Hello DJI,

Do you intend to fix the problrm of exposure pulsing on the DJI POCKET 2? As you well know the issue has already been raised by numerous owners in this forum and their questions have been left unanswered. https://forum.dji.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=233809

I simply require an intention from you (DJI) to address and fix the issue in an future firmware update or for you (DJI) to to state that the issue can not be fixed with firmware, in which case all owners with the issue can return their purchases to retailers for a refund.

It is simple really, I give you money for a product that should fulfill its potential as outlined in your advertising, without defect.

The problem can be viewed at this link: https://youtu.be/O59w3FW68KY

The file is straight out of the camera.

Peter

Seems you are shooting on auto exposure where the running water waves are changing the exposure as you are moving the camera, test the same on manual exposure & if you have ND filters then follow the 180 degree shutter angle.
So when shooting manually on 60fps set shutter speed to 1/120 Manually & choose the ND filter which gets you correct exposure (In daylight you would need 16X or 32X)

Goodmorning everyone.  I too have noticed the same flickering problem of op2 after having done various tests I have seen that it occurs only by activating the high quality mode.  selecting instead hit saver the defect no longer occurs in any shooting mode.  try it too and give me feedback.

djiuser_3PZ9GYbOi4Pv Posted at 8-22 00:43
Goodmorning everyone.  I too have noticed the same flickering problem of op2 after having done various tests I have seen that it occurs only by activating the high quality mode.  selecting instead hit saver the defect no longer occurs in any shooting mode.  try it too and give me feedback.

It’s worth a try for sure.

The pulsing does not occur in all scenes and if you have other movement or scene changes this will disguise the issue.

I found to have an objective test, I used the same static scene of large green grassed area and trees. Recorded a set time under all settings, including different frame rates and quality mode settings and different uSd cards.
It was most noticeable to the eye  in 50/60 fps.  I tried two different pocket2 and both exhibited the same problem.

However it will be interesting to hear feedback if others find the HQ / battery settings makes a difference. Perhaps even slightly different internal hardware revisions make a difference ?

Ranjan Posted at 8-21 20:04
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O59w3FW68KY
Seems you are shooting on auto exposure where the running water waves are changing the exposure as you are moving the camera, test the same on manual exposure & if you have ND filters then follow the 180 degree shutter angle.
So when shooting manually on 60fps set shutter speed to 1/120 Manually & choose the ND filter which gets you correct exposure (In daylight you would need 16X or 32X)

I also agree this option is worth exploring.    Not all exposure pulsing is due to the compression issue, it is normal on any camera to have exposure ramping up and down with moving scenes as explained in this answer.

However no need for filters to prove this, just use manual mode and set exposure appropriately.

in the video you can see the heavy loss of quality in hi quality 30fps mode by performing pan and tilt
https://youtu.be/tMz2NBGIEfI
https://youtu.be/jHB4-ibuu04

this clearly is user created problem without understanding the tool & their internal workings.

Even a $5000 USD camera will do the same, no amount of technology can help if you dont know how to use it.
What you are seeing is the effect of Rolling shutter which you need to avoid on any digital video camera be it USD $300 or $5000.

Ranjan Posted at 8-22 05:25
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHB4-ibuu04
this clearly is user created problem without understanding the tool & their internal workings.

First of all I thank you for your intelligent and very helpfull contribution to me and to all those who are reporting the same problem.
Then Since on pocket 1 and mavic 2 pro I have never had this problem. I would ask you from the top of your knowledge what could be the correct settings to use so that the shooting with pan and tilt does not start to flicker conspicuously.
PS I did several shots also in manual mode and with filters nd installed

Ranjan Posted at 8-22 05:25
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHB4-ibuu04
this clearly is user created problem without understanding the tool & their internal workings.

Ranjan,

Regardless of settings, manual or automatic, the outcome is the same. Tested!

Please check the thread I linked in my original posting. It is well tested!

Peter

djiuser_3PZ9GYbOi4Pv Posted at 8-22 07:23
First of all I thank you for your intelligent and very helpfull contribution to me and to all those who are reporting the same problem.
Then Since on pocket 1 and mavic 2 pro I have never had this problem. I would ask you from the top of your knowledge what could be the correct settings to use so that the shooting with pan and tilt does not start to flicker conspicuously.
PS I did several shots also in manual mode and with filters nd installed

"heavy loss of quality in hi quality 30fps mode by performing pan and tilt"
I acknowledge there is a visual loss of quality when you start panning in that video however there is no "Flicker" which I could notice.

"correct settings to use so that the shooting with pan and tilt does not start to flicker conspicuously."
Flicker is very different & there is no flicker in that video which I could notice after seeing it multiple times. What you are seeing is bcoz your pan is very fast thus it is causing rolling shutter effect combined with High quality Noise reduction to compensate the quality loss due to panning.
Notice how suddenly the video looks blurry as you move your hand, as soon you stop the video is sharp again.

What I suggest is to use the joystick to pan it will be much smoother instaed of moving your arm to swing the camera accross the field.

• Pan Carefully
  

When taking action shots of fast-moving subjects such as race cars, the temptation is to pan the camera to follow the car.

But doing so may result in a rolling shutter – especially if there are vertical fences, posts or trees in the scene.

If  you pan the video camera slower, the race car will speed out of the  field of view and you’ll miss the shot. However, if you pan it carefully  and use a faster shutter speed, you can reduce the rolling effect.

The best way to avoid rolling shutter problems while capturing video  footage is to increase the frame rate (FPS) shoot at 60fps at 1/120 shutter speed in Manual mode for which you will need ND filter to get correct exposure.

Do the following test
1. Pan with joystick at 4k 60fps shutter speed auto
2. Pan with arms moving left to right 4k 30fps shutter speed auto
3. Pan with arms moving left to right 4k 30fps shutter speed auto, stop the pan half way & stay still for 10 sec then continue to pan right.

These 3 test footage will show you the difference & make you understand what not to do & what to do.

"I did several shots also in manual mode and with filters nd installed"
Next time post the video with full deatils & exif info so we can figure out what settinsg are being used.

djiuser_wpte84WsGrck Posted at 8-22 08:14
Ranjan,

Regardless of settings, manual or automatic, the outcome is the same. Tested!

Thanks for reverting back, did you shoot with ND filter on Manual mode to get the 180 degree shutter angle?

Ranjan Posted at 8-22 08:24
Thanks for reverting back, did you shoot with ND filter on Manual mode to get the 180 degree shutter angle?

Yes I try.
the problem occurs only by setting hi quality and in 4k.
at 2.7k it is not present and if I set battery saver at any resolution and setting there is no loss of quality.
anyway I'll try again with shutter 180 and nd filter

djiuser_3PZ9GYbOi4Pv Posted at 8-22 08:36
Yes I try.
the problem occurs only by setting hi quality and in 4k.
at 2.7k it is not present and if I set battery saver at any resolution and setting there is no loss of quality.

Great so at least you were able to pin point one thing that High Quality mode is one factor which might be causing this.

I have been using Pocket 2 since last 4 months & have never seen such issues in my videos but then I always shoot on battery saver mode.

Hi all,

Tried out shooting the same subject, in the same environment with the same device in the same lighting, manual settings 4K and HD and the exposure pulsing is eveident only in the 4K version. What is causing this?

Peter

Beddgelert Posted at 8-22 11:09
Hi all,

Tried out shooting the same subject, in the same environment with the same device in the same lighting, manual settings 4K and HD and the exposure pulsing is eveident only in the 4K version. What is causing this?

One probable cause is when you use Hi quality mode it may cause that what you call pulsing. Try battery saving mode on 4k

Hi Ranjan,

I have never used high quality mode.

Peter

Beddgelert Posted at 8-23 01:27
Hi Ranjan,

I have never used high quality mode.

Can you post a sample on youtube in 4K & link it here so we can have a look what really is causing this to certain users & not happening for other users.

Today I pulled out my older test videos from day 1 when I bought Pocket 2, after going through 100 videos I didn't find a single one having that problem

Hi Ranjan,

The clip in my original post is 4k untouched.

Peter

Hi Ranjan,

Here is a link to footage straight from the P2 memory card, it will download from my Onedrive.

https://1drv.ms/v/s!AhokOP6FCLBKiZwStxT5WpLA0ywSqA?e=eidHfE

Or my google drive: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1HoBJ8diEARiCZtfbGkDClR5KgcJQeykM/view?usp=sharing

Peter

Almost all my videos look like this...
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1a3pimV5oF5EP7ezELNfdbbTFrIxQr5qM/view?usp=sharing
dji does nothing or comment. Also 4k 60 is of unacceptable quality 4k 30 much better. this camera doesn't actually shoot at 4k 60.

I recently dragged my Panasonic FZ1000 from the cupboard and used it for a YouTube video - my first thought on seeing the result was "wow, I really miss the Pocket 2 exposure stability".  I'm sure I paid significantly more for tha Panasonic than for the Pocket 2.  The initial video in this thread is incredibly demanding on the camera's encoder - and at the same time it's processing the gimbal stabiliity side of things - really, expectations have to be reasonable.

Beddgelert Posted at 8-23 10:01
Hi Ranjan,

Here is a link to footage straight from the P2 memory card, it will download from my Onedrive.

Hi Peter,
this indeed shows the same problem as its there in the first post, the exposure ramping has to be done by camera since you are moving the camera left & right & on top of that the water is moving which is causing bright & dark moving objects for the exposure to compensate, this is challenging for any camera.

I asked you to specifically to shoot with ND filter on manual mode so the shutter speed remains locked at 1/120 when shooting 60fps 4k where as this sample video in google drive the shutter speed is set on AUTO & its jumping up & down.

Sitting at my desk I just shot 4 different 4k60fps clips trying to replicate this problem & I don't see any such problem, then I went out today to test it with outdoor scene & see if I can replicate this on my pocket 2 but I dont get that problem at all. I shot it without ND filters on auto exposure mode & even manual mode 4 different clips on different settings.

Watch this on 4k if youtube defaults it to 1080p by changing the settings.


Another test you can do is shoot on auto mode & keep the camera on rock or a tripod (don't pan by moving hand) shoot 30sec the flowing water with greenery in the  background then using joystick pan left to right.

Shoot the above scene twice, once on full auto mode,
another clip on Manual mode with ND filter to maintain 1/120 4k 60fps.

Hope we can pinpoint the actual problem & solve this for some of the users.

element33 Posted at 8-23 11:06
Almost all my videos look like this...
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1a3pimV5oF5EP7ezELNfdbbTFrIxQr5qM/view?usp=sharing
dji does nothing or comment. Also 4k 60 is of unacceptable quality 4k 30 much better. this camera doesn't actually shoot at 4k 60.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1a3pimV5oF5EP7ezELNfdbbTFrIxQr5qM/view?usp=sharing
Your video indeed shows exposure ramping flicker, post full exif settings what you used for this clip.

It would be interesting to see the subtitles displayed which show the current data for exposure, moment to moment.  But there's no data in that file.

fansfe82067d Posted at 8-24 03:21
It would be interesting to see the subtitles displayed which show the current data for exposure, moment to moment.  But there's no data in that file.

According to subtitles there are some exposure changes: SS 7930,21 -> 7887,06 -> 8147,97.
I agree with Ranjan. Perhaps manual exposure eliminates this effect, but that's not why I bought the camera. It has been almost a year since the P2 announcement. Probably imx686 + H2 soc is not the best combination on hardware level. This also explains the significant quality degradation between 4k60 and 4k30. Old OP1 gives a much better picture in 4k60 compared to P2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWOB1CQ3Rug&t=443s
It's time to admit dji presented a raw product.

Hi again everyone,

Here is footage i took two days ago, no water, no panning, just plenty of exposure pulsing. Something is wrong with this product!

Link to footage on my Onedrive: https://1drv.ms/v/s!AhokOP6FCLBKiZwp_4N4e_ZebGUYZQ?e=wMCxrm 4K60

Same on Google drive: https://drive.google.com/file/d/ ... xL/view?usp=sharing 4K60

What the hell is this? Can it be corrected in post?

Peter

Beddgelert Posted at 8-24 07:07
Hi again everyone,

Here is footage i took two days ago, no water, no panning, just plenty of exposure pulsing. Something is wrong with this product!

Hi Peter
I downloaded the 2.1gb clip & barely notice any exposure pulsing in this beautiful clip, all I notice is some artifacts in upper left background trees that too by pixel peeping due variable bit rate. You have striped out the exif data so I cant see it as a subtitle when playing in VLC player.

Just a doubt hence asking, could it be your video play acting differently, try VLC player if you have a different player to view your video files.

element33 Posted at 8-24 06:30
According to subtitles there are some exposure changes: SS 7930,21 -> 7887,06 -> 8147,97.
I agree with Ranjan. Perhaps manual exposure eliminates this effect, but that's not why I bought the camera. It has been almost a year since the P2 announcement. Probably imx686 + H2 soc is not the best combination on hardware level. This also explains the significant quality degradation between 4k60 and 4k30. Old OP1 gives a much better picture in 4k60 compared to P2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWOB1CQ3Rug&t=443s
It's time to admit dji presented a raw product.

Intresting comparision between Osmo Pocket & Pocket 2 with great deatiled description.

But the present topic of exposure pulsing is now puzzeling me too after doing different test & checking old test footage, not a singly time its happening with me where as some of the people are having it. Granted that me being a Professional use this poceket 2 using my professional knowledge about shooting video, however this product is made for usual amatures mainly who would not know much they want simple ready to use product working perfectly out of the box.

Ranjan Posted at 8-24 07:44
Hi Peter
I downloaded the 2.1gb clip & barely notice any exposure pulsing in this beautiful clip, all I notice is some artifacts in upper left background trees that too by pixel peeping due variable bit rate. You have striped out the exif data so I cant see it as a subtitle when playing in VLC player.

Hi Ranjan,

I put it through Resolve 17 to remove the audio track. I will now upload the untouched, straight from SD card version so you can take a look if you wish. I have always used VLC.

Peter

Beddgelert Posted at 8-24 07:55
Hi Ranjan,

I put it through Resolve 17 to remove the audio track. I will now upload the untouched, straight from SD card version so you can take a look if you wish. I have always used VLC.

Hi Ranjan,

Hopefully this has metadata intact.

https://1drv.ms/v/s!AhokOP6FCLBKiZwqJIO5WQzfsr4zXw?e=EfVtrh My Onedrive

https://drive.google.com/file/d/ ... 1i/view?usp=sharing My Google Drive

Peter

Beddgelert Posted at 8-24 08:52
Hi Ranjan,

Hopefully this has metadata intact.

Hi Peter
as per this original file I confirm there is no exposure pulsing happening at all in this clip even though auto shutter speed is varying by 1/3 of stop not much.

So you now need to pin point where are you seeing that pulsing, which area of the frame & at what time duration of the 61sec clip.

Hi Ranjan,

It occurs every second for the entire clip, only the reindeer itself is unaffected. Interestingly, in other footage of the same animal at 4K60, I used the 2x zoom function, exposure pulsing is not visible in that part of the footage. I am confused, as the pulsing is visible to me on the P2 monitor, on my phone after transfer as well as on my PC.

Peter

Hi, there. Thank you for your feedback. This situation has filled us with regret, we are sincerely sorry for the trouble you’ve been experiencing.

The frame rate is synthesized by algorithm encoding. H264 encoding will have a slight difference in the quantization error of the encoding for I-frame and P-frame. In order to ensure the video quality while shooting a bit more complex scenes, the I-frame coding of Pocket 2 takes up a larger bit rate, which leads to a slightly larger brightness difference between I-frame and P-frame. That is why we see the videos flickering. However, the brightness difference is approximate 0.7 (256 brightness range) which is almost hard to tell from according to our measurement.

Sorry again for the inconvenience. If you have any futher question, please feel free to contact us.

DJI Tony Posted at 8-24 20:10
Hi, there. Thank you for your feedback. This situation has filled us with regret, we are sincerely sorry for the trouble you’ve been experiencing.

The frame rate is synthesized by algorithm encoding. H264 encoding will have a slight difference in the quantization error of the encoding for I-frame and P-frame. In order to ensure the video quality while shooting a bit more complex scenes, the I-frame coding of Pocket 2 takes up a larger bit rate, which leads to a slightly larger brightness difference between I-frame and P-frame. That is why we see the videos flickering. However, the brightness difference is approximate 0.7 (256 brightness range) which is almost hard to tell from according to our measurement.

Thanks Dji Tony,
for answering this post & giving a detailed explaination on this issue for the first time.


Based on your description I did test the Peter's original video & even my video in Davinci Resolve color scopes & it does confirm that scopes & histogram jumps after few Miliseconds.
Its hard to notice in actual video but then why are some users able to  notice it so much & other users are not able to notice in actual video, could it be  due to the refresh rate of different TV/ Monitor screens?

DJI Tony,

I appreciate your response, but regret does not solve my problem. Will there be a fix via firmware? Or is this this problem unfixable and a limitation off the hardware?

Your answer is also very technical and beyond my understanding.

I await your reply.

Peter

Beddgelert Posted at 8-25 00:43
DJI Tony,

I appreciate your response, but regret does not solve my problem. Will there be a fix via firmware? Or is this this problem unfixable and a limitation off the hardware?

Hi Peter

By the technical description he gave it seems not fixable due to the way Interlaced (i) frame & progressive (P) frames are encoded to H264. I+P frames work in sync to give us each frame, we have 30/60fps in 1 sec interval where its difficult to notice this brightness difference but you are still able to pick that.

The above image shows 8bit step wedge chart showing 0-255 shades of grey & if you look generally in any 2 next to each other value you cannot recognize the shade difference although there is surely a numerical & brightness difference. On any 8bit monitor its not noticeable  (I have 8bit monitor) but on 10bit monitor you may be able to see the difference I assume since it can show much larger shades of grey.

However you say that even the pocket 2 screen itself shows you that exposure pulsing which is a big puzzle for me as of now.

Can this be fixed?
My guess is no not with the present hardware but I will be happy to have a firmware update to minimize this 1.75 shade difference under 1.0 so the normal eye cannot pick that up.

Hope this make things clear.

Hi Ranjan,

Thanks for sticking with me through this thread. We have our answer and now await an solution.

Minimisation of shade difference  to less than 1.0 sounds great but we need to hear this directly from the horse's mouth. All eyes not being equal, I was just wondering if some eyes may be more sensitive to exposure pulsing/flickering than others, what do you think?

Thanks Ranjan,
Peter

Beddgelert Posted at 8-25 02:15
Hi Ranjan,

Thanks for sticking with me through this thread. We have our answer and now await an solution.

Hi Peter,
indeed my pleasure, I too learnt something new in last few days about pocket 2.

You surely have more sensitive eye to that millisecond brightness difference in I & P frames which I am not able to notice at all.

One question I have is that do you notice the same pulsing in my video which I posted on youtube & shared above? I shot that video mostly like how most people use on auto mode.

Ranjan Posted at 8-25 04:22
Hi Peter,
indeed my pleasure, I too learnt something new in last few days about pocket 2.

Hello Ranjan,

I watched your video several times and I do not see the same issue, however that might be because you have not recorded in a detail rich environment. I would suggest that you test by recording in an environment with dense foliage, both panning and static recording. We can then assess whether your P2 is also cursed

Peter

DJI Tony Posted at 2021-8-24 20:10
Hi, there. Thank you for your feedback. This situation has filled us with regret, we are sincerely sorry for the trouble you’ve been experiencing.

The frame rate is synthesized by algorithm encoding. H264 encoding will have a slight difference in the quantization error of the encoding for I-frame and P-frame. In order to ensure the video quality while shooting a bit more complex scenes, the I-frame coding of Pocket 2 takes up a larger bit rate, which leads to a slightly larger brightness difference between I-frame and P-frame. That is why we see the videos flickering. However, the brightness difference is approximate 0.7 (256 brightness range) which is almost hard to tell from according to our measurement.

Thanks DJI Tony for the detailed explanation. I experienced the flicker problem in a couple of shots and it is indeed apparent in these shots. I use manual mode in almost any situation. I wondered for a second if perhaps also the autofocus could play a role here(?) Nevertheless,  I am still very satisfied with DJI pocket 2 (it often even exceeded my expectations in postproduction (grading) ). However I need a fix for that flicker problem, since the material isn't really useable if there is this flicker. My question: Are there any best practices or recommendations by DJI how to fix it? A first test showed that the deflicker filter in DaVinci Resolve helps, but I don't know if that works always and its only  in the studio version of DaVinci which is a lot of money for some people. Any advise would be very welcome.
Peter