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Request a Waiver/​Airspace Authorization
2697 31 2017-3-12
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JayOne
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is flying drone is getting hard to do ??? you call the airport tower notify you going to fly for fun etc.. and tell them your on the edge of the 5 mile radius  and they say you need to get  a waiver etc.. BUT [size=13.006px] request waivers or airspace authorizations under Title 14 CFR[size=13.006px] Part 107; it is not for modelers or hobbyists flying in accordance with the Special Rule for Model Aircraft (P.L.[size=13.006px] 112-95, Section 336 so why request for  waviers???
2017-3-12
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Grizz 1
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if it is class d or e then wouldn't worry about calling them, but I would be cautious while flying and don't go over the 400 ft buffer. this is assuming your are not on the ends of the runways.
2017-3-12
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piowoc73
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As a hobbyist you are legally not allowed to fly within 5 miles of any airport, no matter if you call ATC, or not. You can request a waiver only if you have a valid sUAS pilot certificate (CFR part 107). Also, as a hobbyist you are never allowed to fly higher than 400 ft.
2017-3-12
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DJI Tom
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Hobbyist or pro, I think both should study the part 107.  Just pros need to get certified.   So I wanted to share with other drone pilots as it's important to promote responsible drone use to keep the FAA at bay.  For me, I studied primarily using an Googleplay app call UAS107 (link is below).  The app is about $4 and has a bunch of prep exam questions and some useful resource.  Even for hobbyist.  Here's the app link: https://play.google.com/store/ap ... otix.labs&hl=en.  
2017-3-12
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JayOne
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piowoc73 Posted at 2017-3-12 14:20
As a hobbyist you are legally not allowed to fly within 5 miles of any airport, no matter if you call ATC, or not. You can request a waiver only if you have a valid sUAS pilot certificate (CFR part 107). Also, as a hobbyist you are never allowed to fly higher than 400 ft.

really as a hobbyist? cant fly within a 5 mile ??? hmmm.. https://www.faa.gov/uas/getting_started/fly_for_fun/ just wondering  and https://www.faa.gov/uas/getting_started/ um.. check these links
2017-3-12
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JayOne
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DJI Tom Posted at 2017-3-12 14:37
Hobbyist or pro, I think both should study the part 107.  Just pros need to get certified.   So I wanted to share with other drone pilots as it's important to promote responsible drone use to keep the FAA at bay.  For me, I studied primarily using an Googleplay app call UAS107 (link is below).  The app is about $4 and has a bunch of prep exam questions and some useful resource.  Even for hobbyist.  Here's the app link: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=uas107.openrobotix.labs&hl=en.

thanks i will look into that
2017-3-12
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JayOne
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Grizz 1 Posted at 2017-3-12 14:00
if it is class d or e then wouldn't worry about calling them, but I would be cautious while flying and don't go over the 400 ft buffer. this is assuming your are not on the ends of the runways.

trust ill respect those 400ft there no real reason why to be that high
2017-3-12
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hdlou94
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, we are going to have drone parks soon,, geeeeez
2017-3-12
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MarkG
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piowoc73 Posted at 2017-3-12 14:20
As a hobbyist you are legally not allowed to fly within 5 miles of any airport, no matter if you call ATC, or not. You can request a waiver only if you have a valid sUAS pilot certificate (CFR part 107). Also, as a hobbyist you are never allowed to fly higher than 400 ft.

I'm new to flying so please don't take this the wrong way.  I'm still trying to learn what I can and can't do so I don't get into trouble.  I live right on the 5 mile boundary of a small airport.  What I've read (maybe the wrong stuff?) says it's OK to fly if  you call.  The following is an excerpt from AirMap.  If I've been doing it wrong I definitely want to know.

"The existing regulations for recreational drone operations in the US are actually quite simple and common sense. They are, however, generally completely misunderstood. The basic rules are:

    Never fly above 400 feet.
    Keep your drone within visual line of sight.
    Don’t fly over people.
    Fly in accordance with a set of community based guidelines.
    If you’re flying within 5 miles of an airport, give notice to the airport.

The last point is perhaps the most misunderstood by lawmakers, law enforcement, and the general public. This lack of understanding has led many to question the rights of individuals who fly their drones. Moreover, drone operators looking at a map may mistakenly believe there are few places where they can fly. After all, there are more than 10,000 airports in the US, so looking at a map with five-mile circles drawn around each one can look quite discouraging, especially in urban areas. But it’s critical to remember that these are not “no fly zones”; they are “give notice” zones. The FAA says that drone pilots must give notice to the airport operator (which is an airport employee, not an FAA employee) or air traffic control (if the airport has an air traffic control tower)."

Link to the whole statement.
https://www.airmap.com/rules-to-fly-recreational-drones/
2017-3-12
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JayOne
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hdlou94 Posted at 2017-3-12 14:58
, we are going to have drone parks soon,, geeeeez

that would be nice tho...
2017-3-12
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JayOne
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MarkG Posted at 2017-3-12 15:07
I'm new to flying so please don't take this the wrong way.  I'm still trying to learn what I can and can't do so I don't get into trouble.  I live right on the 5 mile boundary of a small airport.  What I've read (maybe the wrong stuff?) says it's OK to fly if  you call.  The following is an excerpt from AirMap.  If I've been doing it wrong I definitely want to know.

"The existing regulations for recreational drone operations in the US are actually quite simple and common sense. They are, however, generally completely misunderstood. The basic rules are:

bro your good... this why i have this forum open to discus and lean new information... i was just trying to get clarity from what been told to me... and what they stated didnt make no sense
2017-3-12
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JayOne
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MarkG Posted at 2017-3-12 15:07
I'm new to flying so please don't take this the wrong way.  I'm still trying to learn what I can and can't do so I don't get into trouble.  I live right on the 5 mile boundary of a small airport.  What I've read (maybe the wrong stuff?) says it's OK to fly if  you call.  The following is an excerpt from AirMap.  If I've been doing it wrong I definitely want to know.

"The existing regulations for recreational drone operations in the US are actually quite simple and common sense. They are, however, generally completely misunderstood. The basic rules are:

bro your good... this why i have this forum open to discus and lean new information... i was just trying to get clarity from what been told to me... and what they stated didnt make no sense
2017-3-12
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FCjosh
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Download the Airmap app on your device because it will show if your within a 5 mile radius of airports or helipads and it gives you a super easy 2 minute waiver to notify all airports in your area. This'll save a lot of time. Also, by law you have to notify the airport your flying within 5 miles, and no matter what they respond with you can fly.  
2017-3-12
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JayOne
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FCjosh Posted at 2017-3-12 17:43
Download the Airmap app on your device because it will show if your within a 5 mile radius of airports or helipads and it gives you a super easy 2 minute waiver to notify all airports in your area. This'll save a lot of time. Also, by law you have to notify the airport your flying within 5 miles, and no matter what they respond with you can fly.

i have the app everything and use it.. it something the tower was telling me something that it didnt apply to me...
2017-3-12
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CH4T6
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FCjosh Posted at 2017-3-12 17:43
Download the Airmap app on your device because it will show if your within a 5 mile radius of airports or helipads and it gives you a super easy 2 minute waiver to notify all airports in your area. This'll save a lot of time. Also, by law you have to notify the airport your flying within 5 miles, and no matter what they respond with you can fly.

"Also, by law you have to notify the airport..."

What law is that?
2017-3-12
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piowoc73
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CH4T6 Posted at 2017-3-12 18:39
"Also, by law you have to notify the airport..."

What law is that?

There is no law, at least here in the US, for the hobbyists to notify any airports. Simply they are NOT allowed to fly within 5 miles and they are NOT eligible for any waivers. That's what we have part 107 certification for.
Just imagine all the hobbyists calling ATC of big airports. They would probably need to open dedicated hotlines for them
2017-3-13
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shawn_
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piowoc73 Posted at 2017-3-13 05:30
There is no law, at least here in the US, for the hobbyists to notify any airports. Simply they are NOT allowed to fly within 5 miles and they are NOT eligible for any waivers. That's what we have part 107 certification for.
Just imagine all the hobbyists calling ATC of big airports. They would probably need to open dedicated hotlines for them

Yeah. WRONG.
https://www.faa.gov/uas/where_to_fly/airspace_restrictions/

"Airports

Recreational operators are required to give notice for flights within five miles of an airport to BOTH the airport operator and air traffic control tower, if the airport has a tower. However, recreational operations are not permitted in Class B airspace around most major airports without specific air traffic permission and coordination."


2017-3-13
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piowoc73
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shawn_ Posted at 2017-3-13 06:03
Yeah. WRONG.
https://www.faa.gov/uas/where_to_fly/airspace_restrictions/

Then I am sorry, but I don't understand the system, because it would be easier to legally fly the drone near the airport WITHOUT the part 107 certificate than after obtaining sUAS license. Something is definitely wrong here.
2017-3-13
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CH4T6
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shawn_ Posted at 2017-3-13 06:03
Yeah. WRONG.
https://www.faa.gov/uas/where_to_fly/airspace_restrictions/

That's not a law.  It's one of a billion rules set forth by the FAA in their effort to regulate the airspace above the United States.   The FAA cannot make laws; only elected officials can make laws in this country.  Except for Chuck Norris; he can make laws if he wants.
2017-3-13
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shawn_
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CH4T6 Posted at 2017-3-13 15:56
That's not a law.  It's one of a billion rules set forth by the FAA in their effort to regulate the airspace above the United States.   The FAA cannot make laws; only elected officials can make laws in this country.  Except for Chuck Norris; he can make laws if he wants.

Thanks for such valuable input. Really contributed to the conversation.
I was pointing out that the statement that hobbyists are not allowed to fly within 5 miles of any airport.
2017-3-14
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Mark The Droner
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Lots of misinformation in this thread.  Some of it is correct, some is not.  

Re what's the law and what is not the law, It's probably best to look at the law, read the law, understand the law, and then we know for sure if something is the law or not the law.  In this case, we're talking about law in the US as it applies to a hobbyist UAS otherwise known as a model aircraft which qualifies for the Special Rule.

For the record, a model flying within 5 miles of an airport requires notifying the airport of the flight plan in advance.  A phone call will do.  It's federal law.  See Public Law 112-95 Sec 336, or see FAR (CFR) Part 101.  

It's important that you tell the airport you're flying as a hobbyist.  If the guy at the airport states you need a waiver, he's wrong.  

Hope this helps.


Edit:  The exception is Class B airspace - a hobbyist needs approval from the tower to fly in Class B.  Notification isn't good enough.  
2017-3-16
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piowoc73
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Mark The Droner Posted at 2017-3-16 03:38
Lots of misinformation in this thread.  Some of it is correct, some is not.  

Re what's the law and what is not the law, It's probably best to look at the law, read the law, understand the law, and then we know for sure if something is the law or not the law.  In this case, we're talking about law in the US as it applies to a hobbyist UAS.

Mark, that would be simply illogical for me, because if one has part 107 certificate he, or she is obliged to ask for a waiver every time he, or she wants to fly in the controlled airspace of an airport, which normally takes several weeks.
So, according to what you wrote NOT having sUAS license would be actually an advantage, because all one would need to do is to "notify the airport" and he, or she is good to go. I really doubt that "notifying" anybody, especially by phone would be good enough, because it would be simply untraceable, so there would be no record in case any accident happens. Another problem with this is that for large airport they would need to open hotlines just for people trying to "notify" them about their drone missions, which is simply not going to happen. I am pretty sure that the last thing the ATC operator, or the airport manager need is to be flooded with calls from hobbyists trying to have fun in the airspace surrounding the airports.



2017-3-16
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Mark The Droner
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piowoc73 Posted at 2017-3-16 06:23
Mark, that would be simply illogical for me, because if one has part 107 certificate he, or she is obliged to ask for a waiver every time he, or she wants to fly in the controlled airspace of an airport, which normally takes several weeks.
So, according to what you wrote NOT having sUAS license would be actually an advantage, because all one would need to do is to "notify the airport" and he, or she is good to go. I really doubt that "notifying" anybody, especially by phone would be good enough, because it would be simply untraceable, so there would be no record in case any accident happens. Another problem with this is that for large airport they would need to open hotlines just for people trying to "notify" them about their drone missions, which is simply not going to happen. I am pretty sure that the last thing the ATC operator, or the airport manager need is to be flooded with calls from hobbyists trying to have fun in the airspace surrounding the airports.

This is actually old territory and has been discussed many times over the past 6-7 months.  

What is logical or illogical doesn't really matter.  

I think you're missing what's stated in the OP and also what's stated in my post.  And that is that the pilot is a hobbyist.  

It doesn't matter if a pilot has a Part 107.  If he/she wishes to fly under Part 101, he/she may do so, regardless of the fact that he/she has a Part 107 certificate.  I actually personally confirmed this directly with the FAA last fall.  

Yes indeed, flying under Part 101 does have certain distinct advantages.  There is no question about it.  Notifying by phone is good enough.  We know this for sure because the law says it is.  

Hope this helps.
2017-3-16
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GreenHornet55
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Yesterday after my flights  I ended up talking to ATCs from my local International Airport at a local bar.  They stated that outside of 2 miles form the airport they never refuse permission to fly, they are not allow to refuse.  That being said they also said the drone operator must stay 400ft/120m or below in altitude.  What the said they would really like is for drones to have transponders.  I don't see that happening because of coast and the huge number of returns that would pop up on their radars.
2017-3-16
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piowoc73
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Mark The Droner Posted at 2017-3-16 06:39
This is actually old territory and has been discussed many times over the past 6-7 months.  

What is logical or illogical doesn't really matter.  

So, I guess the whole system needs to be revised and rather sooner than later.
2017-3-16
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HFI9
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piowoc73 Posted at 2017-3-16 13:27
So, I guess the whole system needs to be revised and rather sooner than later.

I understand your confusion. The difference between the hobbyist (Part 101) and the commercial (Part 107) operator is that the US Congress (see Public Law 112-95 as noted earlier) has declared a "hands off" approach for the most part when it comes to model aircraft flying as a hobbyist.

That is not the case for commercial operators and that is the reason they can (and are) regulated more directly when it comes to operations within controlled airspace (a hobbyist, for example has no requirement to even know what controlled airspace is!).

However, controlled airspace does not surround MOST airports and heliports. So while the hobbyist must either remain 5 miles or more from ANY airport, heliport, seaport, etc, (unless they contact and notify the operator/ATC) the Part 107 commercial operator has no such restriction as long as the airport is in uncontrolled (i.e., Class G) airspace.

Finally, if a hobbyist calls an ATC tower, the tower can deny any operation they deem to be unsafe.  So if you call and notify them, and they tell you not to fly, you definitely should not! (See JO 7200.23).

So there are advantages and disadvantages to flying either as a hobbyist under Part 101 or as a commercial operator OR hobbyist under Part 107.   
2017-4-5
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Bob Brown
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piowoc73 Posted at 2017-3-12 14:20
As a hobbyist you are legally not allowed to fly within 5 miles of any airport, no matter if you call ATC, or not. You can request a waiver only if you have a valid sUAS pilot certificate (CFR part 107). Also, as a hobbyist you are never allowed to fly higher than 400 ft.

In the USA you are wrong.
I live .5 miles from a Class G airport and have written permission from the airport manager to fly; whenever I want.
I could fly to the hanger and back as long as there is no air traffic. I could land on the airstrip even. (I would not dare!)

Please be careful what you say... Class G is not affected. Be more specific when you use LEGAL terms.
2018-7-16
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rwynant V1
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This thread is over a year OLD,  but has merit.

Best bet is to do some reading on the FAA sUAS site and understand the expectations.

LAANC has been implemented in much, but NOT all of the USA......some info......there's more if you search.
https://skyward.io/answers-to-your-questions-about-laanc-skyward/

Randy
2018-7-17
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Mark The Droner
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Here is some more LAANC info from the FAA site:  https://www.faa.gov/uas/programs_partnerships/uas_data_exchange/

Also, I've heard that hobbyists can use it to "notify" - I've heard/read this somewhere before.  Here is one link that seems to confirm this:  https://www.thedroneprofessor.com/course/understanding-laanc/

2018-7-18
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Tearuup
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Mark The Droner Posted at 2018-7-18 02:18
Here is some more LAANC info from the FAA site:  https://www.faa.gov/uas/programs_partnerships/uas_data_exchange/

Also, I've heard that hobbyists can use it to "notify" - I've heard/read this somewhere before.  Here is one link that seems to confirm this:  https://www.thedroneprofessor.com/course/understanding-laanc/

Mark The Droner, you are correct.  I live about 4 miles from RIC and a phone call to notify ATC is all I do.  They say "cool" stay below 400"  End phone call with "thanks for calling" and a thank you.  They have never denied.  Also I am within 3 miles of a hospital heliport and they never answer the phone, so I leave a message.  Never had a problem and don't expect any.
2018-7-18
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Mark The Droner
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Tearuup Posted at 2018-7-18 03:43
Mark The Droner, you are correct.  I live about 4 miles from RIC and a phone call to notify ATC is all I do.  They say "cool" stay below 400"  End phone call with "thanks for calling" and a thank you.  They have never denied.  Also I am within 3 miles of a hospital heliport and they never answer the phone, so I leave a message.  Never had a problem and don't expect any.

Yes, Richmond is a good example of the difference between flying as a licensed vs an unlicensed drone pilot in the USA.  Richmond is a Class C airport and its controlled airspace layout at the surface is typical of a Class C airport.  The controlled Class C airspace at the surface has a radial distance of 5 NM (nautical miles) which is a bit more than 5 SM (statute miles).  All Part 107 pilots must get authorization to fly in that airspace within 5 NM.  And yet, per the law, a hobbyist flying under Part 101 / Sec 336 only has to call the airport and the tower if within 5 SM to notify - no authorization required.  What's kind of interesting is that if the hobbyist is outside of the 5 SM radius but within the 5 NM radius, he doesn't even have to bother to call anybody even though it's controlled airspace.  And yet, a 107 pilot flying in the exact same spot is still required to get the authorization before he can fly.  
2018-7-18
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Anokadrone
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File that under "Bazaar" .  I suppose that the situation is this way because once you become a Part 107 certificated operator, you are in their system.  They clamp down on you because they can.  Hobbiests are not really in the system except for registering their drone.  More difficult to enforce any rules laid down by the FAA.  The Part 107 operator is in many cases, more qualified to interact with the system because of training and testing, and the hobbiest - not so much.  There is also the legality and liability associated with flying for hire.  The FAA needs to have a CYA on record to avoid any nasty paperwork.
2018-7-18
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