COMPASS ERROR AND ATTI MODE - QUICK QUESTION
4070 19 2018-3-26
Uploading and Loding Picture ...(0/1)
o(^-^)o
Gerardo Rejec
lvl.3
Flight distance : 120141 ft
United States
Offline

Hi all!   quick and simple question. I have seen some people crashing their drones when they get compass error message.  Some crash cause they cant fly ATTI, some crash cause they
kept it in GPS , some say they crashed their drones cause even though they switched to ATTI mode  they said the drone was still uncontrollable .

The question is, Can the drone be controlled in ATTI mode after compass error>? or once compass error shows up, one just must start praying it wont crash on somebody's child's head?

Thanks !!!!
2018-3-26
Use props
Phantom Help
Captain
Flight distance : 228255 ft
  • >>>
United States
Offline

It depends. If some kind of magnetic metal object is negatively affecting the compass, you might not be able to control the Phantom after it takes off. To prevent such a situation, it would be best to confirm the compass is not being negatively affected before taking off.

Here are a few best practices:

- Verify DJI GO is not displaying a compass related error
- Keep in mind that DJI GO will not always show a compass error when the compass is being negatively affected
- Don't power on the Phantom until it's sitting on the ground at the takeoff location
- When powering on the Phantom, make sure it's not sitting in a location that's near magnetic metal objects (e.g. on a concrete sidewalk)
- While the Phantom is sitting on the ground and getting ready to take off, watch the red aircraft symbol on the map in DJI GO to make sure it's not slowly spinning (which is a sign of compass interference)
- Follow the other best practices in this guide
2018-3-26
Use props
DJI Susan
Administrator
Offline

Hey Gerardo. it is recommended to do a fully pre-flight checklist in every flight. Keep away from the interference source and crowded place if applicable. Also, flying in ATTI mode requires high skills, it will be better to practice in ATTI mode in advance.
2018-3-26
Use props
Bashy
Captain
Flight distance : 2354357 ft
  • >>>
United Kingdom
Offline

Even a preflight does not always pick up a compass error, when i took off from my sunroof as seen from this link you can see the perfect semi circle, that was me fighting with it to bring it back, go to the notifications tab, you will see in the list that it didnt give me the compass error until after i took off, by that point it was too late, it shot off to the left...... added an image in case you cannot view the link over in China, ifinally got full control back after L

2018-3-26
Use props
Dioden
lvl.4
Sweden
Offline

DJI Susan Posted at 2018-3-26 19:02
Hey Gerardo. it is recommended to do a fully pre-flight checklist in every flight. Keep away from the interference source and crowded place if applicable. Also, flying in ATTI mode requires high skills, it will be better to practice in ATTI mode in advance.

A few days ago, I found myself in the same problem, all the sudden it says, “compass error” and auto changing to ATTI mode, got me a little bit worried. My P3P was around 1000 meters away from the start point. So, I pressed “home” -button, it came home but it was a little bit windy and because of that it drifted with the wind.

Was a heavy job to get it down, and not so easy to fly in ATTI mode when people are not use to it. I got it down but hit a tree a few meters up, so one propeller got busted.
2018-3-27
Use props
Mark The Droner
First Officer
Flight distance : 2917 ft
United States
Offline

There is no one answer because "compass error" covers too many compass issues from minor to major.  
2018-3-27
Use props
Gerardo Rejec
lvl.3
Flight distance : 120141 ft
United States
Offline

Bashy Posted at 2018-3-26 20:53
Even a preflight does not always pick up a compass error, when i took off from my sunroof as seen from this link you can see the perfect semi circle, that was me fighting with it to bring it back, go to the notifications tab, you will see in the list that it didnt give me the compass error until after i took off, by that point it was too late, it shot off to the left...... added an image in case you cannot view the link over in China, ifinally got full control back after L

[view_image]

That's a scary one!
2018-3-27
Use props
Gerardo Rejec
lvl.3
Flight distance : 120141 ft
United States
Offline

Mark The Droner Posted at 2018-3-27 04:15
There is no one answer because "compass error" covers too many compass issues from minor to major.

I see..  well I never got a compass error message..  but I always dreaded it!  I wish there was a way to still control the unit even with compass error.. like some way in which the unit turnes the  compass completely off and just goes with what is left , right, backwards and forward. As if it was a simple RC Helicopter...I wonder why this is not possible?

I believe this could have avoided many crashes and scary situations.
2018-3-27
Use props
Gerardo Rejec
lvl.3
Flight distance : 120141 ft
United States
Offline

Bashy Posted at 2018-3-26 20:53
Even a preflight does not always pick up a compass error, when i took off from my sunroof as seen from this link you can see the perfect semi circle, that was me fighting with it to bring it back, go to the notifications tab, you will see in the list that it didnt give me the compass error until after i took off, by that point it was too late, it shot off to the left...... added an image in case you cannot view the link over in China, ifinally got full control back after L

[view_image]

Could you elaborate on why was it hard to control the unit?  what was hard about it while it gave you the compass error>?  It didnt react to your inputs? you tried to fly forward and it went backwards?   how did you manage to control it if that was the case>?  Sorry for all the questions, I would just like to know what  to expect if it ever happens to me
2018-3-27
Use props
Bashy
Captain
Flight distance : 2354357 ft
  • >>>
United Kingdom
Offline

It will be different on a per flight basis dependent on why the error has occurred, which way the craft was facing etc, for all i know, i didnt do anything at all and it just came back round to me, i cannot even  remember what stick i used in this case. What you do will  be dependent on your skill level, i was/am down on level 1 lol
2018-3-27
Use props
DJI Susan
Administrator
Offline

Dioden Posted at 2018-3-27 03:43
A few days ago, I found myself in the same problem, all the sudden it says, “compass error” and auto changing to ATTI mode, got me a little bit worried. My P3P was around 1000 meters away from the start point. So, I pressed “home” -button, it came home but it was a little bit windy and because of that it drifted with the wind.

Was a heavy job to get it down, and not so easy to fly in ATTI mode when people are not use to it. I got it down but hit a tree a few meters up, so one propeller got busted.

Thanks for sharing with us your story. Luckily, the drone did not suffer too much damage at that time. Safe flying!
2018-3-28
Use props
endotherm
First Officer
Flight distance : 503241 ft

Australia
Offline

Compass error messages get a bad rap around here.  They are not as critical as you are making out. A "compass error" is just the system telling you that the data from the compass isn't making sense, and is unreliable.  This could be because it was set up and calibrated incorrectly on the ground, or has flown into an area of disturbance.  The aircraft's altitude is determined by a barometric altimeter, so it isn't going to change altitude due to a change in a different sensor in another sub-system.   This doesn't cause the aircraft to catch fire or explode, or tumble out of the sky.  If you think people are crashing drones and they are falling out of the sky because of a compass error, you would be very wrong.  It would be due to flying in an unfamiliar mode and not being competent, i.e. pilot error.

Compasses don't get along with iron or ferromagnetic materials like steel and other metals and ores.  If you get too close it will upset the compass, which is a device that reacts to and indicates magnetic fields.  If you are hiking and using a handheld compass to navigate, you will be reading the magnetic influences of the Earth.  If you suddenly walk next to a radio tower or under a structure, you might find your compass goes crazy for the duration.  You ignore the readings for the moment because you know they are unreliable, and know that they will return when you clear the interference.  You are not going to explode or fall to the ground!  This is the same with your drone.  

There are two main failures --  flying into a disturbance (e.g. getting close to a steel tower or power line pylon), or taking off from a disturbance (which has been accepted as "normal") and flying into an unaffected space.  Both will return a "compass error".  The first case is pretty self-explanatory.  The second case usually occurs if you take off somewhere close to metal or ferro-magnetic materials.  Taking off from your car's boot or hood, or even your sunroof is pretty stupid.  Your campass is already being affected and returning bad data.  Another bad launch site is when taking off from concrete footpaths/slabs, because they will have rebar reinforcement embedded in them.  Same for other unknowns like roads and other manmade structures.  It is recommended to setup and operate from a clear, natural area, where it is unlikely you will be affected by magnetic fields.  What confuses a lot of people is why they can calibrate and set up on one of these "bad" areas but have little or no problem.  The problem is that metal can be a strong or weak magnet, or their orientation may closely resemble the Earth's field and appear non-existent, or their orientation is highly contradictory to the Earth's (e.g. its S pole facing north, and N facing south).  When calibrating on top of another magnet, you are basically offsetting the planet's N and S poles from their true position, to appear in say London and Sydney instead!  This offset might be by a lot, or some insignificant amount.  In the latter case, your aircraft will appear to calibrate correctly.  When you take off and clear this disturbance, you are now only registering the planet's true field, which will be different from the reading you set when on the ground.  The aircraft will tell you the compass data is unreliable, because it knows something is wrong, but doesn't know which one is right.  It ignores the compass data and switches the aircraft to ATTI.

The problem is that we are spoilt by flying in GPS mode.  The aircraft is doing 90% of the flying for you.  It is making dozens of control changes every second, in response to wind etc.  If  you want to fly in a straight line, just point it in that direction and push the stick forward.  Most people don't consider the micro corrections the aircraft is making to keep it level, and counteract the wind.  When that assistance is removed, most people are thrown into an unfamiliar world.  Their 10% ability isn't enough to pilot the aircraft properly!  They will notice the aircraft moving by itself, not sitting still like it is used to.  It is not running away with a mind of its own, it is being blown by the wind.  You need to power and steer into the wind manually yourself to hold position, then worry about where you want to go on top of that.  Your workload and stress levels go way up.

The compass is one of the sensors, along with GPS, which is used to determine your position, heading and course.  It can be upset by magnetic interference.  The system is smart enough to know when the compass data isn't making sense, and ignores it until it is reliable again.   GPS mode requires a reliable compass and adequate GPS signal reception.  If those conditions don't exist, it makes no sense to let the GPS flight mode to make decisions for flying the aircraft, does it?  The aircraft will automatically switch to ATTI mode for the duration of the failure, then return back to GPS mode (assuming you aren't manually selecting and flying in manual mode).   You don't have to manually switch it in and out of ATTI mode, it will happen automatically.  If you leave it in GPS mode, it will resume by itself when conditions improve.  It is perfectly fine and safe to fly it this way.  There is no problem flying in ATTI mode either, it is essentially the same thing as GPS mode, except there aren't all the micro corrections being made for you to maintain position.  You have to allow for, and make adjustments for the wind.  An inexperienced pilot will say it is "uncontrollable" because they are probably flying in conditions close to the aircraft's capabilities, in wind that is too strong.  The aircraft will appear to be not responding to their inputs.  Even if the compass isn't reading properly, you can still fly.  You can move forwards/backwards/left/right/up/down and rotate.  You can counter the wind.  You can fly in whatever direction you choose.  You just won't be able to navigate properly.

In ATTI mode, the compass is effectively ignored and not used to "hold" the aircraft.  You can move left, right, forward, backwards just like a simple RC helicopter (which is essentially flying in its own ATTI mode!)  which would be much harder than flying one of our drones.  So it is possible, and was already included by design.
2018-3-28
Use props
Eric13
Second Officer
Flight distance : 13982031 ft
  • >>>
Offline

endotherm Posted at 2018-3-28 02:43
Compass error messages get a bad rap around here.  They are not as critical as you are making out. A "compass error" is just the system telling you that the data from the compass isn't making sense, and is unreliable.  This could be because it was set up and calibrated incorrectly on the ground, or has flown into an area of disturbance.  The aircraft's altitude is determined by a barometric altimeter, so it isn't going to change altitude due to a change in a different sensor in another sub-system.   This doesn't cause the aircraft to catch fire or explode, or tumble out of the sky.  If you think people are crashing drones and they are falling out of the sky because of a compass error, you would be very wrong.  It would be due to flying in an unfamiliar mode and not being competent, i.e. pilot error.

Compasses don't get along with iron or ferromagnetic materials like steel and other metals and ores.  If you get too close it will upset the compass, which is a device that reacts to and indicates magnetic fields.  If you are hiking and using a handheld compass to navigate, you will be reading the magnetic influences of the Earth.  If you suddenly walk next to a radio tower or under a structure, you might find your compass goes crazy for the duration.  You ignore the readings for the moment because you know they are unreliable, and know that they will return when you clear the interference.  You are not going to explode or fall to the ground!  This is the same with your drone.  

Ha, Ha - Endotherm - I always like your explanations.
Took me one cigarette and a mug of coffee to read it though.

Question:
Would you know if wind power plants are communicating by WiFi? Maybe the companies can read their performance that way? Recently I was approaching a whole park of like 20 of these huge propellers and
I kept loosing signal as I got close. I was flying at 2.4. I didn't want to switch channels in mid-air...

(Sorry if that is off-topic)
2018-3-28
Use props
Labroides
Core User of DJI
Flight distance : 9991457 ft
  • >>>
Australia
Online

Eric13 Posted at 2018-3-28 03:19
Ha, Ha - Endotherm - I always like your explanations.
Took me one cigarette and a mug coffee to read it though.

I didn't want to switch channels in mid-air...
There's no problem switching channels mid-air.
If you run into interference, it will probably make things better.
The Phantom won't have any problem keeping signal while you do.
2018-3-28
Use props
hallmark007
Captain
Flight distance : 9827923 ft
  • >>>
Ireland
Offline

Can a drone be controlled in Atti mode, yes it can but it can be extremely difficult with no gps and poor compass, if your aircraft is out of VLOS again you may get disoriented,

Although it is controllable it’s not as easy as those who think that it’s the same as just switching to Atti mode and flying around practicing, well it’s not anything like that with compass problem your Aircraft starts to act like it’s violently out of control, all stick movements must be 100% , but if in VLOS your first reaction should always be to lower aircraft to land unless it’s not safe or over water.

Why would a compass error disable GPS?
Orientation (compass data) and position (GPS data) are different but related.
When the P4Pro is moving and getting position information from the GPS that tells the P4Pro that it is travelling in a different direction from what it's getting from compass data, The P4Pro programming can't work with the data conflict.
The solution is to drop data from one source and since the P4Pro can't fly without a compass but can without GPS, it's the GPS data that gets dropped.

Phantom 3’s the same.
2018-3-28
Use props
hallmark007
Captain
Flight distance : 9827923 ft
  • >>>
Ireland
Offline

Eric13 Posted at 2018-3-28 03:19
Ha, Ha - Endotherm - I always like your explanations.
Took me one cigarette and a mug coffee to read it though.


As far as I know wind turbines particularly newer versions operate on their own independent WiFi networks but only for updates performance input output warnings  wind speeds etc , so it should not effect you flying in 2.4 ghz, I use 2.4 ghz and can often be as close as five meters when turbines are turned off, the also pack a huge steel and metal structure inside but seem to be shielded by fiber glass outer core on the blades and main tower, because I almost have never had magnetic interference, frequency , or any other issues with flying close to or around them.
2018-3-28
Use props
Labroides
Core User of DJI
Flight distance : 9991457 ft
  • >>>
Australia
Online

hallmark007 Posted at 2018-3-28 15:36
As far as I know wind turbines particularly newer versions operate on their own independent WiFi networks but only for updates performance input output warnings  wind speeds etc , so it should not effect you flying in 2.4 ghz, I use 2.4 ghz and can often be as close as five meters when turbines are turned off, the also pack a huge steel and metal structure inside but seem to be shielded by fiber glass outer core on the blades and main tower, because I almost have never had magnetic interference, frequency , or any other issues with flying close to or around them.

also pack a huge steel and metal structure inside but seem to be shielded by fiber glass outer core on the blades and main tower
Fibreglass wouldn't have any shielding effect but the blades and nacelle are made of fiber-reinforced epoxy  with no steel anyway.
The tower is probably steel but you would have to be pretty close to have any issues there.
2018-3-28
Use props
Gerardo Rejec
lvl.3
Flight distance : 120141 ft
United States
Offline

hallmark007 Posted at 2018-3-28 15:04
Can a drone be controlled in Atti mode, yes it can but it can be extremely difficult with no gps and poor compass, if your aircraft is out of VLOS again you may get disoriented,

Although it is controllable it’s not as easy as those who think that it’s the same as just switching to Atti mode and flying around practicing, well it’s not anything like that with compass problem your Aircraft starts to act like it’s violently out of control, all stick movements must be 100% , but if in VLOS your first reaction should always be to lower aircraft to land unless it’s not safe or over water.

I understand. As you said, some people say that it would be the same as flying in ATTI mode and that those who have experienced  compass error and crashed was purely because they panicked. And others like you say it is nothing like flying in Atti mode. This is why I posted this question. Thank you.
2018-4-9
Use props
Geebax
Captain
Australia
Offline

hallmark007 Posted at 2018-3-28 15:36
As far as I know wind turbines particularly newer versions operate on their own independent WiFi networks but only for updates performance input output warnings  wind speeds etc , so it should not effect you flying in 2.4 ghz, I use 2.4 ghz and can often be as close as five meters when turbines are turned off, the also pack a huge steel and metal structure inside but seem to be shielded by fiber glass outer core on the blades and main tower, because I almost have never had magnetic interference, frequency , or any other issues with flying close to or around them.

I doubt that power generating wind turbines use any form of WiFi, for one simple reason, they are already wired into a power network in order to deliver their output, so it would take no extra effort to install a fibre control connection. Also, WiFi is regarded as a non-essential consumer grade communications medium, and I feel certain power companies would want a better network than that.
2018-4-9
Use props
andy10
lvl.4
Flight distance : 4585692 ft
  • >>>
Slovenia
Offline

endotherm Posted at 2018-3-28 02:43
Compass error messages get a bad rap around here.  They are not as critical as you are making out. A "compass error" is just the system telling you that the data from the compass isn't making sense, and is unreliable.  This could be because it was set up and calibrated incorrectly on the ground, or has flown into an area of disturbance.  The aircraft's altitude is determined by a barometric altimeter, so it isn't going to change altitude due to a change in a different sensor in another sub-system.   This doesn't cause the aircraft to catch fire or explode, or tumble out of the sky.  If you think people are crashing drones and they are falling out of the sky because of a compass error, you would be very wrong.  It would be due to flying in an unfamiliar mode and not being competent, i.e. pilot error.

Compasses don't get along with iron or ferromagnetic materials like steel and other metals and ores.  If you get too close it will upset the compass, which is a device that reacts to and indicates magnetic fields.  If you are hiking and using a handheld compass to navigate, you will be reading the magnetic influences of the Earth.  If you suddenly walk next to a radio tower or under a structure, you might find your compass goes crazy for the duration.  You ignore the readings for the moment because you know they are unreliable, and know that they will return when you clear the interference.  You are not going to explode or fall to the ground!  This is the same with your drone.  

Excellent explanation. This should be cited at each of compass related posts which are pretty frequent here so nobody will live in doubt any more.
I would like to add that this is one of reasons why is wise to fly in visual range. If you don't see the AC and you're not sure at which direction the camera is pointing, you'll be in trouble in ATTI mode.
2019-5-12
Use props
Advanced
You need to log in before you can reply Login | Register now

Credit Rules