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Yaw Washout on the Avata still not fixed it happend 3 times to me!
574 25 10-17 11:16
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AirKhanFPV
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I don't understand why DJI is not fixing this issue, it happend to me now 3 times in manual mode, today again, and i have the video file + gyrolog i uploaded it on youtube. I was able to recover the avata everytime but i am sure not everybody can say that. This is a really bad security issue and it needs to be fixed, NOW! And yes, i am on the newest firmware!


10-17 11:16
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DJI Paladin
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Hi there. Thank you for reaching out and we're deeply sorry for the trouble that this has caused.  In this kind of situation, I'm afraid that you may consider sending the unit in for a proper diagnosis. You can contact our support team to start up a ticket at https://www.dji.com/support . Also, the warranty can be applied depending on the outcome of the damage assessment including the warranty period of your unit. Thank you for your kind and understanding.
10-17 21:02
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Waden
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Flight distance : 192661 ft
Switzerland
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With propellers guards and that kind of yaw input you most probably stalling a propeller. Starting the turn with some bank to the right makes it even worst.
With a coordinated left roll input the Avata would not washout.
A fix would be the IMU to commande some roll for a yaw input …
10-17 22:48
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DAFlys
Captain
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United Kingdom
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Did you see the Original Dobo video on the issue?   He was able to recover from it with some practice.
10-17 23:42
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Originalas
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Same thing on my SECOND AVATA.

10-18 01:44
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Pajomota
Second Officer
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Won't fix it maybe because it's not fixable. Would it be a conception error? Bad electronic design? I'm afraid that is the case. We'll see...
10-18 02:31
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Airmaxx23
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Pajomota Posted at 10-18 02:31
Won't fix it maybe because it's not fixable. Would it be a conception error? Bad electronic design? I'm afraid that is the case. We'll see...

It's an inherent issue with whoop style quads.
10-18 09:33
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bp328i
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Airmaxx23 Posted at 10-18 09:33
It's an inherent issue with whoop style quads.

No it isn't. Go search YouTube for Cinewhoop freestyle and see how many fall out of the sky from a yaw turn.
10-18 09:53
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djiuser_HROEP8ZV4yNg
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bp328i Posted at 10-18 09:53
No it isn't. Go search YouTube for Cinewhoop freestyle and see how many fall out of the sky from a yaw turn.

Agree.  Something is wrong with the drone and instead of DJI addressing it…you now have YouTubers pushing motor upgrades for a new $1400 product (and there are videos showing the same issue with Axis motors)!  Incredibly sad.  Anyone who is saying pilot error or this is normal…I’ll sell you my entire kit for 15% off. I’m past my return period, this is highly unsafe, and the only reason more serious crashes by the numbers haven’t happened yet…bc 1/2 the new ppl buying this can’t find the the fpv controller to buy!  Wait till that becomes more available and actual newbie pilots attempt manual at more then 10mph…going to be bad news.  Even worse…not just happening in manual mode to people anymore.
10-19 15:16
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Nees
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Flight distance : 80991 ft
Belgium
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djiuser_HROEP8ZV4yNg Posted at 10-19 15:16
Agree.  Something is wrong with the drone and instead of DJI addressing it…you now have YouTubers pushing motor upgrades for a new $1400 product (and there are videos showing the same issue with Axis motors)!  Incredibly sad.  Anyone who is saying pilot error or this is normal…I’ll sell you my entire kit for 15% off. I’m past my return period, this is highly unsafe, and the only reason more serious crashes by the numbers haven’t happened yet…bc 1/2 the new ppl buying this can’t find the the fpv controller to buy!  Wait till that becomes more available and actual newbie pilots attempt manual at more then 10mph…going to be bad news.  Even worse…not just happening in manual mode to people anymore.

The motor upgrade doesnt fix it either... Already seen a video yesterday of someone pushing it, it still fell, but was able to recover it. But at lower speeds (perhaps the max of the standard motors, it was less) its hard to say from the video. But it still happens with the motor upgrade.

Check at 0:51 seconds... crashed it.


10-19 15:56
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Raf_IZ0QWM
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Many thanks for posting the video.
I tried to make a hypothesis about the tumble problem, different from what others say.
I think it is not due to a structural or design problem and therefore from an unstable condition due to the passage of air, such as Vortex ring state, but I think the problem is due to some problem on the IMU and magnetometer.
The IMU calculates the heading by seeing the velocity vector how is displaced in angle and compares it with the heading seen by the magnetometer.
If for some reason there is a bug or any problem, even magnetic interference, you can run into problems similar to the toilet bowl or, when very sudden, to an overturning if the two measures do not coincide.

Not all models have this problem.
To date I have tried three and on one there was no way to drop it or get it off balance in any way. Externally there is no difference, which however means that it is not a design problem.

Even the fact that it is the fault of the wind is not valid, because the overturning takes place under any conditions.

I would like to add that if the problem is on the MEMS component, it is likely that the instability can also occur on other fast rotations as well on the other axes, roll and pitch.

We'll see what DJI will do.
10-19 19:41
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BadBert
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So far, DJI is not doing anything.
Not even responding to customers about this.

I have put the purchase of this drone on hold due to this problem!

i was looking for a second hand unit (because the price is to steep for what you get), but this will get me an "older" unit.....

Only fix i have seen is a youtuber getting a fresh unit (under warranty) and he hasn't been able to reproduce the problem on that one, But he also has not flown that unit as hard as his previous one..... I refuse to put a lot of money into one of these units, fly it and wait for it to fall out of the sky, and then hoping i don't loose the drone so i can send it in for "warranty".
And what if the drone hits someone (or even someone's property) while tumbling down with this error? no thanks....
11-8 00:42
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CoreyFPV
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Any Cinewhoop or freestyle kwad does this as it's called propwash or vortex effect, as it's been described when testing why and when it happens...Carry too much speed into a turn and you are turning into the disturbed air you have just created. It messes up the aero and causes the shakes. It's all about managing the speed and how you turn. If the FC can't handle the input, it will freak out and then will do what has been experienced by some, not all drones. There are still a multitude of people experiencing this, even after the latest FW and looking at some of the footage presented in evidence, it's no surprise the drone is acting like it does.....
11-8 04:23
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arkchan
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CoreyFPV Posted at 11-8 04:23
Any Cinewhoop or freestyle kwad does this as it's called propwash or vortex effect, as it's been described when testing why and when it happens...Carry too much speed into a turn and you are turning into the disturbed air you have just created. It messes up the aero and causes the shakes. It's all about managing the speed and how you turn.

its not propwash, it flipped itself and being uncontrollable, no respond to your controller till the flight controller resumed functional.
does prop-washout stop Flight controller? No.

And again, this problem is not an arguement anymore, DJI confessed it and replied in different post that there are malfunction Flight controller problem for some cases reported. Read posts like:
https://forum.dji.com/forum.php? ... id%3D780&page=3
11-8 05:22
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Elendil
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CoreyFPV Posted at 11-8 04:23
Any Cinewhoop or freestyle kwad does this as it's called propwash or vortex effect, as it's been described when testing why and when it happens...Carry too much speed into a turn and you are turning into the disturbed air you have just created. It messes up the aero and causes the shakes. It's all about managing the speed and how you turn. If the FC can't handle the input, it will freak out and then will do what has been experienced by some, not all drones. There are still a multitude of people experiencing this, even after the latest FW and looking at some of the footage presented in evidence, it's no surprise the drone is acting like it does.....

Wow really? I don't see such propwash or sudden issue on the GEPRC CINEBOT30 even at full speed and sudden 180 degree.
11-8 07:14
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CoreyFPV
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Elendil Posted at 11-8 07:14
Wow really? I don't see such propwash or sudden issue on the GEPRC CINEBOT30 even at full speed and sudden 180 degree.

Do you own this cinewhoop maybe ? The CL35 certainly does it if flown aggressively and throttle is applied at the wrong moment, but not as bad as what has been shown with the Avata. However, with the latest FW, I have certainly not had any jitters or flips of death. I have experienced it with my freestyle rigs but that’s me applying throttle at the wrong time or maybe done something too sharply. There just seems to be a lot of issues from one set of people and zero from another set of people. Now, that either points to a lot of very unlucky people or people who are flying completely differently and getting zero issues. Be interesting to maybe see a poll of Yes or No ?
11-8 09:22
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arkchan
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CoreyFPV Posted at 11-8 09:22
Do you own this cinewhoop maybe ? The CL35 certainly does it if flown aggressively and throttle is applied at the wrong moment, but not as bad as what has been shown with the Avata. However, with the latest FW, I have certainly not had any jitters or flips of death. I have experienced it with my freestyle rigs but that’s me applying throttle at the wrong time or maybe done something too sharply. There just seems to be a lot of issues from one set of people and zero from another set of people. Now, that either points to a lot of very unlucky people or people who are flying completely differently and getting zero issues. Be interesting to maybe see a poll of Yes or No ?

vote post is created:

https://forum.dji.com/forum.php? ... D780%26typeid%3D780

Summary: most believe/experienced there is system issue (as of now, 16 ppl believe/experienced vs 7ppl think its fine)
11-8 11:51
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BadBert
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arkchan Posted at 11-8 05:22
its not propwash, it flipped itself and being uncontrollable, no respond to your controller till the flight controller resumed functional.
does prop-washout stop Flight controller? No.

There are a lot of pilots that say it is not as bad as on the avata with ANY of their other drones.

Also logs show the avata has faulty stick inputs when this happens.
so FC problem....

it should not be as bad as it is, causing it to be uncontrolable and crash like this.
11-8 22:59
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CoreyFPV
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BadBert Posted at 11-8 22:59
There are a lot of pilots that say it is not as bad as on the avata with ANY of their other drones.

Also logs show the avata has faulty stick inputs when this happens.

True and it shouldn't be as bad as this. Seeing quite a few posts across multiple groups, DJI have been involved and in a lot of cases instructed the pilot in question to return it for either repair or replacement. Some of these are also pilots who don't have refresh - Which is only to be commended by DJI.
11-9 01:31
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BadBert
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CoreyFPV Posted at 11-9 01:31
True and it shouldn't be as bad as this. Seeing quite a few posts across multiple groups, DJI have been involved and in a lot of cases instructed the pilot in question to return it for either repair or replacement. Some of these are also pilots who don't have refresh - Which is only to be commended by DJI.

True, but DJI should do more to fix this.
Now there are a lot of avatas that can go down and crash on , for example, a car, or even worse, a person!

And this crash is not pilot error or normal (expected) product failure (props) due to normal wear and tear.... But the pilot is the one that is hold responsible for the damage.

Dji should actively go after this problem, not wait until something goes wrong and THEN deal with people complaining about a defect on their DJI product.
11-9 05:18
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MAF178
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Nothing wrong with the Avata .. it flys like a dream.. its only because dji is a chinese company you throw your garbage Wahaha
https://forum.dji.com/forum.php? ... D780%26typeid%3D780
11-9 05:36
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BadBert
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real funny.....
not.
11-13 23:54
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Pajomota
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bp328i Posted at 10-18 09:53
No it isn't. Go search YouTube for Cinewhoop freestyle and see how many fall out of the sky from a yaw turn.

You're right.
11-24 09:08
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Elephant Apocalypse
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One idea that crossed my mind was trimming the guards so they. Serve more of a landing gear than prop guard, hesitant but for the mean time, 4 blades are more than adequate  with prop mod
11-24 11:58
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celltx
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Actually, landing gear idea is great. Another version of it could be adding some extra weight on the bottom, such as this:



It might balance top heavy Avata. Just a little bit weight on the bottom can turn a marginally unstable drone to a marginally stable one.
11-24 12:35
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Elephant Apocalypse
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I can't help but think of EVTOL with tumble issues, life literally would depend on it lol
11-24 14:35
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