DroneAlps Posted at 2016-11-1 03:16
Exactly my point mr.fly!

DJI are you listening?

My question is, why did you ignore the warning and still think that is not relevant to this discussion?

labroides@yahoo Posted at 2016-10-31 22:38
My question is, why did you ignore the warning and still think that is not relevant to this discus ...

My question is; why is this message displayed in the first place, when it contradicts the advertised operating temperatures of the aircraft. Either the message is wrong, or the advertising is wrong. Both cannot be right. DJI need to answer this.

in your position i would trust my app message and not fly..then after i would consult the issue..u flew regardless of the warning and payed consequences...the app was talking to u and u choose to ignore it...so dont answer a question with a question..U have yourself to blame..if u wopuld stop and not fly u will have your bird and could address the issue...dude, u screwd badly on this one

If you got a warning about this why did you ignore it??? Regardless of specs regardless of whatever else is said, if your RC gave you a warning, why did you continue to fly ignoring the warning??? I'm sorry to say,,, and this is just my opinion  here and I'm not trying to start an argument, but you for all intents and purposes had a warning, and ignored it and as a result lost your drone,,, I'm sorry for your loss but you could have heeded the warning I'm certain that i would have because of the money I have invested in my drone I for sure would have heeded it then called DJI about it but now since you admittedly ignored the warning you have no recourse regardless of specs ...

Chazzm Posted at 2016-11-2 15:21
If you got a warning about this why did you ignore it??? Regardless of specs regardless of whatever  ...

This will not work with this poster. He simply wants DJI to adfmit that they are guilty of false advertising, and the chances of them doing that are as likely as a snowball's chances in hell.

Geebax Posted at 2016-11-2 06:01
This will not work with this poster. He simply wants DJI to adfmit that they are guilty of false a ...

I want to get to the bottom of this issue, since it's very important as we head into the winter. Here is the latest response (or lack of...) from DJI (9th Nov):

Unfortunately, we did not receive the requested information.  We will send the request again.

Thank you for choosing DJI.
Best regards,

DJI Support EU

Geebax Posted at 2016-11-1 23:01
This will not work with this poster. He simply wants DJI to adfmit that they are guilty of false a ...

Maybe one good thing could come out of it.  Maybe one person will read this and think I better pay attention to the pop up warnings so I don't do something wrong, then go start a topic that makes me look/feel foolish.

DroneAlps Posted at 2016-10-10 14:46
Ken, thanks for chipping in. The flight logs have been analyzed by DJI and show that the temperatu ...

You had a failure but it does not equate to "false advertising". If such failures were commonplace within the advertised specs then it would be false advertising.

Unexpected failures can occur under any circumstances. However, if DJI is blaming it on a cold battery that was within operating specs then they cannot use pilot error as an excuse for not covering it under warranty. You mentioned that you bought it last year. Is it still under warranty?

RSW Posted at 2016-11-9 18:48
You had a failure but it does not equate to "false advertising". If such failures were commonplace  ...

True, perhaps not 'false' advertising, but definitely misleading. Was still under warranty.

Update:

Support4.NL (DJI)
Nov 23, 21:33 HKT

Dear Customer,

Thank you for contacting DJI Support.

We are sorry to tell you, but we are still looking for the right answer.

Geebax Posted at 2016-11-2 13:01
This will not work with this poster. He simply wants DJI to adfmit that they are guilty of false advertising, and the chances of them doing that are as likely as a snowball's chances in hell.

I know your speaking about the person who made this posting correct!!???

DJI-Ken Posted at 2016-10-14 04:27
Ok, I remember your case no, it was already explaied to you in another thread.
I'm sorry but the final decision was made. The app gave you the warning not to take off and warm up the battery. Failure to do that is why they denied your case.
I'm am sorry about that and there is nothing I can do.

Hi Ken, despite what you and the warning in the APP say a battery temperature of +6 ° C is well within the battery operating limits which are given on the DJI website as  -10° to 40° C.

The question in my mind is if the battery operating temperature limits of -10° to 40° C, as stated on the DJI website, are correct then why did the APP give the low temperature warning? - the actual battery temperature of +6 ° C is well within the specified battery operating temperature limits?

If the DJI GO App was operating correctly and the low battery temperature warning was correctly given at a temperature of +6 ° C (well within the DJI advertised battery operating temperature range of -10° to 40° C) then it seems to me that the battery operating temperature range (-10° to 40° C) specified on the DJI website is incorrect. One should not expect to receive a low battery temperature warning when the battery is at a temperature of +6 ° C which is well within the advertised battery operating temperature range (-10° to 40° C).

On the basis of this is seems to me that DJI appear to be at fault and should correct the battery temperature range that they give on their website (-10° to 40° C) to a range that correctly reflects the temperature range that the battery can operate at and which seems to be programmed into the DJI GO App. I further believe that in this case DJI should have replaced the lost unit under warranty due to what appears to be incorrect specifications provided by DJI on their website in regard to the battery operating temperature range.

In my opinion DJI has a very bad reputation in regards to customer service and reliability, which must affect sales, and this case further reinforces this belief.

DroneAlps Posted at 2016-11-2 03:43
My question is; why is this message displayed in the first place, when it contradicts the advertised operating temperatures of the aircraft. Either the message is wrong, or the advertising is wrong. Both cannot be right. DJI need to answer this.

Hi, I am from Australia and in my country you can complain to the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission in regard to companies making, what you believe to be, false advertising or deceptive advertising which is the use of false or misleading statements in advertising, and misrepresentation of the product at hand, which may negatively affect many stakeholders, especially consumers.

Have you tried referring your complaint to the Government consumer body in your country or the EU, depending on where you are for investigation?

In my opinion, in this case it seems to me that you are correct in that the temperature operating range specified on the DJI website is not consistent with the actually battery temperature operating range used by the DJI GO App and this is confirmed due to the fact that DJI denied your warranty claim due to operating the battery at too low a temperature despite the temperature being well within the DJI battery temperature operating range specified on their website.

fans82a39c9b Posted at 2016-12-14 20:55
Hi Ken, despite what you and the warning in the APP say a battery temperature of +6 ° C is well within the battery operating limits which are given on the DJI website as  -10° to 40° C.

The question in my mind is if the battery operating temperature limits of -10° to 40° C, as stated on the DJI website, are correct then why did the APP give the low temperature warning? - the actual battery temperature of +6 ° C is well within the specified battery operating temperature limits?

I am sorry you feel that way, DJI is constantly working to improve its products and customer service.
You case has already had a final decision and I'm sorry if you were not satisfied with the outcome.

DroneAlps Posted at 2016-11-2 00:43
My question is; why is this message displayed in the first place, when it contradicts the advertised operating temperatures of the aircraft. Either the message is wrong, or the advertising is wrong. Both cannot be right. DJI need to answer this.

You know why the message displayed in the first place, the warning told you.  I don't understand why you specifically ignored the warning knowing it could lead to your drone falling out of the sky.  If it wasn't but for your decision to ignore the warning, this never would have happened.  It is ridiculous to ignore a warning and say you did it because of advertising.  

fans82a39c9b Posted at 2016-12-14 23:55
Hi Ken, despite what you and the warning in the APP say a battery temperature of +6 ° C is well within the battery operating limits which are given on the DJI website as  -10° to 40° C.

The question in my mind is if the battery operating temperature limits of -10° to 40° C, as stated on the DJI website, are correct then why did the APP give the low temperature warning? - the actual battery temperature of +6 ° C is well within the specified battery operating temperature limits?

You can go on about that as long as you like, but there is a simple fact you are ignoring; there was no evidence of what caused the loss of the aircraft, as he was not able to produce the aircraft flight logs. The loss may not have had anything to do with the temperature of the battery, so all this boring waffle about temperature is incidental to the issue.

fans82a39c9b Posted at 2016-12-14 07:55
Hi Ken, despite what you and the warning in the APP say a battery temperature of +6 ° C is well within the battery operating limits which are given on the DJI website as  -10° to 40° C.

The question in my mind is if the battery operating temperature limits of -10° to 40° C, as stated on the DJI website, are correct then why did the APP give the low temperature warning? - the actual battery temperature of +6 ° C is well within the specified battery operating temperature limits?

You know what they say, "don't let the door hit you in the a.. on the way out."

WilliamM Posted at 2016-12-15 11:46
You know what they say, "don't let the door hit you in the a.. on the way out."

Having just waded my way through dozens of posts on the thread, I might just as well add my comments.

Firstly, I do believe DJI is on shaky ground with the published specifications when their own APP warns us NOT TO FLY while the battery temperature is measured to be still be within their own specifications !
In my country (Australia) this could certainly be challenged in court by our consumer protection watchdog and damages /compensation claimed if a user lost his aircraft without any APP warning while flying within the aircraft specifications.

HOWEVER...this is an entirely separate issue where the poster chose to deliberately ignore a warning from the APP and continue to fly thereby foregoing ALL rights to compensation!

Just my considered opinion.

Regards

Spacetrakker Posted at 2016-12-15 13:56
Having just waded my way through dozens of posts on the thread, I might just as well add my comments.

Firstly, I do believe DJI is on shaky ground with the published specifications when their own APP warns us NOT TO FLY while the battery temperature is measured to be still be within their own specifications !

And the ACCC would take action against ???

billwish76 Posted at 2016-10-10 09:25
The cooler the air the denser the air making it easier to climb

That mostly applies to aircrafts that are powered by engines because the colder/denser air allows the engines to use more air/fuel. At higher altitudes with the Phantom it may be more difficult to fly because the higher you are the less dense the air is. Not sure what the impact of both scenarios could have on a Phantom though. Maybe they cancel each other out.

Cetaman Posted at 2016-10-11 04:39
Aloha DroneAlps,

     Yes, the P3P can fly at high altitudes and cold conditions.  You claimed in this thread that most of your flying is in these extreme altitudes.  But, if you are going to fly in those conditions, you are required to know how to fly in those conditions.  The bird can fly, but can you fly the bird?  The warranty does not cover your flying skills and knowledge.  At some point, you have to take responsibility for flying your P3P.

Spot-on response here. I think there are just too many variables in this situation... Very high altitude flight, possibly low temperatures, mountains? I can only imagine the variation in wind conditions / air pressure, etc.

On a side note - Sorry to hear about your crash. Seems to be part of the hobby unfortunately. To paraphrase Frederick Hagan - " We fly these things that don't glide. Unfortunately, if something goes wrong they drop right out the sky. " If you do it long enough, it's bound to happen eventually.



If you love it, don't let the crash crush your dreams.

DJI-Ken Posted at 2016-12-14 22:16
I am sorry you feel that way, DJI is constantly working to improve its products and customer service.
You case has already had a final decision and I'm sorry if you were not satisfied with the outcome.

Ken, thanks for replying but it was not my case. I am just another P3P and OSMO owner on this forum.

But I am seriously concerned re the quality of DJI products and the customer service DJI provides. I currently have an OSMO handle sent away 5 weeks ago to DJI under warranty and am still waiting to receive it back. With my P3P, since the latest firmware update I have had disconnect problems (hopefully resolved) and low voltage warnings which initiate autolandings (yet to be resolved). These are fairly expensive consumer products for the general public and, in my opinion, if they were quality products then people should not be having all the problems they are reporting experiencing on DJI and other forums.

You did not answer the very important question I posed to you which was "If the battery operating temperature limits of -10° to 40° C, as stated on the DJI website, are correct then why did the APP give the low temperature warning? - the actual battery temperature of +6 ° C is well within the specified battery operating temperature limits?" Are you able to answer this question please?

Furthermore, on the DJI forum concerning the latest firmware update people are now stating that with this firmware update Phantoms will not start unless the temperature is at least 15 degrees. Is this acknowledging that the operating temperature ranges given in the specifications on the DJI website are incorrect?

If, after applying the latest firmware update a drone will not start at a temperature of at least 15 degrees then perhaps DJI need to seriously consider changing the operating temperature ranges given in the specifications on the DJI website.

Geebax Posted at 2016-12-15 04:52
You can go on about that as long as you like, but there is a simple fact you are ignoring; there was no evidence of what caused the loss of the aircraft, as he was not able to produce the aircraft flight logs. The loss may not have had anything to do with the temperature of the battery, so all this boring waffle about temperature is incidental to the issue.

My understanding from reading all the posts in this thread is that the warranty claim was denied due to the low operating temperature (despite this being within the specified temperature operating range given on the DJI website).

WilliamM Posted at 2016-12-15 08:46
You know what they say, "don't let the door hit you in the a.. on the way out."

Sorry I don't understand your post. After reading all the facts given on this thread I asked a simple question to which I have not yet received an answer. It was not my drone that was lost but I do have a P3P which I sometimes fly in low temperature high altitude situations so I would like to know the answer to my question so that I am aware of what my drone can and can't do..

Geebax Posted at 2016-12-15 10:58
And the ACCC would take action against ???

Presumably DJI or their agents in Australia. Remember they have the power to impose penalties or ban the import of products to Australia.

fans82a39c9b Posted at 2016-12-15 15:57
Presumably DJI or their agents in Australia. Remember they have the power to impose penalties or ban the import of products to Australia.

Ah, there is the problem, DJI do not have a corporate presence in Australia, and they have a service agent only, who takes no part in the sales. And DJI, being a Chinese company, are not bound to Australian law. So the ACCC would not be able to take any action against them. Oh, and the ACCC cannot ban the import of anything, that is strictly a customs area.

Sorry to be another to bump this old thread, but I live in Colorado and will be doing flying in what can be fairly cold air, can the P3 operate in the listed temps or not?

I understand OP ignored a warning and flew anyway - but If I take off and gain altitude in this already thin air, the temp will most likely drop considerably, even in non Winter months. So is it a risk to fly it well within the stated range on the site? Will it give me a warning mid-flight or only pre-flight?

This seems to me like buying a tire that says it will be fine to go 0 - 100 MPH on, then having it pop when going 55 MPH, and then blaming the driver for going well under the max listed limit. Anyone here live in colder climates that can assuage my fears?

04red6 Posted at 2016-10-11 10:39
I can not understand a word of this... Can we try some punctuation and proper sentence forming?

thank you grammar police,  sorry we all dont have 200 iqs like you

fans82a39c9b Posted at 2016-12-14 23:51
Sorry I don't understand your post. After reading all the facts given on this thread I asked a simple question to which I have not yet received an answer. It was not my drone that was lost but I do have a P3P which I sometimes fly in low temperature high altitude situations so I would like to know the answer to my question so that I am aware of what my drone can and can't do..

Well you tone and speech pattern sounds the very same as the OP. It's an old thread that needs to die. Most of us who have been on this forum for awhile have already posted here and have told the OP that his story doesn't hold water. Even Jen from DJI though you were the OP because you sound the very same, going on and on. So I'll give you the PC version of my post. Please don't go away mad, just go away.

Geebax Posted at 2016-12-15 12:07
Ah, there is the problem, DJI do not have a corporate presence in Australia, and they have a service agent only, who takes no part in the sales. And DJI, being a Chinese company, are not bound to Australian law. So the ACCC would not be able to take any action against them. Oh, and the ACCC cannot ban the import of anything, that is strictly a customs area.

I just checked the internet and DJI do have an authorized Australian distributor who could possibly be taken to task by the ACCC if it was found that specifications or advertising were not correct. It may well be that DJI do have a presence in the country where the original poster for this thread lives and they may have a regulatory regime who could take some action against DJI if the specifications or advertising are not correct.

OK seriously, this morning in MN it is -15 Fahrenheit (-26 Celsius)

I launched and flew around for 20 minutes at 120 meters (393 feet) till my fingers were too cold to hold the controller.....

Had no issues what so ever with the motors, battery, or anything else.

The bird did better then me, I'm frozen! {:4_142:}

WilliamM Posted at 2016-12-15 12:53
Well you tone and speech pattern sounds the very same as the OP. It's an old thread that needs to die. Most of us who have been on this forum for awhile have already posted here and have told the OP that his story doesn't hold water. Even Jen from DJI though you were the OP because you sound the very same, going on and on. So I'll give you the PC version of my post. Please don't go away mad, just go away.

Firstly, I don't believe you have the right to tell anyone to go away on this forum and hopefully the moderators will give consideration to banning you from the forum. People should be entitled to ask legitimate questions.

In regard to this thread, I came to it after searching the forum because I had a couple of instances where my drone initiated immediate landings due to low battery voltage in high altitude (10,000 ft ground level) and cold conditions.

Fortunately the drone was not lost on the first occasion this occurred and on the other occasions I had the problem I made sure that the drone was at all times over a safe area where an immediate landing could be effected. Similar occurrences happened with two different batteries on the same day within an hour of each other.

I have been involved in aviation for over 30 years and hold an Airline Transport Pilot Licence and worked for a period of time as an Aircraft Accident Investigator so I am very careful to try and know all the facts about my equipment.

Prior to flying my drone I checked the temperature range specifications for the drone and the battery on the DJI website and was satisfied that the conditions were within limits. Despite doing this and not receiving any warning except on one start up where I got a message that the drone was warming up I suddenly got a battery warning and the drone landed immediately and I didn't have any control over where it landed.

This is the reason that I am seeking answers to the temperature operating limits to try and work out exactly why I had my problem.

DroneAlps Posted at 2016-11-23 13:55
True, perhaps not 'false' advertising, but definitely misleading. Was still under warranty.

I agree, it is not false advertising but it is defiantly misleading. I have got the cold battery warning before so I put the battery under my coat to warm it with my body heat. When the error came on screen it should have told you that their was a possibility that the drone would fall from the sky. When I got the battery warning I tried to ignore it but it would not let so they might have made that change because of you.

fans82a39c9b Posted at 2016-12-15 13:34
Firstly, I don't believe you have the right to tell anyone to go away on this forum and hopefully the moderators will give consideration to banning you from the forum. People should be entitled to ask legitimate questions.

In regard to this thread, I came to it after searching the forum because I had a couple of instances where my drone initiated immediate landings due to low battery voltage in high altitude (10,000 ft ground level) and cold conditions.

I think not, I stick up for DJI in most cases because they have great products and great customer service. And it's threads like this one and people like the OP and yourself trying to put them down unfairly. The OP would never just admit he screwed up and lost his drone because of his decision to ignore a warning message not to fly at that moment, but instead post three different threads trying to put blame on DJI in one way or another. So I'm not saying for you to leave the forum, just this thread that is nothing more someone's soapbox to trash DJI. And I still think you sound like the OP using a VPN or the Tor Browser to mask your ID and location.

WilliamM Posted at 2016-12-16 01:59
I think not, I stick up for DJI in most cases because they have great products and great customer service. And it's threads like this one and people like the OP and yourself trying to put them down unfairly. The OP would never just admit he screwed up and lost his drone because of his decision to ignore a warning message not to fly at that moment, but instead post three different threads trying to put blame on DJI in one way or another. So I'm not saying for you to leave the forum, just this thread that is nothing more someone soapbox to trash DJI. And I still think you sound like the OP using a VPN or the Tor Browser to mask your ID and location.

I can assure you I am not the OP - I am from Australia but mainly live in Bangkok where I am at the moment and I had my battery incident in China last week.

I am happy to leave the thread once DJI answers the legitimate question that I have posed regarding the operation of my P3P in regard to their published temperature operating specifications. The question should not be difficult to answer - so why aren't DJI providing an answer to what should be a simple question? Is it that there is something that DJI does not want to admit?

fans82a39c9b Posted at 2016-12-16 03:08
I can assure you I am not the OP - I am from Australia but mainly live in Bangkok where I am at the moment and I had my battery incident in China last week.

I am happy to leave the thread once DJI answers the legitimate question that I have posed regarding the operation of my P3P in regard to their published temperature operating specifications. The question should not be difficult to answer - so why aren't DJI providing an answer to what should be a simple question? Is it that there is something that DJI does not want to admit?

Moderators work on this forum.  Nobody who made the decision to list those batteries at those temperatures work here.  You will never get the answer you are looking for.

fans82a39c9b Posted at 2016-12-16 06:08
I can assure you I am not the OP - I am from Australia but mainly live in Bangkok where I am at the moment and I had my battery incident in China last week.

I am happy to leave the thread once DJI answers the legitimate question that I have posed regarding the operation of my P3P in regard to their published temperature operating specifications. The question should not be difficult to answer - so why aren't DJI providing an answer to what should be a simple question? Is it that there is something that DJI does not want to admit?

You don't get anywhere demanding answers from DJI, they simply do not respond, never have. This is a user forum primarily, and some DJI people do appear here quite regularly, but they seem to have a policy of not engaging in these sorts of discussions. So expect all you like, you won't get an answer.

BTW, the OP refused to post his flight logs, so no-one here has seen them to show what actually happened on that flight. On that basis, and as the aircraft was lost, there was no conclusive evidence presented that the battery actually failed, so draw your own conclusions on that.

fans82a39c9b Posted at 2016-12-15 04:45
Ken, thanks for replying but it was not my case. I am just another P3P and OSMO owner on this forum.

But I am seriously concerned re the quality of DJI products and the customer service DJI provides. I currently have an OSMO handle sent away 5 weeks ago to DJI under warranty and am still waiting to receive it back. With my P3P, since the latest firmware update I have had disconnect problems (hopefully resolved) and low voltage warnings which initiate autolandings (yet to be resolved). These are fairly expensive consumer products for the general public and, in my opinion, if they were quality products then people should not be having all the problems they are reporting experiencing on DJI and other forums.

Interesting to see this latest firmware update prevents aircraft from working in <15 degree temperatures..... and yet they still advertise the false info on their website!

Geebax Posted at 2016-12-14 21:52
You can go on about that as long as you like, but there is a simple fact you are ignoring; there was no evidence of what caused the loss of the aircraft, as he was not able to produce the aircraft flight logs. The loss may not have had anything to do with the temperature of the battery, so all this boring waffle about temperature is incidental to the issue.

DJI have already said the loss was due to cold battery failure (after reviewing the flight logs). What more evidence do you need?

Geebax Posted at 2016-12-15 22:58
You don't get anywhere demanding answers from DJI, they simply do not respond, never have. This is a user forum primarily, and some DJI people do appear here quite regularly, but they seem to have a policy of not engaging in these sorts of discussions. So expect all you like, you won't get an answer.

BTW, the OP refused to post his flight logs, so no-one here has seen them to show what actually happened on that flight. On that basis, and as the aircraft was lost, there was no conclusive evidence presented that the battery actually failed, so draw your own conclusions on that.

Wrong. The flight logs were sent to DJI - you can see for yourself here:
http://forum.dji.com/forum.php?m ... 2&fromuid=25228