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MiniPalourde
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Canada
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Hey guys,
Mavic is basically a flying computer with its cooling fan and 24 computing cores. All this brain power is used for the 5 Obstacle Avoidance cameras and the VERY COMPLICATED intelligent flight modes such as Follow me, Active Track, Gesture Mode, Terrain Follow and Precision Landing.

But honestly those OA sensors are mostly for noobs. I mean they're a cool feature but no advanced pilots will tell you that it is "totally a life saver and a must". You can't rely on it, and in a LOT of conditions it's not going to work anyways ( low light, mavic too fast and branches per example).
Intelligent flight modes are pretty useless too. The most useful of them all are the ones that DO NOT require any brain power like TRIPOD mode.


DJI should make a smaller Mavic (mavic advanced) without any OA or intelligent flight modes that would be much smaller and cheaper because it would have less computing cores. It would also have a much better flight time because I'm sure these cores and cooling fan + their weight are taking a HUGE chunk of battery life.




2018-1-25
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Theppgcowboy
lvl.4
United States
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I would not make it lighter. Point if interest is nice. But I Am still new to quads.
2018-1-25
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Jenee 2
Captain
Flight distance : 7811854 ft
Australia
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What you are suggesting is already available by building your own quad. Very easy these days.
2018-1-25
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MiniPalourde
Second Officer
Flight distance : 7 ft
Canada
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Jenee 2 Posted at 2018-1-25 20:44
What you are suggesting is already available by building your own quad. Very easy these days.

Actually, no.


First of all, DJI mass produces their drones which greatly reduces the price of their materials. You cannot make a drone equivalent to the P3S for the same price.

Building a quad is not "very easy". You need to choose your parts wisely and it actually takes a fair amount of knowledge to do that. There are a lot of different parts and you need to understand what are the differences and what certain term represents. You need to adjust a lot of different setting like PID settings and correctly calibrate all your stuff. Also, not everybody has soldering skills and tools.



And my post is just an idea for a future drone because I find OA and IFMs totally useless. I don't actually want that drone.
2018-1-25
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DJI Elektra
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China
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Sir, thanks for your feedback. I would help you forward your idea.
2018-1-26
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Montfrooij
Captain
Flight distance : 1698205 ft
Netherlands
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Not sure how much more flight time you will get.
I think battling the gravity and moving forward will take more energy than powering the CPU and fan.
And the CPU will still be very busy keeping the bird steady in the air.
2018-1-26
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alex_markov
Captain
Flight distance : 9324301 ft
Bulgaria
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Good idea, But obstacle avoidance system is useful when the connection is interrupted and the drone is RTH, RTH itself is a Very good thing...
So brain power is required
2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
Second Officer
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Canada
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alex_markov Posted at 2018-1-26 03:23
Good idea, But obstacle avoidance system is useful when the connection is interrupted and the drone is RTH, RTH itself is a Very good thing...
So brain power is required

Or you can just set your RTH altitude to 100m and you'll be fine. RTH does not rely on OA or I'd have crashed many times.
2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
Second Officer
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Montfrooij Posted at 2018-1-26 02:13
Not sure how much more flight time you will get.
I think battling the gravity and moving forward will take more energy than powering the CPU and fan.
And the CPU will still be very busy keeping the bird steady in the air.

As we have seen with tiny whoops, even a tiny computer is capable of keeping the bird steady in the air.


Of course motors take more power than CPUs, but you'd still get a much longer flight time
2018-1-26
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sica
First Officer
Flight distance : 679 ft
Israel
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there are enough drone videos on youtube that have a very poor processor but have GPS and barometer. Costs 100..200 $ and after they take off only a few meters with wind very easy they get crazy and do not have direction .. barely can be controlled from RC ... etc. Let's be serious ! MP is a miracle of technique (I mean drone) and nothing is useless from all the electronics that equips it !!!
2018-1-26
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Vincent.
Second Officer
Flight distance : 459738 ft
United States
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I think selling a "intelligent" drone is easier to sell it to many of the casual customers. Why would you want a drone without any security, when you can have it nowadays ? And even if I don't use them often, I'm still glad they're here. I might not use the protection, but the downward vision sensor helps me a lot to know if I'm too close to the ground when the drone is away from me.
2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
Second Officer
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Canada
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Vincent. Posted at 2018-1-26 07:43
I think selling a "intelligent" drone is easier to sell it to many of the casual customers. Why would you want a drone without any security, when you can have it nowadays ? And even if I don't use them often, I'm still glad they're here. I might not use the protection, but the downward vision sensor helps me a lot to know if I'm too close to the ground when the drone is away from me.

"Why would you want a drone without any security, when you can have it nowadays ?"

Because it adds a LOT of weight and takes a lot of power from the battery. All of this reduces flight time considerably and reduces the speed of the quad.
2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
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sica Posted at 2018-1-26 07:41
there are enough drone videos on youtube that have a very poor processor but have GPS and barometer. Costs 100..200 $ and after they take off only a few meters with wind very easy they get crazy and do not have direction .. barely can be controlled from RC ... etc. Let's be serious ! MP is a miracle of technique (I mean drone) and nothing is useless from all the electronics that equips it !!!

GPS does NOT require lots of brain power.   If you actually built a quad you would know that a tiny FC with iNav and a GPS chip is enough to stabilise the quad perfectly.
2018-1-26
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Wirezfree
Second Officer
Flight distance : 17999 ft
United Kingdom
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Build your own Mavic Look-Alike without the fancy bits, instruction included
2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
Second Officer
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Canada
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Wirezfree Posted at 2018-1-26 08:38
Build your own Mavic Look-Alike  without the fancy bits, instruction included

Doesn't have 4K camera or gimbal and I doubt it is good. Probably has a 7 minutes flight time.

This is a trash quadcopter with a mavic skin
2018-1-26
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Wirezfree
Second Officer
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United Kingdom
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The cost of the parts to "dumb" down a mavic will be minimal in terms of overall assembly & labour costs, even in China.
Then new firmware to miss out stuff, new version of DJI GO 4 App "To Not" enable features or have less config

Sounds like it ending up being more expensive "special"

2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
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Wirezfree Posted at 2018-1-26 09:04
The cost of the parts to "dumb" down a mavic will be minimal in terms of overall assembly & labour costs, even in China.
Then new firmware to miss out stuff, new version of DJI GO 4 App "To Not" enable features or have less config

I'm not talking of labour costs. I'm talking of the cost of these CPUs/cooling fan themselves and how it affects the performance/design of the drone as a whole.

Without all this computing power, DJI could also change the battery for a smaller one and install less powerful motors because of the minimized weight. You'd get a MUCH cheaper Mavic. I'm sorry but there is no denying that 24 CPUs and a cooling fan inside a 734 grams quadcopter is a real battery drainer.
2018-1-26
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Wirezfree
Second Officer
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I understand the "leave bits out" But you cannot just leave bit's out.
It a whole new line, and tooling etc etc for a limited market, low numbers = "Higher Cost"
2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
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Wirezfree Posted at 2018-1-26 09:31
I understand the "leave bits out" But you cannot just leave bit's out.
It a whole new line, and tooling etc etc for a limited market, low numbers = "Higher Cost"

What makes you think it would be for a limited market? The P3S sold very well
2018-1-26
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Vincent.
Second Officer
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United States
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MiniPalourde Posted at 2018-1-26 09:42
What makes you think it would be for a limited market? The P3S sold very well

Because it was the most advanced drone of his time, not because he was "basic" compared to other things. People who want something cheap will go for a Spark
2018-1-26
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Wirezfree
Second Officer
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Because DJI haven't brought such a thing to the market

I think DJI have a pretty good handle on the market.
Once they have sweated the market with Mavic variants,
and maybe a new Spark variant... Maybe then, possibly.?
2018-1-26
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sica
First Officer
Flight distance : 679 ft
Israel
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MiniPalourde Posted at 2018-1-26 09:22
I'm not talking of labour costs. I'm talking of the cost of these CPUs/cooling fan themselves and how it affects the performance/design of the drone as a whole.

Without all this computing power, DJI could also change the battery for a smaller one and install less powerful motors because of the minimized weight. You'd get a MUCH cheaper Mavic. I'm sorry but there is no denying that 24 CPUs and a cooling fan inside a 734 grams quadcopter is a real battery drainer.

Friend ... we're in 2018! Leave the 24 core of the processor! In a few years we'll talk to the drones. You tell him where to fly and when to return home. No other manual settings! I hope DJI will remain among the first to do this!
2018-1-26
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Wirezfree
Second Officer
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sica Posted at 2018-1-26 10:00
Friend ... we're in 2018! Leave the 24 core of the processor! In a few years we'll talk to the drones. You tell him where to fly and when to return home. No other manual settings! I hope DJI will remain among the first to do this!

I hope they build a "breathalyser" in it...
Don't want to send it on a dubious mission after a few drinks
2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
Second Officer
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sica Posted at 2018-1-26 10:00
Friend ... we're in 2018! Leave the 24 core of the processor! In a few years we'll talk to the drones. You tell him where to fly and when to return home. No other manual settings! I hope DJI will remain among the first to do this!

I mean sure if you're gonna do something actually useful with them, CPUs don't bother me. Problem is, IFMs and OA aren't really useful to a lot of persons.
2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
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Vincent. Posted at 2018-1-26 09:57
Because it was the most advanced drone of his time, not because he was "basic" compared to other things. People who want something cheap will go for a Spark

People still buy the P3S. As it is basic (no OA and this kinda stuff), DJI was able to give it great performance for a low price. Not everyone can put 1000$ on a drone so the P3S is a really great alternative.


Spark is a TOY. It has a 2 axis gimbal, a fight time under 12 minutes, uses WIFI, and does not have 4K. It's just a toy.
2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
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Wirezfree Posted at 2018-1-26 09:59
Because DJI haven't brought such a thing to the market

I think DJI have a pretty good handle on the market.

What I'm talking about is a Mavic variant. The Mavic Air sold very well so there's no reason a Mavic advanced wouldn't sell well.
2018-1-26
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Vincent.
Second Officer
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United States
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MiniPalourde Posted at 2018-1-26 10:20
People still buy the P3S. Because it's basic (no OA and this kinda stuff), it has great performance for a low price. Not everyone can put 1000$ on a drone so the P3S is a really great alternative.

Yes, people but people like that are a minority. The current target of DJI are the people that goes into a Best Buy, and take a spark / mavic to take family pictures, and if there's a lot of "intelligent" things on the box, it's one more reason to buy it  

As far as I remember, the P3S does not goes further than 500m, and doesn't film in 4k neither
2018-1-26
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Vincent.
Second Officer
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MiniPalourde Posted at 2018-1-26 10:20
People still buy the P3S. As it is basic (no OA and this kinda stuff), DJI was able to give it great performance for a low price. Not everyone can put 1000$ on a drone so the P3S is a really great alternative.

Yes, people but people like that are a minority. The current target of DJI are the people that goes into a Best Buy, and take a spark / mavic to take family pictures, and if there's a lot of "intelligent" things on the box, it's one more reason to buy it  

As far as I remember, the P3S does not goes further than 500m, and doesn't film in 4k neither
2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
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Vincent. Posted at 2018-1-26 10:26
Yes, people but people like that are a minority. The current target of DJI are the people that goes into a Best Buy, and take a spark / mavic to take family pictures, and if there's a lot of "intelligent" things on the box, it's one more reason to buy it  

As far as I remember, the P3S does not goes further than 500m, and doesn't film in 4k neither

The P3S goes farther than 500m lol. That's the range of the Mavic air and it uses WIFI.

I mean that the Spark has 1080P only. The P3S has 2.7k (a lot of mavic owners use 2.7k on their drone instead of 4k)

I don't think the Mavic Air is available on Best Buy yet and the Mavic forum is flooded of people who bought it. Most buys are online.
2018-1-26
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Vincent.
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MiniPalourde Posted at 2018-1-26 10:28
The P3S goes farther than 500m lol. That's the range of the Mavic air and it uses WIFI.

I mean that the Spark has 1080P only. The P3S has 2.7k (a lot of mavic owners use 2.7k on their drone instead of 4k)

My cousin owns one, and with EC rules he got 500m and choppy video feed after 150m.
If you're really looking for something cheap, the 1080p from the spark is enough.

The forum is really nothing. The mavic serie is aimed to casual really.Maybe 20% are comparing, but the others are like apple buyers, they go in the shop and they pick the better looking one
2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
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Vincent. Posted at 2018-1-26 10:35
My cousin owns one, and with EC rules he got 500m and choppy video feed after 150m.
If you're really looking for something cheap, the 1080p from the spark is enough.

Ouch... your cousin must be in a place with lots of intererence. i'm surprised that your heads haven't exploded yet.

If you get 150m with the P3S, you'll get like 40m with the spark.

There's no denying that the spark is grealty inferior to the P3S. Just the WIFI and 10 minutes flight time is a HUGE turn-off. 10 minutes is not enough. You're also limited with the 2 axis gimbal.
2018-1-26
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Vincent.
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MiniPalourde Posted at 2018-1-26 10:38
Ouch... your cousin must be in a place with lots of intererence. i'm surprised that your heads haven't exploded yet.

If you get 150m with the P3S, you'll get like 40m with the spark.

"Max Transmission Distance
FCC: 1000 m; CE: 500 m (outdoors and unobstructed, aircraft's altitude at 400 feet (120 m)) "

Are we talking about the same drone ? That is on the official DJI website, and guess what ? The video transmission is also in WiFI. This was in the country, and I went at 2km with my Mavic without any problems, so my head's fine.

Well, I agree a "vanish" version would be interesting, but I don't see DJI doing that any time soon.
2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
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Vincent. Posted at 2018-1-26 10:44
"Max Transmission Distance
FCC: 1000 m; CE: 500 m (outdoors and unobstructed, aircraft's altitude at 400 feet (120 m)) "

Well I didn't know the CE restricted range that much. Here in Canada we are getting far more than 150 meters with our P3S's. Most of the drone sells are in North America and soon it will be in Asia so these restrictions doesn't affect most users.


2018-1-26
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Oracle Miata
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The P3S is a WIFI drone just like the Spark.  And the Spark is an infinitely better flyer.  All day every day and twice on Tuesdays. I'll even wager to say that the Sparks unedited auto 1080P looks better then the P3S's 2.7.
2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
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Oracle Miata Posted at 2018-1-26 11:06
The P3S is a WIFI drone just like the Spark.  And the Spark is an infinitely better flyer.  All day every day and twice on Tuesdays. I'll even wager to say that the Sparks unedited auto 1080P looks better then the P3S's 2.7.

infinitely better flyer for 10 tiny minutes lol


Anyways this thread is getting off-topic this is supposed to be about Mavic's OA and IFMs
2018-1-26
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HyLenz
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Flight distance : 1848182 ft
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Not sure there would be a big market, but an option to get a "custom appointed" Mavic would be cool, IMO, but i would not want to sacrifice safety, personal or to the drone. I have 1 year (today, in fact) of Mavic Pro flying, about 300 flights and i have never used RTH. And OA has never saved me. in fact, the most dangerous situations i have experienced were when OA did not help. Power lines and tree branches are pretty much invisible to it, and they are the most common obstacles your drone will ever need to avoid. I will say that OA as it works with RTH is a comfort to know it's there, but it's like the emergency brake on my car, which I've never used...ever.

So yes, I would trade OA for flight time, or some other better option, but i would still like to know the RTH would work properly. 100m on RTH can be dangerous as the wind will generally be stronger up there...
2018-1-26
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Montfrooij
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MiniPalourde Posted at 2018-1-26 07:28
As we have seen with tiny whoops, even a tiny computer is capable of keeping the bird steady in the air.

I totally agree that OA is not high on my list, but my point is that leaving that out won't matter a lot battery wise.
You can just turn it off right?
If they programmed the FW right, it should skip those parts.

2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
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Montfrooij Posted at 2018-1-26 14:23
I totally agree that OA is not high on my list, but my point is that leaving that out won't matter a lot battery wise.
You can just turn it off right?
If they programmed the FW right, it should skip those parts.

OA takes a lot of battery power because it requires lots of CPU. Turning it off will do nothing.

More CPUs also equals more weight
2018-1-26
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Wirezfree
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MiniPalourde Posted at 2018-1-26 10:24
What I'm talking about is a Mavic variant. The Mavic Air sold very well so there's no reason a Mavic advanced wouldn't sell well.


I know you are talking Mavic Variant. I really don't see it myself...
Get another Mavic, enable debug mode in Assistant 2 , Then you can change many, many things.

Out of interest you say Mavic Air sold very well. Apart from testers and a few celebrities on YouTube
None have shipped yet..??
2018-1-26
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MiniPalourde
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Wirezfree Posted at 2018-1-26 15:11
I know you are talking Mavic Variant. I really don't see it myself...
Get another Mavic, enable debug mode in Assistant 2 , Then you can change many, many things.

You're telling me I can remove the cooling fan and 20 CPUs with debug mode in assistant 2? WOW I didn't knew that...
2018-1-26
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