Why is the White Balance of the Mavic 3 Enterprise locked to automatic White Balance?

It's an absolute deal breaker when it comes to surveying and mapping. The constant changing of white balance results in some very ugly looking orthomaics.

I've played with the standard Mavic 3, which has the ability to choose present Kelvin units (sunny, shade, overcast, indoors etc) and manual.  
The Mavic 3E with and RTK modual is supposed to be replacing the Phantom 4 RTK, but how can it when it can't produce comparable results.

Hello, there. Sorry for the inconvenience. White balance cannot be manually adjusted in the DJI Mavic 3 Enterprise Series visible light camera, as the app has no related parameters and setting menus. When camera mode is set to Auto, the camera will automatically adjust the white balance.

When the camera mode isn't set to auto (Aperture, shutter or manual), the white balance still remains on auto.

This occurs whether it is flying a pre-programmed mission or manual flight.

Locking the exposure doesn't lock the white balance.

The Phantom 4 RTK has pre-set options.  The Mavic 3 has pre-set options, as well as manual selecting of kelvin units.  So if the Mavic 3 Enterprise is replacing the Phantom 4 RTK and is a very similar model to the Mavic 3, why are we taking a step backwards?

This makes the M3E totally unacceptable for the stated competency.  Wow.

I work in open cut mining and use remotely piloted aircraft for creating geo referenced Orthmosaics, surfaces and colourised 3D textured mesh (OBJ files).

Up until now the Phantom 4 RTK has been our main RPAS of choice, however with the announcement to discontinue them, we have been trialing the Mavic 3 Enterprise.

We have a fleet of M300s with P1 and 35mm lens, but find it to be inefficient compared to the Phantom 4 RTK.  Too long to setup and poor field of view resulting in significantly more photos and longer processing times.  The weight is also an inconvenience. We have ordered some 25mm lens in the hope that it will make them a feasible option for our intended use.

We are flying multiple areas that are generally less than 50 Hectares multiple times a day. so having something light weight and easy to assemble is important.

Unless DJI add the ability to choose pre-set white balance values like the Phantom 4 RTK and Mavic 3, the Enterprise version is useless for aerial mapping.

P1 inefficient compared to P4R?  there may be a usage problem.

LV_Forestry Posted at 3-28 21:25
P1 inefficient compared to P4R?  there may be a usage problem.

If flying at 120m covering an area of 50 hectares or smaller, it is less efficient.

1. P1 with a 35mm lens has a poor FOV resulting in the need for more flight lines and more images.
2. The extra photos and file sizes of the photos increase the processing time.
3. Field setup and pack up time takes longer.
4. Heavier setup and boxes which increase the risk of straining the body.

The 15m/s wind resistance, 50C temp and increased endurance is a big win, but that isn't a major issue for us

Marchetti270 Posted at 3-28 23:09
If flying at 120m covering an area of 50 hectares or smaller, it is less efficient.

1. P1 with a 35mm lens has a poor FOV resulting in the need for more flight lines and more images.

Yes if you do flat ground without obstacle I recognize that 84 is good.
But in image quality it is incomparable. And precision too because the point cloud from the P1 is fantastic.

LV_Forestry Posted at 3-28 23:16
Yes if you do flat ground without obstacle I recognize that 84 is good.
But in image quality it is incomparable. And precision too because the point cloud from the P1 is fantastic.

I agree with your comment, but this thread is not about the comparison of M300, P4 RTK and M3E. It's about the auto white balance issue of the Mavic 3 Enterprise that DJI continues to ignore.

Mavic 3 Enterprise is replacing the discontinued Phantom 4 RTK, but is missing some critical settings.

I have the same complaint regarding the even more expensive Mavic 3 Thermal.  What makes this so frustrating is that all it would take is to update the firmware to allow us to manually set the white balance.  After all, Autel's enterprise drones do just that (they just have a little trouble keeping the horizon level ).

Why is the White Balance of the Mavic 3 Enterprise locked to automatic White Balance?
Is that really the problem you are experiencing?
If white balance was properly auto adjusting, the colour balance of your images should be similar even when lighting conditions change.
But you are getting big variations that suggest the white balance is erratic and changing when it shouldn't.

DJI Wanda Posted at 3-28 01:58
Hello, there. Sorry for the inconvenience. White balance cannot be manually adjusted in the DJI Mavic 3 Enterprise Series visible light camera, as the app has no related parameters and setting menus. When camera mode is set to Auto, the camera will automatically adjust the white balance.

Hi Wanda, can we please be assured that this problem is known by DJI and that it is actively being worked on? Because this is not an inconvenience, this is unacceptable. Speaking of.. your reason of "the app has no related parameters" is too. There was no POI mode in the app last firmware version but guess what? It was added! So add a way to lock/adjust white balance. This is available on every camera from a Mavic Mini to a budget smartphone. My results haven't been as bad as the OP's but the fact that white balance is locked on auto and manual focus changes randomly makes this useless for photogrammetry. I'd rather go back to an electronic shutter that has those two problems fixed than a mechanical shutter that is stuck on auto settings.

Can someone at DJI please acknowledge that these problems are known and being addressed instead of ignoring them and hoping they disappear?

Johnnokomis Posted at 4-1 21:17
Hi Wanda, can we please be assured that this problem is known by DJI and that it is actively being worked on? Because this is not an inconvenience, this is unacceptable. Speaking of.. your reason of "the app has no related parameters" is too. There was no POI mode in the app last firmware version but guess what? It was added! So add a way to lock/adjust white balance. This is available on every camera from a Mavic Mini to a budget smartphone. My results haven't been as bad as the OP's but the fact that white balance is locked on auto and manual focus changes randomly makes this useless for photogrammetry. I'd rather go back to an electronic shutter that has those two problems fixed than a mechanical shutter that is stuck on auto settings.

Can someone at DJI please acknowledge that these problems are known and being addressed instead of ignoring them and hoping they disappear?

We will forward it to our related department for evaluation.

We confirmed again with our engineers that, currently, DJI Mavic 3 Enterprise does not support the white balance adjustment.   Thank you for your feedback. We have forwarded it to our R&D department for evaluation.

This is a massive issue at our company too, could your engineers confirm whether this is a software or hardware issue?
Seems like this could be addressed by a firmware update, but I am no expert concerning cameras.

Labroides Posted at 3-30 14:24
Why is the White Balance of the Mavic 3 Enterprise locked to automatic White Balance?
Is that really the problem you are experiencing?
If white balance was properly auto adjusting, the colour balance of your images should be similar even when lighting conditions change.

I’ve selected some of the more noticeably missions for this thread. They are certainly some that are more subtle, but still unacceptable.

I cannot stress enough that the Mavic 3 doesn’t have this issue as there are preset options and manual Kelvin scale.

Someone else on this thread or the firmware update thread has noticed the same issue with the Mavic 3T.

Marchetti270 Posted at 4-5 02:33
I’ve selected some of the more noticeably missions for this thread. They are certainly some that are more subtle, but still unacceptable.

I cannot stress enough that the Mavic 3 doesn’t have this issue as there are preset options and manual Kelvin scale.

When auto WB is working properly you wouldn't get those big changes even if the lighting does change.
The problem isn't that your drone has auto white balance.
It looks like your drone's auto white balance is malfunctioning.

I had a Phantom with the same problem so I had to use the preset for sunny/cloudy.
I had a second Phantom without the problem and it was find to leave on auto WB.

I really hate when answers from DJI are like we're some idiots. There are many things that needs to be fixed with M3 Enterprise series. Probably biggest problem is that they don't have real life user in their team, so they don't know how Enterprise product should look like.

If you develop and  put product on the market, that product should be complete and tested by real life users, not some internal testers. Also, photogrammetry is not only plain 2D flight plane in one type of environment. You should test it in all parts of the world. Also, some of us use drone for building and archeology photogrammetry. Workflow is in theory the same, but in practice very different.

We need:
obviously WB full control
ISO full control in every mode
full control over min and max speed of drone
all types of flight plans (hint: vertica/fascade, not only for basic mapping)

Cmon DJI, you can do it...

Labroides Posted at 4-5 03:51
When auto WB is working properly you wouldn't get those big changes even if the lighting does change.
The problem isn't that your drone has auto white balance.
It looks like your drone's auto white balance is malfunctioning.

I've used about 9 different Phantom 4 RTK systems for 700 plus flights and can confirm that when they are new the white balance is set to auto.

To change the white balance the pilot must create a programmed mission where the white balance is set to sunning / cloudy / overcast  (not auto) and then execute the mission.  once the first photo has been taken, the white balance will be set to what was selected in the mission.  This will then dictate the white balance for manual flight.  Please note that there is no way to change the white balance on the Phantom 4 RTK during manual flight.

If the pilot pulls it straight from the box and then operates in manual mode, the white balance will remain on auto and the images will fluctuate.

White balance has nothing to do with exposure settings. It will fluctuate when everything is set to manual exposure settings.
White balance fluctuates based on the range of colours within the frame when the lighting conditions are consistant.  So when the aircraft flys over differen material types, vegetated / non vegetated, water / no water.

watch this: DJI Fly Quick Tip - GET OFF AUTO WHITE BALANCE! - YouTube

Labroides Posted at 4-5 03:51
When auto WB is working properly you wouldn't get those big changes even if the lighting does change.
The problem isn't that your drone has auto white balance.
It looks like your drone's auto white balance is malfunctioning.

We have purchased another 6 or so Mavic 3Es. When they arrive, I will confirm that the same issue exists for all of them.

SurveyingRemotePilot Posted at 4-5 16:53
I've used about 9 different Phantom 4 RTK systems for 700 plus flights and can confirm that when they are new the white balance is set to auto.

To change the white balance the pilot must create a programmed mission where the white balance is set to sunning / cloudy / overcast  (not auto) and then execute the mission.  once the first photo has been taken, the white balance will be set to what was selected in the mission.  This will then dictate the white balance for manual flight.  Please note that there is no way to change the white balance on the Phantom 4 RTK during manual flight.

White balance has nothing to do with exposure settings. It will fluctuate when everything is set to manual exposure settings.
White balance fluctuates based on the range of colours within the frame when the lighting conditions are consistant.  So when the aircraft flys over differen material types, vegetated / non vegetated, water / no water.

White balance is a concept that is much misunderstood by many drone flyers and non-photographers.
It is not related to the colour of what you photograph.
It is all about the colour of the lighting and maintaining consistent colour in your images.
Properly functioning auto WB is a good idea for mapping missions

Google will bring up lots of sites that expalin it properly.
Here's one to start:
https://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/white-balance.htm
watch this: DJI Fly Quick Tip - GET OFF AUTO WHITE BALANCE! - YouTube
Watch that for a non-photographer spreading misinformation.
He doesn't understand white balance at all.

Auto white balance is fine as long as it's working properly.
The examples posted above and what you've posted here are not a problem because auto white balance is used.
They are a problem because the auto white balance is malfunctioning.
Like this example from one Phantom I used for many years.
I've had no problem using auto white balance with all my other drone and SLR cameras, over many years.
If your auto white balance is malfunctioning, you need to get it fixed or replaced.



In this example you see the white balance shifting although there is no change in lighting (or the subject matter).

Labroides Posted at 4-5 18:31
White balance has nothing to do with exposure settings. It will fluctuate when everything is set to manual exposure settings.
White balance fluctuates based on the range of colours within the frame when the lighting conditions are consistant.  So when the aircraft flys over differen material types, vegetated / non vegetated, water / no water.

Why run auto white balance on a drone?
Why own a DSLR and put it on auto to take photos?

I would rather set it at the beginning of a mission to either a preset value or manually based on the kelvin scale and hold it fixed for the entire mission.  Why risk having it fluctuate?

It is a basic camera setting that should be available.

This particular Mavic 3E has had this issue since it was new.  We have ordered more and will likely find the same issue with all of them.  The fix is to allow preset options.  simple firmware update.  Phantom 4 RTK had this option and the Mavic 3E which is replacing the Phantom 4 RTK doesn't.  It is a step bacwards.

I've mentioned this before and will do it again.  The Mavic 3 has these options available, so why doesn't the Mavic 3E?
Image is from the link you provided: Understanding White Balance (cambridgeincolour.com)
The senarios being describe in the article is exactly what is happening to me and everyone I work with.  The natural ground colour is generally a reddish colour, so the auto white balance "then tries to compensate for this so that the average color of the image is closer to neutral, but in doing so it unknowingly creates a bluish color"

I think you need to read past the title of the link you provided.  Everything it mentions supports the issues we are having.  White balance tends to be correct more often than not when a vehicle is within the shot.

DJI Wanda Posted at 4-4 02:47
We confirmed again with our engineers that, currently, DJI Mavic 3 Enterprise does not support the white balance adjustment.   Thank you for your feedback. We have forwarded it to our R&D department for evaluation.

No disrespect Wanda but we didn't need confirmation that this problem exist. We need confirmation that it's being actively addressed! This is the equivalent of having a flat tire on your car then the mechanic walking up and saying "yep, it's flat alright". It's abundantly clear that admins here have zero experience with Enterprise products, and that's not your fault. DJI just needs someone on customer support payroll that does.

Check out this beauty captured with a Mavic 3E.

The aircraft is flying over muddy puddles that appear to be quite red, so the white balance tries to compensate for the dominate red colour and turns everything blue.

SurveyingRemotePilot Posted at 4-5 21:42
Why run auto white balance on a drone?
Why own a DSLR and put it on auto to take photos?

Why run auto white balance on a drone?
Why own a DSLR and put it on auto to take photos?
Answer:  Because it's good and deals with changing lighting conditions

I would rather set it at the beginning of a mission to either a preset value or manually based on the kelvin scale and hold it fixed for the entire mission.
Great strategy if your lighting conditions stay the same, but not so good if you have to deal with changing cloudy conditions.  

Why risk having it fluctuate?
If your auto WB is working properly there's no risk.
I've been using auto WB for mapping and professional photography for years.
It doesn't fluctuate unless it's malfunctioning (like I showed above).

It is a basic camera setting that should be available.
Yes it should be available, but that isn't causing the problem you and the OP posted.

I think you need to read past the title of the link you provided.  Everything it mentions supports the issues we are having.
No ... that's different and only a very slight issue, not the big swings you and the OP demonstrated and would be very easily corrected if necessary.  

Labroides Posted at 4-5 22:28
Why run auto white balance on a drone?
Why own a DSLR and put it on auto to take photos?
Answer:  Because it's good and deals with changing lighting conditions

Response: where are you flying that the lighting conditions / cloud cover is changing that fast? Missions should be planned outside of sunrise / sunset and heavy clouds rolling in.  Therefore no need for white balance to be on auto.

I'd be more concerned about the intermittent shadows in the orthomosaic than very minor incorrect white balance for one cloud passing overhead.  Do you even use the Mavic 3E for surveying purposes?

"It doesn't fluctuate unless it's malfunctioning (like I showed above)."
Your image above was fluctuating due to the dominant blue / green, so it was introducing more red which made the grass look yellow.  Sounds like the same issue to me.

It is a basic camera setting that should be available.
"Yes it should be available, but that isn't causing the problem you and the OP posted."
We will know when the other Mavic 3Es arrive.  The issue can easily be fixed by enabling a basic function.  Does DJI want mass recall of Mavic 3E or simple firmware update and no recall.

The example in the article was minor because there were other colours visible in the shot, including white which helps determine the true colour balance.

SurveyingRemotePilot Posted at 4-5 22:50
Response: where are you flying that the lighting conditions / cloud cover is changing that fast? Missions should be planned outside of sunrise / sunset and heavy clouds rolling in.  Therefore no need for white balance to be on auto.

I'd be more concerned about the intermittent shadows in the orthomosaic than very minor incorrect white balance for one cloud passing overhead.  Do you even use the Mavic 3E for surveying purposes?

I'd be more concerned about the intermittent shadows in the orthomosaic  than very minor incorrect white balance for one cloud passing  overhead.
I used to do a lot of mapping in coastal areas where the thickness of cloud cover changed a lot and auto WB worked well.
I used a pair of Phantom 4 pros.

Do you even use the Mavic 3E for surveying purposes?
I don't have that model, but do have the consumer version.

Your image above was fluctuating due to the dominant blue / green, so it was introducing more red which made the grass look yellow.  Sounds like the same issue to me.
Look closer.
It was the same set of images when I was reshooting a panorama.
The subject matter was exactly the same but the colour temperature was swinging way too far.
That screenshot shows WB of 10100°K !!   
Far outside normal values.
It was swinging erratically from much too cool blue to much too warm-yellow.

Johnnokomis Posted at 4-5 21:54
No disrespect Wanda but we didn't need confirmation that this problem exist. We need confirmation that it's being actively addressed! This is the equivalent of having a flat tire on your car then the mechanic walking up and saying "yep, it's flat alright". It's abundantly clear that admins here have zero experience with Enterprise products, and that's not your fault. DJI just needs someone on customer support payroll that does.

Kindly understand that we have forwarded your advice to our related department for evaluation.  We hope this function can be realized through the updates in the future, too.

Whilst I don't own this drone, the fact it can't be set to manual WB would be a reason for me to not buy this if I needed to in the future. Perfect example given by OP where a reddish shot caused by the soil can confuse a camera and cause huge swings in the WB causing the output to look blotchy.

I'll be keeping hold of my P4Pv2 for now. There is zero excuse to not have manual WB on this drone

Labroides Posted at 4-5 22:28
Why run auto white balance on a drone?
Why own a DSLR and put it on auto to take photos?
Answer:  Because it's good and deals with changing lighting conditions

"If your auto WB is working properly there's no risk.
I've been using auto WB for mapping and professional photography for years.
It doesn't fluctuate unless it's malfunctioning (like I showed above)."

I'm sorry but I'm going to disagree with you here. OP's example is a great example of why AWB is bad, the soil confuses the camera and makes it think that the colour reflected from it is either too warm or too cold, so it's swinging between values to correct itself. You're probably not going to notice this from photo to photo unless it's going wildly out of range, but when stitched together, it's really apparent.

Now, what's worse with AWB is that when you take the photo you don't know what the WB is that the camera set, so good luck correcting it back to the correct colour when it could be anywhere in the 3200-6000k range. Fix it to 4600k or whatever and you have a baseline you can always come back to and know how to colour correct using a colour checker chart. Even if it's the most orange, sunny, unusual soil you're capturing, knowing the WB will ensure that you know the colour can be accurately corrected to be true.

CloudVisual Posted at 4-6 08:38
"If your auto WB is working properly there's no risk.
I've been using auto WB for mapping and professional photography for years.
It doesn't fluctuate unless it's malfunctioning (like I showed above)."

I'm sorry but I'm going to disagree with you here. OP's example is a great example of why AWB is bad, the soil confuses the camera and makes it think that the colour reflected from it is either too warm or too cold, so it's swinging between values to correct itself.
That's nonsense.
If you couldn't work it out from the examples I posted, look at the thumbnails in the 2nd and 3rd posts of this thread.
The WB is wandering even though the images are showing the same soil and the same colour.

I'm giving up on this thread and trying to explain the obvious to idiots.

Here's another example of why we need to be able to at least lock white balance. This was shot with the Mavic 3 Enterprise with exposure settings locked. I had to keyframe my white balance adjustment in Premiere Pro so that the image got warmer throughout the clip. It still doesn't look right because the white balance was jumping all around with no way to stop it. Like someone above already said, there's no excuse for this. This feature alone deserves a firmware update to add what should of been available on day one.

I'm going to give this thread a little bump since DJI still has not addressed this white balance issue. The M3E is now last on the list of current drones when it comes to firmware updates. Surely we'll see an update soon. Here's yet another example of how auto white balance can ruin a great shot. Watch the second half of this 6 second clip. The color shift ruins what would otherwise be a very nice shot.

Related to Mavic 3E auto white balance issue...

latest release notes for M300 P1 contains the following:  "Fixed issue: the AWB difference is too large in some scenarios."
Link:  https://dl.djicdn.com/downloads/ ... tes_en_20220928.pdf

When going back through old M300 projects, I had noticed similar white balance issues to the Mavic 3E, but less severe.
If DJI have 'fixed' a known issue with the M300, they should eventually follow up with the Mavic 3E.  The next question is when?

I am looking forward to carrying out tests on the 7 new Mavic 3Es purchased to confirm it's not a single drone malfunctioning.

I'll also test:
- The M300 with the latest firmware and see how that turns out
- P4 RTK with auto white balance to confirm auto white balance is rubbish
- P4 RTK with preset value of sunny to confirm that having a fixed white balance is a must for creating orthomosaics