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Inspire 1 Pro Gimbal Shake
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iKell Aerial
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Hi guys, I have an Inspire 1 V2.0 with the X5 camera. I've been using the Olympus 14-42mm lens with the counterbalancing ring by DJI. All is set up as it's supposed to be, but I've gotten this really annoying gimbal shake going on–even in almost perfectly calm conditions as the video shows. I used the auto-orbit mode for this as well. Any ideas on what could be causing this?

2017-3-31
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Donnie *
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Ok , just for the record you have the proper FW loaded for the X5 camera correct and did a Camera Gimbal calibration with the3 X5 attached  as well ?  More than likely you have  but just want to be sure .  Do you happen to own the OSMO as well ?  It seems to me like this Gimbal shake and Osmo go hand in hand .

Ok some Ideas, do you have e the balance ring AS WELL as filters on the X5 camera ?  If so you  may need to remove the filer and try a test and see if the shake goes away , I know the weight can be critical .

Also go to the Camera "Gimbal  Settings" / Advanced  and check your settings , the defaults are way to high and need to be lowered.  Also be sure to enable the "Synch Gimbal Pan Follow"  if you have not done so already .

Also I did not answer  your post yesterday because I did not want to jump in and answer this as others have more experience in this matter BUT since they did not , I wanted to at least give you my 2 cents.  You may want to send member "Dobmatt " a Personal Message as he has the X5 and is very good in the Camera aspect of the hobby  and may be able to help you more .

Best of Luck
***Also to  this video link  below  , towards the end he does a balance  test and in any position the Camera stays  in that position , that is the type of balance you need .  Try it on yours and perhaps paly with some minor weights.  I am NOT saying that this is OK, DJI should have these balanced already , BUT Just like with Props ( On RC aircraft  ) They need a bit of balancing to make them perfect .  


https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=dji+balance+x5
2017-4-1
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iKell Aerial
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Donnie * Posted at 2017-4-1 04:03
Ok , just for the record you have the proper FW loaded for the X5 camera correct and did a Camera Gimbal calibration with the3 X5 attached  as well ?  More than likely you have  but just want to be sure .  Do you happen to own the OSMO as well ?  It seems to me like this Gimbal shake and Osmo go hand in hand .

Ok some Ideas, do you have e the balance ring AS WELL as filters on the X5 camera ?  If so you  may need to remove the filer and try a test and see if the shake goes away , I know the weight can be critical .

Thanks Donnie! I was not using filters and also this is actually a new X5 as my last one kicked the bucket. I haven't mounted this on my Osmo yet. The last one also had the slight tremble, so maybe it's something with my bird? Also want to mention I was not using the "zoom" part of the 14-42, I had it at it's widest setting. There is a firmware update available, but I had decided to not install it yet. I guess I'll give that a shot.
In some ways, it seems like it's possible that my Inspire is making too many tiny rapid, harsh adjustments and making the X5 have  a "pendulum" effect.
2017-4-1
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iKell Aerial
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Donnie * Posted at 2017-4-1 04:03
Ok , just for the record you have the proper FW loaded for the X5 camera correct and did a Camera Gimbal calibration with the3 X5 attached  as well ?  More than likely you have  but just want to be sure .  Do you happen to own the OSMO as well ?  It seems to me like this Gimbal shake and Osmo go hand in hand .

Ok some Ideas, do you have e the balance ring AS WELL as filters on the X5 camera ?  If so you  may need to remove the filer and try a test and see if the shake goes away , I know the weight can be critical .

Also it's kinda hard to balance the gimbal as shown in the video because with the 14-42mm lens, the "barrel" retracts when you shut down the system. So it is only balanced when it is powered on and extended. Hope that makes sense.
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Donnie *
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iKell Aerial Posted at 2017-4-1 04:49
Also it's kinda hard to balance the gimbal as shown in the video because with the 14-42mm lens, the "barrel" retracts when you shut down the system. So it is only balanced when it is powered on and extended. Hope that makes sense.

I was just out flying mine trying to duplicate your problem  ( I could not ) playing with settings and what not .  One other thing I thought of is to inspect the Vibration plate and make sure all of the Black vibration balls are  in good shape , Be sure to replace them  on occasion as well.

Perhaps you could add a small weight and experiment and see if you can get the shutter out of there.  I have seen this before and the only thing I have ever heard fixes it is  attaching weights  to the gimbal  like in the video .  Just start small and experiment . Looks to me  the YAW motor would be the one to start with .

*****When you were doing the orbit you had ZERO stick movement correct ?  just want to confirm this .
**Be sure to go  through all of your settings and be sure nothing is grossly out of spec .  Try and make sure the AC is not giving the pendulum effect you speek of.  I personally think it is a balance issue on the Camera, I know all of the Camera guys are always talking about perfect balance being the key to keeping vibration at minimum.

donnie

2017-4-1
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Aeromirage
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One thing you could try to verify balance is to remove the gimbal while it is powered on.
Just rotate the mount and off it will come without retracting the lens.
Then, while holding it by the mount, you could see if it is in fact balanced.
Are you using a hood of any kind? That could act as an air scoop and cause wayward stress on the gimbal motors.
2017-4-1
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iKell Aerial
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Donnie * Posted at 2017-4-1 05:06
I was just out flying mine trying to duplicate your problem  ( I could not ) playing with settings and what not .  One other thing I thought of is to inspect the Vibration plate and make sure all of the Black vibration balls are  in good shape , Be sure to replace them  on occasion as well.

Perhaps you could add a small weight and experiment and see if you can get the shutter out of there.  I have seen this before and the only thing I have ever heard fixes it is  attaching weights  to the gimbal  like in the video .  Just start small and experiment . Looks to me  the YAW motor would be the one to start with .

Thanks for putting time into this! I experimented quite a bit with the rubber dampers, including putting zip ties through the balls to lessen the "pendulum" effect. That didn't work as I just got more "microvibrations" from the props. And yes, zero stick input mostly–I know that wasn't the cause. Thanks, I'll look into the rest of your suggestions.
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Aeromirage Posted at 2017-4-1 05:27
One thing you could try to verify balance is to remove the gimbal while it is powered on.
Just rotate the mount and off it will come without retracting the lens.
Then, while holding it by the mount, you could see if it is in fact balanced.

Good idea, I don't use a hood but I'll double check the balance that way.
2017-4-1
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iKell Aerial
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Alright, guys, I updated the firmware, ensured balance etcetera. One thing I've noticed that I'm able to get pretty consistently good shots in ATTI mode. I'm not sure, somehow it just seems that the Inspire's GPS corrections are very rapid and not very precise or something and that makes the camera wobble excessively. I don't know what the technical probabilities of that are (they seem kinda slim).  Not sure what to try next.
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Donnie *
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iKell Aerial Posted at 2017-4-1 05:33
Good idea, I don't use a hood but I'll double check the balance that way.

Aeromirage is also a very good pilot and camera guru.  I hope  you can get this figured out .

donnie
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Aeromirage
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I had the 14-42 lens and got rid of it for many reasons. I didn't like the way it fit (actually didn't fit) on the X5 and it didn't seem to focus very well. I recently picked up a Z3 which I am really liking.
If you watch eBay, they come along once in while at good prices. I got very lucky and snagged a brand new one for $500.
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Donnie * Posted at 2017-4-1 07:21
Aeromirage is also a very good pilot and camera guru.  I hope  you can get this figured out .

donnie

Thanks for the kind stroke, Donnie!
What's up with the duck? (Donald Duck = Donnie Duck?)
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iKell Aerial
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Aeromirage Posted at 2017-4-1 09:22
I had the 14-42 lens and got rid of it for many reasons. I didn't like the way it fit (actually didn't fit) on the X5 and it didn't seem to focus very well. I recently picked up a Z3 which I am really liking.
If you watch eBay, they come along once in while at good prices. I got very lucky and snagged a brand new one for $500.

Okay, I'll keep that in mind!
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Donnie *
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Aeromirage Posted at 2017-4-1 09:24
Thanks for the kind stroke, Donnie!
What's up with the duck? (Donald Duck = Donnie Duck?)

My daughter saw my Avatar one day ( Tony Soprano ) and thought it was to harsh , so I had a bit of fun .  Also you know you stuff so I was just speaking the truth brother !

All the Best

donnie
2017-4-2
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Aeromirage
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Donnie * Posted at 2017-4-2 04:20
My daughter saw my Avatar one day ( Tony Soprano ) and thought it was to harsh , so I had a bit of fun .  Also you know you stuff so I was just speaking the truth brother !

All the Best

Thanks again.
Having a great time with Z3 camera. This thing is awesome!
This was shot from 300 yards away.

I always figured, who needs a zoom lens. Just fly closer to subject.
Well, you can't get too close to some things.
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iKell Aerial Posted at 2017-4-1 10:38
Okay, I'll keep that in mind!

I have been reading your post with great information and ideas. Sometimes the camera could be reacting to something else on the aircraft....

I had a couple of ideas for you too.
1) Do you have the brake feature turned down? I have found that the brake can cause issues depending on how smooth you fly and the wind. I have my brake set at 70.

2) Prop balance is always overlooked. You might want to try a different set of props.  People think that because the props come out of a plastic bag, they are perfectly balanced.  I have found they are pretty close but some props take a small piece of tape to put the balance in order.

Rich's tip... the smoother your Inspire flies the smoother the videos

All the best
Rich
2017-4-2
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iKell Aerial
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RichJ53 Posted at 2017-4-2 09:20
I have been reading your post with great information and ideas. Sometimes the camera could be reacting to something else on the aircraft....

I had a couple of ideas for you too.

Thanks Rich, I actually do have the braking turned down as well. And yes, I've changed out the props, but maybe thinking I need to get a balancing tool of some type.
Thanks!
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iKell Aerial Posted at 2017-4-2 13:31
Thanks Rich, I actually do have the braking turned down as well. And yes, I've changed out the props, but maybe thinking I need to get a balancing tool of some type.
Thanks!


Okay, I am so glad that you were already doing these things....

So, I guess you can look into balancing the props also. If you have already tried another set, it is not likely the cause of the camera movement, ??##  (maybe the gimbal motors)
this is a nice video for balancing the Inspire 1345 T props



Tools used:
1. Exacto knife
2. Fine grit sand paper
3. Dubro prop balancer:
link for DuBro
Prop rod



Rich
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Dobmatt
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Well, there's not much I can add since The Three Musketeers (Donnie, Rich and Aeromirage) already covered the issue almost completely. What I would like to know, however, is how actually the bird is behaving in flight. Try to choose calm day, launch and let her hover at eye level. Walk around as close as safety allows and look for visible low frequency vibrations of the frame, motor booms in particular and gimbal. In real flight conditions these vibrations or shakes may come and go as motors rotate at various speeds, but with evident mechanical problem (i.e. loose boom bushing) they'll be very obvious even during static hover. Another troubleshooting method involves your smartphone. Tape the baby securely to one side of Inspire body (electrical tape is best), make sure is not wobbling, start recording and fly. Do the same on another side. Finally the best way to examine your bird during flight is GoPro Session cube mounted on tag plate with sticky foam (supplied with). You'll be surprised how much everything shakes and see how the gimbal actually behaves...   If everything looks normal, than I don't know ...

Cheers.
2017-4-2
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iKell Aerial
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RichJ53 Posted at 2017-4-2 15:38
Okay, I am so glad that you were already doing these things....

So, I guess you can look into balancing the props also. If you have already tried another set, it is not likely the cause of the camera movement, ??##  (maybe the gimbal motors)

Rich,
I don't believe it's the gimbal motors as it's a brand new gimbal–plus, my last X5 had the same issue, only  a bit worse. Thanks for the video, I'll definitely look into that.
2017-4-3
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iKell Aerial
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Dobmatt Posted at 2017-4-2 21:01
Well, there's not much I can add since The Three Musketeers (Donnie, Rich and Aeromirage) already covered the issue almost completely. What I would like to know, however, is how actually the bird is behaving in flight. Try to choose calm day, launch and let her hover at eye level. Walk around as close as safety allows and look for visible low frequency vibrations of the frame, motor booms in particular and gimbal. In real flight conditions these vibrations or shakes may come and go as motors rotate at various speeds, but with evident mechanical problem (i.e. loose boom bushing) they'll be very obvious even during static hover. Another troubleshooting method involves your smartphone. Tape the baby securely to one side of Inspire body (electrical tape is best), make sure is not wobbling, start recording and fly. Do the same on another side. Finally the best way to examine your bird during flight is GoPro Session cube mounted on tag plate with sticky foam (supplied with). You'll be surprised how much everything shakes and see how the gimbal actually behaves...  https://vimeo.com/181420204 https://vimeo.com/181726543 If everything looks normal, than I don't know ...

Cheers.

Dobmatt,
Thanks a lot! I really enjoyed the videos and think you have some great ideas. I had already done the "hover test" and all looked to be in good shape as far as vibrations and airframe integrity. Maybe it is simply my choice of lens and I should just stick with a more commonly used lens. Wish I had a DJI 12mm to test it with. Anyway, I might post a video of what I find.
Where do you live??? Beautiful landscape.
2017-4-3
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iKell Aerial
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Dobmatt Posted at 2017-4-2 21:01
Well, there's not much I can add since The Three Musketeers (Donnie, Rich and Aeromirage) already covered the issue almost completely. What I would like to know, however, is how actually the bird is behaving in flight. Try to choose calm day, launch and let her hover at eye level. Walk around as close as safety allows and look for visible low frequency vibrations of the frame, motor booms in particular and gimbal. In real flight conditions these vibrations or shakes may come and go as motors rotate at various speeds, but with evident mechanical problem (i.e. loose boom bushing) they'll be very obvious even during static hover. Another troubleshooting method involves your smartphone. Tape the baby securely to one side of Inspire body (electrical tape is best), make sure is not wobbling, start recording and fly. Do the same on another side. Finally the best way to examine your bird during flight is GoPro Session cube mounted on tag plate with sticky foam (supplied with). You'll be surprised how much everything shakes and see how the gimbal actually behaves...  https://vimeo.com/181420204 https://vimeo.com/181726543 If everything looks normal, than I don't know ...

Cheers.

So I did the smartphone video capture from the two side arms. It didn't seem that anything was shaking too much except on occasion the gimbal mounting plate would really shake. (obviously causing the camera to shake.  That's where the problem seems to be coming in...but the question is what causes that.
I guess I'll start with balancing the props.
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Dobmatt Posted at 2017-4-2 21:01
Well, there's not much I can add since The Three Musketeers (Donnie, Rich and Aeromirage) already covered the issue almost completely. What I would like to know, however, is how actually the bird is behaving in flight. Try to choose calm day, launch and let her hover at eye level. Walk around as close as safety allows and look for visible low frequency vibrations of the frame, motor booms in particular and gimbal. In real flight conditions these vibrations or shakes may come and go as motors rotate at various speeds, but with evident mechanical problem (i.e. loose boom bushing) they'll be very obvious even during static hover. Another troubleshooting method involves your smartphone. Tape the baby securely to one side of Inspire body (electrical tape is best), make sure is not wobbling, start recording and fly. Do the same on another side. Finally the best way to examine your bird during flight is GoPro Session cube mounted on tag plate with sticky foam (supplied with). You'll be surprised how much everything shakes and see how the gimbal actually behaves...  https://vimeo.com/181420204 https://vimeo.com/181726543 If everything looks normal, than I don't know ...

Cheers.

Dobmatt

It is good to see you posting again. I was wondering if you were finished hibernating from the winter months yet!  

Thanks for sharing your videos and it is always good to see what you have been up too.

All the best
Rich
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iKell Aerial Posted at 2017-4-3 06:27
Rich,
I don't believe it's the gimbal motors as it's a brand new gimbal–plus, my last X5 had the same issue, only  a bit worse. Thanks for the video, I'll definitely look into that.


iKell
I had a brand new Phantom 4 Pro with the back gimbal motor buzzing (overdriving) that caused the camera to shake. The gimbal motors should be smooth and precise. This was only a thought as we are all scratching our heads on this one.  
Maybe you can change out your rubber dampeners for the X5 mount.... or just take everything apart and clean it, then reassemble....   I hope you figure this out soon.  

Please report back and findings that you have for us to learn from your experience.

Rich
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fansa84fe8a4
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Idea.  How about using some other app and doing an orbit with it?

That would eliminate any possible RC control stick issues and maybe GO as well.  Try Autopilot's Orbit Mode (or Litchi) perhaps and see how smooth it is, or not?

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iKell Aerial
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RichJ53 Posted at 2017-4-3 08:21
iKell
I had a brand new Phantom 4 Pro with the back gimbal motor buzzing (overdriving) that caused the camera to shake. The gimbal motors should be smooth and precise. This was only a thought as we are all scratching our heads on this one.  
Maybe you can change out your rubber dampeners for the X5 mount.... or just take everything apart and clean it, then reassemble....   I hope you figure this out soon.  

Good thought. I have already changed out the rubber dampers, though. I'm going to go do an orbit with a another lens... Olympus 25mm. I'll let you know what i find.
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fansa84fe8a4 Posted at 2017-4-3 08:24
Idea.  How about using some other app and doing an orbit with it?

That would eliminate any possible RC control stick issues and maybe GO as well.  Try Autopilot's Orbit Mode (or Litchi) perhaps and see how smooth it is, or not?

I'll definitely try this, good idea.
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So, I just did an orbit with the Olympus 25mm lens using both the Go app and Autopilot. The difference between the two wasn't really noticeable, but as far as the lens it was actually a little bit better handling the shaking–not perfect, but better. I'm going to keep an eye on eBay for good deals on the Olympus 12mm. Additionally, my prop balancing equipment should be arriving sometime in the near future. If none of these things improve it, I think I'll contact DJI.
Thank you for all your input on this, and I'll keep you posted!
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iKell Aerial Posted at 2017-4-3 08:54
So, I just did an orbit with the Olympus 25mm lens using both the Go app and Autopilot. The difference between the two wasn't really noticeable, but as far as the lens it was actually a little bit better handling the shaking–not perfect, but better. I'm going to keep an eye on eBay for good deals on the Olympus 12mm. Additionally, my prop balancing equipment should be arriving sometime in the near future. If none of these things improve it, I think I'll contact DJI.
Thank you for all your input on this, and I'll keep you posted!

I was hoping you could find something that would make a difference. One more thing to look at... try this settings for the gimbal to see if they smooth out. Just so you know, I do not have the X5 camera (only the X3) at this point but these settings should still work for you . I am saving up for the Inspire 2 X5S in the near future.

Rich

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RichJ53 Posted at 2017-4-3 10:14
I was hoping you could find something that would make a difference. One more thing to look at... try this settings for the gimbal to see if they smooth out. Just so you know, I do not have the X5 camera (only the X3) at this point but these settings should still work for you . I am saving up for the Inspire 2 X5S in the near future.

Rich

I think those parameters are strictly for the gimbal dial, but I'll adjust them and see if it makes a difference. Thanks
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iKell Aerial Posted at 2017-4-3 13:20
I think those parameters are strictly for the gimbal dial, but I'll adjust them and see if it makes a difference. Thanks

iKell

Yes, they work with the dial and the smoothness  and syncro gimbal pan works with the Inspire motion also.

I was just thinking of something else you could try
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RichJ53 Posted at 2017-4-3 16:37
iKell

Yes, they work with the dial and the smoothness  and syncro gimbal pan works with the Inspire motion also.

Funny, but I've just realized that shaky video issue we're all trying to solve here is related to orbit mode ... Does this mean that you don't see such shakiness in video taken during normal (stick controlled) flying? I use 45mm Olympus often with no issue whatsoever, although never with pre-set flying modes. Maybe that's the problem? Gimbal trying to deal with the targeting, I don't know ... Anyway, I never had much trust in cheap zoom lenses, pankake style in particular ... Go for 12mm Oly, expensive but worth every penny with x5 ...
BTW, I wish to live there (Arrow Lake BC), but don't. I tow my houseboat 900 km from Edmonton AB and enjoy summer holidays ...
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Dobmatt Posted at 2017-4-3 19:40
Funny, but I've just realized that shaky video issue we're all trying to solve here is related to orbit mode ... Does this mean that you don't see such shakiness in video taken during normal (stick controlled) flying? I use 45mm Olympus often with no issue whatsoever, although never with pre-set flying modes. Maybe that's the problem? Gimbal trying to deal with the targeting, I don't know ... Anyway, I never had much trust in cheap zoom lenses, pankake style in particular ... Go for 12mm Oly, expensive but worth every penny with x5 ...
BTW, I wish to live there (Arrow Lake BC), but don't. I tow my houseboat 900 km from Edmonton AB and enjoy summer holidays ...


Hi Dobmatt
you are spot on... he is using the automatic flight mode and the DJI Go app takes it settings from whatever the user has put in. So you are correct, it might be the App causing the problem (smart observation!). I guess we will need to wait and see what he says tomorrow.

Maybe he could try AutoFlight logic's App (it is awesome third party app) Link for AutoPilot App

Edmonton AB  (COLD)    I really like your spot at the lake  peaceful accept for the drone buzzing around.

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iKell Aerial Posted at 2017-4-3 13:20
I think those parameters are strictly for the gimbal dial, but I'll adjust them and see if it makes a difference. Thanks


Please look at posts #32, #33

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Hey guys,
That's a very good point. I think that the problem is definitely worse in the Orbit mode–which is kinda required for me because I need to do 360 degree orbits around a construction site. I'm not that good at it freehand yet.
I do have the Autopilot app and I tried doing an orbit with it and the 25mm attached. It was okay-ish, but not the rock-solid smoothness that I see on YouTube and on the videos that Dobmatt posted.
Weather here in Iowa hasn't been super for flying lately, a lotta rain...so I'll do more manual vs. automated flight tests later. As I said before though, it seems that in ATTI mode (all manual, no GPS) it handles a lot better with very little gimbal shake. So, I think there's merit to this idea.
Also Dobmatt, that's awesome! My girlfriend lives in Washington State and I thought the scenery in the video looked very northwest-ish.
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RichJ53 Posted at 2017-4-3 16:37
iKell

Yes, they work with the dial and the smoothness  and syncro gimbal pan works with the Inspire motion also.

Thanks Rich!
I'll adjust these settings a bit, but I do know that i did have syncro gimbal pan enabled already.
Thanks
2017-4-4
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iKell Aerial
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Flight distance : 1535308 ft
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Donnie * Posted at 2017-4-1 05:06
I was just out flying mine trying to duplicate your problem  ( I could not ) playing with settings and what not .  One other thing I thought of is to inspect the Vibration plate and make sure all of the Black vibration balls are  in good shape , Be sure to replace them  on occasion as well.

Perhaps you could add a small weight and experiment and see if you can get the shutter out of there.  I have seen this before and the only thing I have ever heard fixes it is  attaching weights  to the gimbal  like in the video .  Just start small and experiment . Looks to me  the YAW motor would be the one to start with .

Donnie,
Just curious what lens you tried to duplicate this issue with? I balanced my props and also found a decent deal on an Olympus 12mm. The problem is pretty much resolved with the 12mm...
2017-4-14
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Donnie *
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iKell Aerial Posted at 2017-4-14 08:47
Donnie,
Just curious what lens you tried to duplicate this issue with? I balanced my props and also found a decent deal on an Olympus 12mm. The problem is pretty much resolved with the 12mm...

The X5 with the standard DJI lens.

donnie
2017-4-17
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mixchief
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Flight distance : 160646 ft
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iKell Aerial Posted at 2017-4-1 04:49
Also it's kinda hard to balance the gimbal as shown in the video because with the 14-42mm lens, the "barrel" retracts when you shut down the system. So it is only balanced when it is powered on and extended. Hope that makes sense.

Ikell, my Osmo does not retract the lens , the video on my thread has the AC turned off with the lens extended because I put it and turned it off on the Osmo, I don't know if yours will do the same, I've heard of folks having the opposite issue, bird doesn't close Osmo does, go figure
2017-4-29
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Donnie *
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Flight distance : 3636782 ft
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Saw this thread and thought of your slight shake,( vibration )  the bottom line was the 2 black flat  ribbon cables were transmitting vibrations from the aircraft  to this members  camera.  Might be worth reading the thread and then checking your cables as well.  It did solve the members vibration and is maybe the cause of yours . also some good infrotmation on the thread .
Cgheck it out -

http://forum.dji.com/thread-96495-1-1.html

donnie  
2017-5-19
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