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FLYING OVER THE WATER AND VPS ON PHANTOM 3S
2758 36 2017-12-5
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ICEBERG03
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Hello guys,

greetings from Canada. I have a question regarding flying my P3 Standard over the water.

I watched some tutorials and they all recommend to desable Vision Positioning System. However, on my DJI app (for P3S) there is no such option.

Would you have any tip or recommendations on how to safely fly over the water without a risk of VPS getting confused, making DJI difficult to control?

Thank you so much for any tip or advise.

Paul
2017-12-5
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Nebuchadnezzar
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Hope it help !!!
2017-12-5
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AlanHd
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The 3 standard does not have vision positioning system.
2017-12-5
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Mark The Droner
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+1

2017-12-5
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Kneepuck
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The Standard has no VPS. So that will not be a problem.  However, you should know, if something bad happens,your warranty will not be covered from water damage. So you may want to reconsider that flight.
2017-12-5
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solentlife
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Oh Dear ............

Flying over water is no different to flying over a field.

Its the fear factor ....

I live with a deep wide river at back of my house ... I have no fear of flying over it .......... I even lost my P3S due to my stupid flying too far and battery dying on me .. but my P3P ... I still fly over the water ...

What is this fear of water ?

Nigel
2017-12-5
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Bashy
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solentlife Posted at 2017-12-5 11:24
Oh Dear ............

Flying over water is no different to flying over a field.

the op is about vps and water, totally different to a fear of flying over it.
if the vps is on and too close to the water for the vps to be in range
it can have an adverse affect
2017-12-5
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ICEBERG03
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solentlife Posted at 2017-12-5 11:24
Oh Dear ............

Flying over water is no different to flying over a field.

Hi Nigel,
thank you for your input.

I guess it all started when watching some videos and tutorials on flying drone over the water. All these guys are saying that surface of the water tricks Visual Positioning System, making drone very difficult to control. One of the videos is here:

All these guys recommend to disable VPS, but there is no such option on PH3 DJI app.

Your thoughts?
2017-12-5
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AlanHd
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If I was you I would reread the user manual to familiarise yourself with the features of the 3 standard, I fly my 3 std over water all the time but I never try push the boundaries with the height.
2017-12-5
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solentlife
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Bashy Posted at 2017-12-5 11:39
the op is about vps and water, totally different to a fear of flying over it.
if the vps is on and too close to the water for the vps to be in range
it can have an adverse affect

......................

The guy has a Standard .......... it has NO VPS system !!
His watching others has created a fear because of others and his not appreciating a P3S is not fitted with VPS  - the source of the problem.

Maybe instead of attacking me - maybe read original post ?

AND - for Pro and Adv users ... VPS has problem over water due to reflection and non-hard surface ....

But again - OP has no VPS ....

Nigel
2017-12-5
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solentlife
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ICEBERG03 Posted at 2017-12-5 11:42
Hi Nigel,
thank you for your input.

Hi ... sorry if some others fail to read properly !

With a P3S .... ignore all you hear about VPS and problems seriously.

You have no problem at all. The P3S has no other sensor apart from GPS and Barometer for altitude / hover. You can fly over water just the same as flying over a field.

Nigel
2017-12-5
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Rene Jensen
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Denmark
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the fear of water is that its wet and your drone will drown and dye if somthing happens and it goes down.i newer fly over water with my standard
2017-12-5
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Bashy
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solentlife Posted at 2017-12-5 12:03
......................

The guy has a Standard .......... it has NO VPS system !!

woah, easy tiger, didnt you notice how i worded it, i didnt mention anything about his phantom, just that fact that he mentioned VPS and you chirped up saying about folks fearing water...../
2017-12-5
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solentlife
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Bashy Posted at 2017-12-5 12:10
woah, easy tiger, didnt you notice how i worded it, i didnt mention anything about his phantom, just that fact that he mentioned VPS and you chirped up saying about folks fearing water...../

No sorry ... you need to read OP properly.

Your post implied that I did not understand OP. Clearly that is not the case.

Nigel
2017-12-5
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solentlife
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Rene Jensen Posted at 2017-12-5 12:10
the fear of water is that its wet and your drone will drown and dye if somthing happens and it goes down.i newer fly over water with my standard

Youtube : "solentlifeuk"
Many flights over water ...
Only time water was a problem was my own stupidity of not compensating for increased wind for return flight of near 5km with a P3S ............

Nigel
2017-12-5
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Bashy
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yes, thats exactly how i read your post. but im not here to go 10 rounds as who posted what, i will bid good evening to you!
2017-12-5
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ICEBERG03
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AlanHd Posted at 2017-12-5 11:59
If I was you I would reread the user manual to familiarise yourself with the features of the 3 standard, I fly my 3 std over water all the time but I never try push the boundaries with the height.

Thanks Alan,
may I ask you what you consider hight boundary  to be?  10 m above the surface?
Thanks again for your support.
2017-12-5
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AlanHd
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ICEBERG03 Posted at 2017-12-5 13:04
Thanks Alan,
may I ask you what you consider hight boundary  to be?  10 m above the surface?
Thanks again for your support.

It depends on my speed and how far I am flying. I have flown within a couple of meters of the water but that’s slow and calm water. 10m should give you a nice safety margin but you have to judge each flight on its merits.  Remember the P3S just has the baraomter and gps which can vary due to local conditions.
2017-12-5
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ICEBERG03
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AlanHd Posted at 2017-12-5 13:23
It depends on my speed and how far I am flying. I have flown within a couple of meters of the water but that’s slow and calm water. 10m should give you a nice safety margin but you have to judge each flight on its merits.  Remember the P3S just has the baraomter and gps which can vary due to local conditions.

Thank you Alan.
Cheers,
Paul
2017-12-5
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ICEBERG03
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Thank you guys for all your inputs and tips.
Cheers,
Paul
2017-12-5
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ICEBERG03
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solentlife Posted at 2017-12-5 12:07
Hi ... sorry if some others fail to read properly !

With a P3S .... ignore all you hear about VPS and problems seriously.

Thank you Nigel. I really appreciate your support.
Cheers and happy flying.
P
2017-12-5
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repairman
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ICEBERG03 Posted at 2017-12-5 11:42
Hi Nigel,
thank you for your input.

yea iwas thinking about this subject the other day on the p3p.nice to learn all i can on the pro.thanks for sharing.     stay dry ha ha.
2017-12-5
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ALABAMA
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There's always a risk, whether on land, or water that your drone won't make it back.  Lots of stories on here about both.
2017-12-5
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Dirty Bird
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The Phantom 3 Standard does not have a VPS Module to disable.  Personally I have never disabled VPS when flying low over water with any of my VPS-enabled birds nor noticed any I'll effect.
2017-12-5
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ICEBERG03
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Dirty Bird Posted at 2017-12-5 15:05
The Phantom 3 Standard does not have a VPS Module to disable.  Personally I have never disabled VPS when flying low over water with any of my VPS-enabled birds nor noticed any I'll effect.

Thanks DB for your response. I really appreciate it. Yeah, it really sounds like there should be no issue, when flying with caution.
Thanks again,
Paul
2017-12-5
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DJI Susan
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Hey Paul, keep certain distance above the water(at least more than 10 meters). More tips, please visit here: http://dl.djicdn.com/downloads/p ... Disclaimer+v1.4.pdf
2017-12-6
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solentlife
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Something that can affect flight behaviour but is rarely mentioned. Thermal / Flat Field Glider boys know it well.

Air sitting over different surfaces can have different temperature. It may only be a degree or so - but that can be enough to create UP and DOWN moving air mass. The Glider boys love corn fields / dark land mass which tends to create warm air rising and so they get a lift in the thermals. I have had my ASW or my older Golden Lady up for an hour at times with this.

What has that got to do with us ?? Rising air means higher temperature - which leads to a slight pressure drop. ARRRRR ... now the penny drops !

Over water it is common in DAYTIME to have cooler air ... at NIGHTTIME warmer air. This leads to the morning and evening breezes found at the beach etc. when through day it has been relatively calm.

The pressure difference usually will not affect us too much .. maybe a foot or so ... but it can lead to some heart stopping events ... also the sinking air etc.

Lets say you are flying out over water and for quite a distance and you may be at limit of LoS. You look at height reading on GO .... you descend .... PLEASE take care to NOT descend too low - your altitude data could be wrong - especially if you are in a summers day etc.

The advice to stay a reasonable height above the water is definitely good advice. The penalty for ignoring that can be fatal to your precious P3 !!  I have a personal rule of about 2 - 3m above water when close to ... and not less than 10 - 15m when far out ... in fact as I go out further - I adjust height higher because of difficulty to see / know exactly what's going on.

Nigel
2017-12-6
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ICEBERG03
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solentlife Posted at 2017-12-6 05:56
Something that can affect flight behaviour but is rarely mentioned. Thermal / Flat Field Glider boys know it well.

Air sitting over different surfaces can have different temperature. It may only be a degree or so - but that can be enough to create UP and DOWN moving air mass. The Glider boys love corn fields / dark land mass which tends to create warm air rising and so they get a lift in the thermals. I have had my ASW or my older Golden Lady up for an hour at times with this.

Thank you Nigel for all the info.
It makes a perfect sense. BTW, I did my first over the water flight and it went great. Actually I did exactly what you are suggesting - slowly increasing hight as the drone flew further. It was a nerve-racking, but so exciting.
Thank you again,
Paul
2017-12-7
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ICEBERG03
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DJI Susan Posted at 2017-12-6 01:41
Hey Paul, keep certain distance above the water(at least more than 10 meters). More tips, please visit here: http://dl.djicdn.com/downloads/phantom_3/20170331/Phantom+3+Safety+Guidelines+and+Disclaimer+v1.4.pdf

Thanks DJI Susan,

yes, I always do keep at least 10 meters above the water. Especially while I am still learning.
Thanks again,
Paul
2017-12-7
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Peterx
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The P3S does´nt have any VPS .....or did you upgrade this bird with any VPS??  What water area is your flight area?
2017-12-8
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Epicdoom
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ICEBERG03 Posted at 2017-12-5 11:42
Hi Nigel,
thank you for your input.


as stated the P3S doesn't have VPS, However I have flown my P34K with VPS over water with zero issues, even flying just inches above the surface.  As to fear of flying over any water there will always be a fear of doing that at first. For me I bought the DJI drone to see things I cant get to by other means such as a fort in the middle of our harbor here in Baltimore. The flight distance to the fort from land is 4800ft It was scary yes, but my desire to see that fort was strong and I didn't buy the drone to see myself from overhead. Unfortunately the fort is off limits to boaters so the only way to see it up close is a drone. Flying over water. nothing to it. but to do it. I don't recommend it for the faint of heart but I'm not the type who is easily scared of things.  Yes I understand water effect and flight I do have a Private Pilots Lic and Have been flying RC for more then 30 years over land and water
2017-12-8
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solentlife
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No worries Epic ....

I fly a P3P and have no problem over water ... but I do not go inches above it ... unless I am very close by.

The VPS is known and even DJI advise about over water errors with it.
Having a P3S as well ... I am well aware of its lack of VPS ...

Nigel
2017-12-8
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Epicdoom
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solentlife Posted at 2017-12-8 05:53
No worries Epic ....

I fly a P3P and have no problem over water ... but I do not go inches above it ... unless I am very close by.

I was approx. 4 inches off the waters surface dead calm water, I was trying to see if I could look into the water with the camera at a bass that was swimming around lol I could see it when I leaned over the boat so I backed off and put the drone in the air. Thinking about it now it was rather silly, the prop wash was disturbing the water surface to bad to see anything below. haven't  flown My Pro over water yet, But I'm not worried about doing it in the least. Id bet many folks who dump they're drones in the water do so in panic. unfortunately the cure for panic, is time flying. I don't run the VPS system on my P34K or P3Pro its turned off. I have an indoor flight spot, but haven't been there with my DJI stuff. I usually fly small 1/72 scale scratch build RC planes at that location.  
2017-12-8
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solentlife
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The P3S would be safer in fact over disturbed water for the fact of no VPS. This is not only voiced by owners - but also DJI themselves - that VPS is not suitable over water, wavy long grass etc.

I find that VPS can make my P3P move about a bit when near to ground - so I prefer to go up a bit till VPS is no longer as strong influence ... over 2m and it significantly reduces ...

Nigel
2017-12-8
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Epicdoom
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good to know Brother.  I shut it down with the thought that somehow Id have a tad more battery time since its not using power for that feature. I used it one time on an uneven terrain where the terrain was dropping off like 1.5-2 foot drops the Drone followed it perfectly sinking into the lower sections to maintain the altitude I started off flying at. on gradual rise it did climb to maintain alt over the terrain. all I used was forward stick and let the VPS system follow the terrain on its own. was pretty cool to see it drop of the edge of the drop offs to maintain the altitude off the ground.

How high does it remain active and do as it should, have you figured that out yet? I wouldn't think it would have the power to sense more then 4-5 feet off the ground if they are the same sensors I use with Arduino projects they look like the same sensors, but they could be quite different.
2017-12-8
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DJI Susan
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ICEBERG03 Posted at 2017-12-7 11:48
Thanks DJI Susan,

yes, I always do keep at least 10 meters above the water. Especially while I am still learning.

You are welcome. Wish you have a good time on flying the drone. Don't forget to share your videos with us.
2017-12-10
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solentlife
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Its supposed to be accurate up to 2 -3m of the ground depending on what is surface. It can detect I believe up to 10m - but it is unreliable and virtually ineffective at that height.

So based on that and what I seem to observe ... it works to just over 3m ...

Nigel
2017-12-10
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