audience mode working however much pixalation in the second goggles at speeds or distance; any way to improve? when you stop moving, it clears up; dave

I have the same problem. Does anyone know how to solve it?
Who uses the audience mode, your pilot goggles signal differs from the audience goggles?

The primary goggles get data correction packets from the drone but the spectators can't because they do not communicate with the drone. They just receive the signal. So if they get incorrect data they get pixelation. There's not much That can be done about that.

SgtRay Posted at 4-23 12:56
The primary goggles get data correction packets from the drone but the spectators can't because they do not communicate with the drone. They just receive the signal. So if they get incorrect data they get pixelation. There's not much That can be done about that.

This is the best explanation of this problem that I've seen, and I've been looking for a while.

Thx!!

:-)

TCS

Chaosrider Posted at 5-8 09:55
This is the best explanation of this problem that I've seen, and I've been looking for a while.

Thx!!

lol thanks

SgtRay Posted at 5-8 10:59
lol thanks

Thinking more about this, what's the composition of the data correction packets? What's the "shortfall" in the basic video transmission  that makes the packets necessary?

I've got to believe that there's a non-hardware fix for this, but I'm sure it would have to be a DJI fix, rather than a consumer fix.

Thx!

Chaosrider Posted at 5-9 06:14
Thinking more about this, what's the composition of the data correction packets? What's the "shortfall" in the basic video transmission  that makes the packets necessary?

I've got to believe that there's a non-hardware fix for this, but I'm sure it would have to be a DJI fix, rather than a consumer fix.

The correction should only go to the primary goggles. Because any correction causes latency.. Latency cannot be tolerated in a racing/action drone. Because latency equals crash

This is why racing was originally done and still done in analog.. In analog there is no image correction whatsoever. So they have the lowest latency. If the drone were to also send corrections to multiple goggles the latency would be through the roof.

Fast moving or action aircraft require low latency because of that fast speed. This problem will not be corrected anytime soon for this category of drones nor should it be. They are looking into 5G transmissions on other aircraft and even then it will not send corrections to every viewer.

SgtRay Posted at 5-9 07:53
The correction should only go to the primary goggles. Because any correction causes latency.. Latency cannot be tolerated in a racing/action drone. Because latency equals crash

This is why racing was originally done and still done in analog.. In analog there is no image correction whatsoever. So they have the lowest latency. If the drone were to also send corrections to multiple goggles the latency would be through the roof.

Hmmm...I'm still not quite tracking.

The audience goggles aren't gong to be controlling the aircraft, so if they have some latency in them...so what?

I'm not interested in racing, so issues specifically related to that aren't really issues for me. I was mostly interested in the DJI FPV for the fully immersive experience, and that has fully met my expectations! I'm also not interested in hardcore aerobatics. The DJI FPV is a fully immersive, super-fast and maneuverable Mini, which is exactly what I wanted.

So my interest in the audience goggle video isn't for racing; it's for giving FPV "rides" to people. I just want them to get a picture that's not reliably worse than what I get in my pilot goggles. If the latency is high, it really doesn't matter at all.

I know that in general there's a trade-off between latency and video quality, and that makes sense to me. The default setting for the DJI FPV works fine for me in that regard. I'd like to be able to set the audience goggles to max quality, accepting an increased latency that may result.

I'm looking for a bit more detail about why the digital correction packets are necessary...what aspect of the "straight" signal are they "correcting"?

Thx

Chaosrider Posted at 5-13 09:12
Hmmm...I'm still not quite tracking.

The audience goggles aren't gong to be controlling the aircraft, so if they have some latency in them...so what?

The latency doesn't control the action but when your eye gets the information late the person who is controlling which is you makes the correction late which means you crash.

I understand not being interested in racing. I don't race mine. But that's what it was designed to do or at least one of it's features. So that's why it does what it does. Not because you're interested. But because that's the way it was built.

In order to send a correction to an audience goggles requires that the drone itself communicate communicate back-and-forth with yet another request. If you know computers you know cycle time is cycle time and it takes real time.

As for why pockets need to be recent. You do know this is digital right? Not analog.Digital packets are just another way of saying computer packets. And all computer packets have checksums. And when they don't match computers resend packets for correct information. That's how digital works.I can refer you to your digital TV set.

Digital T v's don't have packet resends. And when you get a weak signal you get pixelation and a black screen. You can see where's that's not a good thing for a flying object moving at better than 60 miles an hour. The designers have to account for this in a safety fashion considering how they built the drone to fly. So you have packet resends sent as quick as possible to the primary goggles for the primary pilot not to have a primarily bad day.

If you're saying that you would like for them to have a way to shut that off. Maybe in the future. Or to switch to a high latency maybe in the future. For right now the only thing I could think is to drop the resolution as low as possible and drop the quality. That should be less data being sent. That may help.

Lastly. It does not send a straight signal. So there is correcting. The signal is error correcting.. TV broadcast signal is a straight digital signal just like spectator goggles. Which is why you get pixelation and black screen..
There is a chart that shows which antennas on the goggels RX and wich TX it is not a straight signal. Anolog is and that's part of way it looks as it does. And why they are pushing Digital. But your TV when receiving weak is a good example of why these error correct

I just read your other post in another place. You should understand now. I read both and I have an even better understanding. I see now the vid comes from primary G. This tells me even more why it works the way it does. I don't know how to explain in text but I get it. I don't see and easy work around but DJI has better people than me on it. Sorry I couldn't do a better job of explaining what I know

SgtRay Posted at 5-13 11:06
The latency doesn't control the action but when your eye gets the information late the person who is controlling which is you makes the correction late which means you crash.

I understand not being interested in racing. I don't race mine. But that's what it was designed to do or at least one of it's features. So that's why it does what it does. Not because you're interested. But because that's the way it was built.

My scenario is me flying the FPV with the primary goggles, and having somebody else "ride along" with a second set of goggles. My point was, if there's latency in the "ride along" goggles...so what? The rider isn't flying the aircraft.

What I'm still not seeing is what is it about the underlying transmission and processing algorithm that requires that the data stream be separate for the "main" signal, and the DGPs. What, technically, causes the need for handshaking to get the correction packets? What data is the aircraft getting through the handshaking? Ranging data? What?

I assume that without the DCPs, the primary goggles would have the same crummy/intermittent video quality that the audience goggles get now. OK. Why? What flight data is being communicated during the handshaking required to get the DCPs? What specific kinds of data are the aircraft and the goggles getting with DCPS, that they don't get without them?

I understand the distinction between analog and digital just fine. I managed a project to upgrade the old analog public safety radio system for the State of Nevada to a more modern digital microwave system. That was 20 years ago.

You keep referring to this as if it points to something obvious and important, it may be important, but it's definitely not obvious.  Why, specifically, do you suggest that this difference explains the need for the DCPs?

Thx,

TCS

Chaosrider Posted at 5-18 12:12
My scenario is me flying the FPV with the primary goggles, and having somebody else "ride along" with a second set of goggles. My point was, if there's latency in the "ride along" goggles...so what? The rider isn't flying the aircraft.

What I'm still not seeing is what is it about the underlying transmission and processing algorithm that requires that the data stream be separate for the "main" signal, and the DGPs. What, technically, causes the need for handshaking to get the correction packets? What data is the aircraft getting through the handshaking? Ranging data? What?

You seem to know more than I can even explain. I saw on the other thread you where getting better info. So I'll have to leave it to that. It's over my ability at this point.

Good luck

SgtRay Posted at 5-19 02:59
You seem to know more than I can even explain. I saw on the other thread you where getting better info. So I'll have to leave it to that. It's over my ability at this point.

Good luck

Thanks!

It's not an urgent thing. Sometimes I just get obsessed with sorting out how something works, and this is one of those times.

Good flying to you!

:-)

TCS

tldr: Reduce your transmission bandwidth to 10 Mhz to greatly reduce audience pixelation.

I know that this is an older post, but I recently purchased a second Goggles V2 to use with my Avata for "ride-along". However, like others I have been experiencing bad pixelation issues on the audience goggles. I read everything I could on it and finally decided to do some experiments to see if I could tweak it.

What I ended up doing is going to the Transmission settings on the primary (pilot) goggles and changing the bandwidth from the default 40 Mhz to 20 Mhz and using the audience goggles to fly the drone to see if it made a difference. I found that with it set to 20 Mhz, it pixelated a good bit less, so I changed it to 10 Mhz (you can do this mid-flight) and the pixelation problem was almost completely fixed.

Doing this seems to reduce the video quality in both headsets and I noticed that the data rate showed between 9 and 10 Mbs instead of the typical 25+, but the video in the audience goggles was greatly improved, so I think this is a good tradeoff. Since the video is recording on the goggles and the drone, I can always use the 5K video from the drone for any post-flight review, etc. since it is unaffected by the transmission bandwidth.

Another thing that I discovered by doing this is that it extended my working range significantly. When it is set to 40 Mhz, I would start to lose video long before my controller signal dropped and if I continued to fly farther away, I would lose video and it would initiate a RTH. With the bandwidth set to 10 Mhz, I was able to fly nearly twice as far before my video started breaking up, and I was still using the audience goggles without the massive pixelation occurring. I have only verified this on one flight so far, but I wanted to post this for those who run across this thread and haven't had any luck with the pixelation problem so far.

The bottom line is, you can apparently trade off some video quality in the headsets for near elimination of pixelation in the audience headset by reducing your transmission bandwidth to 10Mhz.

Mr. MR Posted at 3-20 07:27
tldr: Reduce your transmission bandwidth to 10 Mhz to greatly reduce audience pixelation.

I know that this is an older post, but I recently purchased a second Goggles V2 to use with my Avata for "ride-along". However, like others I have been experiencing bad pixelation issues on the audience goggles. I read everything I could on it and finally decided to do some experiments to see if I could tweak it.

UPDATE: I have done several more flights with the lower bandwidth setting and can confirm that it does improve audience video significantly and also extends the range of the main goggles, but at the farther range the audience goggles again pixelate badly. In the end, I think this workaround is good for close-in (within a few hundred meters) audience video but falls off quickly outside of this range. Still, for general audience participation, it is a big improvement over the default settings.