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No CE Certification & No AirSense outside the USA
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Mailliw_Sirrom
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Ulli01 Posted at 6-3 08:30
I don't now what you are talking about?
Art. 22 (b) refers to a weight of 500g or more and less than 2kg!
A drone with this weight (Air2 as far as I remember with 570g?) can under this circumstances be flown with a minimum distance from "people" (NOT uninvolved persons!!) of 50m, IF the pilot has a license acc. to A2.

Then you should start flying it under the A3 license when you take off and then switch to fly it under the A2 license.

(Still you would be able to take off with the drone where you are under A2 license, when you read 'the law' you have to bear in mind the purpose of 'the law' when you 'interterprate' it and the context there are to keep uninvolved persons safe even if the merely states 'persons' it is not put in place to protect you as the actual drone pilot.)

And yes, you may fly any drone up to 25kg under the A3 license, even if it weighs 570gr.
(Latest/upcoming changes are here: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX%3A32020R0639#d1e410-1-1)

You have an easier exam for A1/A3 and you will get both of those certificates, the A2 license is more advanced and will have a (slightly) more advanced exam.  
6-6 12:41
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urbanweb
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B737ng Posted at 6-6 08:21
After doing some homework on this Airsense and looking at various Air 2 teardown images and videos, both US & EU models actually appear to have the same hardware.
Theres 2 possible options that could be.

As per Ian’s reply, could you try enabling it to see what happens?  It would be interesting if you could spoof the location to near an airport to see if you get alerts!
6-7 03:48
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MICHAL01
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From what i have seen on Forums and also on Facebook, DJI wont do anything!
Everywhere they are copy&paste same answer saying you will still be able to fly it after new regulations.

If you read it carefully
All it say is that basically you will be able to fly it in A3 as C4!!!!!

So it is clear DJI wont do anything!

They are making huge advertisement for Mavic Air 2 now to sell as many as possible
knowing that after new regulations many users will have no other choice then to buy new drone again
meaning? MORE PROFIT FOR DJI, MORE MONEY!

So they wont do anything about recent situation.
6-7 14:32
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Trunks1983
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According to the reschedule of the CE certification, do you expect the mavic air 2 not to be certified before 2021?
I was waiting for July hoping for the certification, but now it is long time to wait and I am wonder if I should buy it instead of keep waiting.
6-8 09:15
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Acerr
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Trunks1983 Posted at 6-8 09:15
According to the reschedule of the CE certification, do you expect the mavic air 2 not to be certified before 2021?
I was waiting for July hoping for the certification, but now it is long time to wait and I am wonder if I should buy it instead of keep waiting.

Yeah, same. Would be nice if someone from support team could give us answers.

@DJI Support @DJI Panda
@DJI Mindy

6-8 14:05
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Thr0nSK
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Trunks1983 Posted at 6-8 09:15
According to the reschedule of the CE certification, do you expect the mavic air 2 not to be certified before 2021?
I was waiting for July hoping for the certification, but now it is long time to wait and I am wonder if I should buy it instead of keep waiting.

Just buy it. I already did like 2 weeks ago because I didn't feel like waiting anymore. Try to use the drone as much as possible and then sell it for the MA3.
And I believe what DJI have said - that we will be able to fly it within the new regulations as well because it meets all the requirements. It also has the remote id.. I think that the EU says that drones will not be able to be certificated retrospectively because they don't think somebody will put the required hardware in the drones now.
6-9 03:14
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castormalin
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CE certification is linked to the mfg date and is never given retrospectively
6-9 06:00
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hallmark007
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Trunks1983 Posted at 6-8 09:15
According to the reschedule of the CE certification, do you expect the mavic air 2 not to be certified before 2021?
I was waiting for July hoping for the certification, but now it is long time to wait and I am wonder if I should buy it instead of keep waiting.

Never put off until tomorrow what you can do today. Life’s too short, they’re many who wouldn’t want you to have it, but those are usually miserable people who don’t know when or how to live.
Buy now and for the next 2 1/2 years you can fly and enjoy at will .
6-9 07:13
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Trunks1983
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hallmark007 Posted at 6-9 07:13
Never put off until tomorrow what you can do today. Life’s too short, they’re many who wouldn’t want you to have it, but those are usually miserable people who don’t know when or how to live.
Buy now and for the next 2 1/2 years you can fly and enjoy at will .

Sure, but if is was waiting for only 1 month (before it was posponed), that was meaningful
6-9 08:28
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MICHAL01
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Thr0nSK Posted at 6-9 03:14
Just buy it. I already did like 2 weeks ago because I didn't feel like waiting anymore. Try to use the drone as much as possible and then sell it for the MA3.
And I believe what DJI have said - that we will be able to fly it within the new regulations as well because it meets all the requirements. It also has the remote id.. I think that the EU says that drones will not be able to be certificated retrospectively because they don't think somebody will put the required hardware in the drones now.

"" that we will be able to fly it within the new regulations as well""

YES BUT AS C4 IN A3!!
and that is the whole problem, becuase look at restrictions in A3!

In that new Reg. it say All drones out before new reg. came out, will be able to fall in to A3 as C4
but also only case they have necesery software&hardware
6-9 09:02
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Kris Murphy
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ok, got a headache reading all 7 pages and my conclusions are:
1. ADS-B isnt required (and possibly never be) in EU --> we are sorted
2. All what DJI need to do (presuming MA2 get CE cert)  is to send NEW labels to registered owners --> problem solved
6-9 13:42
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MICHAL01
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Kris Murphy Posted at 6-9 13:42
ok, got a headache reading all 7 pages and my conclusions are:
1. ADS-B isnt required (and possibly never be) in EU --> we are sorted
2. All what DJI need to do (presuming MA2 get CE cert)  is to send NEW labels to registered owners --> problem solved

Sound easy but remember!
We are talking about EU.
bunch of bored "&^$&(%(^%" that are acting like they know everything
but in reality nothing make sense with them!

If there is a product out and go by all regs. then what's the problem.....
6-10 16:42
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LT.MAVERICK
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As castormalin has pointed out, EASA will not be issuing labels/certifications on sold drones. Current MA2 owners for example, will be seen as 'legacy' drones. Source: Dronewatch.nl (Dutch article)

In consequence, to place an “old” product on the market with a class identification label you need to fully apply Regulation (EU) 2019/945 as it was a new product, i.e.:
– You need to ensure full technical compliance of the product with the requirements applicable to its class
– You need to demonstrate its compliance to these requirements, using the methods defined in the Regulation
– Of course you may reuse the technical file produced to demonstrate the compliance of the “old” product with other legislations (like the RED, etc.)
– You need to issue a new certificate of conformity including now Regulation (EU) 2019/945

This, however, also means that there is no possibilities to transform an “old” product already sold into a “new” product by a simple s/w update performed by the customer (and the provision of the adequate class logo). Such an update must be done before the placing on the market and reflected in the conformity assessment and the technical file.”
6-10 23:28
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virtual
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MICHAL01 Posted at 6-10 16:42
Sound easy but remember!
We are talking about EU.
bunch of bored "&^$&(%(^%" that are acting like they know everything

What a exact description of EU!
6-11 00:12
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jmshelley
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LT.MAVERICK Posted at 6-10 23:28
As castormalin has pointed out, EASA will not be issuing labels/certifications on sold drones. Current MA2 owners for example, will be seen as 'legacy' drones. Source: Dronewatch.nl (Dutch article)

In consequence, to place an “old” product on the market with a class identification label you need to fully apply Regulation (EU) 2019/945 as it was a new product, i.e.:

This is exactly how CE marking works not just for drones, but across all industries. I work with medical devices and it’s exactly the same principle.

In 6 months time you’ll only be able to fly a MA2 in A3 (or A2 if you get the CoC) with additional training. In 2.5 years time you’ll only be able to fly in A3.

Anyone that thinks DJI will be able to change this is in denial (IMO). And authorities really won’t care about your legacy drone, irrespective of how much you paid or how close you purchased it to the change in legislation.

Personally I’ve purchased it, and will take my A2 CoC later in the year. That way I get to fly the MA2 pretty much as I do today for 2.5 years (moderate distance away from people) and not over built up areas.
6-11 00:54
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crosswired
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ok, what if DJI retrofit ads-b to eu drones and call them e.g mavic air 2.1 for the label purposes? remember that ads-b version not being sold in eu so in my understanding, dji can get ce certs for 'upgraded' version, then retrofit 'old' air 2s with ads and provide new labels for them...
possible or not?
6-11 12:47
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jmshelley
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It’s possible I think.

DJI will make more money though from having a brand new product on the market, rather than sorting out legacy drones.

People will buy the new models as that’s what us drone geeks do.

Commercially, it wouldn’t make sense for DJI to give certificates to old models.
6-11 12:53
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hallmark007
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crosswired Posted at 6-11 12:47
ok, what if DJI retrofit ads-b to eu drones and call them e.g mavic air 2.1 for the label purposes? remember that ads-b version not being sold in eu so in my understanding, dji can get ce certs for 'upgraded' version, then retrofit 'old' air 2s with ads and provide new labels for them...
possible or not?

I suggest if you have care refresh wait until this happens send your drone in get an ADS-B version .
6-11 12:55
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crosswired
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hallmark007 Posted at 6-11 12:55
I suggest if you have care refresh wait until this happens send your drone in get an ADS-B version .

thats what I was thinking
got 3rd party insurance as well so I'm sorted if my drone 'unexpectedly flies away'
6-11 13:02
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crosswired
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jmshelley Posted at 6-11 12:53
It’s possible I think.

DJI will make more money though from having a brand new product on the market, rather than sorting out legacy drones.

well, air 2 is a decent drone if not the best in its class which I call semi-pro so by my guess, dji can sell it with success for next two years without releasing air 3 ...
also, if ce certs not sorted, I'd expect massive drop in sales in eu pretty soon (might be wrong of course as a simply folk doesnt care about regulations )
6-11 13:06
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jmshelley
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Most buy drones first, and worry about the rules after.

Suspect there will be a MA 2.1 with CE marking for the start of 2021. Maybe calling it MA 2.1 zoom.
6-11 13:11
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crosswired
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jmshelley Posted at 6-11 13:11
Most buy drones first, and worry about the rules after.

Suspect there will be a MA 2.1 with CE marking for the start of 2021. Maybe calling it MA 2.1 zoom.

so I've done
6-11 13:18
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jmshelley
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The regs are only relevant if enforced. And for them to be enforced, usually you’d have either put someone at harm or something like a near miss at an airfield.

I’m sure a large proportion do not follow the current rules fully e.g VLOS.
6-11 13:23
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swoermck
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B737ng Posted at 6-6 08:21
After doing some homework on this Airsense and looking at various Air 2 teardown images and videos, both US & EU models actually appear to have the same hardware.
Theres 2 possible options that could be.

Hi,

interesting - in another forum I read that somebody with a US Version of the MA2 didn't have the AirSense toggle enabled while in the EU - this would support your findings that it is currently only availbe in the U.S, even if the hardware for ads-b is present.

Maybe you can check your Model No.? Read at "MyDealz" that somebody (in Germany) purchased via Apple and got a MA2 with the model number "MA2UE3W" - hinting to the AirSense Model. Furthermore it was mentioned that MA2 models with production date from 05/2020 will be equipped with AirSense - but so far I was not able to verify the production date and AirSense statement somewhere else..








6-14 02:21
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crosswired
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...seriously, DJI should announce officially whats is going on and what their plans are...
6-14 06:42
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Andy Uk
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Ian in London Posted at 4-30 22:37
The CE certification is pretty useful if you want to fly in less restricted airspace in 2 years....

with NPAS and Military using MLAT and not ADS-B and the EASA regs only mandating ADS-B on manned craft with a MTOM above 5700kg (unlike the FAA rules) the small low flying craft will still sneak up on you.  AirSense sounds good in theory but it only works if everything manned is ADS-B mandatory.  
6-14 11:54
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Andy Uk
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Bigplumbs Posted at 4-30 21:12
Agreed but if it is in effect a mandatory requirement I am not buying one now and will wait. I was right ready to spend my money but not now and I think most buyers in the CE area (If they are aware) will feel the same

ADS-B isn't mandated in any regs.  You are thinking of remote identification, they are not the same
6-14 11:56
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Andy Uk
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DJI Mindy Posted at 5-1 05:30
Thanks for raising your concerns here in Forum. DJI will implement the production and sales standards in accordance with the requirements of local policies, there will be no restrictions currently.
Actually none of the electronic products can do the CE Certification until the CE standard is released.
According to the conclusion given by our legal affairs, even after the new policy is launched, the products currently on the market will have a product protection period of two years, which means we can use Mavic Air 2 as usual.

Annex Part 1 of the Attached Document.  These are the detailed specifications of the various class ratings introduced into Law in the EU March 2019.  DJI have failed to do anything about this

COMMISSION DELEGATED REGULATION (EU) 2019/945
6-14 12:03
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djiuser_4R5yxglQcL7i
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Who has DJI CARE Refresh will be able to exchange for one that has Airsense?
6-27 11:48
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A J
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jmshelley Posted at 6-11 00:54
This is exactly how CE marking works not just for drones, but across all industries. I work with medical devices and it’s exactly the same principle.

In 6 months time you’ll only be able to fly a MA2 in A3 (or A2 if you get the CoC) with additional training. In 2.5 years time you’ll only be able to fly in A3.

How is A3 different to the current drone code?
6-27 11:58
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Red Zeppelin
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swoermck Posted at 6-14 02:21
Hi,

interesting - in another forum I read that somebody with a US Version of the MA2 didn't have the AirSense toggle enabled while in the EU - this would support your findings that it is currently only availbe in the U.S, even if the hardware for ads-b is present.
Intrigued by this as I've been holding off buying the MA2 in the hope AirSense and certification would be added to the UK/EU version.

Having successfully tested the Floater GPS app hack with my Spark, my understanding is that it's the controller that's fooled into thinking its in the US. If that's the case, could this mean AirSense for the MA2 is actually in the controller rather than the drone itself?

I've read lots of opinions on whether AirSense is necessary, but living on the coast where there are lots of light aircraft and helicopter low level flights, I'd rather have it than not.
6-27 22:47
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Danveal
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Hi,
unfortunately, the impossibility of retroactive marking for the Mavic Air 2 was officially confirmed by EASA in the person of Ing. Natale Di Rubbo  at the Rome event Drone Webinar Channel which took place on Facebook. Drones placed on the market without the new Open CE marking will not be able to receive the new marking retroactively.
All the details in an article published by Quadricottero News in Italian language: https://www.quadricottero.com/20 ... -che-non-potra.html
6-28 01:26
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jmshelley
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A J Posted at 6-27 11:58
How is A3 different to the current drone code?

Hardly any difference. 150m from congested areas. No people in area (which CAA have defined as within 50m - same as now). Still VLOS and 400ft.
Main difference is the cylinder vs. Dome for distances from people.
6-28 11:02
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A J
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jmshelley Posted at 6-28 11:02
Hardly any difference. 150m from congested areas. No people in area (which CAA have defined as within 50m - same as now). Still VLOS and 400ft.
Main difference is the cylinder vs. Dome for distances from people.

Thanks for the info - seems like nothing to worry about then when compared to how we are allowed to fly recreationally now.
6-28 14:08
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Luca90
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Today the Engineer Di Rubbo,  Program Manager Drones EASA, wrote to the Italian drones website Quadricottero News that the European Commission and EASA are working together for defining the details that will permit the retrofitting for the drones already sold.
This will be possible by letting the drone makers to recall the products, apply the needed changes to correspond the requested parameters (if possible) and than they will be able to attach the corresponding marking.
The good news is the DJI is really interested as Olivier Mondon, Comunication Manager DJI Europe said.
So let's hope and wait.
https://www.quadricottero.com/20 ... 6eb_ksAC-9bfgvk&m=1
7-17 10:59
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WinMarc
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Luca90 Posted at 7-17 10:59
Today the Engineer Di Rubbo,  Program Manager Drones EASA, wrote to the Italian drones website Quadricottero News that the European Commission and EASA are working together for defining the details that will permit the retrofitting for the drones already sold.
This will be possible by letting the drone makers to recall the products, apply the needed changes to corresponding the requested parameters (if possible) and than they will be able to attach the corresponding marking.
The good news is the DJI is really interested as Olivier Mondon, Comunication Manager DJI Europe said.

That are some good news. Thx for sharing that info.
7-18 04:16
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KREMi
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will see 1st will it work in RL. Sometimes it's just a fake news/rumor spreaded to keep sales going - and in reality nothing will happen.

I did return MA2, same as few other pilots I know. A3 is not where we wanna have our toy in future. I take care of my tech, so it last me way way longer then "just" 2 years.
and everybody can cry a lot about EU rules/rights (which some are really ... strange, agree here) but that idea: one ruleset for any EU country UAV is nice welcome - as if U travel over EU in past - You did need to know every country specyfic regulations... with 1 common right it will be just easier.
7-20 00:55
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1piotr13
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KREMi Posted at 7-20 00:55
will see 1st will it work in RL. Sometimes it's just a fake news/rumor spreaded to keep sales going - and in reality nothing will happen.

I did return MA2, same as few other pilots I know. A3 is not where we wanna have our toy in future. I take care of my tech, so it last me way way longer then "just" 2 years.

That's why I'm waiting till 2021 to buy MA2.
7-20 01:33
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B737ng
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Most recent  Mavic Air 2 models will be sold with Airsense module even in the EU. The ADS-B modules are back in production and will be fitted retrospectively.  

But do bear in mind that Airsense does not work in EU as of yet, ( I tested the Airsense model at my local airfield with active mode s adsb transponders) which is so far  are only enabled on FCC models as required by regulations .

Good news is that its coming , bad news is that those who got Air 2 at the launch are going to be without it. Either ways, no big deal. Lets look forward to an Air 3
7-20 15:40
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PAYBACK
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So have we confirmed that CE models with 3W designation have AIRSENSE hardware?
11-5 02:19
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