Mikey.C Posted at 2017-2-8 22:12
For what it is worth i do agree slightly with frank on pre flight checks etc but you surely have to question a manufacture esp paying 6k a drone that ''Updates mid flight'' REALLY......????????

Yes certainly it's not something that should happen at all.
However - people who have been flying DJI for a while know all to well that there is always something like this to be aware of and to take steps to manage.

Early FW on the inspire 1 had the dreaded 'Toilet Bowl Effect', where the A/C would start to spiral out of control for the first few minutes of flight.

The S900 and i think the S1000 also had the 'Flip of death' where it would suddenly turn turtle and crash.

About a year ago we were seeing Inspire batteries 'brick' themselves due to poor quality firmware leading the self-discharge function to over-discharge or worse, to mis-report charge level while in flight. Many people saw their craft go from 65% or so down to 5-6% charge in seconds!

Firmware V1.3 saw the inspire lose the ability to hold a straight course in GPS mode, as well as lose altitude in a turn. Many people crashed with that one!

The point here is that there is ALWAYS something wrong, always a bug or issue that pilots need to be aware of. The manual will always be incomplete and will never detail what you need to know.

So a conservative approach, with standard procedures and as much testing as possible both on the bench and in a safe flight location is essential.

I'm two years in and haven't had a crash yet - but fully expect that something will occur that will make my luck change for the worse - until then I keep trying to cover as much as I can to ensure that I'm as safe as I can be.   

Farnk666 Posted at 2017-2-9 00:05
Yes certainly it's not something that should happen at all.
However - people who have been flying DJI for a while know all to well that there is always something like this to be aware of and to take steps to manage.

My point here is they focus this on the "professional" film maker !! I don't see how their reputation will survive long if the industry see the lack on concern, technical support and quality control required to deliver the product.  To compare manufacturers I recently purchased a Nikon DLSR and after 2 weeks got some very strange photos which i couldn't find what was causing it . I contact them and received a phone call back from a technical support guy that quickly identified the problem and a replacement camera arrived 48 hours later. Compare this with DJI that the only way i can get a response is to speak mandarin and use the Chinese WeChat line.  

Dr Jon Posted at 2017-2-9 00:56
My point here is they focus this on the "professional" film maker !! I don't see how their reputation will survive long if the industry see the lack on concern, technical support and quality control required to deliver the product.  To compare manufacturers I recently purchased a Nikon DLSR and after 2 weeks got some very strange photos which i couldn't find what was causing it . I contact them and received a phone call back from a technical support guy that quickly identified the problem and a replacement camera arrived 48 hours later. Compare this with DJI that the only way i can get a response is to speak mandarin and use the Chinese WeChat line.

Yes, and they marketed the Inspire 1 as 'Professional' grade too.
Clearly it wasn't and clearly the I2 has issues that rule it out as well just now.
Give it 6 months and things will settle down.

A truly 'professional' UAV, (not that the term really means anything beyond each individual's perceptions and beliefs) that has sufficient QA, support and engineering is a much more expensive proposition. At least 5-10x the cost of the Inspire.

We use large quad, hex and octo UAVs at work for mapping and inspections that are well into 6 figures by the time sensors and gimbals are added. The engineering is exquisite and tech is solid, with direct support 24 hours a day in english with just a phone call. These are used by cinematographers as well, but our uses are little more industrial...

As a comparison - the rotors are hand made hollow Carbon fibre - perfectly balanced by hand along each blade and cost $1200 each.   

The inspire has it's place, but it is no-where near the quality and value that the marketing would have you believe.

Farnk666 Posted at 2017-2-9 01:16
Yes, and they marketed the Inspire 1 as 'Professional' grade too.
Clearly it wasn't and clearly the I2 has issues that rule it out as well just now.
Give it 6 months and things will settle down.

I bought 6 off I2 based on a contract to use 4G rather than the normal radio based on the existing I2 products. My team has developed code for a 4G/5G support for a plugin dongle in both R/C and I2 and we gave our first demo to the customer a few days ago and he loved it.

Why not a big craft like you mentioned is all about portability. The I2 fits in a custom back pack we have made and i have done some serious climbing with it on my back so far. Now all i need to do is lock out any DJI upgrades unless released from me and maybe i will have some sleep at night.  

Dr Jon Posted at 2017-2-9 01:53
I bought 6 off I2 based on a contract to use 4G rather than the normal radio based on the existing I2 products. My team has developed code for a 4G/5G support for a plugin dongle in both R/C and I2 and we gave our first demo to the customer a few days ago and he loved it.

Why not a big craft like you mentioned is all about portability. The I2 fits in a custom back pack we have made and i have done some serious climbing with it on my back so far. Now all i need to do is lock out any DJI upgrades unless released from me and maybe i will have some sleep at night.

You're a braver man than me Doc!
I was an early purchaser of the I1, and the many issues we had in the first few months were very frustrating. DJI were still sorting out their support model and spare parts / repairs were almost impossible to get done.

We still get problems, but they are manageable with some attention to procedures and conservative flying. It's still a solid ship.

Will be interesting to see how the 4G control evolves on the I2. Interesting to hear that your team is on the cutting edge with this development.

Farnk666 Posted at 2017-2-9 02:50
You're a braver man than me Doc!
I was an early purchaser of the I1, and the many issues we had in the first few months were very frustrating. DJI were still sorting out their support model and spare parts / repairs were almost impossible to get done.

As a taster. we did a 9 mile flight on 4G and passed through 3 handovers between base stations. fixed site R/C which controlled the flight was 30 miles away. We have also found a way around the NFV so can fly in approved military spaces which was a base specification requirement.  At take off and land a "local R/C" sends its location as RTH. So one pilot launches and another flies the mission then returns control to local R/C. Average delay was 120 ms (worst 500ms) bandwidth was 150 Mbs symmetrical. Video quality was considered as very good compared to the normal radio downloads. For security we have a parachute attached to the I2 and a GPS tracker which auto activates on take off and good for 48 hours.   

JBSonic Posted at 2017-2-8 09:26
No, it goes without saying that checking battery firmware version is part of the PRE FLIGHT CHECKLIST.
How do I know that? I did a RPQ-S course to properly learn how to work with such tools.

I2 is professional? really??

Maybe DJI should remove the (AUTO FUNCTION) to keep you happy?

Last time I checked there was no consumer drone capable of shooting RAW video at 4.7GB/s.
Since I work in production I can tell you that this is ONLY found on professional hardware.

It might not be 'as professional' as some much larger commercial aircraft, but it terms of deliverables, it is certainly out there.
You would have to lift Red Epics or Arri Alexas into the air to achieve a noticeable improvement in image quality, ANY other DSLR or film camera will have inferior deliverables to this, and those hexacopters carrying DSLRs are certainly considered professional.

And yes, I don't like shooting in auto modes, auto exposures/auto white balancing do ruin shots if you want to achieve a certain look.

I 2 Fly Posted at 2017-2-5 03:57
Can I assume it then is safest to switch 3G / WiFi off (Airplane mode) when you fly?  This should prevent internet / update connection?

I agree, to prevent such accident, I recommend that every time you fly should activate airplane mode for safety

I 2 Fly Posted at 2017-2-5 03:57
Can I assume it then is safest to switch 3G / WiFi off (Airplane mode) when you fly?  This should prevent internet / update connection?

The I2 can do a firmware update even if it is not connected to the Internet in that it stores the firmware update so if you then purchase some new batteries it can update the firmware when it detects that batteries with old firmware have been inserted. It does ask for confirmation before doing the update.

JBSonic Posted at 2017-2-9 06:06
Last time I checked there was no consumer drone capable of shooting RAW video at 4.7GB/s.
Since I work in production I can tell you that this is ONLY found on professional hardware.

Need to separate the payload from the aircraft when considering issues of flight capability, operational safety and performance. There's no point in having an excellent sensor and lens combo if you can't consistently get into position for the shot.

The cost of the rig is minimal in comparison to the overall production cost.

But I certainly agree that they have done a good job in packaging a lot of video capability into a small and inexpensive platform.

Farnk666 Posted at 2017-2-9 02:50
You're a braver man than me Doc!
I was an early purchaser of the I1, and the many issues we had in the first few months were very frustrating. DJI were still sorting out their support model and spare parts / repairs were almost impossible to get done.

Yup Frank,
You are exactly right.  The I1 had so many issues.  Just google battery issues on the Inspire 1.  I can't tell you how many 50% charge to 5% air discharges they were even after firmware updates. I still have them when using TB47 for some reason.   I personally had around 3 in air discharges when drone first came out.   Of course,  I will end up buying the I2 as soon as I see fewer issues because it's capabilities will be awesome once all issues fixed.   DJI makes wonderful products eventually.   It is very funny to me that KARMA by go pro recalled all drones and DJI 0, yet many more problems.   DJI makes my favorite drones.  I'm just afraid that if I buy right away that I will get so many headaches.  I did get the Phantom 4pro+  and have virtually NO video transmission shooting 4k.  So sorry about your I2 falling from the sky, hopefully you will not have to pay for repairs.  As someone with a background in engineering I can tell you first hand we a stubborn people.  Imagine a bunch of engineers who are very overworked trying to fix all of the issues on every drone because the head engineers are pushing out drones that are not 100 percent completed.  I wish DJI would realize that they are so far ahead of other drone companies that they have plenty of time to perfect their drones.  Imagine what would happen if they tested out every single facet of the drone before the release.  Instead,  they can't hire enough employees to even return emails within week or two (that is my experience might be different for others).   Sorry for the tangent, good luck with your drone and please let the forum know your progress.  I am waiting for the "Beta" period to end so I can buy!!!{:4_142:}

Dr Jon Posted at 2017-2-8 21:27
Please take a look at response 77"

Thanks dr jon,

Nice job on your analysis of the reboot during flight problem. Knowing this I now feel a little safer flying. It's a little unsettling that people here are blaming others for not checking the firmware before flying. I agree that it is not a bad idea but, should not be a requirement. If there is a firmware update that needs to take place then the software should not allow the aircraft to fly until the firmware is updated. This is a problem that DJI needs to address because under no circumstances should the aircraft perform an update during flight. I can imagine a day, not too far in the future, where our cars will have updatable firmware. Can you imagine driving down the road, and all of a sudden, your car turns off and you loose all control of your car including breaks and steering. Sounds silly, right? Well, no sillier then a UAV updating firmware during flight and causing a loss of power.  

Regards,
Tom

DJI-Jamie Posted at 2017-2-7 14:24
Good to hear! You'll be up and running again in no time.

Its been "fixed" and being delivered.  No word on the cause.  I'm thinking there wasn't anything I could have done differently anyways being it was covered under the warranty.  A week from crash to a replacement I don't think It could have happened faster.  Thanks for the help!

eggbeater Posted at 2017-2-10 19:07
Its been "fixed" and being delivered.  No word on the cause.  I'm thinking there wasn't anything I could have done differently anyways being it was covered under the warranty.  A week from crash to a replacement I don't think It could have happened faster.  Thanks for the help!

eggbeater I'm glad you've got your replacement so quickly, DJI are not always forthcoming with what the problem is perhaps we will never know.

They might just issue a firmware update.

Glade for you eggbeater , in fixing your issue, In some ways DJI admits that there is a big problem with our I2 FW, and so I expect to fix it asp.

My Phantom IV also fell in midflight on February 5. Flying 17 mph at 108', not 500' from home. "Aircraft Disconnected" appeared and then iPad screen went blank. We heard the crash. I am sending to DJI for investigation.

Something went terribly wrong here. I am sure that DJI will be very interested in seeing your flight log. Please be sure to contact them.

eggbeater Posted at 2017-2-6 09:05
Cant file a FAA report unless the damage other than to the aircraft exceeds $500.

Even if it were over $500. 00. The FAA is only concerned about damage to others, not yours.

Not good

Very sorrt to  hear, it seems this problem is getting worse and worse. DJI is like the unintended Toyotal acceleration problem a while back

Sorry to hear this. It seems like this forced update problem is getting worse and worse. DJI is reminding me of Toyota's unintended acceleration a while back that killed a lot of people. Had your Inspire crashed on top of someone because of DJI's forced update, DJI would have blood on its hands.

I'v been the same victim of these DJI shenanigans. Its time the FTC and FAA get involved.

See my post here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/djimavi ... _mavic_from_forced/

bochen7 Posted at 2017-2-16 09:11
Sorry to hear this. It seems like this forced update problem is getting worse and worse. DJI is reminding me of Toyota's unintended acceleration a while back that killed a lot of people. Had your Inspire crashed on top of someone because of DJI's forced update, DJI would have blood on its hands.

I'v been the same victim of these DJI shenanigans. Its time the FTC and FAA get involved.

Thought the Toyota incident was proven to be myth, your point is well taken..  DJI needs to make these optional, or at least on your own time, not mid-air.   Are the Inspire 2's auto updating regardless of the pilot?

I hope you the best, but the Inspire has bad legs, so falling out of the sky can break them.

I have flown the new machine for a few hours and I haven't had any downloads or problems.

You are not the first.Please send the logs to the DJI Engineers so we can figure this out.

My Inspire 2 dropped today. It was only my 9th flight with my new Inspire 2. I noticed just before take off that it said a Firmware update was available, but I didn't do it. It was only going to be a short flight to shoot some footage of a barge that was going through a waterway that hadn't seen barges in 40 years. I did a fly by at about 90-100 feet up then was doing an arc around the boat manually. I increased my height to 269 feet but lost contact about 1/2 way through the arc. After a few seconds I reconnected and titled my camera down just a little. Then I started getting a warning that my Gimbal reached its movement limit. Then a pitch and yaw warning. Several quickly. As it fell I took a screen shot (of the cached video) and it appears that one of the landing gear arms had broken or snapped or something BEFORE it had made any contact with anything. I was at 269 feet, well about the banks tree line.  So I have NO IDEA what went wrong today other than having a $3600 paperweight right now. It was a very sickening feeling.

wow, very sorry for that!  the nightmare of all pilots indeed!
it is very clear this is has to be a harware failure of that t-joint mid air!
has to be replace 100%!

but this is another very bad problem to the i2, this joint was allready a problem on the i1
and the i2 t-joint made me suspicous before , lots of people have noticed it is not very tight allowing some play
did you notice this before maybe?

also could you post more photots how this joint is fixed? is has almost no screws from the outside...is it partly glued in palce maybe?

you should also post this in a new thread and on other forums
a ripped of arm mid air is very very serious...something that simply cant happen on a drone this price range...not even on a cheap one

Well there's not much left of the arms after a 269 foot plummet to the ground!!  Batteries are toast, the back of the AC frame is warped. Gimbal and camera are toast (I "just" had the X4S). I will attach some of the pictures of the remaining aircraft.

Brad Jones Posted at 2017-3-13 07:55
Well there's not much left of the arms after a 269 foot plummet to the ground!!  Batteries are toast, the back of the AC frame is warped. Gimbal and camera are toast (I "just" had the X4S). I will attach some of the pictures of the remaining aircraft.

Wow Brad ,that is a drag .  So glad you have the flight evidence that it was broken in Mid flight .....You know the problem here is going to be .......was it already  broken from a hard landing previously .....Just playing devils advocate here .  

I hope you are able to send it in to DJI and they can see it is a clean break  and you get another one .  

best of luck and keep us posted

donnie

Brad Jones Posted at 2017-3-12 15:57
My Inspire 2 dropped today. It was only my 9th flight with my new Inspire 2. I noticed just before take off that it said a Firmware update was available, but I didn't do it. It was only going to be a short flight to shoot some footage of a barge that was going through a waterway that hadn't seen barges in 40 years. I did a fly by at about 90-100 feet up then was doing an arc around the boat manually. I increased my height to 269 feet but lost contact about 1/2 way through the arc. After a few seconds I reconnected and titled my camera down just a little. Then I started getting a warning that my Gimbal reached its movement limit. Then a pitch and yaw warning. Several quickly. As it fell I took a screen shot (of the cached video) and it appears that one of the landing gear arms had broken or snapped or something BEFORE it had made any contact with anything. I was at 269 feet, well about the banks tree line.  So I have NO IDEA what went wrong today other than having a $3600 paperweight right now. It was a very sickening feeling.

Hi Brad

Sorry for your loss and crash. I hope that this will  be replaced by DJI after they evaluate the flight logs, broken parts etc.

Thanks for sharing
Rich

Wow! Sad story! (@Brad) - I wonder how long will it take DJI to replace it?  What if it were during a production shoot, you need a replacement ASAP.  Wow!  

And even more

No hard landings in the 9 total flights that I've taken with the I2.

I'm just glad it didn't land on a car or person. It literally was 6 feet from the major roadway and right in the middle of a major greenway that is heavily used.

ROCStudios Posted at 2017-3-13 10:46
Wow! Sad story! (@Brad) - I wonder how long will it take DJI to replace it?  What if it were during a production shoot, you need a replacement ASAP.  Wow!

Took a week.  Alot of pros have a backup quad.

Yeah my back up Phantom 3 Professional is not in much better shape, but that crash was definitely pilot error. Misjudged a tree 500' away.

Here is a look at the actual drop.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/irkpnji9htn53z8/Video%20Mar%2012%2C%201%2047%2041%20PM.mp4?dl=0