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Downfall - battery suddenly dropped from 50% to 7%
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6323 82 2015-6-8
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Jorgehlopezc
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In 6 minutes and 28 seconds into flight, suddenly tha battery fell from 50% to 7%. As I was flying a rivera of the river, the aircraft was nearly 300 meters above the ground. Knowing that we couldn´t come back to home, we look for a place to land but did not reach down and the aircraft fell to the ground from about 20 mts high.
We search the plane for about an hour and found with a broken arm and one of the axis of the gimbal a little twisted.
The Tb-48 battery recharges used was 15 and already had made the first complete download.
It´s very sad we couldnt believe in the batteries because It is the second time it happens, Dji before the first report that the same battery is discharged from 37% to 7%, only recommended full discharge and recharge me which I did with all my batteries.


Here is the flight record and the downfall video:

https://www.youtube.com/embed/4FxYUBKhiUA

2015-6-8
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Czyka
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Fantastic attempt to direct it to a safe landing area.  Were the batteries fully charged at launch?
2015-6-8
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SimplePanda
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Question - were you up the latest battery firmware?

Any manufacturing date / information of that nature about your TB-48?

I have to say; if I have a new-ish battery that suddenly loses charge level like that for any reason (firmware or cell defect or otherwise) that battery is immediately grounded and replaced. Not in any way saying this was your fault but I never would have used that suspect battery for anything other than a charger / test pack.
2015-6-8
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GrahamJ
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Australia
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Awesome process followed.  I take it your on the latest firmware?  There seems to be more and more similar occurrences.
2015-6-9
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Jorgehlopezc
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Czyka Posted at 2015-6-9 12:03
Fantastic attempt to direct it to a safe landing area.  Were the batteries fully charged at launch?

Yes, and I was made the process of complete discharge and charge just one week ago.
2015-6-9
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Jorgehlopezc
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GrahamJ Posted at 2015-6-9 21:00
Awesome process followed.  I take it your on the latest firmware?  There seems to be more and more s ...

Yes the battery was updated to the latest firmware. Yes, there is several similar cases.
2015-6-9
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Jorgehlopezc
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SimplePanda Posted at 2015-6-9 12:56
Question - were you up the latest battery firmware?

Any manufacturing date / information of that na ...

Yes, I agree, but I believed in that Dji suggested me.
2015-6-9
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Starship
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I agree,  great attempt at finding a safe landing site.  Every time I get that first low battery warning, I get more grey hair.

I noticed at take off 00:00 the battery was at 94%.  I'm assuming preflight fiddling around.  But I also notice at the 1 minute mark you were already down to 87%, and at the 2 minute mark 79%.   That seems like a lot of drain for just 2 minutes.  
If your Inspire still boots up, you might want to check the battery in the pilot app and see if there's any clues.

I just got a TB48, so I'm going to pay real close attention to the drain.
2015-6-9
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leoamartinez
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Sorry for your loss mate!
2015-6-10
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mark
New
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This same exact thing happened to me a few days ago. I was at around 52% and it dropped to 3% instantly. The drone gods were looking down on me as I was able to land safely - so no damage.

There have been several other reports of this on different forums. I hope DJI takes note of this issue and fixes it quickly.

2015-6-10
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DJI-Autumn
First Officer

Hong Kong
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We will keep updated about the analysis process.
Thank you
2015-6-10
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DJI-Autumn
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mark@markkriege Posted at 2015-6-11 05:22
This same exact thing happened to me a few days ago. I was at around 52% and it dropped to 3% instan ...

Remember to fully discharge and recharge periodically.
2015-6-10
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Jorgehlopezc
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DJI-Autumn Posted at 2015-6-11 15:02
Remember to fully discharge and recharge periodically.

Just I had this procedure on the recommendation of you . Battery used was only 14 charges and complete download process too.
2015-6-11
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DJI-Bruce
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Jorgehlopezc Posted at 2015-6-10 00:08
Yes, and I was made the process of complete discharge and charge just one week ago.

I saw your video, you started your flight at a power level of 95%, the battery is not fully charged. Every time you wanna fly the inspire after you put the battery aside over days, please fully charge the battery before use.
2015-6-11
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PeteGould
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DJI-Bruce Posted at 2015-6-12 11:07
I saw your video, you started your flight at a power level of 95%, the battery is not fully charge ...

Don't forget that 5% of charge could have been bled off with taking the aircraft out of travel mode, compass / IMU calibration, etc.  The video only shows from time of takeoff, not from the moment the pack was first inserted.
2015-6-11
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DJI-Bruce
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PeteGould Posted at 2015-6-12 11:18
Don't forget that 5% of charge could have been bled off with taking the aircraft out of travel mod ...

I saw Jorge's flight log and he really started using the battery from 95% with the cell voltage of only around 3.89V, which is far from being fully charged.

I strongly recommend the users to fully charge  the battery before you use it if the battery is not used over days.
2015-6-11
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Jorgehlopezc
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DJI-Bruce Posted at 2015-6-12 11:07
I saw your video, you started your flight at a power level of 95%, the battery is not fully charge ...

The battery was fully charged but when turn on it update to new firmware. That is the explanation for the initial charge percentage. what you say you can go , but not in my case.
2015-6-11
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Jorgehlopezc
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DJI-Bruce Posted at 2015-6-12 11:28
I saw Jorge's flight log and he really started using the battery from 95% with the cell voltage of ...


Bruce, I wanna say you that since I have my first issue about the battery, always start my flights fully charged. I challenge you to try in his factory as a battery is spent to upgrade your firmware and you will see I'm right. I never lie even if I have too much to lose. This is not a satisfactory explanation for the large instantaneous battery discharge.
2015-6-11
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PeteGould
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DJI-Bruce Posted at 2015-6-12 11:28
I saw Jorge's flight log and he really started using the battery from 95% with the cell voltage of ...

Bruce - While we are on this issue here is a related question.  Say a battery was charged but not used when intended.  By the time it will be used several days have passed.  The battery is now showing 95% charge.  QUESTION: is it sufficient to just top the battery off so it shows 100% or must it be discharged first?
2015-6-11
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Jorgehlopezc
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PeteGould Posted at 2015-6-12 11:18
Don't forget that 5% of charge could have been bled off with taking the aircraft out of travel mod ...

Pete you are right the ignition process, calibration and others spend a little battery power, but in this case the battery updated firmware which forced an additional power cycle that led to 95%. I remember everything that happened like today, because I was explaining to another person present the update process Battery.
2015-6-11
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PeteGould
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Jorgehlopezc Posted at 2015-6-12 11:47
Pete you are right the ignition process, calibration and others spend a little battery power, but i ...

I had forgotten to mention firmware update as an additional consumer of power.
2015-6-11
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InspireAggie
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What the hell does 5% discharge make?   This really doesn't help the op solve his problem.  It's just useless advice for something we already know.  Sure, your supposed to charge up before you go fly...who doesn't.  This has nothing to do with his problem.   And he doesn't have to justify anything

2015-6-11
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PeteGould
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InspireAggie Posted at 2015-6-12 12:28
What the hell does 5% discharge make?   This really doesn't help the op solve his problem.  It's jus ...

Actually, I think the problem is – that it does have to do with his problem.

From what we are hearing, charging up the battery, and waiting a few days so that it begins to self discharge, then flying with the battery in that state, is asking for trouble (perhaps with only certain battery packs that are predisposed to this issue).  No one yet knows all the factors involved.  It would be nice to get a more solid explanation from DJI, but I'm not sure at this juncture that they know either.

But it has been repeatedly demonstrated that taking off on anything less than a 100% charged battery pack, for any reason (including completing a flight, shutting down, then initiating an additional flight with the same pack) can potentially lead to this outcome.

Some of these situations may later prove to be red herrings.  We won't know until DJI identifies the problem.

2015-6-11
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DJI-Bruce
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PeteGould Posted at 2015-6-12 13:17
Actually, I think the problem is – that it does have to do with his problem.

From what we are h ...

Yes. I am also extremely curious it seems that the battery discharged but the power level didn't go down as expected. Then when the user charge it but not fully, the power level is also wrong. I don't think it relates with the auto-discharge feature cause we have tested this feature many times and it proves to be all right. I wonder if there's some problem with this battery's control board.
2015-6-12
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PeteGould
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DJI-Bruce Posted at 2015-6-12 17:31
Yes. I am also extremely curious it seems that the battery discharged but the power level didn't go ...

The problem described by Jorgehlopezc seems to have occurred with a number of users (not hundreds or thousands that we know of, but still a significant number).  I have not seen it with any of my five batteries.  But we have seen virtually this precise story ten times or more in this forum alone.

If it is a specific and identifiable failure mode there may be a way to guard against it but obviously it needs to be identified first.  It sounds as though it might be wise to develop a way of collecting all batteries that exhibit this problem in one place instead of having them go through the normal repair process.  That way a group of analysts can more easily attribute it to (for instance) a specific and perhaps recurring component failure that might be identified in an additional firmware routine, preventing the flight.

Just a thought....,
2015-6-12
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thunderstruck
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PeteGould Posted at 2015-6-12 13:17
Actually, I think the problem is – that it does have to do with his problem.

From what we are hea ...

Yes but its not acceptable, its 100% a bug and needs to be addressed.

I have been flying Lipo powered RC helis and planes for years and they dont fall out of the sky minutes later because you took off with a battey at 80%!! There is no rocket science in what DJI are doing with their batteries. They have opted to put a computer in the battery which requires its own firmware and now they have to deal with bugs in a battery!!

Frankly I am amazed it has not been fixed yet unless of course its more than just a software issue...

So while we are all talking about "what we should do to avoid this bug" the botton line is that DJI are the only ones who can resolve this!! To date I was convinced that it was only for batteries under ~50% charge which is what I experienced but now it seems it could happen to anyone even with an almost fully charged battery.

Serge
2015-6-12
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GB44
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PeteGould Posted at 2015-6-12 11:43
Bruce - While we are on this issue here is a related question.  Say a battery was charged but not  ...

Pete,

Thats a good question.  If we know the battery is say 80% and we top it up to full 100% for flight this should not cause any problems, but should we be getting some confirmation from DJI on that as we seem to be going round in circles on this issue whilst making assumptions.  I am sure I read in the manual that you can top up the batteries, may be wrong, but thought you switched on the battery if it is above 95% if you wish to top up.




2015-6-12
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PeteGould
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thunderstruck Posted at 2015-6-12 20:44
Yes but its not acceptable, its 100% a bug and needs to be addressed.

I have been flying Lipo powe ...

Of course it's a bug.  But it appears to only strike in a minority of cases, making it difficult for DJI to identify it.
2015-6-12
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Jorgehlopezc
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PeteGould Posted at 2015-6-12 21:54
Of course it's a bug.  But it appears to only strike in a minority of cases, making it difficult f ...

My friends, of course it's a technical problem that will have to solve DJI because I assure you that I always carry my battery to 100% and in this case, the firmware update Battery spent 5%.  I am using the drone for commercial purposes which makes me constantly flying.
2015-6-12
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Jorgehlopezc
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DJI-Bruce Posted at 2015-6-12 17:31
Yes. I am also extremely curious it seems that the battery discharged but the power level didn't go ...

This is inconceivable, now DJI wants to evade responsibility for trying to blame improper handling of batteries, is absurd. I acknowledge at this forum that I'm not lying and that DJI is evading its responsibility.

This is the Dji support answer:
_______________________________
Hi Jorge,

Normally, it's recommended to keep the battery with 40-50% capacity. And try a fully discharge and recharge of the battery before you use it to make sure the battery performs well.

According to the flight log, the battery had been stored for a long period. And this time flight only with 95% battery capacity - 3.89V; which was not charged fully. So the battery info was not very accurate, and then caused the "losing battery" crash.

The crash was caused by battery problem, while was due to the lack of maintenance on the battery.

Best regards,

DJI Product Application Technical Support
_______________________________________
An this is my answer to that:
Hello Sophie I think the important thing for you in this case is not whether or not give a guarantee, what is important is to know the real cause of the problem so that it can resolve. What you are saying is not true,
I can assure you that the batteries always charged to 100% and the reason for 95% it is because it updated its firmware, which discharged battery 5%. I have witnessed it, because someone was watching the takeoff procedure.
I am using the drone for commercial purposes which makes me constantly flying do not leave long periods without flying. Please believe me, my religion does not allow me to lie. I usually always check the status of my batteries before leaving to fly.

Do not make the mistake of closing the case without finding the real cause of the problem which I see more on the side of software that automatically downloads the battery.

Jorge Hernán López C
General Manager Viewdrone Colombia


2015-6-12
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PeteGould
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Jorgehlopezc Posted at 2015-6-12 22:58
This is inconceivable, now DJI wants to evade responsibility for trying to blame improper handling  ...

That is a very unfortunate response.  Based on how you describe your level of activity, you need to keep pushing.  Obviously I can't see from here and DJI is saying they can see things in the battery log and flight log - if that's a lie it's outrageous, but no one on the forum can actually see the truth, we can only hear both sides.  I tend to believe you, so I hope you keep on it.
2015-6-12
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GB44
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So does this mean if you fly your inspire land it on around 25% then put the inspire in its case for some days until the day before your next flight then fully charge the battery to 100% before your next flight that is incorrect  maintenance of battery  as it wasn't charged back up to 50%.

Why would you charge your battery up to 50% after a flight then store it for a 4 or 5 days before charging again before the next flight.  Surely if these batteries are used in flight then left for 4 or 5 days before charging them this is ok or is this really poor maintenance of the battery?

I suspect the more times these batteries are charged the closer they get to their life expectancy charge cycles then there will be an in-built programme to shut down the battery to prevent further flights, just speculation on my behalf but I would discount it, so why waste charging up to 50% just for a week or so.  These batteries certainly seem to be very delicate as well as the dangerous aspect.

2015-6-12
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Jorgehlopezc
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PeteGould Posted at 2015-6-13 01:10
That is a very unfortunate response.  Based on how you describe your level of activity, you need t ...

I also hope that all this out the truth of what happened to anyone else will pass and we can rely on our batteries.
2015-6-12
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cmontisano
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DJI-Bruce Posted at 2015-6-12 11:07
I saw your video, you started your flight at a power level of 95%, the battery is not fully charge ...


I am surly concerned I have 9 TB48's and have them fully charged for over a two weeks now due to I was not able to fly  due to a sudden emergency surgery of my 81yr old mother, I understand long term storage to me is well over a couple of months. I have run my batteries down to a 10% cycle after the firmware update, I will charge all batteries before next flight and cycle them down to below 5% to make sure this issue doesn't happen to me, I would think DJI would be rushing to fix this as when I purchased my batteries new from my dealer this was not a concern, should DJI re-call all their batteries that they sold us since its not our responsibility that DJI sold us a defective batteries that needed a fix well after our purchase. I would think DJI is responsible for any damages that may result from this issue, since when is it the consumers responsibility to fix your issues? I am just venting I have not seen this with any of my 9 batteries I surly am concerned that DJI sold a faulty product at the time of the release of their product.
2015-6-12
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larsjoh
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Jorge, I hope you get a positive outcome!
I have 4 batteries and after flying I always charge them to about 50%, then the day before I go flying they are topped up to 100%
Have the automatic discharge set to 3 days, just in case something would hinder me from flying. Seems to work fine, (so far)
2015-6-12
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Jorgehlopezc
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larsjoh@me.com Posted at 2015-6-13 03:11
Jorge, I hope you get a positive outcome!
I have 4 batteries and after flying I always charge them t ...

Thanks I hope so too.
2015-6-16
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Jorgehlopezc
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DJI-Bruce Posted at 2015-6-12 17:31
Yes. I am also extremely curious it seems that the battery discharged but the power level didn't go ...


Request (73849)
Dear Bruce the accident is not for lack of maintenance like sophie say, because after Dji responded to my request 68211, for the last same instant discharge of the battery, I realized the complete discharging and charging up to 100% according to your instructions. I repeat, when the battery placed in the drone, she updated its software spending 5% charge before the flight in question.
As shown in the video, the application never reported that the battery will was needed another process of complete discharging of the battery.
Annex copy of the conversation sustained today with one of their Dji technical, which clearly indicates that these instant downloads do not occur if the battery was charged to 100% and if it was stored for several days, the application reports, which are not he gave in this case.
-------
DJI
11:20:32
HELLO
Hello! This is Inspire 1 technical support center. What can I do for you?
My aircraft was sent to dealer to repair, how can I discharge the batteries without aircraft?
11:21:35
I think the repairs can take a long time
11:22:49
The battery will discharge automatically after 10 days in default if you leave the battery alone and do not open it.
11:24:11
After that, I have to do the process of complete discharge?
When I go to flight?
Not yet. The app will require you to do a fully discharge when necessary.
11:26:55
The battery will discharge ten days without use?
Yes, 10 days in default. If you did not change the setup on app , the time shall be 10 days.
11:29:03
Can I believe in the app for saying me when have to do de discharge process?
It's recommended to follow the requirements of app.
11:30:04
Can the battery discharge itself during flight?
The power will be consumed when flying.
11:31:37
the question is instantly discharged battery?
You mean will the power level dropped down instantly ?
Yes
11:32:57
You could fully charge the battery before flying for the sake of safety.
11:34:24
if the battery charge is 100% that guarantees me not to dropped down instantly?
may I trust in that?
11:36:52
Yes, if the battery is in fine condition, you could trust it. If you are not sure enough, you could send the battery to the support center for test.
11:38:52
ok Thanks
--------------

For all this I beg you please meet my warranty claim which clearly succeeded by a technical failure of the battery.
I need the drone urgent because I use it for commercial purposes so I'm constantly flying and do not keep long periods of time.

Thank you for your attention and prompt response.

Jorge Hernán López C
General Manager Viewdrone Colombia
2015-6-16
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DJI-Bruce
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Jorgehlopezc Posted at 2015-6-17 01:13
Request (73849)
Dear Bruce the accident is not for lack of maintenance like sophie say, because a ...

Our supporting staff will definitely give you, our valued customer, a good answer. But I read all your flight logs and found the battery really started at 95%, including when you started the upgrade. I went through all your flight logs including these from the very beginning when you started using your Inspire 1. Sorry for the inconvenience this brings to you. Please try to fully charge the battery in the future.
2015-6-18
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hammerdrone
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United States
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I`m a potential new pilot and I'm doing my research here. I have to ask- whats the deal with these batteries and the power drop issue? It seams to be the main issue now? Is this a bug or what? I haven`t purchased my I-1 yet and am looking VERY hard for a reason why I should but all I find are reasons why I shouldn`t.
2015-6-18
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InspirelessAggi
Second Officer

United States
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Wait.   The service isn't keeping up with demand.   Give it 6 months.    Maybe the inspire 2 will be along.   Two cameras....forward facing and gimbal..   Longer landing gear to support DSLR gimbals.  Maybe light bridge upgrades to support 2 video feeds.  Upgraded motors.  Maybe payload capabilities.     

Right now, it's really a need basis.  If you need it for business, then buy it.  But I'd wait.  
2015-6-18
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