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Part 107 and DJI No Fly Zones are not on the same page
814 12 2017-8-2
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rudebega56
lvl.2
United States
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Will DJI ever put in place a proceudre that recognizes Part 107 operators when it comes to DJI's No Fly Zones? It seems to me that DJI has put in place a blanket for their own liablity purposes. This blanket however inadvertantly covers those opertors going the extra mile to understand and adhere to the rules the FAA has put in place for safe and responsible flying. The procedure for unlocking a DJI NFZ is for All DJI drone owners and doesn't take into account the actual Part 107 permissions granted by the FAA to a Part 107 Authorized operator.

- Rudy


2017-8-2
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Mark The Droner
Captain
Flight distance : 2913 ft
United States
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Not sure what you mean.  Could you give an example?  
2017-8-2
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Aardvark
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"doesn't take into account the actual Part 107 permissions granted by the FAA to a Part 107 Authorized operator."

Are you saying that by having the Part 107 that the FAA gives you permission to fly in No Fly Zones ?
2017-8-2
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rudebega56
lvl.2
United States
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Aardvark Posted at 2017-8-2 13:10
"doesn't take into account the actual Part 107 permissions granted by the FAA to a Part 107 Authorized operator."

Are you saying that by having the Part 107 that the FAA gives you permission to fly in No Fly Zones ?

Under certain condiiotns yes. Part 107 certified operators are allowed to fly in airspace that DJI considers a no-fly zone.
Lets take Class E non-surface airspace ( this is air space designated as a faded magenta line only), airspace that starts at 700 ft. Part 107 operators' ceiling is 400 ft. So therefore as a 107 operator flight is allowed with out contacting the airport manager. Of course i must emphasize that right-of-way rules apply (very very important).

I want to attempt to keep this under the context of this specific topic. DJI doesn't recognize at this time the 107 permissions. I am only hoping that in the vey near future the DJIJ App will allow some type of process to recognize 107 operators and release the no fly zones categorically.  
2017-8-6
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c k
New
United States
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This is extremely frustrating. There should be a way to verify part 107 in the app to avoid this.
2018-3-16
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Geebax
Captain
Australia
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rudebega56 Posted at 2017-8-6 13:24
Under certain condiiotns yes. Part 107 certified operators are allowed to fly in airspace that DJI considers a no-fly zone.
Lets take Class E non-surface airspace ( this is air space designated as a faded magenta line only), airspace that starts at 700 ft. Part 107 operators' ceiling is 400 ft. So therefore as a 107 operator flight is allowed with out contacting the airport manager. Of course i must emphasize that right-of-way rules apply (very very important).

All this would require additional bloatware programmed into the aircraft, just to satisfy a minority of US flyers. The rest of the world would not care less about it.
2018-3-16
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Genghis9
Captain
United States
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To Clarify something...holding a Part 107 certificate does not automatically  authorize you in anyway to operate in any airspace different from a hobbyists or recreational flyer.  Except the 107 being nearly and only exclusive to being a requirement for performing commercial (for hire) operations that may require operation in more restrictive airspace that hobbyists and recreational flyers have no need to penetrate or in certain environments such as night ops ( which still requires a waiver for 107 holders).  All operators, 107 or not, must still obtain the appropriate FAA clearance and permission to operate in whatever airspace they intend to be in and in accordance with FAA rules, assuming you are planning to fly in airspace other than unrestricted and below 400 feet AGL.
Meaning DJI is not going to make any exceptions in their Geo fencing system simply because you have a 107 and also as Geebax noted too.
Now all that said, I am no fan of a foreign corporation deciding and determining where and if you can fly EVEN if the FAA has already properly cleared and granted you permission.  You will still need to get DJI to unlock whatever their indicated airspace is showing as restricted in your planned area, and that to me is bass ackwards.  Not to mention I have seen far too many disconnects with the geo fence from actual airspace restricted zones either due to outdated info or just inaccurate, in other words I don't put much stock in to the fence's accuracy but you are ham strung by it regardless and that is a source of irritation no matter what.
2018-3-25
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Mark The Droner
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rudebega56 Posted at 2017-8-6 13:24
Under certain condiiotns yes. Part 107 certified operators are allowed to fly in airspace that DJI considers a no-fly zone.
Lets take Class E non-surface airspace ( this is air space designated as a faded magenta line only), airspace that starts at 700 ft. Part 107 operators' ceiling is 400 ft. So therefore as a 107 operator flight is allowed with out contacting the airport manager. Of course i must emphasize that right-of-way rules apply (very very important).

Can you give us a real-life example of a Class E non-surface airspace, below of which DJI considers an "NFZ" and won't allow you to fly without being cleared through the Go app?   I do agree the Go app isn't perfect.  Some of the FAA restricted areas are overlapped or underlapped by the DJI-NFZs, and also, from what I've read in other posts, I don't believe it will let you fly real close to certain airports (such as within a half mile) regardless of whether you are legal to fly in the area, including flying indoors.  The only solution may be to layer tin foil over the GPS antenna.  
2018-3-25
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rudebega56
lvl.2
United States
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Now I hope we can say DJI and the FAA will be on the same page. This is what I was hoping for. DJI and the LAANC system.
https://www.dji.com/newsroom/new ... controlled-airspace

Genghis9 is right. The FAA is always the source for permissions in flying in the NAS. Local, State also have their regulations to deal with. I have no problem with that. My company has been flying commercially for a while now. Getting permits (permission) is part of the game. DJI should not have been getting in the way of commerce. Well, Now it looks like DJI will be participating in the permission SOlutions and not be part of the problem. Here's to DJI and the FAA.
2018-10-12
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AngelAndres
lvl.1
United States
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Frustrated!

We just got completely denied by DJI's NFZ issue.

We received a LAANC authorization to fly in KAPA's airspace (Centennial Airport in the Denver, CO, USA area) up to 150feet AGL this evening via Airmap's app. Our pilot entered the DJI app and followed the unlock procedure to remove the "Geo" zone, including entering the six-digit token that was texted to me. After he got that far, he tried to take off and was hit with the dreaded, "NFZ" warning. Some quick research led me to DJI's website and these forums where I now find that we have to give DJI up to 5 days notice to unlock our drone for a limited period.

DJI has taken our convenient, well thought out instant airspace authorization system and made it utterly useless.

We have 10 DJI drones locally here in our fleet and hundreds company wide across the country. Do we need to sell them all and move on to restriction-free solutions from some other companies? Does anyone have any suggestions of such platforms on to which we can move on?

Thanks ahead of time for your thoughtful responses.

Kind regards,
3-19 19:41
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mongobird
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United States
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AngelAndres Posted at 3-19 19:41
Frustrated!

We just got completely denied by DJI's NFZ issue.

Furthermore, I went through two weeks of frustration and never managed to get DJI to correct an airspace restriction that their database had, but did not in fact exist.  GeoFence may be a great idea, but for people who know what they are doing, and have work to do, and limited time to do it in, the errors and red tape are stifling. For me, the solution is clear, and it is that I can't afford for my next purchase to be a DJI.  
4-9 07:33
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patiam
Second Officer
United States
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@mongobird & @AngelAndres- agreed.

DJI is going to lose professional users if they continue to make it more difficult to accomplish our work with their tools.
4-9 08:59
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JPilotR
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patiam Posted at 4-9 08:59
@mongobird & @AngelAndres- agreed.

DJI is going to lose professional users if they continue to make it more difficult to accomplish our work with their tools.

Fully agree.

Part 107 is there for the professional to practice professionalism, meaning, like a manned aircraft pilot, we as PIC are the final authority as to the safe operation of the aircraft. DJI, let us be professionals and follow the rules as they have been delineated for us. Don't penalize and walk backwards the well thought out FAA LAANC authorizations. It should not take 5 DAYS to clear us for take off.

I get the GEO-fencing for the hobbyist that is not aware of all the 107 rules, but for those of us (and no, not the "minority" of us) that are appropriately rated professionals, well, we need to be allowed to practice our professionalism. If we get a LAANC clearance, then, DJI, you must lift that restriction IMMEDIATELY. Otherwise, you are knowingly interfering with a country's commerce activities and essentially making your own rules outside of the federal agency that already created rules for the activity.

Look, as a Part 107 pilot, I have demonstrated my commitment to upholding the professional standards set forth by the controlling agency, in my case, the FAA. I DO NOT need to be told by DJI what my responsibilities are. I know my responsibilities as I took and passed the FAA knowledge exam and proved my dedication and commitment to safe operations. That is akin to Airbus or Boeing programming a commercial aircraft to "not take off" in some pre-determined environment and circumventing the PIC decision-making authority. Imagine you are PIC of a commercial passenger aircraft taking off out of Reagan National airport (near Washington DC) only to be told by the computer that "no, you can't take off because the White House is too close to the departure direction". That is just ridiculous. The PIC, as a professional commercial (or in this case Airline Transport Pilot) has proven their ability to discern regulations and airspace and procedures to successfully take off, fly the appropriate departure procedure, and avoid the restrictive airspace.

Aack. Sorry for the rant ya'll. This is just a point of issue with me. DJI, stop trying to "suck up" to the FAA or CAA, or whatever agency by creating your own rules to prove your dedication to safety. It may be okay for hobbyists, but for those of trying to make a living doing this, well, it is just draconian.

Thanks for listening!
4-10 05:30
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