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What f/stop is good for sharpness all around?
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AntDX316
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I've been shooting auto like a total novice and it does f/5-f/6.3.  Now, the sharpness all around at long range is bad.  Upon research, it should be f/8-f/16/22!  Will there be significant blur though as the shutter speed would have to decrease even on a very bright day?  Focus stacking cannot work in the air because the drone always slightly moves.

The drone can only do up to f/11 but auto will most likely never go beyond 6.3.
6-14 03:21
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Labroides
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If you are interested to know, do some testing.
You may find that some of your assumptions are not right.
6-14 04:42
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AJC-W
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I typically find f4 to f5.6
6-14 05:24
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AntDX316
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Yeah, I'm going to be testing some f/stops like nuts today.  I will also be running the H.265 vs H.264 test on both drones multiple times.  I have all the batteries charged up and ready to go.  Should be no issue unless a bird hits it.  I have a job at 11AM  to do w/ it so I'm planning on using the P4PV2.0 then use the M2Z for some good reach.
6-14 05:30
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allyssongemelli
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AntDX316, depends what you are shooting or what feeling you wanna for your photo. For better sharpness like a panorama, or better details between f/8 and f/11 it's good. But you have go manual to do it. Nice fly!
6-14 06:57
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KEJ
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Rule of thumb

Focus F Stop.png
6-14 07:08
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BagoDJIoperator84
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It varies, I would say do some testing and comparisons
6-14 07:34
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KEJ
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Question, do you just want your main subject in focus or the entire picture ?
6-14 08:12
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AntDX316
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KEJ Posted at 6-14 08:12
Question, do you just want your main subject in focus or the entire picture ?

entire picture
6-14 10:58
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KEJ
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So you can see from the diagram and bearing in mind other factors, is the area well lit and what are you trying to achieve and how spread out is the area in question.

I would probably set my F-Stop between F8 & F11(some say sweet spot around 5 ish) and focus 1/3 or 1/2 way into the picture for starters, but does depend on the subject.But ideally for everything in focus high F No, big vista. If on the otherhand it was a tree in a field that you wanted crystal clear and the background slightly blurred then lower F No.

Factor in the light and are you using polarising filters as you will probably drop another F stop in light.
The other consideration of course, small aperture(High F stop) then you might have to lower your shutter speed, so then potentially blurring, of course you can up your ISO(slightly), too much then noise!

But as other people have suggested, take some test shots for example the other day you did the bridge, so I suspect I would have focused on the first towers as I would definitely want them to be perfectly clear, but F stops at the higher end(smaller aperture) to try and get everything in focus if that's your aim.







6-14 12:17
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AntDX316
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KEJ Posted at 6-14 12:17
So you can see from the diagram and bearing in mind other factors, is the area well lit and what are you trying to achieve and how spread out is the area in question.

I would probably set my F-Stop between F8 & F11(some say sweet spot around 5 ish) and focus 1/3 or 1/2 way into the picture for starters, but does depend on the subject.But ideally for everything in focus high F No, big vista. If on the otherhand it was a tree in a field that you wanted crystal clear and the background slightly blurred then lower F No.

I want everything sharp.  What is the best?
6-14 13:52
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KEJ
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AntDX316 Posted at 6-14 13:52
I want everything sharp.  What is the best?

So read the reply !
Ideally depending on the light conditions etc, F stop at the higher numbers.........maybe start start at F11 and focus 1/3 or 1/2 way into the imagine.


6-15 03:35
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AntDX316
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KEJ Posted at 6-15 03:35
So read the reply !
Ideally depending on the light conditions etc, F stop at the higher numbers.........maybe start start at F11 and focus 1/3 or 1/2 way into the imagine.

Looking at the images f/6.3 is the sharpest all-around.
6-15 04:34
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KEJ
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AntDX316 Posted at 6-15 04:34
Looking at the images f/6.3 is the sharpest all-around.

No fair enough thats why I mentioned the sweet spot previously, that most lens have and if that works for you, then stick with it.

Its very subjective as you might have a remote building a mile away and the rest of the area being mountains or trees, so you want the building to be pin sharp and you might not be fussed on the rest, so if you focus on that.

So a slight blur on everything could be fine with a lower F stop and effective, on the other hand if you want everything in focus then higher.

Countryside I don't mind blur, but city scapes I prefer in focus.

But the rule of thumb still stands.....
6-15 04:40
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AntDX316
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KEJ Posted at 6-15 04:40
No fair enough thats why I mentioned the sweet spot previously, that most lens have and if that works for you, then stick with it.

Its very subjective as you might have a remote building a mile away and the rest of the area being mountains or trees, so you want the building to be pin sharp and you might not be fussed on the rest, so if you focus on that.

What is the rule of thumb?

I've examined the images and everything beyond f/6.3 is worse.  I'm not sure if my focus point is incorrect but it should be, the higher the f/stop the sharper everything else.  Maybe my focus point is incorrect?
6-15 04:45
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KEJ
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AntDX316 Posted at 6-15 04:45
What is the rule of thumb?

I've examined the images and everything beyond f/6.3 is worse.  I'm not sure if my focus point is incorrect but it should be, the higher the f/stop the sharper everything else.  Maybe my focus point is incorrect?

As I said previously in #8

This, so genereally taking a picture and considering aperture only F32 everything in focus, F2 just the subject only you focused on.

Focus F Stop.png
6-15 04:59
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KEJ
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KEJ Posted at 6-15 04:59
As I said previously in #8

This, so genereally taking a picture and considering aperture only F32 everything in focus, F2 just the subject only you focused on.

Then this picture I took was at F9, saved in lower quality for this website(Just HDR, 5 exp)

SMChurchDJI_0334_5_6_7_8_Smooth 3.jpg
6-15 05:01
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AntDX316
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KEJ Posted at 6-15 04:59
As I said previously in #8

This, so genereally taking a picture and considering aperture only F32 everything in focus, F2 just the subject only you focused on.

Yeah, I know but that is if the lens quality was at 100% maximum potential.  In the real-world, the lensing system isn't 100%, more like 60% so when you start increasing the f/ the quality starts to degrade.
6-15 05:09
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AntDX316
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KEJ Posted at 6-15 05:01
Then this picture I took was at F9, saved in lower quality for this website(Just HDR, 5 exp)

It's still blurry in some spots.  Would an automatic front Sphere Pano work then we just crop out that section because in a Pano doesn't the center of each image get focused so this way we can have 4 points be in focus instead of 1?
6-15 05:09
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KEJ
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AntDX316 Posted at 6-15 05:09
It's still blurry in some spots.  Would an automatic front Sphere Pano work then we just crop out that section because in a Pano doesn't the center of each image get focused so this way we can have 4 points be in focus instead of 1?

Its subjective, I think at the time I focused on the church, I like the picture personally.

HDR so also slightly bumped up the colours, the picture is not meant to be for a planning application.

Probably if I had focused further into the background, might have been clearer, but remember there are 5 images here and I also removed ghosting for all the movement of cars etc(done quickly by the way so may have missed a few cars etc).
Yes possibly clearer just with a single image as well, but I was taking a HDR remember.
The point is though the rule of thumb........as a guide!


The picture below on the otherhand was at F2.8  as it was taken near dusk, low quality for upload

SMDJI_0349B_50_51_52_53_Smooth 3.jpg
6-15 05:15
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KEJ
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AntDX316 Posted at 6-15 05:09
It's still blurry in some spots.  Would an automatic front Sphere Pano work then we just crop out that section because in a Pano doesn't the center of each image get focused so this way we can have 4 points be in focus instead of 1?

And don't forget and just to clarify, the F-Stop is for the depth of field.

You still focus on the main subject and with a landscape you may want to everything in focus or to be clear, but slightly different.

In principle I am with AJC-W, however Labroides has a point and we need to test more, maybe the sweet spot is best!
6-15 09:53
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AntDX316
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KEJ Posted at 6-15 05:15
Its subjective, I think at the time I focused on the church, I like the picture personally.

HDR so also slightly bumped up the colours, the picture is not meant to be for a planning application.

This was taken at f/2.8?
6-15 17:37
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KEJ
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AntDX316 Posted at 6-15 17:37
This was taken at f/2.8?

Therefore I would say, try taking the same picture with say the two settings.

F2.8 & F11 just as singles(not AEB) ideally no wind, sunny, the only issue might be the shutter speed.
(F11 might be slower(tiny aperture shutter open longer) than the F2.8 obviously, possibly slight blur if windy etc), then do we say try using a stronger ND filter at 2.8 to try and match the shutter speeds(then also additional glass etc).
I think we are maybe putting too much into this, have a play and possibly focus further into the shot as well(could be that), 1/3 or 1/2 into the picture.


6-15 21:00
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Labroides
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KEJ Posted at 6-15 09:53
And don't forget and just to clarify, the F-Stop is for the depth of field.

You still focus on the main subject and with a landscape you may want to everything in focus or to be clear, but slightly different.

we need to test more, maybe the sweet spot is best
People talk about a "sweet spot" as if it's one magic number and nothing else is worth using.
Fact is, testing shows that if there is a "sweet spot" it's a range rather than a number and the difference between in that range and outside the range isn't much at all.
6-15 22:03
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KEJ
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Labroides Posted at 6-15 22:03
we need to test more, maybe the sweet spot is best
People talk about a "sweet spot" as if it's one magic number and nothing else is worth using.
Fact is, testing shows that if there is a "sweet spot" it's a range rather than a number and the difference between in that range and outside the range isn't much at all.

I think I am starting to agree with you.

Just for my own benefit I will still try some decent(hopefully) outside long shots at a later day.
Also in reality, usually I am trying to make my pictures pop as opposed to be able to read a car number plate at two miles.
All that said, I do love the detail!
6-15 23:47
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Manxmann
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What an excellent way to explain/demonstrate things !
Great work ...  
6-16 01:09
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KEJ
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Manxmann Posted at 6-16 01:09
What an excellent way to explain/demonstrate things !
Great work ...

Thanks.

It's not my creation, can't take the credit, but its a very good reference for the basics on how things work.

Picture paints a thousand words and all that!
6-16 01:50
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AJC-W
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KEJ Posted at 6-15 05:15
Its subjective, I think at the time I focused on the church, I like the picture personally.

HDR so also slightly bumped up the colours, the picture is not meant to be for a planning application.

Stunning shot KEJ
6-16 01:59
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KEJ
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AJC-W Posted at 6-16 01:59
Stunning shot KEJ

Thanks.

Also, goto 3mins in this video:





I will still try a real world test when I get chance.......
6-16 02:31
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Labroides
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KEJ Posted at 6-16 02:31
Thanks.

Also, goto 3mins in this video:
go to 3mins in this video:
That's completely irrelevant for aerial photography with your Phantom.

Yes... learn it for down on the ground with your SLR but up in the air it doesn't make any difference.
6-16 04:18
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AJC-W
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KEJ Posted at 6-16 02:31
Thanks.

Also, goto 3mins in this video:

When the subject is in close distance you will see the comparison more distinctly as shown but when your drone is 400' AGL flying at 30MPH it's hard to gauge any difference
6-16 04:49
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KEJ
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Labroides Posted at 6-16 04:18
go to 3mins in this video:
That's completely irrelevant for aerial photography with your Phantom.

But it demonstrates it does work !
6-16 05:04
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KEJ
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AJC-W Posted at 6-16 04:49
When the subject is in close distance you will see the comparison more distinctly as shown but when your drone is 400' AGL flying at 30MPH it's hard to gauge any difference

Yes exactly and that's why I want to carry out a real test.

To be honest for what I do(messing around) its brilliant, perfect and does exactly what I want.

6-16 05:05
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AJC-W
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KEJ Posted at 6-16 05:05
Yes exactly and that's why I want to carry out a real test.

To be honest for what I do(messing around) its brilliant, perfect and does exactly what I want.

Same here - we can get caught up in all the settings then just a ten degree yaw to/from the sun ruins everything in a split second. Drone photography is so, so different to hand held.
6-16 05:11
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Labroides
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KEJ Posted at 6-16 05:04
But it demonstrates it does work !

It demonstrates that the principle works with the lens he had at the distances he had.

But when you are flying your Phantom, it's lens has buckets of depth of field at any aperture.
And you will not be anywhere near as close to your subject.

I don't see what the problem is understanding this.
Depth of Field is not an issue flying a Phantom.
It's something you'll never have to deal with unless you have a subject closer than 2 metres and still want detail further back ...... and that's likely to be less than 0.2% of your aerial photography.
6-16 07:31
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KEJ
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AJC-W Posted at 6-16 05:11
Same here - we can get caught up in all the settings then just a ten degree yaw to/from the sun ruins everything in a split second. Drone photography is so, so different to hand held.

Very true.
6-16 12:30
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KEJ
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Labroides Posted at 6-16 07:31
It demonstrates that the principle works with the lens he had at the distances he gad.

But when you are flying your Phantom, it's lens has buckets of depth of field at any aperture.

Again very true, I think it all stemmed from the comment of not being very clear and the best settings.

Ok, lets be honest it could be 101 things, but initially I was pointing out about F-Stops and I do agree with you at short distances it is really obvious. However, at a distance not so.

I might park this up before I start dreaming about it!

Cheers
6-16 12:35
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Bashy
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You are looking for the golden spoon fed answer, sadly with togging, there isnt one and with your questions you keep missing one important factor, ISO, if shooting at f11 and its a bright day and you need a faster shutter speed, then up the ISO, not much more than 800 mind, failing that, theres always ND filters, not a cheap set though else they will be too heavy for the gimbal.  I also agree with Labroides re f-stop and drones, of little use due to the drone being so far from the subject. If  you are having oof issues, then you need to make sure that youve clicked on the screen or half pressed the shutter button to put it in to focus and upping the shutter speed  should help a lot too, remember, its windy up there, the gimbal can only do so much, movement with the drone or subject will throw the image, so its not always the focus.

If you have a DSLR or use your phone camera with a pro app. go out and practise, see which settings do what and practise, then its very simple to use the same principles learnt with the drone, i only say use another media type because its far easier with the camera on the ground, bringing it down to change the battery can easily put you off and make you forget...
6-16 18:27
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AJC-W
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Yeah, it's a bit of a pain
6-16 22:15
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Manxmann
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KEJ Posted at 6-16 01:50
Thanks.

It's not my creation, can't take the credit, but its a very good reference for the basics on how things work.

Yer not wrong....  it's brilliant  
6-17 01:26
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