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The BIG Battery problem may affect All of Us..
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DJI-Dave
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Kit Walker Posted at 2015-10-5 03:16
Thanks. It's probably not a big deal for most other users anyway.
Everyone here likes the fact that  ...

That's ok, I understand. I have seen much, much worse.

Thanks!

2015-10-5
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Kit Walker
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QaaUz Posted at 2015-10-5 22:09
The thumbs up is in regard a product that has issues with its composite casing, diverse failures wh ...

I think China's copyright laws might be a bit more relaxed.
Copying can also create competition, and higher standards. (It would be great to have a wristband similar to the Lily drone)
Perhaps it may be true that the majority of faults are dealt with accordingly, and fast. I do not disagree, but this doesn't negate my issue.
I think that DJI has become very popular recently from Lightbridge being built-in.
All some other company would need to do, is reverse engineer Lightbridge and sell it at a MUCH lower price than DJI. (eg. Walkera make solid quads)

If DJI wants to stay on top.., I would recommend focusing strongly on communicating with their customers and sorting out problems to keep the loyalty and gain positive word of mouth feedback.
2015-10-5
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brycerichert
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DJI-Dave Posted at 2015-10-2 21:24
Reverse engineer, do you mean copy and then sell it themselves as their product. I hope not! I hope ...

This touchy feely thread doesn't help any of us who are being screwed over by DJI. We are so sorry you had to read threads for 8 hours. What a first world problem. However, it IS your job so we can't feel bad for you.
2015-10-6
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rodger
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gregg1r Posted at 2015-10-5 15:03
Rodger, if it were a bad cell, you'd see in the app that a cell was down. If everything appears go ...

I realize the App in regard to the Battery. What I am not sure about is if they are just looking at the Voltage and not the capacity. The Voltage can be perfect and yet when you call upon it to move the current it can fall flat on it's face. The Electronic Equipment that I work with daily actually puts the Battery under load once a minute. If the Current is not available the program will flag it.

OK on the Lamp and Warranty. Been there a few times in life.

8 Amps for a Bike Light, Wow! That is a lot of Current and the Battery must be huge!
2015-10-6
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gregg1r
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rodger Posted at 2015-10-6 09:06
I realize the App in regard to the Battery. What I am not sure about is if they are just looking a ...

Rodger,

  As for the size of the battery, it looks like a bike water bottle, just with a large diameter coiled cord coming out of the top.

The Phantom 3 battery is rated for close to 25 amps continuous current draw. The prismatic lithium polymer battery used is 4 cells wired in series to give you 15.2 volts nominal, 17.4 v peak based on charging to 4.35 volts each.

With the more powerful motors, Light Bridge, and GPS used in the P3, the 3 cell arrangement used by the P2 wouldn't cut it.  

The next step up will probably be a 22.2 volt system in a 6S configuration. It's cheaper to increase the voltage verses increasing the battery amperage.
2015-10-6
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DJI-Dave
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brycerichert Posted at 2015-10-6 02:05
This touchy feely thread doesn't help any of us who are being screwed over by DJI. We are so sorry ...

I'll bite my tongue on this one. Other than to say I don't want you to feel bad for me. That was not the intention of my post.


2015-10-6
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JerEl
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DJI-Dave Posted at 2015-10-3 00:24
Reverse engineer, do you mean copy and then sell it themselves as their product. I hope not! I hope ...

The part about how many DJI products are sold is relevant and many people don't understand.  No doubt DJI sells at least double the amount of ALL higher end consumer drones and maybe many more times that number.  It stands to reason that one crash by company X may be equal to the same percentage (or lower) than 100 crashes by DJI drones.  It's all in the ratio of factory defects vs. number of units sold.

So success has its negatives in this regard.  Same with customer service that generates a lot of complaints.   People are more inclined to post the negatives rather than the positives.  But...DJI could and should do more to make their customers happy.  One of the most important things I learned in the retail business is that one unhappy customer will tell 10 other people how they were "screwed" but how many happy customers will express their happiness to others...Maybe to 2 or 3 others.
2015-10-6
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Fulgerite
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DJI-Dave Posted at 2015-10-2 16:05
It is posable that you just got a bad battery with a cold solder joint. Very few people are having t ...

Very few people:

http://forum.dji.com/thread-32940-1-1.html

http://forum.dji.com/thread-32963-1-1.html

http://forum.dji.com/thread-23538-1-1.html

http://forum.dji.com/thread-32646-1-1.html

http://forum.dji.com/thread-32640-1-1.html

http://forum.dji.com/thread-32596-1-1.html

http://forum.dji.com/thread-32450-1-1.html

http://forum.dji.com/thread-32258-1-1.html

http://forum.dji.com/thread-31948-1-1.html

I can go on... and on...  and on...



2015-10-7
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QaaUz
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DJI-Dave Posted at 2015-10-6 02:44
Thanks so much QaaUz.

That's super Dave.
We grow though open expression and 'pulling on the same rope' (..mmm, you know I mean,- in the same direction :-) )
I'm glad I've filled space to the good and appreciate experiencing a growth in understanding and camaradie.
All the best and thanks for your presence.
2015-10-7
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QaaUz
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Fulgerite Posted at 2015-10-7 17:14
Very few people:

http://forum.dji.com/thread-32940-1-1.html

Just checked the first one - A forester - obviously experiencing a care of battery issue, or, some defect - none mentioned.
His charging and care of batteries does not indicate the growing understanding I/we are gaining - true, this vital subject is abysmally ignored by DJI, whilst critical to the whole battery and I 'thing' Oh, battery and UAV, buhrrrd!

I daresay I'd not be alone in recommending a thorough inauguration to battery care - YT, an Aussie has done a good 'how to treat them' - you can try a playlist of mine yt owpeterj - I think it was archived there.

This has nothing to do with defective construction though.

How many other of the posts you indicate are unrelated to a fault in contruct/materiel?

The first one, I find misleading - though a tragic loss - and I too use mine in the forest - same thing.
2015-10-7
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QaaUz
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Fulgerite Posted at 2015-10-7 17:14
Very few people:

http://forum.dji.com/thread-32940-1-1.html

Nr 4 is a battery issue - not the cosntruction fault here.

Enough from me. I'm missing something here from you -

I hope both you me, we all, have good flights and experiences, and clear up discrepancies in a way that is equitous. This issue around batteries is somewhat sensitive - perhaps if known beforehand, some may not engage in this endevour due to is bearing the potential to confront them greater than they can bear. This does appear to be a 'beta' phase though in a slightly different way meant - at the front of a tek, there will be elements which need refining, the next gen will be better, you will feel you paid a lot 'comparitively', and you might be dealing with geeks who don't have the best of rooooteens, groan, and are not the greatest to customer relationships - That's what being on the cutting edge means to a degree - it 'cuts' both ways.

The forum grows through time and the potential to beat many issues before they occur.

I, not time for more, but a thread on battery use, storage etc from DJI, backed by some of those in the field who also give time to video presentations for sharing instructive experiences to better those who take the time to participate.
Phantom preemptive catastophe training instrux: Battery: Soft landing, harsh use and missing props, cracked cases.
There will be faults, but better we don't aggravate them!
Ignorance is not bliss.

BTW: Your post? ...mmmm, anything other than links? Any reason - going somewhere? Still goin' there?
2015-10-7
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DJI-Dave
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QaaUz Posted at 2015-10-7 08:50
That's super Dave.
We grow though open expression and 'pulling on the same rope' (..mmm, you know  ...

Contrast is the mother of clarity. I welcome open debate and discussion. As long as it is civil we can all learn from it and enjoy it.


Dave
2015-10-7
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rodger
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gregg1r Posted at 2015-10-6 10:41
Rodger,

  As for the size of the battery, it looks like a bike water bottle, just with a large di ...

The higher the Voltage the easier it is to move the Current, thus, not losing the amperage in the form of heat. Batteries in series increases the voltage but the amperage stays the same as what one individual cell is capable of. Batteries in parralell the voltage stays the same but the capacity increases.

I don't think I have ever seen a Battery as you describe it Gregg. Although, they come in all shapes and sizes.
2015-10-7
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parkgt
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DJI-Dave Posted at 2015-10-2 18:05
It is posable that you just got a bad battery with a cold solder joint. Very few people are having t ...

How many are acceptable considering the safety risk?
2015-10-7
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Kit Walker
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QaaUz Posted at 2015-10-8 03:20
Nr 4 is a battery issue - not the cosntruction fault here.

Enough from me. I'm missing something  ...

I think his point is fairly straightforward. Lots of people are having problems.
To cherry pick 1 and 4 as examples of there not being a problem, or about how "most" others don't have these problems is odd behaviour, although I do see a need to question everything, so kudos for being diligent.

I don't see why anyone would argue against wanting battery problems sorted out.., regardless of numbers or the actual fault.
Point is.., people are having problems, so a solution should be found, albeit simple education or warning messages.
No one is arguing about dave or tim being bad or good.
Yes. We all know that DJI is awesome and that most drones work perfectly.

But.., to repeat this in context of a thread where we are discussing a problem.., just seems like brown nosing to me.
Totally redundant information, which just adds to the sea of worthless posts we need to wade through to find relevant information to the actual thread topic.
EDIT
I guess I'm just having a rant. It's been a long day.




2015-10-7
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DJI-Dave
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parkgt Posted at 2015-10-7 18:54
How many are acceptable considering the safety risk?

Impossible to quantify. Did you read post Number 44?


2015-10-7
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QaaUz
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Kit Walker Posted at 2015-10-8 05:32
I think his point is fairly straightforward. Lots of people are having problems.
To cherry pick 1 a ...

Like us all, you'll have a lot going on other than forums.
I've learned a lot about our p3p power source here and from an Aussie on YT - When I get to writing, it can get slightly out of hand. Yr point noted (b4 you mentioned :-) )

I can't separate subject from a pm - and that fills space to wade through. Don't know to adress the issue, but will not so often be here as time passes. 2much2do in woods- etc.
Sorry mate - but screw it, at least one meets the meat of people rather than a superficial impression.
Have a fine day.
PS: brown nosin' - wierd sounding but I recognised what you mean as I wrote some things. It is not intended as such, and I can't use more time on formulation. Yé, I could just drop out.
Catch ya!
2015-10-8
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Fulgerite
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QaaUz Posted at 2015-10-7 09:03
Just checked the first one - A forester - obviously experiencing a care of battery issue, or, some ...

Someone is jumping to conclusions...

All I was saying is that DJI-Dave says "very few people" are experiencing issues with batteries.

Yet we hear about sudden power loss mid flight frequently on this forum.  I am not jumping to conclusions (Like you are) about the cause.  I just know it's happening.  Some may be solder joint issues.  Some may be cell issues.  Some may be electronic/software issues.  I don't know from reading sketchy descriptions.  I just see a lot of failures being reported on this forum and it's a concern.
I will also say that a battery described as "Inteligent" by DJI should not require the extraordinary care & precautions of the past LiPo systems that used external cell balancers and chargers.  These DJI batteries have built in cell balancers and charging controllers.  They are also designed to self discharge to safe levels automatically when stored for prolonged periods.  The Phantom 3 "intelligent" battery is described as "maintaining" its self.  These are extraordinarily expensive "intelligent" batteries.  I think we are seeing a lot of reports of failures of various descriptions.

I think statements like "very few people" are experiencing issues is not accurate.  I think there IS a high rate of failure in these batteries and I think it's a concern.
2015-10-9
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QaaUz
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Fulgerite Posted at 2015-10-9 17:43
Someone is jumping to conclusions...

All I was saying is that DJI-Dave says "very few people" are  ...

Tried to assess - no conclusions.
Right - is a concern
Right, intelligent, expensive - issues where not to be expected.
Read support issues - makes one cry - bloke in uk sobbin his '1350' pounds down the drain and so on. There's enough to notice.

I got a UAV not to do this or assess anything other than where I fly.

I do see a cultural interaction showing differing approaches. It is an interesting element appearing out of something that might have been a simple aquisition.

I've discovered - so if more, you can request friendship and the interchanges are as PM which is possibly more appropriate.

Best wishes and for flights without the need for 'support' - I certainly wish to be free from the desructive we hear of, and the consequences.

Do check the support area of the forum - makes your heart bleed and if the 'story (ies)' is/are right can be right peeving - mildly put!
2015-10-9
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Geebax
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QaaUz Posted at 2015-10-10 07:40
Tried to assess - no conclusions.
Right - is a concern
Right, intelligent, expensive - issues wher ...

I hope you do not take offence, but it looks as if you are using a translator to make your posts in English, and if so, it is making you posts very difficult to comprehend. Perhaps try a different one?
2015-10-9
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Fulgerite
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QaaUz Posted at 2015-10-9 13:40
Tried to assess - no conclusions.
Right - is a concern
Right, intelligent, expensive - issues wher ...

So...  I have no ax to grind here.  I am certainly not throwing an anti DJI rant.  I am very impressed and thankful that DJI has produced this product.  It's pretty much what I expected.  I think you and I are in agreement about most of the issues here.

I have a long history of building hobby models.  I have a "fleet" of RC helicopters.  I design and produce RC inspection robots.  I am certainly not one of those "consumers" who expected the Phantom 3 to be a polished idol of perfection like an iPhone.  I understand that DJI has produced a "hobby" grade drone with $20,000 worth of features and sell it for $1,200.  I understand it's not going to be perfect.

I do think it's fair to point out possible manufacturing & design flaws when we see them.  I do think there is a tendency for some employees at DJI (Not saying exactly who...) that tend to brush off legitimate issues as "user error" and dismiss valid complaints.  

Something is going on here.  Too many reports of Phantom 3's dropping out of the sky.  The fact that many of these reports include details like the video was not saved lead me to think power was cut off abruptly.

I have not opened my batteries to inspect the solder work.  Nor have I experienced any issues.  So far my Drone works fine.  Although the horizon needs manual leveling on each flight.

Hey I can't complain.  I am getting a quad with $20,000 worth of features for $1200.   Thanks DJI!
2015-10-9
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dji.blitzk
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May be or may not be related, I don't know....  but while flying today I had a warning pop up... something about excessive current draw from battery, or something like that.  It scared the crap out out me....  I was flying over water, quite a ways out.  I "dropped" the sticks and gently moved the P3P with the wind (wind wasn't that strong anyways) and down.   I got it back and swapped batteries and never had the problem again.

2015-10-9
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DJI-Dave
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Fulgerite Posted at 2015-10-9 17:05
So...  I have no ax to grind here.  I am certainly not throwing an anti DJI rant.  I am very impres ...

I hope not me..
I think not, especially if you read my post #18 in this thread.
I would not want to brush off anything. Just sometimes good perception is needed.
2015-10-9
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QaaUz
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Fulgerite Posted at 2015-10-10 02:05
So...  I have no ax to grind here.  I am certainly not throwing an anti DJI rant.  I am very impres ...

With you all the way.
I probably expected more than you, but apart from deviation time to deliver and wait for battery nr two and the contact interface between the magic zen desk and yours truly, I personally have had no issues.
2015-10-9
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QaaUz
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Geebax Posted at 2015-10-10 01:02
I hope you do not take offence, but it looks as if you are using a translator to make your posts i ...

Yes, twitter habits of compounding words; fleeting touches to stimulate the conceptualisation. Not very precise and without obvious structure.
Apologies. As said, a forum was not quite the intention (in relation to UAV aquisition), though opens perspectives for our joint growth.
When using a translator, I retranslate to check the validity and alter my wording or phraseology (more often) (you see, you've got something there) to achieve a correct impression of the substance.
Hope this is comprehendable - didn't use a translator. Never do for english :-) (perhaps I ought to give it a bash)

Good flight time. PM if relevant.
2015-10-9
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Fulgerite
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DJI-Dave Posted at 2015-10-9 19:34
I hope not me..
I think not, especially if you read my post #18 in this thread.
I would not w ...

Nope.  Not you.  No worries.  
2015-10-10
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DJI-Dave
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Fulgerite Posted at 2015-10-10 10:23
Nope.  Not you.  No worries.

Thanks.....
2015-10-10
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brycerichert
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Fulgerite Posted at 2015-10-9 17:05
So...  I have no ax to grind here.  I am certainly not throwing an anti DJI rant.  I am very impres ...

That's the way I see it... we can't complain about much with it only costing 1-2 grand to purchase.
2015-10-10
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