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Errors with MAVIC MINI! Flyaways caused two crashes!
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7097 67 2019-12-22
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Geebax
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The Saint Posted at 12-23 22:02
ok, so while we are paused for a bit, i never could understand why pilots take off screaming either completely vertical or up and then speed away immediately.  not this particular incident but in general; is there something to that?  they start the engines on the ground and then blast off!   i ALWAYS use the takeoff button, let it hover automatically for a bit, listen for instructions, and then test the drone to make sure it "flies."  it takes about a minute but then i start flying like a bat if i feel like it.  what's the thrill from taking off from the ground like a rocket?  these drones aren't really that fast anyway.  i don't get it.  i would be happy if dji forced this (with an override of course) if it contributes to some of the many issues we read about daily.  why not stop you from flying if you don't have satellites, in the wrong mode, errors, etc unless you acknowledge?  is it because the mm would be throwing some sort of error on almost every takeoff?

When you fly indoors, you mostly don't have GPS satellite reception, so there is one reason.
2019-12-23
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JodyB
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There are folks right here in this forum who can tell you just as much. *JJB comes to mind being one of them who knows quite a bit about flight logs.
2019-12-23
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Dean01
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fansa029aa8c Posted at 12-23 15:47
I used the phantom link to view the txt file but don't want to share the link as I feel the OP should do that if she wants.

It never left P-GPS mode. Home point was recorded about 8 seconds after start. From 7-27 secs it was max ascend, left stick maxed forward ascending up to about 120'. Both sticks in home position after that and mini kept increasing horizontal speed. at 27 secs it was 1.3 mph and at 37.9 secs it was 36mph having reached over 41 mph a short time earlier. Again, this is with both sticks in neutral position.

ok fair enough -
i did look for phantom link but did not see it in the thread.

My assesment was made on available data.

as mentioned in my post i would be quite happy to be wrong.
2019-12-24
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fansa029aa8c
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Dean01 Posted at 12-24 00:48
ok fair enough -
i did look for phantom link but did not see it in the thread.

Here is the phantomhelp link to the incident in question.

https://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer/OFJFK8R1JQD5JYBR4N0J/
2019-12-24
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fansa029aa8c
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JodyB Posted at 12-23 22:13
There are folks right here in this forum who can tell you just as much. *JJB comes to mind being one of them who knows quite a bit about flight logs.

That quite possibly could be true as I just recently joined the DJI forum. However I have been a member of the Phantompilots, MavicPilots, Sparkpilots and now Mini for years and have watched hundreds of crashes analyzed by those over there and I really respect many of their analyses. Many people just touch a couple of the basic facts but the ones that truly interpret the logs and all their various fields and entries are quite phenomenal. Like I said, I just recently started following this forum. It will be interesting to see what the actual cause was.
2019-12-24
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Paul_IA
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Here's the link for the flight data taken from UAV and imported into PhantomHelp:

Flight Log

Looks like you might have a claim with DJI. The last part of the log, the drone is flying over 40 MPH with no stick input. Could be a faulty IMU or other calibration issue, but no errors are being reported and it's not a RTH "blinded by the sun" issue either.
2019-12-24
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The Saint
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Geebax Posted at 12-23 22:13
When you fly indoors, you mostly don't have GPS satellite reception, so there is one reason.

sure, like i said, i wouldn't forbid it; maybe just have to manually override the warning.  seems many pilots many not understand the implications of no gps.
2019-12-24
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Niknik
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maybe a boken battery caused it or a strong wind? If there is no connection with the remote the drones makes a RTH
2019-12-24
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BudWalker
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I looked at your incident. It was almost certainly caused by the launch site being geomagnetically distorted. The Yaw data shows the heading to be 61° (NE) at launch - pointing at the house. Do you recall the actual orientation? It's shown here as the yellow line 2019-12-24_17-03-20.jpg

If you want additional confirmation you will need to supply the .DAT from the device running the Fly App. These instructions explain how to do that.
Retrieving a V3.DAT from the tablet
2019-12-24
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AntDX316
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On the next drones or updates, do not cost cut to stay within regulations.  The tolerances are too tight and too many failures exist.  I assume it's a way for people to stay away from drones.
2019-12-24
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AntDX316
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People will willingly go bankrupt over medical bills and spend thousands of dollars on vacation but not spend to get a reliable M2.
2019-12-24
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Labroides
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AntDX316 Posted at 12-24 17:30
On the next drones or updates, do not cost cut to stay within regulations.  The tolerances are too tight and too many failures exist.  I assume it's a way for people to stay away from drones.

On the next drones or updates, do not cost cut to stay within regulations.  The tolerances are too tight and too many failures exist.
The biggest failure is people who despite knowing almost nothing, assume they really understand and make nonsense statements like this.
People will willingly go bankrupt over medical bills and spend thousands of dollars on vacation but not spend to get a reliable M2.
Because no other drone is reliable?
Here's a little idea to contemplate.
The Mini is cheap and new, it attracts thousands of new fliers, some of which will do silly things.
The result is many, many incident reports that have nothing to do with the reliability of the Mini but plenty to do with the inexperience of the users.
2019-12-24
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Labroides
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HereForTheBeer Posted at 12-22 20:11
def think more then 1% opportunity for non pilot error crash/flyaway.   i been around enough to see when things go wrong, batteries disconnect, GPS suddenly drops lock, software crashes on the drone, overheating, hel even solor weather can impact it, such as a solar storm knocking out satalights and and stuff known as Kp index.  etc etc.  lot of opportunities.  infact i think DJI should update their splash screen to include both ground weather and Kp index before clicking the button to go fly.

looking at her data in airmaps which references historical weather data based on gps info ad time of flight.   the wind was only 7-10 mph. one would hope even mavic mini could happily handle a 10mph wind, if not then mavic mini is a genuinely useless and dangerous drone for mass majority which see 10mph winds and pretty normal occurance.

Solar weather knocking out satellites and Kp Index?

i think DJI should update their splash screen to include both ground weather and Kp index before clicking the button to go fly
.

You might think that and it might be mentioned in forums but there's never been a verified case of solar weather having any measurable impact on anyone flying a recreational drone.
Think about it.
If the Kp Index really had a detrimental effect, the day one drone was affected, thousands would be.

The next drone knocked out by a high Kp Index event will be the first one.

2019-12-24
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Bright Spark
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Labroides Posted at 12-24 23:48
Solar weather knocking out satellites and Kp Index?

i think DJI should update their splash screen to include both ground weather and Kp index before clicking the button to go fly.
Well done Labroides.
At last the right take on  reported 'flyaways.'
(All I would add is the chance of there also  being  some  active trolls )
2019-12-25
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Bright Spark
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BudWalker Posted at 12-24 17:05
I looked at your incident. It was almost certainly caused by the launch site being geomagnetically distorted. The Yaw data shows the heading to be 61° (NW) at launch - pointing at the house. Do you recall the actual orientation? It's shown here as the yellow line[view_image]

If you want additional confirmation you will need to supply the .DAT from the device running the Fly App. These instructions explain how to do that.
[Image]
Regards magnetic distortion,the flight path does suggest this.However on the spark and mini I feel sure a compass error would be flagged as soon as an unexpected change in compass behaviour was registered, and gps dropped.
Just moving my mini next to apair of scissors will cause this.
2019-12-25
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BudWalker
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Bright Spark Posted at 12-25 01:41
Regards magnetic distortion,the flight path does suggest this.However on the spark and mini I feel sure a compass error would be flagged as soon as an unexpected change in compass behaviour was registered, and gps dropped.
Just moving my mini next to apair of scissors will cause this.

A geomagnetically distorted launch site doesn't always cause a compass error to be indicated in the Go App. A compass error occurs because the geomagnetic field strength is out of the normal range. That will be the case in some, but not all, parts of a distortion. There are many fly away incidents where this has happened.

The single most effective method to prevent this type of fly away is to check that the red triangle heading indicator on the map display is consistent with the actual orientation. If it isn't then, by definition, the Yaw value is compromised and erratic flight and/or fly away is likely. This method will catch Yaw problems that can't be seen with other methods, including the compass error.

It's indeed unfortunate that DJI doesn't document this test and encourage pilots to use it prior to launch. If it were documented and used many, many fly aways could have been prevented and many more will be prevented.
2019-12-25
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HereForTheBeer
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Labroides Posted at 12-24 23:48
Solar weather knocking out satellites and Kp Index?

i think DJI should update their splash screen to include both ground weather and Kp index before clicking the button to go fly.

actually you would be wrong, just because you may lack the data or lacked seeing it occur doesnt mean its not something that happens and is warned against.     i lost solid diversity last year flying my drones during a solar storm, KP 6 - 7 typically a KP of 6 is when you should be on alert if you are flying.. KP of 7 i will now avoid flying on and KP of 8 and above you can expect outages of anything in the path of the storm.  thankfully such high KP values are pretty uncommon event.  i lost GPS lock last year during a flight and turned out to be a KP 7 index out when it happened, i didn't know why mid flight i lost GPS lock but im experienced enough to managed flying in atti mode for brief few moments before i regained lock so imagine an inexperienced pilot suddenly lost GPS on their mavic Mini because of a solar storm that they were unaware of...is that pilot error..? that's easy to say yes from our prospective as experienced drone pilots who should know how to cope with something like sudden atti mode, but i would say no for a new pilot that's never had to deal with their aircraft suddenly void of position stabilization in the air for no reason as far as they are aware its for no reason.  not just that its void of position stabilization bu also flight dynamic changed to become much more aggressive in atti, like a very drifty sport mode.

but...if you need to visualize how much energy occurs during solar storms, check out the Auroras.   as beautiful as they are that shows you how much power there is, enough to ionize the magnetosphere and strip away ions causing brilliant lights and glowing colors to occur... thats same energy that GPS has to deal with up in space so you can imagine that disruptions are possible...  

now question of will this cause a fly away?  well i think its possible with djis fairly buggy software that it could get confused. i know i had a mavic pro that i sold that for whatever reason would set its homepoint at take off like it should then set homepoint again later further away and at seemingly completely random but sometimes after a disconnection event (scary bit because if i didnt reconnect in time it would landed at that home point instead of coming back to me)

2019-12-25
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Labroides
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HereForTheBeer Posted at 12-25 12:24
actually you would be wrong, just because you may lack the data or lacked seeing it occur doesnt mean its not something that happens and is warned against.     i lost solid diversity last year flying my drones during a solar storm, KP 6 - 7 typically a KP of 6 is when you should be on alert if you are flying.. KP of 7 i will now avoid flying on and KP of 8 and above you can expect outages of anything in the path of the storm.  thankfully such high KP values are pretty uncommon event.  i lost GPS lock last year during a flight and turned out to be a KP 7 index out when it happened, i didn't know why mid flight i lost GPS lock but im experienced enough to managed flying in atti mode for brief few moments before i regained lock so imagine an inexperienced pilot suddenly lost GPS on their mavic Mini because of a solar storm that they were unaware of...is that pilot error..? that's easy to say yes from our prospective as experienced drone pilots who should know how to cope with something like sudden atti mode, but i would say no for a new pilot that's never had to deal with their aircraft suddenly void of position stabilization in the air for no reason as far as they are aware its for no reason.  not just that its void of position stabilization bu also flight dynamic changed to become much more aggressive in atti, like a very drifty sport mode.

but...if you need to visualize how much energy occurs during solar storms, check out the Auroras.   as beautiful as they are that shows you how much power there is, enough to ionize the magnetosphere and strip away ions causing brilliant lights and glowing colors to occur... thats same energy that GPS has to deal with up in space so you can imagine that disruptions are possible...  

actually you would be wrong, just because you may lack the data or lacked seeing it occur doesnt mean its not something that happens and is warned against.    
Except that what I said is correct.
i lost solid diversity last year flying my drones during a solar storm
... i lost GPS lock last year during a flight and turned out to be a KP 7 index out when it happened, i didn't know why mid flight i lost GPS lock but im experienced enough to managed flying in atti mode for brief few moments before i regained lock

And it couldn't possibly have been due to anything else?
As they say in the classics: Correlation does not equal causation.
If a high Kp Index incident affected your drone that way, it would affect thousands of other drones flying around the same time and there's never been any such thing reported.
now question of will this cause a fly away?
In a high Kp Index, the worst you'd experience would be to have a GPS location data error a few feet larger than the error that is already a part of normal GPS.
You'd probably not even notice it.
well i think its possible with djis fairly buggy software that it could get confused.
DJI's fairly buggy software?
It sounds like you mean your own buggy reasoning and assumptions.
i know i had a mavic pro that i sold that for whatever reason would set its homepoint at take off like it should then set homepoint again later further away and at seemingly completely random but sometimes after a disconnection event (scary bit because if i didnt reconnect in time it would landed at that home point instead of coming back to me)
That's an interesting story, but I'm disinclined to accept it.
In 6 years of flying and being involved in forums, I haven't heard of anything like that.
I have encountered many instances where a flyer believed something was happening but the recorded flight data told a completely different  (and much more believable) story.
I'd like to investigate your recorded flight data to see what was really happening.
2019-12-25
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Labroides
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HereForTheBeer Posted at 12-25 17:33
sounds like you are one of hallmark's alt account dck sucking dji and using same template of responding

If you can't comment intelligently on the substance of what I've posted, go ahead and suggest all kinds of irrelevant nonsense.
It only reflects poorly on you.

FYI .. I'm a much more experienced drone flyer than you and I don't mindlessly repeat old wive's tails about stuff I don't understand.

If you don't want to benefit from accurate information, continue to wallow in ignorance and superstition.

2019-12-25
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Bright Spark
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BudWalker Posted at 12-25 05:37
A geomagnetically distorted launch site doesn't always cause a compass error to be indicated in the Go App. A compass error occurs because the geomagnetic field strength is out of the normal range. That will be the case in some, but not all, parts of a distortion. There are many fly away incidents where this has happened.

The single most effective method to prevent this type of fly away is to check that the red triangle heading indicator on the map display is consistent with the actual orientation. If it isn't then, by definition, the Yaw value is compromised and erratic flight and/or fly away is likely. This method will catch Yaw problems that can't be seen with other methods, including the compass error.

I personally check the orientation arrow is correct , since I had a spark before.
The mini’s is somewhat less user friendly  in my view.
However, no one who takes it out the box Christmas Day and immediately whizzes off will not, I imagine,  be aware  of   the implications of the local environment in that degree of detail.
First timers have, I suggest , but two options.
Make first flights under experienced supervision, or  research  the subject perhaps with a cheaper, simpler drone and many scrapes.
Alas my experience tells me that most people do neither and disaster follows.

2019-12-26
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BudWalker
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Bright Spark Posted at 12-26 11:47
I personally check the orientation arrow is correct , since I had a spark before.
The mini’s is somewhat less user friendly  in my view.
However, no one who takes it out the box Christmas Day and immediately whizzes off will ,I imagine,  be aware  of   the implications of the local environment in that degree of detail.

I'm curious. How is the mini less user friendly?
2019-12-26
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Bright Spark
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Spark’s icon just seemed easier to read.
You could spin it in you hand  before take off and correlate its orientation  with the icon.
Mini’s icon seems to be erratic until it’s well away from  controller/take of point.
2019-12-26
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Dzulkernian747
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Mine flew away did not RTH and I lost it completely. Waiting for DJI to analyse the flight logs and revert on the wayforawrd.
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GaryDoug
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Forgive me if I haven't read every post completely. But has anyone noticed that the reported wind direction was about the opposite as the drone drift? Winds were out of the NE and the drone flew to the east, seemingly against the wind. No expert here by any chance and you can call me out if I am wrong.

Ooops, I guess this topic is too old.

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GaryDoug
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Also, the ground level temp was 41F (?). Am I reading that correctly? Is it possible, that at 100 feet the temp might be near the low limit for the drone? Again, no expert here.

The OP could verify or dispute the wind direction and temp if possible.
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JJB*
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Bright Spark Posted at 2019-12-26 13:22
Spark’s icon just seemed easier to read.
You could spin it in you hand  before take off and correlate its orientation  with the icon.
Mini’s icon seems to be erratic until it’s well away from  controller/take of point.

if you check the orientation in the map view, this view uses only the data from the mini.
Map is always good orientate, so better way to check if actual drone heading is seen correctly in the map view.

cheers
JJB
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djiuser_WGClehojBz8o
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My Mavic mini also crashed today , it was fully charged, it fell after a high wind warning is it normal
2021-12-7
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Labroides
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djiuser_WGClehojBz8o Posted at 12-7 06:10
My Mavic mini also crashed today , it was fully charged, it fell after a high wind warning is it normal

A high wind warning won't make the drone crash.
It would be necessary to look at your flight data to be able to say anything about your incident.

Go to http://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer/Upload/
It has instructions to find the .txt file from your phone or tablet which you can upload to that site
Upload it and it gives you a summary of the flight data.
Post a link to that summary.

Or just post the .txt file
2021-12-7
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