Hello,

I live in Europe, and I recently purchased a DJI Mini 2. I have a concern regarding the future actions that EASA (European Aviation Safety Agency) will take on the open category. According to EASA regulations, if an Drone doesn't have a certified Maximum Take-Off Mass (MTOM) of less than 250 grams from the manufacturer, it will be categorized as open category A3 starting from 2024.

Upon checking the user manual of the DJI Mini 2, I couldn't find any specification regarding the MTOM, whereas the DJI Mini SE has it specified in its user manual.

Is there any official communication regarding the MTOM for the DJI Mini 2?

If not, probably it's better to buy a Mini SE.

Thanks

https://www.seguridadaerea.gob.e ... ado_Fabricantes.pdf

Many thanks
but how is not that written in the DJI page?
In any case did you enter in this page from EASA page? Or you wen specifically for spanish pages?  

BlueLlama Posted at 8-1 12:25
Many thanks
but how is not that written in the DJI page?
In any case did you enter in this page from EASA page? Or you wen specifically for spanish pages?

Luckily CAAs aren't stupid. Article 20 concerning legacy drones (put on the market before 2024) can be interpreted in several ways.

Option A: The manufacturer's manual must say MTOM.
Option B: The manual indicates the mass of the drone as delivered. As soon as the user does not modify it, it is the mass to be taken into account.

I regularly go around the European CAA websites, I have not yet found one that chooses option A.

The Spanish CAA is the one that is the clearest, it defines the mass indicated in the manual as being the MTOM. And that's the right thing to do, I think.

For DJI it's a godsend, how many people with a drone in perfect working order will rush on the latest mini only in order to obtain a C0?

A lot.

I can't believe EU institutions will restrict drone use just because of 4 letters in a manual. This to say that for the richest it is not a problem, but for the others, it is more complicated. It's not EU spirit at all. But article 20 is there, and it is to be expected that someone will find a good reason to apply it unfavorably to us.

LV_Forestry Posted at 8-1 13:00
Luckily CAAs aren't stupid. Article 20 concerning legacy drones (put on the market before 2024) can be interpreted in several ways.

Option A: The manufacturer's manual must say MTOM.

Unfortunately, the interpretation of the regulations leaves many, including myself, in an "uncertain" legal status, which is unsettling and takes away from the enjoyment of using the drone.

I find it interesting that only the Spanish government has provided specific specifications. I am curious if that can be used in other countries outside of Spain. Refusing that means calling Spanish CAA stupid

Since the new drone or the Mini 2 SE explicitly specifies the MTOM in its manual, I am considerating returning the Mini 2, just to be on the safe side.

Thank you very much for your time, LV_Foresrty.

Hi there. Thank you for reaching out. The standard weight of the aircraft (including battery, propellers, and microSD card) is 242 grams. Actual product weight may vary. Registration is not required in some countries and regions. Check local rules and regulations before use. These specifications have been determined through tests conducted with the latest firmware. Firmware updates can enhance performance, so updating to the latest firmware is highly recommended. Thank you for your valued support.

DJI Paladin Posted at 8-3 02:26
Hi there. Thank you for reaching out. The standard weight of the aircraft (including battery, propellers, and microSD card) is 242 grams. Actual product weight may vary. Registration is not required in some countries and regions. Check local rules and regulations before use. These specifications have been determined through tests conducted with the latest firmware. Firmware updates can enhance performance, so updating to the latest firmware is highly recommended. Thank you for your valued support.

I can't find the documentation where 242g is indicated. Can you guide me please?

LV_Forestry Posted at 8-3 08:59
I can't find the documentation where 242g is indicated. Can you guide me please?

Thank you for your response, Captain. You may access this link https://www.dji.com/products/comparison-consumer-drones and select the DJI Mini together with other drones then you can see the information on the bottom of the take of weight, see the image below. Should you have other inquiries, please don't hesitate to reach us. Thank you for your continued support.

DJI Paladin Posted at 8-5 02:04
Thank you for your response, Captain. You may access this link https://www.dji.com/products/comparison-consumer-drones and select the DJI Mini together with other drones then you can see the information on the bottom of the take of weight, see the image below. Should you have other inquiries, please don't hesitate to reach us. Thank you for your continued support.
[view_image]

Thank you DJI Paladin.

Do you know why it's not in the manual? It's not very serious issue because the manual mentions <249g, but it's still strange to have fragments of information everywhere.

LV_Forestry Posted at 8-5 03:53
Thank you DJI Paladin.

Do you know why it's not in the manual? It's not very serious issue because the manual mentions

You are always welcome, Captain. We also appreciate this feedback of yours. We will surely coordinate this with our relevant team for attention. Thank you for your valued support!

DJI Paladin Posted at 8-7 04:46
You are always welcome, Captain. We also appreciate this feedback of yours. We will surely coordinate this with our relevant team for attention. Thank you for your valued support!

Hello,
EASA just made a statement for drone classes. Easa Open Category

I do not see the mavic mini 2 in the C0 class, that means it will fall starting from 01.2024 to the subcategory A3.

Is there any hope that this will change?
Thanks

BlueLlama Posted at 8-11 04:14
Hello,
EASA just made a statement for drone classes. Easa Open Category

I think the DJi Mini 2 falls under the category "Privately built and drones purchased before 01/01/2024   (under 250 gramm)" and will thus be allowed to operate in subcategory A1.

Subcategory	A1 (can also fly in subcategory A3)
Operational restrictions	May fly over uninvolved people (should be avoided when possible) No flight over assemblies of people
Drone operator registration	No, unless camera / sensor on board and a drone is not a toy
Remote pilot competence	No training required
Remote pilot minimum age	No minimum age

Herbie53 Posted at 8-11 14:54
I think the DJi Mini 2 falls under the category "Privately built and drones purchased before 01/01/2024   (under 250 gramm)" and will thus be allowed to operate in subcategory A1.

I hope....
Becasue the Mini 2 can weight more that 250gr with accessories. That's also why they didn't put it in C0 but for example the mini 2 SE is there.

BlueLlama Posted at 8-11 15:45
I hope....
Becasue the Mini 2 can weight more that 250gr with accessories. That's also why they didn't put it in C0 but for example the mini 2 SE is there.

I have always read and heard that the Mini 2 was never going to get a C classification anyway because it was already on the market before these classifications were fully specified and it is apparently not possible to give a classification retroactively. The fact that it can weigh more than 250 gram with accessories has probably nothing to do with it.
As I understand it, in 2024 you will still be allowed to fly your Mini 2 in A1 subcategory as long as your drone is lighter than 250 grams. If you add accessories that bring it above that weight, you are no longer allowed in the A1 subcategory. In fact, this is also the rule right now, so as far at the Mini2 is concerned, nothing will change compared to the present situation.

BlueLlama Posted at 8-11 04:14
Hello,
EASA just made a statement for drone classes. Easa Open Category

Hi there. DJI is committed to complying with the new European Drone Regulation for other existing drone models. We will work with notified bodies to obtain additional drone certificates over the coming year. More details will be announced in due course. Thank you for your understanding.

DJI Paladin Posted at 8-13 18:17
Hi there. DJI is committed to complying with the new European Drone Regulation for other existing drone models. We will work with notified bodies to obtain additional drone certificates over the coming year. More details will be announced in due course. Thank you for your understanding.

Hi DJI Paladin, have you any news in order to the mini 2 certificate? It's the 14 th of december and 01.01.2024 is soon.......

Thank you!

giuseppe celona Posted at 12-14 11:09
Hi DJI Paladin, have you any news in order to the mini 2 certificate? It's the 14 th of december and 01.01.2024 is soon.......

Thank you!

Thank you for your response. The DJI Mini 2 does not have C0 certification (no C0 label firmware) therefore, you can continue to use the drone without any modifications as it does not support the certification. Hope this helps. Thank you for your valued support.

Hi. What about that?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5xr091Qzdg

According to his research and an email response from EASA there is a problem for the mini 2 because the exact MTOM (Maximum Take of Mass) is not clearly defined from the manufacture in the manual.  

Angelix Posted at 12-26 10:43
Hi. What about that?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5xr091Qzdg

Texts 945 and 947 are however rather clear.

-In order to obtain a C label, the manufacturer must place the drone on the market with an instruction manual which must includes
the mass of the UA (with a description of the reference configuration) and the maximum authorized take-off mass (MTOM);
2019-945 Annex

-Article 20 mentions drones placed on the market before 01/2024, for which they must not exceed 250g maximum at takeoff for category A1, and 25kg for category A3.

At no time is it mentioned that this must appear somewhere.
What I understand and this is also from the point of view of the CAA, it is the responsibility of the remote pilot to ensure that the take-off mass does not exceed the maximum mass provided for in article 20 :

2019-947 :
UAS.OPEN.060 Remote Pilot Responsibilities
1)Before commencing UAS operation, the remote pilot must:
e) if the UAS is equipped with an additional payload, verify that its mass does not exceed either the maximum take-off mass (MTOM) defined by the manufacturer nor the MTOM limit of its class


So, it's all right.

LV_Forestry, thank you for your link to this topic
You may be right:
https://www.easa.europa.eu/en/do ... lT1kZIni3qHAbWsyYXs

However I hope that the national fly area agencies will keep the same regulations.

domin45670 Posted at 12-26 12:40
LV_Forestry, thank you for your link to this topic
You may be right:
https://www.easa.europa.eu/en/domains/civil-drones-rpas/open-category-civil-drones?fbclid=IwAR3OtZAf9JjKeDt8N85cN8fGPyQnAsLQYDksnlN0lT1kZIni3qHAbWsyYXs

There is another element which supports this thesis, 2019-947 article 9 point b):


2. No minimum age for remote pilots shall be required:
(b)  for privately-built UAS with a maximum take-off mass of less than 250g;



I may be mistaken, but I have not seen any article which requires the hobbyist who builds "privately" to publish a manual or to make any declaration of Maximum Take Off Mass. And yet in this article 9 we are still told about this MTOM.

The mention of the mass of drones without accessories is therefore certainly more than sufficient.


Mavic mini :
Mavic_Mini_User_Manual_v1.2_enI.pdf (djicdn.com)


Mini 2 :
DJI_Mini_2_User_Manual-EN.pdf (djicdn.com)


Mini 3 :
DJI_Mini_3_User_Manual_v1.0_EN.pdf (djicdn.com)

domin45670 Posted at 12-26 12:40
LV_Forestry, thank you for your link to this topic
You may be right:
https://www.easa.europa.eu/en/domains/civil-drones-rpas/open-category-civil-drones?fbclid=IwAR3OtZAf9JjKeDt8N85cN8fGPyQnAsLQYDksnlN0lT1kZIni3qHAbWsyYXs

Yet another element, although I don't really like relying on graphics outside of the official texts, so take it with caution, but this one comes from EASA so why not...

It is mentioned that the law applicable until December 31, 2023, also refers to the MTOM. I have been checked three times this year, twice by the police, once by the CAA, no one has asked me for the MTOM. For takeoff weight yes.

According to this graph, this would mean that almost all of us were already outlaws?

Angelix Posted at 12-26 10:43
Hi. What about that?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5xr091Qzdg

I’m not sure about this interpretation. The sentence you highlighted is applicable only when flying an UAS with an additional payload.
There are many discussions around about this topic and, for my personal safety, I prefer to consider the most restrictive interpretations.
In fact, in case of litigation with the insurance (they always try not to pay in case of accident), the judge will decide  based on the content of the regulation, not the FAQ or any other information available in the net.

FabioV Posted at 12-26 23:35
I’m not sure about this interpretation. The sentence you highlighted is applicable only when flying an UAS with an additional payload.
There are many discussions around about this topic and, for my personal safety, I prefer to consider the most restrictive interpretations.
In fact, in case of litigation with the insurance (they always try not to pay in case of accident), the judge will decide  based on the content of the regulation, not the FAQ or any other information available in the net.

In the case of going to court, you are absolutely right.  Only it is not mentioned only for legacy drones that the MTOM must appear somewhere, unlike the C label.

Regarding insurance, it's good that we talk about it, in all my contracts the maximum mass is indicated.  It allows the insurance company to define the amount of insurable damage.  It is Latvian law which imposes it, not European law.

If you decide to put drones in the trash, don't forget to tell me where you put them

LV_Forestry Posted at 12-26 13:18
Yet another element, although I don't really like relying on graphics outside of the official texts, so take it with caution, but this one comes from EASA so why not...

It is mentioned that the law applicable until December 31, 2023, also refers to the MTOM. I have been checked three times this year, twice by the police, once by the CAA, no one has asked me for the MTOM. For takeoff weight yes.

You are correct to not rely on information other than the official texts. This one says "Applicable until 01 of January 2014" !

Stu.Baby Posted at 12-27 03:51
You are correct to not rely on information other than the official texts. This one says "Applicable until 01 of January 2014" !

They still took care to put the right date in the title

But I recognize that coming from the institution that is supposed to educate us to “reduce the risk” it is scary for the future.