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Avoid Crash due to Compass Interference
31678 387 2017-7-11
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hallmark007
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MiniMoke Posted at 2017-9-10 05:20
I didn't realise this.  Because the Go 4 app starts with the status panel open where the compass has a [calibrate] option it sort of invites you to re-calibrate every flight.

In the future I'll only respond to warnings on the panel

Yes I see that as a problem and many have fallen for this, it actually turns red or blue when compass needs calibration, should be removed IMHO.
2017-9-10
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Centraltooth
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Great tip! I would rather spend the extra 2 mins making sure my Spark is ready to fly, than to start flying sooner in a compromised state.
2017-9-10
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hallmark007
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Centraltooth Posted at 2017-9-10 07:50
Great tip! I would rather spend the extra 2 mins making sure my Spark is ready to fly, than to start flying sooner in a compromised state.

Thank you, you will find once you get used to doing the exercise it doesn't take so long, but will give you some comfort while flying, if they're is something amiss then you can just land and get it sorted.

Good luck....
2017-9-10
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Charles Adams
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hallmark007 Posted at 2017-9-10 08:46
Thank you, you will find once you get used to doing the exercise it doesn't take so long, but will give you some comfort while flying, if they're is something amiss then you can just land and get it sorted.

Good luck....

Amen!  You can heed the warnings and the signs, and take a few inconvenient minutes to address the situation.

Or warnings and signs be damned:  fly anyways.  Please feel free to share your fly-away/crash experience with us.
2017-9-10
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Nemroig
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Just my own experience with that: Last week flying the bird in Croatia, when it was about 80 meters away and maybe 20 meters high, the compass symbol momentarily pointed in the wrong direction, not where the drone was heading. It was only a moment, but just the precise moment that I was looking at the screen and not at the drone, so I can not assure that it is not something that happens more assiduously.

These are small things that do not seem to have much importance because they do not cause a critical failure at that moment, but these small errors are there.

I fully understand that checking and testing each and every one of the possible casuistics that can happen, or reproduce the characteristics of all the places in which we can fly, possible interferences, etc. etc, is absolutely impossible, but I think that in this type of products should be implemented very clear security systems that would always act in the event of multiple failures or situations, not only if the connection with the RC or the phone is lost or if the battery level gets to a critical point, or things like that.

For example, another day I experienced a failure in which when I moved the joystick forward, the AC did not respond at all. Luckily the other sticks were working and I was able to bring the AC back to me with the other directions (flying backwards) and lower it to land it. But what if it were the "down" stick that stopped working?

Luckily this has not happened again on the other 71 flights, but can someone (DJI) assure that it will not happen again? I think the answer is NO.

(Yes, the AC, RC and App were all up to the latest version, and I was flying in a forest area without interference and with the battery charged).
2017-9-14
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hallmark007
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Nemroig Posted at 2017-9-14 07:05
Just my own experience with that: Last week flying the bird in Croatia, when it was about 80 meters away and maybe 20 meters high, the compass symbol momentarily pointed in the wrong direction, not where the drone was heading. It was only a moment, but just the precise moment that I was looking at the screen and not at the drone, so I can not assure that it is not something that happens more assiduously.

These are small things that do not seem to have much importance because they do not cause a critical failure at that moment, but these small errors are there.

It would be great to have a redundancy for every working part of the AC, but I'm afraid for €500 this is not going to happen, yes there are many more redundancies on bigger more expensive dji craft, but the same goes for an airbus V a Cessna you get what you pay for.
But anyone in aviation will tell you they live and die by checklists, and this follows through to these small craft like spark, if you prepare correctly are fully aware of your flying environments do proper preflight checks during flight checks and landing checks, then you have done your utmost to secure a good flight and you as the person in charge can do no more, in the world we live in today things are more likely to go wrong because of human error than technology error and it's for this reason I believe more crashes are due to pilot error than technology failure so it's important that we get the human part right. As regards technology/hardware failure this is on the whole is something we have very little control over and must place a certain amount of trust in the technology/hardware , I'm sure a day will come when we are sitting at home we will just be able to push a button and the drone will go off and do it's stuff, but where is the fun and thrill in that. I think we should make the most of what we have today and enjoy it.
2017-9-14
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Charles Adams
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hallmark007 Posted at 2017-9-14 08:45
It would be great to have a redundancy for every working part of the AC, but I'm afraid for €500 this is not going to happen, yes there are many more redundancies on bigger more expensive dji craft, but the same goes for an airbus V a Cessna you get what you pay for.
But anyone in aviation will tell you they live and die by checklists, and this follows through to these small craft like spark, if you prepare correctly are fully aware of your flying environments do proper preflight checks during flight checks and landing checks, then you have done your utmost to secure a good flight and you as the person in charge can do no more, in the world we live in today things are more likely to go wrong because of human error than technology error and it's for this reason I believe more crashes are due to pilot error than technology failure so it's important that we get the human part right. As regards technology/hardware failure this is on the whole is something we have very little control over and must place a certain amount of trust in the technology/hardware , I'm sure a day will come when we are sitting at home we will just be able to push a button and the drone will go off and do it's stuff, but where is the fun and thrill in that. I think we should make the most of what we have today and enjoy it.

I worked for an airline some years ago, and to this day one of the most interesting lessons/classes that I received at that time was an evaluation of accidents.  Such a class was given in the hopes that we would carefully in playing our role to avoid an accident, but also so that we were prepared in the unfortunate event that something horrible happened.

To this day I remember a key axiom of airline accidents:  It is never one single event.  It is always a chain of events.  Nearly every "point" in that chain of event is a human controlled event.  And at any of those points a different behavior or decision could/would have changed the outcome.

Thus the checklist is so important.
2017-9-14
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Zaheed
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There is absolutely no logic to this 2 min routine. You're better off spending time to learn to fly in ATTI. Just go about flying as usual and be ready to takeover in ATTI whenever the AC behaves odd. Saved me every time. I learned it the hard way by waiting for it to fix itself the very first time I had a odd AC behavior due to compass issue, and sure enough it didn't. That was some 3-4 years ago in a NAZA FC when things were a lot less stable. This stupid routine might seem to be useful but trust me it's of no use. It can all go well in the beginning and you can still have issues mid flight, in fact ALL my incidents have been like that. And of course if you've a motor, ESC, or battery failure, nothing in this world, not even 2x of this stupid 2 min routine will do you an ounce of good. If anything those 2 mins every time will leave your AC further used and warmer, which eventually can only increase the chances of such failures, specially if you're doing consecutive flights. Instead if you even leave the AC off for those 2 minutes, it will be way more useful.

Please don't waste 2 mins in every flight because someone, who clearly doesn't know what they're talking about, told you so. I hate it when people pretend to know something they have zero idea about.
2017-9-14
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hallmark007
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Zaheed Posted at 2017-9-14 13:54
There is absolutely no logic to this 2 min routine. You're better off spending time to learn to fly in ATTI. Just go about flying as usual and be ready to takeover in ATTI whenever the AC behaves odd. Saved me every time. I learned it the hard way by waiting for it to fix itself the very first time I had a odd AC behavior due to compass issue, and sure enough it didn't. That was some 3-4 years ago in a NAZA FC when things were a lot less stable. This stupid routine might seem to be useful but trust me it's of no use. It can all go well in the beginning and you can still have issues mid flight, in fact ALL my incidents have been like that. And of course if you've a motor, ESC, or battery failure, nothing in this world, not even 2x of this stupid 2 min routine will do you an ounce of good. If anything those 2 mins every time will leave your AC further used and warmer, which eventually can only increase the chances of such failures, specially if you're doing consecutive flights. Instead if you even leave the AC off for those 2 minutes, it will be way more useful.

Please don't waste 2 mins in every flight because someone, who clearly doesn't know what they're talking about, told you so. I hate it when people pretend to know something they have zero idea about.

I don't really have an answer for that except

“...There are too many idiots in this world. And having said it, I have the burden of proving it.”
2017-9-14
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hallmark007
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Zaheed Posted at 2017-9-14 13:54
There is absolutely no logic to this 2 min routine. You're better off spending time to learn to fly in ATTI. Just go about flying as usual and be ready to takeover in ATTI whenever the AC behaves odd. Saved me every time. I learned it the hard way by waiting for it to fix itself the very first time I had a odd AC behavior due to compass issue, and sure enough it didn't. That was some 3-4 years ago in a NAZA FC when things were a lot less stable. This stupid routine might seem to be useful but trust me it's of no use. It can all go well in the beginning and you can still have issues mid flight, in fact ALL my incidents have been like that. And of course if you've a motor, ESC, or battery failure, nothing in this world, not even 2x of this stupid 2 min routine will do you an ounce of good. If anything those 2 mins every time will leave your AC further used and warmer, which eventually can only increase the chances of such failures, specially if you're doing consecutive flights. Instead if you even leave the AC off for those 2 minutes, it will be way more useful.

Please don't waste 2 mins in every flight because someone, who clearly doesn't know what they're talking about, told you so. I hate it when people pretend to know something they have zero idea about.

You may have overlooked the fact that spark doesn't have Atti, Doh....
2017-9-14
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Zaheed
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hallmark007 Posted at 2017-9-14 14:12
You may have overlooked the fact that spark doesn't have Atti, Doh....

Spark automatically goes to ATTI mode when there is compass failure (or even for GPS issues). If you would had actually run into the incidents that me and others have dealt with, you would have known that already. But of course you know best what to do without having even faced what we have. That says a lot about how useful what you know is, specially when, unlike me, you can't even back up your suggestions with any reasonable explanation.
2017-9-14
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hallmark007
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Zaheed Posted at 2017-9-14 14:27
Spark automatically goes to ATTI mode when there is compass failure (or even for GPS issues). If you would had actually run into the incidents that me and others have dealt with, you would have known that already. But of course you know best what to do without having even faced what we have. That says a lot about how useful what you know is, specially when, unlike me, you can't even back up your suggestions with any reasonable explanation.

You said it's better to practice in Atti mode explain how you do that with a spark?
2017-9-14
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brian_b
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See here, people prefer advice from folks who use tact and are cordial. I donʻt quite understand where your adversarial attitude comes from, but is is completely unnecessary in a community like this. Iʻll take what youʻre saying with a grain of salt as well.

No specific process guarantees a complete elimination of potential issues in flight. But, that preflight process can reduce them; as such it is still effective to a high degree and therefore not ʻstupidʻ, as youʻre very eloquent to point out. Taking precautions is necessary with flying things that can hurt people or result in losing an expensive investment. If all of your incidents have been like that, that is hardly an objective sample to measure by and apply to a vast user group who havenʻt had the same experience, and you canʻt assume they havenʻt flown in Atti mode.

The AC from 2 minutes of the routine as far as temperature is negligible. Electronics are engineered to operate in a specified range of temperature and stresses. The only downside I see is less battery life.


Per my observation, hallmark007 would appear to know what he is talking about.

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2017-9-14
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Zaheed
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brian_b Posted at 2017-9-14 14:35
See here, people prefer advice from folks who use tact and are cordial. I donʻt quite understand where your adversarial attitude comes from, but is is completely unnecessary in a community like this. Iʻll take what youʻre saying with a grain of salt as well.

No specific process guarantees a complete elimination of potential issues in flight. But, that preflight process can reduce them; as such it is still effective to a high degree and therefore not ʻstupidʻ, as youʻre very eloquent to point out. Taking precautions is necessary with flying things that can hurt people or result in losing an expensive investment. If all of your incidents have been like that, that is hardly an objective sample to measure by and apply to a vast user group who havenʻt had the same experience, and you canʻt assume they havenʻt flown in Atti mode.

My point was there is no logical explanation to support the claim that those 2 mins routine reduces anything.

Please don't compare numbers that mean nothing. I build and fly my own multicopters majority of the time. And even when I use DJI stuff, the set up I use more often is where I don't login into the DJI app to avoid forced firmware updates and maintain FCC mode (CE mode is a joke). So DJI is the last system that can track how much I've flown. For DJI ACs even my Airdata stats are far superior, but then again like I said I also fly stuff I build myself, for example now I'm using PX4 Pixhawk FC, which is really impressive. But certainly the numbers DJI track are the last thing I could care about.
2017-9-14
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Zaheed
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hallmark007 Posted at 2017-9-14 14:34
You said it's better to practice in Atti mode explain how you do that with a spark?

Good point. Someone who can't figure out how to practice in ATTI mode, or basically learn to really fly a AC, is already risking more than they should by flying a Spark. For less than 20 bucks one can buy something to learn to fly before they risk their Spark. Now this is actually something that will truly reduce risks with Spark. Not some pointless 2 min routine before every flight.

I might seem to be coming at it too hard but if people would only realize how lame that 2 min suggestion is, they would have been 10x mad.
2017-9-14
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hallmark007
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Zaheed Posted at 2017-9-14 14:51
My point was there is no logical explanation to support the claim that those 2 mins routine reduces anything.

Please don't compare numbers that mean nothing. I build and fly my own multicopters majority of the time. And even when I use DJI stuff, the set up I use more often is where I don't login into the DJI app to avoid forced firmware updates and maintain FCC mode (CE mode is a joke). So DJI is the last system that can track how much I've flown. For DJI ACs even my Airdata stats are far superior, but then again like I said I also fly stuff I build myself, for example now I'm using PX4 Pixhawk FC, which is really impressive. But certainly the numbers DJI track are the last thing I could care about.

I think you posts are more about bigging up yourself rather than helping anyone here, if you want to complain about dji then by all means take it up with them and not try to high jack a post only offering the explanation that it is stupid.

Regarding points much of my hobby flying is done through litchi and auto pilot. I am also a commercial registered pilot.
I actually fly a MATRICE 600 2 1/2 days a week for a large uk company surveying onshore and offshore wind turbines building quads is something I've done since I was a young boy.
My advice is a well known and recognised procedure used by a lot of commercial pilots and should not be reduced to stupid by someone who chooses to fly modded aircraft with little regard for regulations or safety of others.
2017-9-14
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hallmark007
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Zaheed Posted at 2017-9-14 14:58
Good point. Someone who can't figure out how to practice in ATTI mode, or basically learn to really fly a AC, is already risking more than they should by flying a Spark. For less than 20 bucks one can buy something to learn to fly before they risk their Spark. Now this is actually something that will truly reduce risks with Spark. Not some pointless 2 min routine before every flight.

I might seem to be coming at it too hard but if people would only realize how lame that 2 min suggestion is, they would have been 10x mad.

Well if you bothered to read any of my posts I have always recommended buying cheap drones to learn how to fly without gps.
2017-9-14
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brian_b
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Zaheed, your points could possibly cogent and credible, but they are served up with such an obnoxious, braggadocios and condescending tone, I could easily dismiss them. Numbers may not mean anything, but for all we know, youʻre simply a full on troll with nothing better to do than to disrupt an otherwise constructive and helpful thread. Your best bet is to seek validation for whatever personal issues you have on another forum. A pilot with your level of inconsideration really isnʻt one that should fly.
2017-9-14
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hallmark007
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brian_b Posted at 2017-9-14 15:56
Zaheed, your points could possibly cogent and credible, but they are served up with such an obnoxious, braggadocios and condescending tone, I could easily dismiss them. Numbers may not mean anything, but for all we know, youʻre simply a full on troll with nothing better to do than to disrupt an otherwise constructive and helpful thread. Your best bet is to seek validation for whatever personal issues you have on another forum. A pilot with your level of inconsideration really isnʻt one that should fly.

I think you nailed it brian. B , just another troll.
2017-9-15
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Charles Adams
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That was interesting.

I am happy to spend two minutes in preparation, as it gives me additional confidence.  I have never felt that they were minutes wasted.  Instead, it feels like more time invested in my hobby.  Much like the time I spend in these forums.
2017-9-15
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fans7295e5ea
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Thanks from
2017-9-16
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Leonb63
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Zaheed Posted at 2017-9-14 13:54
There is absolutely no logic to this 2 min routine. You're better off spending time to learn to fly in ATTI. Just go about flying as usual and be ready to takeover in ATTI whenever the AC behaves odd. Saved me every time. I learned it the hard way by waiting for it to fix itself the very first time I had a odd AC behavior due to compass issue, and sure enough it didn't. That was some 3-4 years ago in a NAZA FC when things were a lot less stable. This stupid routine might seem to be useful but trust me it's of no use. It can all go well in the beginning and you can still have issues mid flight, in fact ALL my incidents have been like that. And of course if you've a motor, ESC, or battery failure, nothing in this world, not even 2x of this stupid 2 min routine will do you an ounce of good. If anything those 2 mins every time will leave your AC further used and warmer, which eventually can only increase the chances of such failures, specially if you're doing consecutive flights. Instead if you even leave the AC off for those 2 minutes, it will be way more useful.

Please don't waste 2 mins in every flight because someone, who clearly doesn't know what they're talking about, told you so. I hate it when people pretend to know something they have zero idea about.

Lets be nice to each other. You might not agree with someone statement but to call it "stupid" is really not the right way. Just stating your facts would be enough.

I think the suggested routine can do no harm but I am a newbie as yet and thus I will choose the safer option of doing the safety checks.
2017-9-19
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Leonb63
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brian_b Posted at 2017-9-14 14:35
See here, people prefer advice from folks who use tact and are cordial. I donʻt quite understand where your adversarial attitude comes from, but is is completely unnecessary in a community like this. Iʻll take what youʻre saying with a grain of salt as well.

No specific process guarantees a complete elimination of potential issues in flight. But, that preflight process can reduce them; as such it is still effective to a high degree and therefore not ʻstupidʻ, as youʻre very eloquent to point out. Taking precautions is necessary with flying things that can hurt people or result in losing an expensive investment. If all of your incidents have been like that, that is hardly an objective sample to measure by and apply to a vast user group who havenʻt had the same experience, and you canʻt assume they havenʻt flown in Atti mode.

was my first thought as well, the experience level
2017-9-19
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Leonb63
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Zaheed Posted at 2017-9-14 14:51
My point was there is no logical explanation to support the claim that those 2 mins routine reduces anything.

Please don't compare numbers that mean nothing. I build and fly my own multicopters majority of the time. And even when I use DJI stuff, the set up I use more often is where I don't login into the DJI app to avoid forced firmware updates and maintain FCC mode (CE mode is a joke). So DJI is the last system that can track how much I've flown. For DJI ACs even my Airdata stats are far superior, but then again like I said I also fly stuff I build myself, for example now I'm using PX4 Pixhawk FC, which is really impressive. But certainly the numbers DJI track are the last thing I could care about.

Ok correction on my part, so you are a drone guru by the facts you mention here. Help me understand, does that give you the right to attack and call someone else "stupid". How about the respect factor for another person.

Your knowledge could be very useful but the way you present it might not be accepted so easily, some food for thought and you do have the option of ignoring it.
2017-9-19
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Leonb63
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Zaheed Posted at 2017-9-14 14:58
Good point. Someone who can't figure out how to practice in ATTI mode, or basically learn to really fly a AC, is already risking more than they should by flying a Spark. For less than 20 bucks one can buy something to learn to fly before they risk their Spark. Now this is actually something that will truly reduce risks with Spark. Not some pointless 2 min routine before every flight.

I might seem to be coming at it too hard but if people would only realize how lame that 2 min suggestion is, they would have been 10x mad.

I think he is asking exactly you would put the Spark into Atti mode and then fly it.
2017-9-19
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Viking-Pilot
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Nice, thanks for the tip, i will remember to put in practice when i get my Spark
2017-9-27
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fansfc9ca035
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Great info
2017-10-30
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hallmark007
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Your welcome, it really is a very quick exercise once you get used to it and if there is something wrong you can pick it up pretty quickly and your AC will not be far away.
Good luck.
2017-10-30
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nixuspix
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Hello! First of all so much thanks to You for spending your time and educating the novices like we are.
My question is about 4/ clause of your advice to check if the red triangle show the same direction as spark.
In my case after the Spark hit the tree, now between the AC long axis and triangle axis from the arrow to its base there is an angle about 40-50 degrees. They are not exactly parallel.
But when i rotate the Spark the triangle also folloes the Spark movement, but never both axis are parallell
Have tried to recalibrate, but nothing.
Should i send my Spark for repair, or this behaviour is normal?
My post about my crash is #54 in this thread:
https://forum.dji.com/thread-103414-1-1.htm
2017-11-4
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UncleManuel
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Well, I took the first flights with my new Spark on Friday indoors, no GPS lock, the compass went crazy with all the interferences in my room. Next day I got out in an open field for the first flights, got a solid GPS lock and did the first flight. On the next battery I checked the sensor readouts and the IMU was happy. The compass not. It was yellow 3/4 to the right. So I did a manual calibration (yeah boi, do the drone dance!!! )
After the compass calibration the readout was all the way to the left, greener than green.

But I will try the method from the first posting when the weather is better. I burned only 4 batteries so far but I also noticed some yaw drifts of my Spark...
2017-11-6
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Enri
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I think this is a smart and safe practice.....and I would add manholes to the list of interfering objects during takeoffs.
2017-11-6
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Arnor
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I was flying in Lesotho and the ground there contains lots of iron. Even normal compas were perturbed. So I d add a pre-flight check : check compass perturbation prior starting Spark with normal compass.
2017-11-6
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headshot9
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My only issue is that yet another 2 min out of 16 min optimal battery life. Don't get me wrong, I go thru a very similar cycle before every flight because getting another minute in the air does not worth losing your Spark, but it ends up as 10 min flight time - at best (because I also never let it go to red). This is really the big difference compared to the Mavic, for the Spark, safety procedures take out ~30% out of 15 min, for the Mavic it is only ~15% out of 25
2017-11-20
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hallmark007
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headshot9 Posted at 2017-11-20 12:57
My only issue is that yet another 2 min out of 16 min optimal battery life. Don't get me wrong, I go thru a very similar cycle before every flight because getting another minute in the air does not worth losing your Spark, but it ends up as 10 min flight time - at best (because I also never let it go to red). This is really the big difference compared to the Mavic, for the Spark, safety procedures take out ~30% out of 15 min, for the Mavic it is only ~15% out of 25

Try it you will find that it takes less than a minute, put 2 minutes in because I use this amount of time checking my bigger aircraft.
2017-11-20
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hallmark007
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Arnor Posted at 2017-11-6 11:09
I was flying in Lesotho and the ground there contains lots of iron. Even normal compas were perturbed. So I d add a pre-flight check : check compass perturbation prior starting Spark with normal compass.

So would I good job.
2017-12-25
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xsparx
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Thanks, in my "flying checklist" now.
2018-1-4
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Flighty
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Great info,, I do very much the same before each flight. This should become standard practice.
2018-1-4
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hallmark007
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Flighty Posted at 2018-1-4 23:53
Great info,, I do very much the same before each flight. This should become standard practice.

Thank you, it is for me with all drones.
2018-1-5
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MKPSG12
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When people are talking about being TOLD by the app to calibrate their compass, is that a warning in the DJI 'banner' on the main screen or just in the settings menu?

Everytime i fire my Spark up the attached screen opens automatically with a box around 'Calibrate', rather than 'Normal', does that mean my Spark needs its compass calibrating or is that just the way it looks normally??


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2018-1-7
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hallmark007
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MKPSG12 Posted at 2018-1-7 23:42
When people are talking about being TOLD by the app to calibrate their compass, is that a warning in the DJI 'banner' on the main screen or just in the settings menu?

Everytime i fire my Spark up the attached screen opens automatically with a box around 'Calibrate', rather than 'Normal', does that mean my Spark needs its compass calibrating or is that just the way it looks normally??

That is just a short Cut to calibrate, doesn’t mean to calibrate.
2018-1-8
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