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X7 Gimbal Balance Problems
1071 19 2017-11-27
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Skylux Media
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[size=14.6667px]Greetings. After purchasing a full X7 kit with all 4 lenses, I am finding significant gimbal imbalance problems with all 4 DL/DL-S lenses. With the lens, lens hood, and stock balancing ring attached, the gimbal is significantly back heavy. I've already spoken with a few other users who are seeing the same thing with their's as well. I would love to hear from any other X7 owners out there who can report on their systems.

[size=14.6667px]DJI ships the DL/DL-S lenses with the 46mm balancing ring already attached to the lens, however they also include a 46mm clear glass haze/filter which is not attached. When I swap out the balancing ring for the included glass haze/filter, the lens WILL balance properly. I have also tried using my Polar Pro ND Filters and they DO NOT balance properly, which is unfortunate because I love their Polarizer ND's. Some users have reported that B+W filters WILL balance properly on the X7. I can understand DJI making this system so that it works with ND's. However, being a professional filmmaker, I don't always want/need filters in front of my lens (i.e. sunrise, sunset), in which case their included balancing ring should do the trick (but it doesn't). Needless to say I'm VERY disappointed that my $8,000 system won't balance out of the box. What say ye?
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2017-11-27
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DJI Mindy
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We recommend to balance the gimbal by filter+ lens hood, balancing ring+lens hood or two filters without lens hood.
From the picture you posted, it is normal, the gimbal motor of X7 is strong enough to balance itself when power on. No worries.
2017-11-28
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Skylux Media
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DJI Mindy Posted at 2017-11-28 00:58
We recommend to balance the gimbal by filter+ lens hood, balancing ring+lens hood or two filters without lens hood.
From the picture you posted, it is normal, the gimbal motor of X7 is strong enough to balance itself when power on. No worries.

Mindy, that's the problem.  The gimbal DOES NOT balance out with the included Balancing Ring + Lens Hood.  It is EXTREMELY back heavy.  DJI is shipping this unit with the same balancing ring that is included in the X5S system, which is 10g too light.  This is creating a serious imbalance.  Please Advise, DJI needs to ship this unit with a different balancing ring.  
2017-11-28
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fansa84fe8a4
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I don't see why a clear filter would be an issue as the Phantoms all have one.  Helps for bug strikes too.

No matter what lens I use on the I2, I have do some balancing act with either the front or back.  A Velcro dot on the back can hold various coins, and a rubber band on the front with a bit of a tin can can balance the front.  Just goes with the territory.  Being back-heavy means I can put something on the front if even a couple of step-up rings or a blank filter ring.  I use the Breakthrough brand of filters as they seem to be a bit heavier than the B+W being made of brass, although thinner and sharper overall with far truer color without the ND tint issues as seen by the stronger ND series.

You can't use this stuff without an imbalance occuring somewhere with or without the use of a filter.

2017-11-28
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Skylux Media
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fansa84fe8a4 Posted at 2017-11-28 08:16
I don't see why a clear filter would be an issue as the Phantoms all have one.  Helps for bug strikes too.

No matter what lens I use on the I2, I have do some balancing act with either the front or back.  A Velcro dot on the back can hold various coins, and a rubber band on the front with a bit of a tin can can balance the front.  Just goes with the territory.  Being back-heavy means I can put something on the front if even a couple of step-up rings or a blank filter ring.  I use the Breakthrough brand of filters as they seem to be a bit heavier than the B+W being made of brass, although thinner and sharper overall with far truer color without the ND tint issues as seen by the stronger ND series.

What's important to note is that you can only fit ONE filter/ring on the X7 with the lens hood on.  Ask any professional photographer/videographer and they will tell you the same, that anytime you can avoid putting unnecessary glass in front of your lens is always ideal.  I won't go into reason why, a simple google search will yield sufficient information.  As for the stock X7, it clearly won't balance as a stock unit, and I shouldn't have to pay hundreds more for balancing rings and ND filters to get the system to work.  

I have now realized that what they are doing is shipping the X7 with the same balancing ring from the X5S, which is 10g too light for the X7. This helps them cut costs, but unfortunately they need to manufacture a separate heavier balancing ring for the X7.

I did some extensive testing yesterday and I was getting a "Lens Not Connected" error with the 16mm lens when not properly balanced. After switching out the filters, restarting, and balancing properly, the error went away. I was also getting jittery lag when panning up and down at full speed when the gimbal was imbalanced, but that disappeared after properly balancing. What's also worth noting is that the gimbal isn't just "slightly" imbalanced with the provided balancing ring, its a MAJOR imbalance. A 10g imbalance is a lot when we're talking about such a lightweight platform.
2017-11-28
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DJI Elektra
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Skylux Media Posted at 2017-11-28 09:38
What's important to note is that you can only fit ONE filter/ring on the X7 with the lens hood on.  Ask any professional photographer/videographer and they will tell you the same, that anytime you can avoid putting unnecessary glass in front of your lens is always ideal.  I won't go into reason why, a simple google search will yield sufficient information.  As for the stock X7, it clearly won't balance as a stock unit, and I shouldn't have to pay hundreds more for balancing rings and ND filters to get the system to work.  

I have now realized that what they are doing is shipping the X7 with the same balancing ring from the X5S, which is 10g too light for the X7. This helps them cut costs, but unfortunately they need to manufacture a separate heavier balancing ring for the X7.

Yes, please mount one filter on the X7 with the lens hood on. And I would recommend you read our user manual carefully and follow the instruction to balance X7.
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2017-11-28
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Skylux Media
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DJI Elektra Posted at 2017-11-28 19:04
Yes, please mount one filter on the X7 with the lens hood on. And I would recommend you read our user manual carefully and follow the instruction to balance X7.

Elektra,

The problem is that DJI's instructions on balancing are INCORRECT.  Multiple users have now reported the same thing; the X7 needs a 20g balancing ring or ND filter in order to balance.  DJI's provides the X7 with a 10g balancing ring, and an 11g has filter, which cause serious rear heavy imbalance.  This is a huge miss-step for DJI to have shipped the X7 with no way to balance it.  I've used a digital scale to find that the magic number for counterbalance on the X7 needs to be around 27-28g total.  Let me quote your instructions:

"Please use a filter with a diameter of 46 mm, a weight between 10 to 12 g, (10g TOO LIGHT AND WILL NOT BALANCE) and a thickness of 4.4 mm (thread mount excluded). To balance the gimbal weight, the following combination is recommended when mounting the lens onto the Zenmuse X7:
a. Lens hood + lens protector (Weighs 20g total, IMBALANCED)
b. Lens hood + balancing ring (Weighs 20g total, IMBALANCED)
c. Lens hood + ND  filter (Using B+W ND - Weighs 27g PERFECT BALANCE)
d. Two ND filters (Very difficult to find the perfect combination to weigh 26-27g)"

Ss as you can see, it is literally impossible to balance the X7 with the provided balancing ring or haze filter.  You literally have to purchase a B+W ND filter.  No other filters are the proper weight either.  I have tried using Polar Pro filters and they are not heavy enough.  DJI needs to ship the X7 with a much heavier balancing ring and haze filter.  Simply using the X5S balancing ring is not an option
2017-11-29
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fansa84fe8a4
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Try the Breakthrough brand of ND.  Much better color and coating than the B+W and their filter is a fluted brass and weighs in at 14.25 grams (Just weighed my 46mm.).

Breakthrough X4 Neutral Density FIlter

2017-11-29
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ICarrascosa
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fansa84fe8a4 Posted at 2017-11-29 06:15
Try the Breakthrough brand of ND.  Much better color and coating than the B+W and their filter is a fluted brass and weighs in at 14.25 grams (Just weighed my 46mm.).

Breakthrough X4 Neutral Density FIlter

With the filter you comment, can you confirm that it is perfectly balanced?
You have tried it?
2017-11-29
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ICarrascosa
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Skylux Media Posted at 2017-11-29 05:28
Elektra,

The problem is that DJI's instructions on balancing are INCORRECT.  Multiple users have now reported the same thing; the X7 needs a 20g balancing ring or ND filter in order to balance.  DJI's provides the X7 with a 10g balancing ring, and an 11g has filter, which cause serious rear heavy imbalance.  This is a huge miss-step for DJI to have shipped the X7 with no way to balance it.  I've used a digital scale to find that the magic number for counterbalance on the X7 needs to be around 27-28g total.  Let me quote your instructions:

Can you specify which model of b + w ND perfectly balances the X7?
If you are so kind if you can put the url of the model.

Thank you.
2017-11-29
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fansa84fe8a4
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ICarrascosa Posted at 2017-11-29 07:00
With the filter you comment, can you confirm that it is perfectly balanced?
You have tried it?

I balance given the need and lens.  None of this stuff is perfectly balanced without an aid.  Zoom lenses that grow out are another matter.  I have to use two filters with the X5S camera:  A green CC10G to counteract the poor tint of the manual white balance along with the ND, and that may take a Velcro'd coin on the back of the camera.

If their lenses had the ability to move an interior weight for balance, then that would be something.  That or time for some 3rd party to make a stick-on slider weight for the tube.  As it is, just balance out your gear given the circumstances.
2017-11-29
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Skylux Media
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fansa84fe8a4 Posted at 2017-11-29 07:29
I balance given the need and lens.  None of this stuff is perfectly balanced without an aid.  Zoom lenses that grow out are another matter.  I have to use two filters with the X5S camera:  A green CC10G to counteract the poor tint of the manual white balance along with the ND, and that may take a Velcro'd coin on the back of the camera.

If their lenses had the ability to move an interior weight for balance, then that would be something.  That or time for some 3rd party to make a stick-on slider weight for the tube.  As it is, just balance out your gear given the circumstances.

Fansa, maybe you're not getting the point.  Your X5S should balance properly out of the box, given that it's the stock DJI lens that comes with the gimbal.  Almost every X5S owner knows that the stock DJI 15mm lens included with that system balances perfect with the included balancing ring.  I completely agree with you that 3rd party lenses definitely require some manipulating to get them to balance correctly.  I have had to do the same with all my additional 3rd party lenses for the X5S.

But we're not talking about 3rd party lenses here.  We're talking about $1300-a-piece DJI Lenses that are are so back heavy out of the box, that users are reporting malfunction and errors.  No professional filmmaker or photographer who spends $8,000 on a camera system should have to purchase additional equipment simply to "Fix a Problem" that wasn't addressed by the manufacturer.
2017-11-29
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fansa84fe8a4
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Skylux Media Posted at 2017-11-29 08:22
Fansa, maybe you're not getting the point.  Your X5S should balance properly out of the box, given that it's the stock DJI lens that comes with the gimbal.  Almost every X5S owner knows that the stock DJI 15mm lens included with that system balances perfect with the included balancing ring.  I completely agree with you that 3rd party lenses definitely require some manipulating to get them to balance correctly.  I have had to do the same with all my additional 3rd party lenses for the X5S.

But we're not talking about 3rd party lenses here.  We're talking about $1300-a-piece DJI Lenses that are are so back heavy out of the box, that users are reporting malfunction and errors.  No professional filmmaker or photographer who spends $8,000 on a camera system should have to purchase additional equipment simply to "Fix a Problem" that wasn't addressed by the manufacturer.

Ha!  Not true with my X5S.  It needs a color correction filter due to the magenta color tint of the poor manual white balance that has been a plaque of the X5 series cameras for a few years.

Another issue is my X5S with the stock 15mm and hood (sans a filter) is indeed back heavy.  Why?  Because it is packed with two types of thermal grease inside it.  I've been in there and there is a blue and clear greasy goop leading from the sensor and some boards and onto the outer walls of the camera shell as well as the thinner back metal shell underneath the screw-off back cover.  I doubt if it is measured or weighed and likely heat and time may shift it about  too throwing off the balance.

In an ideal world a perfectly balanced rig would be nice, but you also have heavy moving glass for focusing internally along with sundry balance issues.   As it is, it is a buzzy platform (Put your finger on the lower gimbal plate sometimes!) so it will never reach something shot on a heavy tripod along with image stabilizers.

Just balance it by whatever means necessary and use it.  Trying to overthink it is fruitless as it isn't possible given the variables.   Just try and avoid a "Gimbal overload" and get on with the job at hand.



2017-11-29
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Skylux Media
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fansa84fe8a4 Posted at 2017-11-29 08:54
Ha!  Not true with my X5S.  It needs a color correction filter due to the magenta color tint of the poor manual white balance that has been a plaque of the X5 series cameras for a few years.

Another issue is my X5S with the stock 15mm and hood (sans a filter) is indeed back heavy.  Why?  Because it is packed with two types of thermal grease inside it.  I've been in there and there is a blue and clear greasy goop leading from the sensor and some boards and onto the outer walls of the camera shell as well as the thinner back metal shell underneath the screw-off back cover.  I doubt if it is measured or weighed and likely heat and time may shift it about  too throwing off the balance.

That's really unfortunate you've had that experience with your X5S.  I would have quickly sent it back to DJI for repair.  If DJI can simply create a balancing ring made specifically for the X7, then they'd solve a lot of problems.  There are now multiple users reporting complete motor failure of they X7, possibly associated with this balance issue.  

I realize plenty of people are putting sticky tack, pennies, weights, and other things on their X5S to get it to balance for their needs.  But now we're talking about an $8,000 camera that I purchased to use on set of a big budget Hollywood film and I'm not going to tell my DP that he needs to "sticky tape" our Super 35 Camera because the manufacturer didn't sell us a properly working product.
2017-11-29
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Skylux Media
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ICarrascosa Posted at 2017-11-29 07:03
Can you specify which model of b + w ND perfectly balances the X7?
If you are so kind if you can put the url of the model.

Hi Icarrascosa,

I am doing some testing today and I have been reporting my findings over on the" InspirePilots" forum with my findings.  There is an X7 thread over there where a bunch of users who are having the same problems, are reporting their findings.   I will post on here as well once I have compiled the list of workable solutions.
2017-11-29
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ICarrascosa
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Skylux Media Posted at 2017-11-29 09:53
Hi Icarrascosa,

I am doing some testing today and I have been reporting my findings over on the" InspirePilots" forum with my findings.  There is an X7 thread over there where a bunch of users who are having the same problems, are reporting their findings.   I will post on here as well once I have compiled the list of workable solutions.

Thanks again,

As I said you would not have to do these tests if you do not DJI, I also follow you in the other Forum.
What I do not understand is all the X7 videos that DJI has shot, have not you noticed the imbalance and the problem of overheating the lens to update with it?
What they have done reviews at any time have made comment of imbalance are they bought? or is it some lenses or are they all?

Miss Mindy could tell us if she has informed DJI about these problems and what she plans to do, because for my humble opinion, not because it is worth 8000 USD the equipment has to work perfectly, it is that even if it was worth 1 USD, the operation would have to be perfect as well.
2017-11-29
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DJI Elektra
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Skylux Media Posted at 2017-11-29 05:28
Elektra,

The problem is that DJI's instructions on balancing are INCORRECT.  Multiple users have now reported the same thing; the X7 needs a 20g balancing ring or ND filter in order to balance.  DJI's provides the X7 with a 10g balancing ring, and an 11g has filter, which cause serious rear heavy imbalance.  This is a huge miss-step for DJI to have shipped the X7 with no way to balance it.  I've used a digital scale to find that the magic number for counterbalance on the X7 needs to be around 27-28g total.  Let me quote your instructions:

Thanks for your attention and hard work. We will forward this thread to our engineers for further check. Please wait patiently for the reply. Thanks a lot.
2017-11-30
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Skylux Media
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DJI Elektra Posted at 2017-11-30 03:50
Thanks for your attention and hard work. We will forward this thread to our engineers for further check. Please wait patiently for the reply. Thanks a lot.

Thanks for all the help Elektra!

I think I may have found another glitche for the Programmers to inspect:

I experienced a whole new set of problems today. With the X7 attached, the camera was stuck in “Photo” mode, and I couldn’t switch it over to “Video” mode. I power cycled numerous times with no luck.  When I would push the button to switch to video mode, the screen would flash and then freeze for a minute, and then stay stuck in “Photo” mode.   It also kept giving me “SSD Failure” warnings, as well as “SSD NOT RECOGNIZED” warnings. After 30 minutes with no success, I removed the X7 and put on my X5S, and everything worked perfectly normal, no hiccups whatsoever. I decided to give the X7 one more try, and after a couple more power on/off cycles, the X7 started working. Needless to say I’m terrified to try and use it in the field on any upcoming jobs for fear of it not switching back into Video Mode.
2017-12-1
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DTK
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As any new product, there will be still a lot of bugs to be ironed out. You have to be patient and provide DJI engineers all your issues so that hopefully a more reliable product will end up for everyone else who can afford these beautiful lenses.
2017-12-3
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DJI Elektra
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Skylux Media Posted at 2017-12-1 16:59
Thanks for all the help Elektra!

I think I may have found another glitche for the Programmers to inspect:

In your case, please try to reinstall the SSD card. Did the problem exist now? Thanks for your help.
2017-12-5
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