Received my Osmo+ yesterday. Question about orientation lock. Should the middle of the framed shot stay center while moving Osmo and keeping trigger pushed? Mine sort of does but definitely doesn't keep the frame very close to original center.


Lee

Squeezing the trigger should keep the camera pointed in the same direction when moving the gimbal around.
Can you post a video?

DJI-Ken Posted at 2016-9-22 13:40
Squeezing the trigger should keep the camera pointed in the same direction when moving the gimbal ar ...

DJI-Ken,

As you can see from the video link below when I press the trigger lock and move the Osmo+, the camera doesn't keep pointing at the umbrella. Yes, it remains in the shot, however I would like to know if the trigger lock function should keep the umbrella centered the entire time or is the drift exhibited in the linked example as good as it gets?

https://goo.gl/photos/eN7ZnL69dQX7P2jA8

breezeway95 Posted at 2016-9-22 20:35
DJI-Ken,

As you can see from the video link below when I press the trigger lock and move the Osmo ...

Think of the Osmo keeping the camera pointing towards infinity when you hold the trigger.  Things in the foreground, not being at infinity, will move from side to side, but the vanishing point will stay centered.

breezeway95 Posted at 2016-9-23 08:35
DJI-Ken,

As you can see from the video link below when I press the trigger lock and move the Osmo ...

I haven't tried the Osmo+ yet, but on the Osmo Mobile when you hold the trigger and if it was centered on your umbrella, when moving the Osmo left and right the umbrella would stay centered, even up and down too.
I will see if I can test one tomorrow.
See if there's any kind of trigger setting in your gimbal settings.

james.mcmillan Posted at 2016-9-22 21:14
Think of the Osmo keeping the camera pointing towards infinity when you hold the trigger.  Things  ...

James,

The DJI info makes it sound like the camera will lock on to a subject much closer than infinity and keep it centered. However the behaviour I was seeing was as you described.
I didn't know if I had either the settings wrong or had a defective unit.

thanks for the response.

DJI-Ken Posted at 2016-9-22 23:30
I haven't tried the Osmo+ yet, but on the Osmo Mobile when you hold the trigger and if it was cente ...

DJI-Ken, I don't think this is right.  You're implying some kind of tracking feature which analyzes the image and keeps "something" centered (in this case, an umbrella).  Two problems with that:  1) the object to keep centered is never defined, and 2) DJI has clearly said that only the Osmo Mobile has a tracking feature.

With respect to how the trigger works (on any Osmo model), think back to art classes where they taught drawing in perspective (perhaps I'm showing my age).  These types of drawings have a "vanishing point" at an infinity distance.  When you hold the trigger, the Osmo will treat the center of the frame as this vanishing point and keep it centered.  Anything that's not at infinity in the frame (which, of course, is everything) will change its position relative to the vanishing point as the camera moves.  However, given the wide FOV of the camera, things that are about 10 ft. away are effectively at infinity, so they won't move much.  But, things that are only a few feet away from the camera, will move a fair amount relative to the vanishing point.  This is exactly what's happening in the video of the umbrella.  When the camera is moved side to side, the trees in the background, perhaps 15-20 ft away, effectively do not move, while the umbrella, perhaps only 3 feet away, moves back and forth relative to the vanishing point (which is effectively the trees).  I believe this behavior is absolutely normal.

If "object tracking" is required for the Osmo (or Osmo+ or Osmo Pro, e.g. not the Osmo Mobile), there are 3rd party solutions available (Autoframe or Vertical Studio).  I've got both.  Neither are perfect; one works better on certain types of targets and the other one works better on other types of targets.

I hope this makes sense.

breezeway95 Posted at 2016-9-23 19:59
James,

The DJI info makes it sound like the camera will lock on to a subject much closer than inf ...

No it does not lock onto a subject when holding the trigger down (although the Osmo Mobile does that with active track and will follow the subject chosen), The Osmo Mobile when holding the trigger down just keeps the phone in the same position and when moving your hand left/right up/down and twisting your wrist left/right the phone stays in the same position it was when you first squeezed the trigger.

james.mcmillan Posted at 2016-9-23 20:13
DJI-Ken, I don't think this is right.  You're implying some kind of tracking feature which analyzes ...

My above post explains what I was talking about.Here's a screenshot from the regular Osmo manual.

james.mcmillan Posted at 2016-9-23 20:13
DJI-Ken, I don't think this is right.  You're implying some kind of tracking feature which analyzes ...

Taking this discussion a bit further, think about how the Osmo gimbals work.  They are not getting any feedback from what's being recorded.  The feedback is coming from the Osmo's accelerometers or encoders (I don't know which) to keep the camera pointing in the same direction (at the vanishing point), regardless of the handle's position.  We know this is true because the Osmo works even when it isn't connected to anything and the lens cover is still on.

To truly track an object, it is necessary for the object's position to be defined - in this case, on the imaging device (phone), then create some kind of feedback loop where the image is continuously analyzed to determine where the object is, then the Osmo must be told how to move the gimbals to re-center the object.  For this to be successful, (at least) two things need to happen:  1) the pattern-recognition algorithm must be effective enough to recognize the object as it moves relative to the background, and 2) the "analysis/correction" process must be done fast enough that the object remains within the FOV.  A number of things work against this:  1) by definition, since the Osmo's main function is to smooth out the resulting images, it doesn't move the gimbals very quickly or precisely, 2) the lighting on the object is probably changing as it moves, so that stresses the pattern-recognition algorithm, 3) since the object trying to be tracked is (almost always) three dimensional, it will probably be presenting a different profile as it moves, again stressing the pattern-recognition algorithm, and 4) doing all this in real time requires quite a bit of processing horsepower.

In the Osmo Mobile, all of this process except the actual gimbal recentering movements are accomplished in the device (phone) itself via software.  To accomplish the same thing on the other Osmos, the image itself must first be downloaded from the Osmo to the device (phone), where the same processing steps described above occur.  This image downloading takes time - and is affected by the speed of both the camera and the WiFi connection.  Remember, we're talking about video - at 25+ fps.  And, of course, the speed of the required processing is determined by the speed of the device itself (phone).  The reality is, that the real-time image(s) available for processing (what we see on our devices from the Osmo) may only be running at 10 fps or less and at a reduced resolution.  Further, the pattern-matching algorithm is probably only being performed on a subset of those images, otherwise it would fall way too far behind given the lack of computing power.

It's why object tracking that relies on pattern recognition doesn't work perfectly.  At the very least, it is inconsistent.  And, it explains why the best tracking is accomplished when the object being tracked can always be positively identified by something more robust than a pattern-recognition algorithm running on a low computing power device (phone).  If an object's GPS coordinates can be accurately defined, object tracking is much more robust.  In fact, Autoframe does have the ability to track via GPS coordinates, but it requires the object to be stationary and its GPS coordinates defined, or a moving object (person, car, etc.) must be carrying a GPS-enabled device (phone).  However, since GPS generally doesn't work very accurately inside, it means pattern recognition is often the only option.

In my view, the weak point of doing tracking via pattern recognition is the fact that the algorithm can't be particularly sophisticated because there just isn't the necessary processing horsepower in our devices (phones) to make this work (well).  The requirement to move the image from the camera to the device (phone) via WiFi (and probably at a lower resolution), only adds to the problem with the non-Osmo Mobile models.

DJI-Ken Posted at 2016-9-23 05:57
No it does not lock onto a subject when holding the trigger down (although the Osmo Mobile does that with active track and will follow the subject chosen), The Osmo Mobile when holding the trigger down just keeps the phone in the same position and when moving your hand left/right up/down and twisting your wrist left/right the phone stays in the same position it was when you first squeezed the trigger.

I received mine yesterday and have tried a plethora of things, It does not Lock for me, only in sport mode. Tried 3 diff phones. All phones are balanced. I need this feature to work as this is likely the only one I will use  Have latest firmware the unit is new.  The unit swivels all over when locked makes no difference. Any suggestions?