomenon

Thank you for this! Even years later, I was doing a little digging around on the topic and came across this thread, and I was literally fuming reading that completely bs response.

#UPVOTE