KREMi Posted at 4-15 08:50
same - I also ask my friends and potential buyer to HOLD - how this case unfold - as if IT happen in place with people close it may really be if not deadlt, then a serious injury
(drone weight x 60-70km/h... quite hevy bullet) - and with DJI all blaming it on "pilot error" - so $@#$@# us as evidence clearly show it's on drone side fckup + ignoring dissarms command
I have no confidence at all in avata till it's solved

Yep this is just unacceptable, I was waiting for months now for dji getting this sorted Out because I wanted to like this product and the idea is really nice but the product itself Just suck like it ist now, I'm constantly worried how I fly and not making it crash instead of Just flying and enjoyong the Hobby.

The motion 2 topped it now for me, instead of fixing theyr stuff the only thing happened in the last patch is adding Support for a in my optinion insult for everyone buyed this early. Its not a new option or tool its like Sony released a new console and 3 months later they add another console that has 2x the specs and Charge you again,  hey they offer you a 100€ coupon arent they nice? No, that Just was the Thing that maked me finally rage against them I will not accept this any longer.

Dont think the yaw stuff ist fixable because of to weak Motors and tbh i think they would have fixed the flyaway stuff too If they would be able to make it, I dont think they will ever fix this.

Perhaps completely dumping the M mode would have been a better option. The DJI was a great cinewhoop to fly in N and S for my opinion. And it was a teaser for getting deeper into that FPV flying. Logical step ahead was a "real" FPV drone then for me. Some hours flying that in M returning back to the Avata and trying some manual flying was rather frustrating, besides from the bad crashes and flyaways it's much less "sharp" to operate.

I would love the Avata the same if it only had N and S but in the way it was before the Remote-ID F/W.

if u guys want change... Report this drone MODEL to the FAA and the FTC in the United States.  It can break laws if its a faulty aircraft and DJI is at fault. They would ultimatly make this model illegal and force a recall or be banned from the USA for non compliance to regulations and airspace.  To fast track this whole process you can directly contact your local congress person or local government in your state and they can submit it quicker.

Lets get this drone banned from being sold. Its not a very hard process as long as you have proof and enough individuals contribute to complaint. And, if airspace rules and laws were affected and it crashed during a part 107 flight (or in some cases recreational too) that permision was granted for a restricted airspace and it was not your fault then that could be icing on the cake... For example if you were flying recreationally and the drone came dangerously close to coming within possibly hitting a human being and it was not your fault, or damaging property, fire risk, causing a car crash, violating airspace regulations (and it not being your fault) ... etc.. etc..

Would a simple and "responsible" solution for this be for DJI to update their firmware and add a shut-off safety feature?
So that if the drone has a hard crash, which it seems it can easily measure, the motors shut off.

Is recognizing a crash really that simple? I think, it's a bit complicated to differentiate manual flying ("acro") maneuvers from a crash. If it lies upside down for a longer time with a static camera image might by a clue but there are lots of other scenarios where it might not be that obvious, I think. But event there, if you fly acro it might also happen to free fall upside down with camera and downward sensors only see a blue sky for some seconds. I think this might be too ambigous to turn off the engines.

If you take an "ordinary" FPV drone with Betaflight and fly in "Air" mode for instance, if you down it (e.g. for landing) the flight controller / motors will wildly try to regain control over the drone which makes you to be in charge turning the motors off in the moment of landing manually. This is the opposite behaviour but unavoidable because of the way the flight controller is working while flying Acro/Air.

It's not a trivial task to clearly differentiate a "good" from a "bad" situation for the flight controller in a flight mode where the drone flies in ways that might seem uncontrollable, e.g a free fall that you want it to do.

Sorry if my english is a bit funny, I'm not a native english speaking person. Hope you get the point I'm trying to make anyway.

And there I see the main problem for the Avata: it's very complicated to get a GPS controlled drone to let loose any controls and hand them over to the pilot while manual and STILL maintaining some kind of "failsafe". I think both sides contradict each other. If you wanna go swimming you will get wet probably.

But anyway that's not the issue that needs to be fixed. As seen in the numerous videos linked above in the event of the flyaway you cannot do anything against it with the remote control.  And that MAY NOT BE the case. In manual YOU HAVE TO BE IN CONTROL ALL THE TIME. And this is not the case right now.

Hours and hours thinking about what might be the main problem, I came to the point that the trouble seems to start the moment the Avata is falling back from M to N and then getting trouble with sensor values, estimating an incorrect state of the drone and starting to correct this false state and the pilot has no measure left to intervene until the drone has come to its mind again.

I think it is not good at all that the manual mode is left on its own by the drone without any pilot action. This encounters when getting over the height limit, when the drone thinks (!) it got too fast and when the drone thinks (!) it had a crash. The Avata still wants to be "intelligent" in manual mode. I do not think this is a good approach at all. Manual should mean "hand it all over to the pilot". ALL.

* redacted afterwards: not completely correct, things happen also without being in manual.

Lots of behaviour that does look similar...

My Avata is packed and will be fetched by UPS today, shipping to Hungary. I am curious if the blackbox logs will reveal enough evidence what's wrong in the recent firmware versions.

Will keep you updated.

It's getting even more:


(jump to 8:15)

Impact detected with no impact and flyaway following, same scheme.

Wough, 7 months ago same:



I think selling the Avata might be a consideration to make.

So maybe, the problem is not related to the two last firmware steps, it may be older than that:

Again a wrong height reading, going up to 200 ft while plunging down...

Wonder why this still is only a small issue...

Always the same. The Avata makes a strange dip down, then spools up and goes to the moon without any control left, the gimbal OFTEN looking straight DOWN. It may crash or not, it may notice "crash detected", the behaviour of the Avata is always the same, it gets some kind of flash and reacts in a very dangerous manner without any possibility for the pilot to other than wait for the outcome.

Wough.

Well, you've got a lot of to work on there if the same problem was there 7 months ago and still not fixed.
I'm shocked. Really shocked. Didn't expect that.

I don't know if he get's it nailed but at least he really has some experience in FPV:

https://youtube.com/shorts/hJJ8EwjnZ5I?feature=share

Yeah this is just not acceptable any more Today I was flying and did not touch the Avata because I'm just to tired babysitting this drone and just trying to not crash instead of just flying, all batterys are still fully charged in my bag but had a blast with the Nazgul. I just hope DJI will do something in the next days, I hope I don't need to get a Lawyer involved in this case. There are far to many Videos of this behaviour online

I really just want to get my goddamn money back meanwhile, this drone was simply too expensive to let it rust somewhere because it sucks and is dangerous to anyone. Wouldve better buyed another Product that just works, wouldn't suggest this drone to anyone at this state. Unbelievable a DYI selfmade drone is in the end much safer then a drone with so much Sensors and a big company behind, shame on you DJI thats just not funny anymore...

Was buying The Avata to get a good and Safe beginner Drone trusting a what I thought trustworthy company that lives safety to learn FPV and all I got now is a bad slow flying selfcrashing dangerous flying Brick that can go kamikaze at any time and Teaching you Fly styles you would never do with a "real" FPV Drone.


@SeehawerB  what you do with your Drone in Hungary?

The DJI repair center is in Hungary. At least any drones for repair or exchange are sent to Hungary from Germany. Maybe the next location for that.

I also invested a lot in the Avata because it started so tempting. 7 batteries, 3 spare air ducts, 3 spare frames, around 20 packs of propellers, all meant for a long and fun relationship with this drone. Now I think about selling the drone with all the accessories and get a "real" cinewhoop as a replacement, e.g. the GEPRC 30 with O3. My Nazgul Evoque F6D with O3 is a blast! Most fun I ever had with a drone. Although the Avata brought me into FPV flying and was the starting point that led to the Nazgul, I loved the Avata very much and wanted to keep flying it in more calmer ways, not necessary in manual. But right now I am getting pi**ed more and more day by day. The problem is not new. Obviously. And no official comments from DJI.

... and selling is a bit difficult because of course I will keep the Goggles 2. For the O3 drones.

SeehawerB Posted at 4-17 12:23
The DJI repair center is in Hungary. At least any drones for repair or exchange are sent to Hungary from Germany. Maybe the next location for that.

I also invested a lot in the Avata because it started so tempting. 7 batteries, 3 spare air ducts, 3 spare frames, around 20 packs of propellers, all meant for a long and fun relationship with this drone. Now I think about selling the drone with all the accessories and get a "real" cinewhoop as a replacement, e.g. the GEPRC 30 with O3. My Nazgul Evoque F6D with O3 is a blast! Most fun I ever had with a drone. Although the Avata brought me into FPV flying and was the starting point that led to the Nazgul, I loved the Avata very much and wanted to keep flying it in more calmer ways, not necessary in manual. But right now I am getting pi**ed more and more day by day. The problem is not new. Obviously. And no official comments from DJI.

Okay that's Strange, my first rep where it just crashed itself was made in a Repair Center in Germany and im living there also. Did you open just a repair ticket, what did you report as error? Was hoping DJI would react here, but doens't look like it. If its needed I will send it to them till they fix it or give me my money back :/

God bless I just bought the Fly more Kit but yeah It's already enough that's adding up already. The FPV Controller 2 would've been a bad buy against a Real Controller too dunno if I will exchange that sooner or later too (think i would need to buy another backpack too…), did see Videos where it made Problems with the O3 Unit I don't want to lose my Nazgul because of DJI Software... Really get angry because everything from DJI side doesn't work like it should and causes trouble and feels somehow unfinished.

Buyed the Nazgul just because I got a good offer for it but don't regret buying it at any second till now, its just working like it should, maybe DJI should ask Iflight how to fix their Firmware... Would bet their CInewhoop just works, Steel City Drone Pilot in one of your posted Videos says exactly this.

SeehawerB Posted at 4-17 12:24
... and selling is a bit difficult because of course I will keep the Goggles 2. For the O3 drones.

Or you could maybe Buy a second Hand V2 Google if you have trouble with the fitting, would open also Analog flying and connecting the googles to your PC for simulators and stuff. I'm not sure about this, would need to see a direct comparison because the Screens are nice and it's better fitting with the 10 Euro AliExpress cushioning for me so I think I would prefer the Googles 2 too...

SeehawerB Posted at 4-17 12:23
The DJI repair center is in Hungary. At least any drones for repair or exchange are sent to Hungary from Germany. Maybe the next location for that.

I also invested a lot in the Avata because it started so tempting. 7 batteries, 3 spare air ducts, 3 spare frames, around 20 packs of propellers, all meant for a long and fun relationship with this drone. Now I think about selling the drone with all the accessories and get a "real" cinewhoop as a replacement, e.g. the GEPRC 30 with O3. My Nazgul Evoque F6D with O3 is a blast! Most fun I ever had with a drone. Although the Avata brought me into FPV flying and was the starting point that led to the Nazgul, I loved the Avata very much and wanted to keep flying it in more calmer ways, not necessary in manual. But right now I am getting pi**ed more and more day by day. The problem is not new. Obviously. And no official comments from DJI.

did you learn to fly in manual mode on avata?

No. With Liftoff and the Nazgul.

Please I would like DJI to say something about this matter.
I haven't flown with the Avata for 3 weeks because I'm afraid of crashing it without just cause.

I would love to hear something like "we know it, we're on it".
Hopefully there will be a solution for this at all just tweaking the firmware and not dumping the hardware...

Hello everyone,

Got some good news on my side. DJI acknowledged the problem on my flight where the drone got out of control after a hard brake (which caused an impact detection and a flyaway frenzy) :



- I erased the names on purpose (mine and the technical support one's) -

However, I don't think this answer counts for flights where a real impact (even a touch) occurred, so I would still consider to fly very carefully waiting for an update from their side.

djiuser_WKrVrzQSr9gH Posted at 4-14 02:01
For now I'm stuck with :
[view_image]

Hello everyone,

Got some good news on my side. DJI acknowledged the problem on my flight where the drone got out of control after a hard brake (which caused an impact detection and a flyaway frenzy) :


- I erased the names on purpose (mine and the technical support one's) -

However, I don't think this answer counts for flights where a real impact (even a touch) occurred, so I would still consider to fly very carefully waiting for an update from their side.

djiuser_WKrVrzQSr9gH Posted at 4-19 15:05
Hello everyone,

Got some good news on my side. DJI acknowledged the problem on my flight where the drone got out of control after a hard brake (which caused an impact detection and a flyaway frenzy) :

Yep, Think this will not be the case if you Tumble to the Ground by itself and it's happening because of the Error it got.
DJI Always blamed us for this and pointed out Pilot error, it's the same for disarming when something bad happens.

My Avata right now is under inspection at DJI Service Center in Hungary. Hopefully they read out the flight data, especially from the 26nd of march, and find some clear hint what's going wrong in the flight controller leading to the "shoot-down-and-fly-away" so often.

so after today flight I also can join club of pilot who got problems with avata
- one ground bounce which ended a fullthrottle uncontrolable run
- one strange altitude drop+flif >> failed comeback ;)
need to get logs and videos from drone for investigate

DJI does not seem to officially aknowledge that the Avata has a serious problem. So I suppose this is a problem that cannot be fixed in firmware, a hardware related issue of some kind.
I slowly tend to think I threw more than 2.000 Euros in the bin. Do I feel happy selling that drone via Ebay? Would that be responsible? Tough decision to be made...

At least I got the Googles 2 I will keep for the Nazgul F6 and probably a Cinebot 30 as a replacement for the Avata. The controllers and the drone will surely not fly anymore with me in charge.

SeehawerB Posted at 4-22 01:33
DJI does not seem to officially aknowledge that the Avata has a serious problem. So I suppose this is a problem that cannot be fixed in firmware, a hardware related issue of some kind.
I slowly tend to think I threw more than 2.000 Euros in the bin. Do I feel happy selling that drone via Ebay? Would that be responsible? Tough decision to be made...

already sold mine and bought cinebot30 ;)avata is trash, and dji technical support is even worse ;)

SeehawerB Posted at 4-22 01:33
DJI does not seem to officially aknowledge that the Avata has a serious problem. So I suppose this is a problem that cannot be fixed in firmware, a hardware related issue of some kind.
I slowly tend to think I threw more than 2.000 Euros in the bin. Do I feel happy selling that drone via Ebay? Would that be responsible? Tough decision to be made...

You could basically still try to swap the Motors and Frame, but then you surely will throw your warranty and care down the bucket, I'm also considering what to do if they don't fix this, would've been definitive the Last product I bought from DJI that is not in relation to the O3 system and I'm also considering getting a lawyer involved because I'm that angry about DJI ignoring it fully.

Would be a lot of money I lost because of this damn error. Basically not because of the Drone because I'm perfectly fine how it flies if it's slower and you need to consider the bit lacking motors if you do crazy stuff, but I'm getting it's not made for super aggressive flying but flying with 30kmh even slowing down by getting the nose up while doing it in a yaw turn isn't something super crazy for me which you would even do flying Cinematic. I mean If the Yaw Spin of death and flyway stuff wasn't the elephant in the Room I would love my Avata and the possibilities it offers when it works, but yeah it's not working so it's pretty much useless.

@djiuser_HpDFzmS8X3Wv Are you happy with it and do you get anything like Tumble in Yaw movements with it?

Koolada Posted at 4-24 03:56
You could basically still try to swap the Motors and Frame, but then you surely will throw your warranty and care down the bucket, I'm also considering what to do if they don't fix this, would've been definitive the Last product I bought from DJI that is not in relation to the O3 system and I'm also considering getting a lawyer involved because I'm that angry about DJI ignoring it fully.

Would be a lot of money I lost because of this damn error. Basically not because of the Drone because I'm perfectly fine how it flies if it's slower and you need to consider the bit lacking motors if you do crazy stuff, but I'm getting it's not made for super aggressive flying but flying with 30kmh even slowing down by getting the nose up while doing it in a yaw turn isn't something super crazy for me which you would even do flying Cinematic. I mean If the Yaw Spin of death and flyway stuff wasn't the elephant in the Room I would love my Avata and the possibilities it offers when it works, but yeah it's not working so it's pretty much useless.

there is no any yaw tumble in cinebot



look here.

If You have time, go to the court and take lawyer, unfortunatelly I am not this guy, but there are a plenty of reasons and technical experts in DJI are not very professional, as they told me that I was flying a full speed (when I was flying 11 m/s - this is full speed of AVATA? XD) ;) they are aware about problem but they want to agree and say sorry.

djiuser_HpDFzmS8X3Wv Posted at 4-24 23:38
there is no any yaw tumble in cinebot  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqfGQhU1mOw&pp=ygUgY2luZWJvdDMwIGF2YXRhIGRlZmVuZGVyIGNvbXBhcmU%3D

not good comparsion IMHO :/
on avata tests he keeps RPM/power (so left stick) way higher - also sound from motors confirm it.
on later comparsion def/6s cine - looks he kills power before sharp turn. that delay for sure affect also how those drones turn and are much stable.

to be clear - I do NOT defend avata - it got so many problem I'll be returning/selling mine. We all should get full refund + some compensation IMHO from DJI for such dangerous drone!
but this video is little not fair about how "stable" other cines are.

So, obviously the "damage" on my Avata has been assessed.

They do charge me either

1) a new upper frame (had some minor scratches) for 55.60 Euros

or

2) Refresh Replacement for 55 Euros.

NOT A WORD ABOUT THE FLYOFF THAT OCCURED!!!

DJI, I DID NOT SEND YOU THE DRONE BECAUSE OF A MINOR SCRATCH ON THE UPPER FRAME! THIS IS NO DEFECT THAT HAS TO BE REPAIRED. I SENT YOU THE DRONE TO CHECK THE FLIGHT LOGS AND FIND THE PROBLEM IN THE IMU / FC THAT HAS LED TO THIS CRASH AND FLYOFF ON 26nd OF MARCH!

I will not pay ANY of these two offerings!

SeehawerB Posted at 4-25 06:25
So, obviously the "damage" on my Avata has been assessed.

They do charge me either

That’s why I decided to NOT send my Avata to them.