Ok i am confuse what it means by vlos. Cause some people are saying, it means you have to see your drones at all time. Other are saying if you have a visual line of sight where you are flying, you dont need to see your drone. Example, you are out in a field with no trees or buildings and can see miles away. That is your vlos. So you are legally able to fly out as far as your vlos. Cause the point is you are looking out for manned aircraft, not your drone. So which is it? If i can see miles out with no obstruction, am i allow to fly out that far? Or i have to be able to see my drone at all times. I am asking cause ive seen many folks fly out over 3000 feet to even 30,000 ft. No way in hell can anyone see a drone the size of a phone beyond 1000 feet. Idk about you guys but i loose sight of my drone once i go pass like 700-800 feet. How do people see their drone 3000 feet out and beyond? O.o

you have to be able to see your drone
https://fixar.pro/blogs/vlos-evl ... is-the-difference/#

The Saint Posted at 6-7 14:59
you have to be able to see your drone
https://fixar.pro/blogs/vlos-evlos-and-bvlos-what-is-the-difference/#

So 90% of drone pilot posting on youtube are breaking the law. Lol  Cause i doubt anyone with the best eye sight will be able to see a small drone that far out. Im all for drone safe law but this law is ridiculous imo given the technology we have on drones now.

Strictly speaking I think it is that, not only should you and or your spotter be able to literally see the drone, unaided by anything other glasses, but you should also be able to determine its orientation, i.e. what way it is facing. I think the idea behind it is that you should be able to determine what else is in the air around your drone and know which way to move to avoid a conlfict.
For most people I doubt they can see a mini sized drone beyongd 600m and that's if they have watched the drone the whole way out.
If you lost sight of a drone and then had to find it, you could probably cut that distance by a third or a half.
In the past I have triggered an RTH then looked away from the drone and subsequently not been able to spot the drone until it is nearly overhead, they can hide very well.

djiuser_zKR5HFX3a2EC Posted at 6-7 15:47
So 90% of drone pilot posting on youtube are breaking the law. Lol  Cause i doubt anyone with the best eye sight will be able to see a small drone that far out. Im all for drone safe law but this law is ridiculous imo given the technology we have on drones now.

Where did you get that 90%???

But yes, the line of sight, is a bit of a loose term... What the law imply is that you should always try to see what you are doing with your flying RC toy, without having to rely on a screen...

Practically common sense should apply... Of course your eyesight may be better, may be worse than mine, and that is where things get blurry...

When I fly in the middle of the outback, My eyesight always get much, much better...

§ 107.31 Visual line of sight aircraft operation.

(a) With vision that is unaided by any device other than corrective lenses, the remote pilot in command, the visual observer (if one is used), and the person manipulating the flight control of the small unmanned aircraft system must be able to see the unmanned aircraft throughout the entire flight in order to:
(1) Know the unmanned aircraft's location;
(2) Determine the unmanned aircraft's attitude, altitude, and direction of flight;
(3) Observe the airspace for other air traffic or hazards; and
(4) Determine that the unmanned aircraft does not endanger the life or property of another.
(b) Throughout the entire flight of the small unmanned aircraft, the ability described in paragraph (a) of this section must be exercised by either:
(1) The remote pilot in command and the person manipulating the flight controls of the small unmanned aircraft system; or
(2) A visual observer. (The visual observer must be co-located with the pilot)

Here's a good article and video on VLOS.

https://pilotinstitute.com/drone-vlos-rules/

It's my understand that with the advent of AI, the FAA will be able to, and will begin using it to delete any videos or images known by the AI program to have been taken beyond the visual line of sight. Should be happening in 5...4....3....2....1.... POP ! Go check your youtube channel ! Empty, eh?  What? All the forum posts with images gone...but my three? Ah well.

Hi there. Thank you for reaching out. VLOS stands for Visual Line of Sight. VLOS refers to the requirement that the drone user/pilot must maintain visual contact with the aircraft at all times during its operation. When operating a drone within a visual line of sight, the operator can see the drone with unaided vision, meaning they do not require binoculars or any other devices to maintain visual contact. This ensures that the operator can effectively monitor the drone's position, altitude, and overall flight path to avoid collisions with other objects, aircraft, or people. Should you have other inquiries, please don't hesitate to reach us. Thank you.

digibud Posted at 6-7 17:18
It's my understand that with the advent of AI, the FAA will be able to, and will begin using it to delete any videos or images known by the AI program to have been taken beyond the visual line of sight. Should be happening in 5...4....3....2....1.... POP ! Go check your youtube channel ! Empty, eh?  What? All the forum posts with images gone...but my three? Ah well.

Should be happening in 5...4....3....2....1.... POP !

   

Honestly I think the FAA has found a decent balance between having a rule that's a bit over-the-top and then not really enforcing it except in pretty egregious cases. There are definitely stories out there of YouTubers getting calls from the FAA and even threatened with fines for videos where the VLOS violation is blatant. Proving a pilot is out of VLOS is pretty difficult because any pilot can just say "yes of course I could see it." I think it's fine for them to have the rule available for them to use against rogue pilots doing obviously dangerous stuff with the sort of implicit understanding that they just don't care if Joe Drone Pilot is flying his Mavic Mini out to half a mile on a nice day.

2wheeledphotog Posted at 6-8 06:31
Honestly I think the FAA has found a decent balance between having a rule that's a bit over-the-top and then not really enforcing it except in pretty egregious cases. There are definitely stories out there of YouTubers getting calls from the FAA and even threatened with fines for videos where the VLOS violation is blatant. Proving a pilot is out of VLOS is pretty difficult because any pilot can just say "yes of course I could see it." I think it's fine for them to have the rule available for them to use against rogue pilots doing obviously dangerous stuff with the sort of implicit understanding that they just don't care if Joe Drone Pilot is flying his Mavic Mini out to half a mile on a nice day.

...or even claiming they had a spotter.  but i agree with you, the faa doesn't seem to be enforcing this unless it is combined with some other violation.  ultimately i believe this rule will be modified or even dropped in the coming years as we get into issues like remote id or protected zones.

2wheeledphotog Posted at 6-8 06:31
Honestly I think the FAA has found a decent balance between having a rule that's a bit over-the-top and then not really enforcing it except in pretty egregious cases. There are definitely stories out there of YouTubers getting calls from the FAA and even threatened with fines for videos where the VLOS violation is blatant. Proving a pilot is out of VLOS is pretty difficult because any pilot can just say "yes of course I could see it." I think it's fine for them to have the rule available for them to use against rogue pilots doing obviously dangerous stuff with the sort of implicit understanding that they just don't care if Joe Drone Pilot is flying his Mavic Mini out to half a mile on a nice day.

You think proving someone is beyond vlos is difficult? Lol not really. You do know all your flight data is being recorded when you fly right? Such as your home point, your pilot location, drone location, height agl, distance, etc. They can easily prove you are beyond vlos. So you really think someone can still see their tiny drone 3000 -30000 ft from home point? Lol. Cause i lose sight on my mini 2 very quickly and my distance is like 500-800 ft.

djiuser_zKR5HFX3a2EC Posted at 6-8 08:01
You think proving someone is beyond vlos is difficult? Lol not really. You do know all your flight data is being recorded when you fly right? Such as your home point, your pilot location, drone location, height agl, distance, etc. They can easily prove you are beyond vlos. So you really think someone can still see their tiny drone 3000 -30000 ft from home point? Lol. Cause i lose sight on my mini 2 very quickly and my distance is like 500-800 ft.

PROVING it is difficult. Alleging it is easy, but the theoretical range at which someone can see a drone depends on so many factors there aren't a lot of situations where someone could definitively say "you COULD NOT HAVE SEEN your drone." While many YouTubers post their telemetry or flat out say how far away they're flying, there's no practical way for the FAA to know my location in relation to my drone after-the-fact. And given that there are hundreds of videos on YouTube of people doing range tests with their drones, it seems very clear that the FAA isn't proactively looking for VLOS violations.

2wheeledphotog Posted at 6-8 09:04
PROVING it is difficult. Alleging it is easy, but the theoretical range at which someone can see a drone depends on so many factors there aren't a lot of situations where someone could definitively say "you COULD NOT HAVE SEEN your drone." While many YouTubers post their telemetry or flat out say how far away they're flying, there's no practical way for the FAA to know my location in relation to my drone after-the-fact. And given that there are hundreds of videos on YouTube of people doing range tests with their drones, it seems very clear that the FAA isn't proactively looking for VLOS violations.

it's the same challenges faced by police when watching speeding motorcycle videos.  too difficult to prove beyond a reasonable doubt.

Sean-bumble-bee Posted at 6-7 15:50
Strictly speaking I think it is that, not only should you and or your spotter be able to literally see the drone unaided by anything other glasses but you should also be able to determine its orientation, i.e. what way it is facing. I think the idea behind it is that you should be able to determine what else is in the air around your drone and know which way to move to avoid a conlfict.
For most people I doubt they can see a mini sized drone beyongd 600m and that's if they have watched the drone the whole way out.
If you lost sight of a drone and then had to find it, you could probably cut that distance by a third or a half.

Whilst you are correct re orientation,, i feel thats just a way for the CAA to make sure you stay close,  It does not matter which way the drone is facing, if there is another aircraft approaching your vicinity, you ain't gonna turn and run from it, you should be descending, quickly!

I think someone should create drone wing mirrors, this would help us lol

2wheeledphotog Posted at 6-8 09:04
PROVING it is difficult. Alleging it is easy, but the theoretical range at which someone can see a drone depends on so many factors there aren't a lot of situations where someone could definitively say "you COULD NOT HAVE SEEN your drone." While many YouTubers post their telemetry or flat out say how far away they're flying, there's no practical way for the FAA to know my location in relation to my drone after-the-fact. And given that there are hundreds of videos on YouTube of people doing range tests with their drones, it seems very clear that the FAA isn't proactively looking for VLOS violations.

Proving it is very simple, if its a mini drone and over 600m, you've lost LOS, heck, i lose my P4P at 600m, 300-400m is my max with the Mini's, proving that, as i said is simple, if they were so inclined, they would have you do a field test with them.

Here in the UK, we can use nav lights to aid in knowing the orientation, which increases VLOS somewhat and even more so during a night flight.

Bashy Posted at 6-12 07:05
Whilst you are correct re orientation,, i feel thats just a way for the CAA to make sure you stay close,  It does not matter which way the drone is facing, if there is another aircraft approaching your vicinity, you ain't gonna turn and run from it, you should be descending, quickly!

I think someone should create drone wing mirrors, this would help us lol

You might be surprised how many people have suggested a horizontal component to the 'avoidance' flight path or even a purely horizontal flight path.

You have to maintain eye contact on the drone at all times if you can see the drone at 10 miles great fly it 10 miles But generally I loose sight of my Mavic3 at around 1500 feet , with strobe lights on about 5000 feet on a clear day flying at a airport with atc observiing me.

The FAA clearly states there is no right ,waiver or methrod allowed for Bvlos for Recreational flyers as of yet.   But there is a Bill in congress for Bvlos as I am writing this . But for now a p107 is required.
So My advice for now Its be best  for you to "follow the rules"  and keep your drone in sight at all times.  you can be hit with heavy fines and loose your drone. or worst have a mishap that could injure someone.
when i fly bvlos I tend to do it at a uncontrolled  airports under the airports observations.  But Technically I am still breaking the rules as well as far as the faa is concerned.
If your really interested in learning about Bvlos  you can read the FAA ruling on it here https://www.faa.gov/regulations_ ... REPORT_03102022.pdf

That is my experiences, with BVlos  Good luck

Sean-bumble-bee Posted at 6-12 07:57
You might be surprised how many people have suggested a horizontal component to the 'avoidance' flight path or even a purely horizontal flight path.

Makes no sense to me, should be dropping in my book

Bashy Posted at 6-12 18:12
Makes no sense to me, should be dropping in my book

"descending" might be a more appropriate word, though, for me, a mid-air motor-stop would also be on the cards.