Hi,
I make documentaries about traditions of native peoples.
I would like to know your thoughts on Pocket 3 and HLG vs DLOG-M. If you have used them extensively, which one do you prefer?
When to use HLG or DLOG-M?
Is the dynamic range of HLG much higher than the NORMAL profile or just slightly better in video editing?
Thanks to share for your thoughts
When using Osmo Pocket 3 in Video mode, HLG in the color setting of the PRO menu refers to HDR, as HLG is an HDR standard. The HLG mode supports the same range of frame rates as normal recording, that is, up to a maximum of 4K/60fps. Starting with firmware version v01.02.06.04, users can record slow motion videos at 120fps with support for D-Log M and HLG color modes. Osmo Pocket 3 defaults to capturing HDR photos, and does not have access to HDR mode.
DLog-M allows the camera sensor to record enough dynamic range. You can process color grade easier during post processing. DLog-M is developed based on D-Log, the colors are distributed evenly so the bright and dark parts of the video have greater fidelity and clarity.
Hope this helps.
Should you have any further questions, kindly message us for assistance. Thank you.
I work as a Broadcast TV video editor by profession, but this by no way does it mean that my reply might weight more than any other.
First of all, if shooting HLG, you naturally have to use an HDR monitor.
The problem is that most up to 500 euros HDR monitors don't have enough nits for HDR and are also not true 10-bit, but rather 8+2.
Expensive TVs costing above 1.500 euros are usually true 10-bit.
Then, if you want to edit HDR, you will have to match the color profile and see at the vectorscope, higher video level values where the 1000 is the 100% video level.
As for the actual shooting with the Pocket 3, and that's just an ecxperiment I did, I tried shooting the same scenario during the day with 3 different profiles.
Normal, D-Log and HLG.
I found Normal being too harsh.
D-Log is great if you don't want to export your work as HDR.
Most streamers (Amazon Prime, Apple TV+, Disney+, Netflix) play HDR and they play 10-bit 4:2:0 like the Pocket 3 records.Each supports a different format and only Apple TV+ plays both on HDR 10+ and Dolby Vision, at a bitrate of about 25 Mbps, higher than all the others.
The difference is on TV sets.
Samsung TVs for example play HDR 10+ and LG TVs Dolby Vision, but Pocket 3 does not record in any of these profiles.
Using HLG, compared to D-Log, I saw that highlights were more easy to burn.
That's why I use under the bright Mediterranean sun an ND 128 and leave EV to -0.7.
If you want zebras, you will have to use the MiMo app and your mobile.
To my eyes, HLG looks more vivid and pleasing, but that's just for day shots with no High ISO shooting.
Maybe if you have low light shots, it would be better for consistency to use D-Log.
Just remember that D-Log goes up to ISO 3200, while Normal to ISO 6400.
Yes, you can mix color profiles but I doubt you can bring consistency between a day shot with HLG and a Low Light shot that will have hard contrast.
I mostly use the Pocket 3 for two reasons.
Stock footage to send on agencies, and travel videos on my personal YouTube page.
At my YT channel, I see that 20 % watch content on big TV sets and Google reports that they search for the word HLG.
I would suggest that you do two tests:
First, shoot during the day a scene including highlights and shadows.
Then, at night shoot a scene with people maybe before a fire, using D-Log, Normal and Low Light.
In any case remember to create a proper project that matches the color profiles you recorded with.
Finally, I find that when applying the D-Log to Rec. 709 LUT that DJI gives us for free, I might have to lower the contrast and open the shadows a bit in post production, to create a proper look.
Here's a link to my latest HDR video I uploaded on YT.
If you don't watch it on a compatible HDR TV set or mobile phone, you will not notice any difference.
This video is uploaded as HLG H.265 10-bit at a bitrate of about 45 Mbps. (about 5 % of content is recorded with a Sony camera, but also in HLG-all the rest with the DJI Osmo Pocket 3)
bestravelvideo Posted at 7-16 08:06
I work as a Broadcast TV video editor by profession, but this by no way does it mean that my reply might weight more than any other.
First of all, if shooting HLG, you naturally have to use an HDR monitor.
The problem is that most up to 500 euros HDR monitors don't have enough nits for HDR and are also not true 10-bit, but rather 8+2.
Hi there, we extend our gratitude for the information you have shared with our community of users. Your contribution and generosity in providing valuable insights to our fellow members are highly appreciated. Also, the video looks wonderful and truly appreciate your effort.
Keep us posted. Thank you for your ongoing support!
I got interesting info here. I thank you for it.
I need to ask a question please. I have never used HLG and would like to know this: I use Edius 11 for video editing and I don't know how to configure the color space. Is it necessary? What should I do exactly? Thanks
bestravelvideo Posted at 7-16 08:06
I work as a Broadcast TV video editor by profession, but this by no way does it mean that my reply might weight more than any other.
First of all, if shooting HLG, you naturally have to use an HDR monitor.
The problem is that most up to 500 euros HDR monitors don't have enough nits for HDR and are also not true 10-bit, but rather 8+2.
bestravelvide,
I read your interesting post with interest and I would like to ask you a few questions.
1) I understand that you like HLG more than D-Log M. But if I look at that file that I get with various TVs and some do not have the HLG option, then how well does the video look? Does it look worse than using D-Log M in the editing phase?
2) I read that under the Mediterranean sun you use ND 128 and leave EV at -0.7 with Pocket 3. I often go under the African sun (not in the city, but in remote areas) and every time I have problems with underexposure using the wide angle lens because the sun enters abundantly into the lens.
On my next trip I will use both the Pocket 3 and the Lumix GH6. I will put the filters, but I can't understand how it is possible to put EV at -7.
Could you explain it to me please? What profile would you use for the GH6? Better the V-Log or another profile?
Thanks.
Apologies for the late reply, it seems I missed the post.
If you don't have an HDR monitor, don't try to edit in HDR.
Everything will look washed out.
If you still want to shoot HDR, you can change in your editing program the color profile to Rec.709 and still edit in the right (non HDR) colors.
I use a paid version of Premiere Pro so I can only give such suggestions on that program.
My PC monitor displays worse HDR than my QLED TV does, but the TV is more expensive and can dispaly true 10-bit, while most of PC monitors 8+2 bit, even if they cost 1000 euros!
Why not just use D-LOG then?
No, I don't find it worse, I just want to use HLG for my YT videos.
But there are many technical details about editing and exporting HLG and if you edit it as you do with non-HLG videos, it might also appear with a low contrast.
My main camera is a Sony mirrorless, not a Panasonic, but I also shoot HLG with it.
About exposure, try to add a variable ISO but experiment with the range.
Maybe like ISO 100-400 for both the DJI Osmo Pocket 3 and your mirorless camera.
Then try with ISO 100-200 and see if you are ok.
I use zebras on my Sony that's why I'm begging DJI all this time to add this option on the screen of the Pocket 3!
Currently, you can only see zebras via the MiMo app!
EV both on the Pocket 3 and a mirorless can be set manually, to any value.
On my Sony I don't use this option often, as I shoot with a fixed ISO, and in that case you can't set an EV value.
But when I go to choose a manual ISO range, I put the EV to my mirrorless at -0.3.
On the DJI Osmo Pocket 3 I have it at -0.7, but being a video editor by profession, I can see on the editing software vectorsope if the video level is low and correct it.
I hope I did not confuse you, as it seems I have all these things in my mind, but I might not be able to explain them properly.
Below I include the latest video I shot in HLG and I uploaded to YT.
It's mostly shot with the Pocket 3, but some parts (the still or zoomed ones) are recorded with my Sony mirorless.
HDR uploads (if edited and exported properly) are compatible for both HDR and non-HDR screens. In that video below, EV is set to -0.7 on the Pocket 3 and -0.3 on the Sony.
bestravelvideo Posted at 9-4 02:35
Apologies for the late reply, it seems I missed the post.
If you don't have an HDR monitor, don't try to edit in HDR.
Everything will look washed out.
bestravelvideo,
Thanks for sharing your experiences.
Out of curiosity:
do you leave the White Balance on AUTO?
Almost never, and sometimes I regret it!
Like, when I go inside a place and the shot is impossible to correct.
I have such a bad example at the video I uploaded, where I am inside a shop and the color is wrong! I could not correct it properly!
I usually set the same WB on the Pocket 3 and my mirorless camera.
Here's a tip:
Sometimes, if a want to find the current WB fast, instead of going throught the menu of the Pocket 3, I just open my phone's camera ans see what the current WB number is.
But I usually use 5600 outdoors and 3200 indoors, which I might change closer to 4000 something, if I see fit.
It's usually bad practice to leave WB in AUTO.The color will most probably fluctuate.
I would only do it for a long walking tour with the Pocket 3, and that if the video was only for YT.
I never use WB AUTO for commissioned works or stock videos.
bestravelvideo Posted at 9-4 06:50
It's usually bad practice to leave WB in AUTO.The color will most probably fluctuate.
I would only do it for a long walking tour with the Pocket 3, and that if the video was only for YT.
I never use WB AUTO for commissioned works or stock videos.
bestravelvideo,
Thank you so much for your precious suggestions.
OK with 5600K outdoors, but if do you need to shoot at 5-6pm when the the light is warmer? Do you manually change WB on Pocket 3 or do you fix it in post production?
Thanks again.
PS: Out of curiosity: Have you ever mixed the clips shot with Pocket 3 and those shot with the Sony camera? I saw you do it in your video that you posted on youtube, but would you do it also when you do more important work?
Each day and lighting condition has its own K. So, when in doubt, use Pocket 3 to check the setting.
Choose AWB but don't just hit confirm.
The Pocket will display you the current WB setting.
That's why I suggested it could be faster to find the same WB setting, by using your mobile phone's camera.
Many ask DJI to give us a WB lock when pressing record, which is a feature some mobile phone apps have.
It would be beneficial and fast, even if you don't know the WB setting, or have no time do change.
I have only used the Pocket for single stock video clips so far, regarding non social media work.
For a single clip, there's no problem.
If I want to mix cameras, I choose the same WB settings but it's difficult to match exactly.
Why? The two cameras have different color profiles.
Try and spot a walking video with Pocket 3 and then a still video with Sony.
They can never look the same, despite using the same settings.
Their color science is different, not to mention the depth of field, even with an f1.8 lens, but that does not affect the color anyway.
In the video I uploaded, I used a custom setting for color.
In general, it looks similar, but looking in more detail, there are scenes that the color is not the same.
Even on the same scene, with the same light, it's hard to be the same.
So, since you're probably thinking of matching cameras, that's a matter of color matching clip by clip.
Being a video editor, I have to recognise that this is work for a colorist, not just any video editor.
You can do that in Premiere, but many prefer DaVinci Resolve for that reason.
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