ulfw Posted at 2018-9-10 09:16
They don't care one bit, having left their Mavic Air buggy since May just to work on the next-best-thing-to-sell. I surely won't be upgrading to another DJI drone in the short term, and definitely not a Mavic.

What issues are you running into that you are waiting to be fixed?

ulfw Posted at 2018-9-10 09:16
They don't care one bit, having left their Mavic Air buggy since May just to work on the next-best-thing-to-sell. I surely won't be upgrading to another DJI drone in the short term, and definitely not a Mavic.

I can relate to that.

They ARE going to find out, to their detriment, that poor customer support spreads like wild fire and like you said "No more DJI"

SirPasta117 Posted at 2018-9-10 08:35
I bet any work was delayed while teams worked on the Mavic Pro 2. Now thats its out I'm hoping the Air gets a little more love. I haven't had any issues or disconnects like other people have had so I can't make any recommendations for bugs that need fix. I would like to see waypoints and hyperlapse added, as well as course/home lock.

I bet any work was delayed while teams worked on the Mavic Pro 2. Now thats its out I'm hoping the Air gets a little more love.

I hope so to for all Mavic Air owners who DJI left in a pseduo Catch-22 situation.  Mavic Air owners could not revert to .0300 FW.  DJI failed to produce .0500 (or a .040x).

Still, teams working on Mavic Pro 2 is absolutely no excuse.  DJI is Billion Dollar company, with enough resources to have teams continue to Fix bugs in existing products, while another Team works on Mavic Pro 2.

There is one other reason I hope to see Mavic Air owners get a Firmware update that resolves current .0400 issues or opens door to rollback to .0300 - that is, very high potential same issue will spill over to Mavic Pro 1.  Which has been big disappointment when it comes to reliability and flyability.

KlooGee Posted at 2018-9-10 09:37
No need to apologize.  What I'm trying to get to is this....

What specific problems are you running into?  You mention it is buggy and want it fixed, but I'm curious as to the specific problems you are running into that you are wanting DJI to fix.  

Thanks.

I contacted them directly and through this forum about the sluggishness (does not respond to controls as it was before the firmware upgrade) as well as drifting (also after the firmware upgrade). Me thinks that they hide behind misunderstanding one`s requests. All the while perfectly understanding but just wanting to get as many units to sell out there.

You know that there is a new possible trade ban for contravening copyright? When did the Chinese worry about copyright.  There are many Chinese industries built exactly on the fact that they reverse engineer and copy international patents.  Re-brand and sell for cheaper. I`m NOT saying that it is the case with DJI but...........

KlooGee Posted at 2018-9-10 07:01
I'm sorry, you are right.  It is much better to just scream "FIX IT!" without actually providing any details at all.  That is definitely going to help get an issue resolved.

I do like that you've provided specific examples of how DJI can help us to help them.  That is productive and exactly what I'm saying we all need to do.  I'm not sure if they will actually listen, but like I said, if we don't communicate specifics, how will they ever know what we would like?

Let me throw another example at you (and Lord knows it has been vehemently suggested).

DJI issued Mavic Air .0400 Firmware with a Lockout on Rollback.  Throughout my days of working on cutting edge hardware, I have never run into a Firmware update that could not be rolled back by loading previous Firmware updates.  Nothing comes to mind that Firmware can do to hardware that causes it to be permanently stuck at last loaded Firmware revision.  To do so would imply Firmware has ability to physically modify hardware.   As in Firmware issuing a set of CAM instructions to automated milling machine to grind on its self.   Moving on...

By DJI blocking rollbacks of Mavic Air from .0400 to say .0300.  It took away one of ways Mavic Air owners could possibly have provided additional information, building on ability for customers to provide very specific details as to problems experienced.

If Mavic Air owners could rollback, then would have been able to find out whether their problems went away or stayed.  By being rollback to say .0300 FW, then cusotmers could re-update to .0400.  Allowing Mavic Air owners to find out if there problems came back or not.  The 'not' part being important as it relates to DJI's ongoing suggestions of refreshing FW sometimes solving problems.   With refresing Firmware sometimes solving problems, it points to there being serious issues with DJI's Firmware Installation program / process.

I submit that to provide the very specific details, DJI needs to work with us to enable us to do so.

HedgeTrimmer Posted at 2018-9-10 10:30
Let me throw another example at you (and Lord knows it has been vehemently suggested).

DJI issued Mavic Air .0400 Firmware with a Lockout on Rollback.  Throughout my days of working on cutting edge hardware, I have never run into a Firmware update that could not be rolled back by loading previous Firmware updates.  Nothing comes to mind that Firmware can do to hardware that causes it to be permanently stuck at last loaded Firmware revision.  To do so would imply Firmware has ability to physically modify hardware.   As in Firmware issuing a set of CAM instructions to automated milling machine to grind on its self.   Moving on...

Here is a suggestion to help enable us.

DJI provide backup and restore program for various products.  With ability to backup & restore: 1) Firmware, 2) User Settings, 3) Firmware and User Settings, and 4) Full reset to Factory defaults - as product left DJI.

Now imagine how useful such a tool could be.

User with a problem makes a Full back up of everything (#3).  Then load latest Firmware (which has been known to change user settings).  Followed by testing.  If testing shows problem, user can then load back only User Settings (#2).  Followed by another test.  Problem possibly solved do to paramter being put back.

User with a problem makes a Full back up of everything. (#3).  Uploads entire backup to DJI.  DJI can now load that backup on a Test drone to see if they can reproduce problem based on Firwmare and User settings.

User with a problem makes a User Setting back up (#2).  Uploads it to where helpful members here, look over settings.  Or possibly even load settings on their drone to see if there is a problem with user setting.  Leading to one of helpful members here, making changes or providing user with problems a copy of settings that do work.

HendrikJB Posted at 2018-9-10 09:54
I can relate to that.

They ARE going to find out, to their detriment, that poor customer support spreads like wild fire and like you said "No more DJI"

Customer service can be a bit subjective, I have had to use CS a couple of times over the years, I have had to send Mavic Pro in for damage caused by heat to top cover.
Procedure: email support, they arrange pick up from through ups, ups call and collect drone, ups deliver drone back in 10 days, is that good CS , expected service or bad service.
I have had to get a moderator here to have flight log checked for a problem had with P4 , she requested flight log to be synced, engineer then requested .dat file in Dropbox file, she moderator got the result of my flight and I was now aware of what occurred . Is that good service, bad service or expected service.

We tend to look at excellence of customer service as we see in companies like Apple, but we forget that at 11 years old Apple company was not the company it is today, they dumped Steve Jobs, their products were a bit of a shambles, their distribution as a international company was appalling.

In the last five years dji has grown exponentially, their CS has greatly improved , yes more work to be done, but it is improving year on year. Nobody comes here to praise dji for CS , but plenty will come if CS doesn’t live up to their expectations, so we see and hear a very jaundiced view of CS.

You can step up on to forums for cannon cameras Panasonic cameras, and you will find many complaints regarding CS, particularly around release of new products and similar to what we see here , when is new FW coming , and response in not met with a fixed date, it’s met similar to what we see here, it will come when it’s ready, so check the website etc, yet these companies have been around for a long time and are not going anywhere, so I don’t believe dji will be going anywhere.

KlooGee Posted at 2018-9-10 07:01
I'm sorry, you are right.  It is much better to just scream "FIX IT!" without actually providing any details at all.  That is definitely going to help get an issue resolved.

I do like that you've provided specific examples of how DJI can help us to help them.  That is productive and exactly what I'm saying we all need to do.  I'm not sure if they will actually listen, but like I said, if we don't communicate specifics, how will they ever know what we would like?

KlooGee, want to say I am sorry if my replies came off a little harsh.
My whole experience with DJI has left me, let's just say, far from enthused.  

hallmark007 Posted at 2018-9-10 10:38
Customer service can be a bit subjective, I have had to use CS a couple of times over the years, I have had to send Mavic Pro in for damage caused by heat to top cover.
Procedure: email support, they arrange pick up from through ups, ups call and collect drone, ups deliver drone back in 10 days, is that good CS , expected service or bad service.
I have had to get a moderator here to have flight log checked for a problem had with P4 , she requested flight log to be synced, engineer then requested .dat file in Dropbox file, she moderator got the result of my flight and I was now aware of what occurred . Is that good service, bad service or expected service.

Excellent narrative

However ........

Thank you for taking the time to set it out as you see it.

HedgeTrimmer Posted at 2018-9-10 11:22
KlooGee, want to say I am sorry if my replies came off a little harsh.
My whole experience with DJI has left me, let's just say, far from enthused.

I agree with Captain HedgeTrimmer. I feel strongly for DJI not doing anything about the firmware so I`m actually currently not very positive

I you personal experiences with the Mavic Air, have you had any issues?

HendrikJB Posted at 2018-9-10 11:56
Excellent narrative

However ........

It’s not how I see it , I have been dealing with this company and have had many problems, I have also seen the growth this company has come through, I was here when dji launched Mavic Pro , they were swamped with troubles, it was the biggest selling drone ever, problems with service became very difficult, with problems to aircraft, problems with huge numbers of new users trying to figure out how to use this technology.
Now I look at the Mavic Pro forum. It is by far dji’s most reliable aircraft, problems pale into insignificance, when I look around other forums here. It’s now a truly reliable aircraft, with the fewest complaints on any of these forums.
I beleive Mavic Air will follow on from this , just as I have seen P4 and P4Pro year on year improve, but I have accepted that this happens with drones and no other manufacturer is doing anything any better.
We will see new FW for Mavic Air , one thing for sure is it won’t fix every problem and likewise if you go back through the forum , Mavic Air had just as many problems with 0.300 FW, and that’s a fact, but we tend to forget that, but hopefully 0.500 brings good things to those who own Mavic Air .

LordoftheFlies Posted at 2018-9-10 12:10
I you personal experiences with the Mavic Air, have you had any issues?

Good day (evening here by me),

Yes after firmware update 0.0400 issues with sluggish handling that caused my MA to crash.  At first I thought it was my pilot error until some other people came up with the same issue.  Anyways NOW I`m SUPER careful where I fly.

Apart from that I`m extremely happy with the quality of the video and photo`s that I get for such a small sensor.

KlooGee Posted at 2018-9-10 09:45
What issues are you running into that you are waiting to be fixed?

Got the drone replaced twice by DJI HK, first for faulty camera (this was before this release) and now again due to a crash caused by this release and it's odd motor controls (drone accelerated 3m above landing at a 45 degree angle into the ground without stick input). Since then I don't trust the drone as even the new one still spits out random error messages left and right. So I avoid flying it far or where I can't retrieve it.
A drone you don't trust is not a useful drone.

ulfw Posted at 2018-9-10 22:51
Got the drone replaced twice by DJI HK, first for faulty camera (this was before this release) and now again due to a crash caused by this release and it's odd motor controls (drone accelerated 3m above landing at a 45 degree angle into the ground without stick input). Since then I don't trust the drone as even the new one still spits out random error messages left and right. So I avoid flying it far or where I can't retrieve it.
A drone you don't trust is not a useful drone.

None of those issues sound like FW issues, but posting your flight log would help understand what happened.

Like I said before, if your drone flew perfectly with a certain numbered firmware, and ALL you do, is update that firmware, and now you have all sorts of troubles, chances are quite big, that the problem is the firmware.
It is not up to the consumer to know if it is firmware, hardware, bloat ware, android or ios ware, software, lazy ware or plain DJI not aware, that is causing the problem.
Mavic Air needs fixing, maybe not yours, or yours but a couple of others definitely do.
Personally, would love these few things to be available, or fixed on BOTH MA,rs I flew.
1: Better connection, in order to fly the proposed, or even close to the proposed distance. Not the 100 to 200 meters i presently get, or got, from both.
2 and 3 and the rest: Working video feed, while flying. Fix the lag, fix the freezes videos, fix the aircraft disconnect, then reconnect mid flight issue.
That alone, could make me happy. A stable flying drone.
Rest would be nice add ons: Waypoints (but moot point with Litchi)
Stop RTH beep, or low battery beep
Shutter control on the remote
EV that can be manually set

Charissa Posted at 2018-9-11 04:18
Like I said before, if your drone flew perfectly with a certain numbered firmware, and ALL you do, is update that firmware, and now you have all sorts of troubles, chances are quite big, that the problem is the firmware.
It is not up to the consumer to know if it is firmware, hardware, bloat ware, android or ios ware, software, lazy ware or plain DJI not aware, that is causing the problem.
Mavic Air needs fixing, maybe not yours, or yours but a couple of others definitely do.

Hi Charissa,

Glad to see that someone else feel the same as me.  Not like some judgmental people who "accused" me of being to stupid to fly the MA and then complaining about performance.
You back from the Land of Sand already?

Charissa Posted at 2018-9-11 04:18
Like I said before, if your drone flew perfectly with a certain numbered firmware, and ALL you do, is update that firmware, and now you have all sorts of troubles, chances are quite big, that the problem is the firmware.
It is not up to the consumer to know if it is firmware, hardware, bloat ware, android or ios ware, software, lazy ware or plain DJI not aware, that is causing the problem.
Mavic Air needs fixing, maybe not yours, or yours but a couple of others definitely do.

Like I said before, if your drone flew perfectly with a certain numbered firmware, and ALL you do, is update that firmware, and now you have all sorts of troubles, chances are quite big, that the problem is the firmware.

Or changes in Firmware have brought out a hardware problem with drone.  Possibly using a hardware function never used before (not likely, but...). Or Possibuly pushing hardware harder, resulting in failure, due to a bad batch of chips not being up to design specs.  All of which fall to DJI, and not result of a bad or stupid owner / Pilot.

HedgeTrimmer Posted at 2018-9-10 11:22
KlooGee, want to say I am sorry if my replies came off a little harsh.
My whole experience with DJI has left me, let's just say, far from enthused.

No worries!  Passion is good!  I think we all have passion for it.  I'm just trying to help us all to try to direct that passion in a positive and productive manner.  

I enjoy a positive and productive discussion.  I just find on the internet that many people (not necessarily pointing to anybody in this particular thread) want to scream and yell loudly, but don't do anything productive to try to move the situation forward.  

Believe me, I completely understand how frustrating it can be when your expensive purchase of something you are so excited about ends up having problems.  When I received my brand new Mavic Air, it had a rear sensor problem straight out of the box and wouldn't fly at all.  Had to ship it back to DJI via the warranty process...

At the end of the day, we all just want to get out and go fly it!  Hopefully this weather clears up so I can go do just that!  Cheers!

ulfw Posted at 2018-9-10 22:51
Got the drone replaced twice by DJI HK, first for faulty camera (this was before this release) and now again due to a crash caused by this release and it's odd motor controls (drone accelerated 3m above landing at a 45 degree angle into the ground without stick input). Since then I don't trust the drone as even the new one still spits out random error messages left and right. So I avoid flying it far or where I can't retrieve it.
A drone you don't trust is not a useful drone.

Yes, I agree, if I can't trust a drone, I won't want to fly it.  I'm not wealthy enough to throw hundreds of dollars up in the air and expect it to come back just fine if I don't trust it.

I'm curious about your particular incident and I'm always trying to learn more.  Have you posted your flight record log from this flight where this occurred?  I would definitely be interested in having a look at it if at all possible to see if there is anything that could be learned from it.  Thanks much!

KlooGee Posted at 2018-9-11 06:22
No worries!  Passion is good!  I think we all have passion for it.  I'm just trying to help us all to try to direct that passion in a positive and productive manner.  

I enjoy a positive and productive discussion.  I just find on the internet that many people (not necessarily pointing to anybody in this particular thread) want to scream and yell loudly, but don't do anything productive to try to move the situation forward.  

I wish my experience had been as good as your single case.
Let me sum up where I am at, assuming problems are found with RC, MPp, & Cs-Ub; and none are NTF.
When I get them back, I will be on my 3rd RC, my 3rd MPp, and 4th Cs-Ub; in less than 8-month period.

HendrikJB Posted at 2018-9-10 12:17
Good day (evening here by me),

Yes after firmware update 0.0400 issues with sluggish handling that caused my MA to crash.  At first I thought it was my pilot error until some other people came up with the same issue.  Anyways NOW I`m SUPER careful where I fly.

What do you mean by sluggish handling? The input response was slow from the RC to the Drone?

LordoftheFlies Posted at 2018-9-11 20:21
What do you mean by sluggish handling? The input response was slow from the RC to the Drone?

The drone is sluggish in responding to commands.

I can relate to think twice before buying a new DJI product. Boy, and I was about to buy a Ronin-S and maybe a MP2 soon.  Given the experience with lack of fixes and focus on selling new things only,  I'm not inclined to follow that path again.

Good news for those who have been desperately waiting. I just found a strong indicator that the release might be imminent.

Ah our patient friend Captain Wachtberger. Thank for your support and patience.

HendrikJB Posted at 2018-9-11 22:48
The drone is sluggish in responding to commands.

You know you can change the settings to how your drone reacts in your dji go 4 app, I see such a wide divergence of problems here all want to relate them to FW, but if this was the case, then FW would be so bad that almost all Mavic airs would be having these or similar problems.
If you take your own case, I have not heard of one similar case, I also believe it’s not FW related simply from what you describe it as.
I see others say one day it’s grand next day it’s not, simple things like the envoirment we fly in can cause problems on a daily basis, we fly in an area one day, we can fly 1000 metres, next day we only get 500metres, this has nothing to do with FW, FW doesn’t decide to work on Monday and not on Tuesday, but I have experienced many times Interference on one day flying in an area and none the next day, this has nothing to do with FW.
I have received 21 sats in an area and next day 13 satellites, again nothing to do with FW, but yet I read everyday here that it is FW causing these problems, but it’s not it’s envoirment, and FW won’t fix this.
I read that FW .400 was the cause of bad video feed, yet there was as many complaining that .300 was causing this, and now it seems it’s much more to do with devices.
I hear other people complaining about app being stuffed with so much stuff and in the same breath they’re looking for many more upgrades to be added.
Overall since the last FW .400, they’re have been from what I see two problems with last update that have been consistent , first one is the ability of AC to hover at altitude without moving around itself, and the other one is motor current warning .
I also believe these should be fixed in the next FW update, maybe they can do something in FW for video feed , but I wouldn’t hold out for this, it’s more likely to be improved with SW update.
Again believing that next FW is going to be the answer to all things is foolhardy even thinking that way, so hopefully it will come soon and some having problems with last FW will get some relief.
The big problem will be, how many will have problems after next FW , whether related or not.

HendrikJB Posted at 2018-9-12 08:26
Ah our patient friend Captain Wachtberger. Thank for your support and patience.

You are very welcome and I hope you won't be disappointed. Quite a number of issues associated with the previous release in my opinion were not firmware related but rather caused by other factors. And the same will happen after the new release I fear.

HendrikJB Posted at 2018-9-11 05:31
Hi Charissa,

Glad to see that someone else feel the same as me.  Not like some judgmental people who "accused" me of being to stupid to fly the MA and then complaining about performance.

That really P me off. Sorry for the description. I honestlly don,t care if 99 persent fly their Mavic Airs to the moon and back, I just want my versions, to fly the way they advertized, or just fly one out of two without problems at least.

Some people like to believe that it is a years worth of studies, just to be able to fly a drone. Not everyone is graced with slow learning abilities.

Wachtberger Posted at 2018-9-12 08:18
Good news for those who have been desperately waiting. I just found a strong indicator that the release might be imminent.

Would you mind to share in the good news?
That would definitely make a couple of hearts happy, mine included.

Charissa Posted at 2018-9-12 11:16
Would you mind to share in the good news?
That would definitely make a couple of hearts happy, mine included.

Ok, I give you a little hint ;-) As you have probably noticed, all important DJI announcements about e.g. new products, new competitions and new firmware versions are sticked to the top of the forum page to make sure that nobody will miss them. In particular the announcements about firmware updates are important for new users because the devices frequently ship with outdated firmware since production date was before the release of a new firmware. Until yesterday the announcement for the May Mavic Air firmware update has been also there, but it is no longer. Then go to forum page 3 and watch it further dropping down in order to get out of sight. Now what does this tell you? ;-)

Wachtberger Posted at 2018-9-12 11:57
Ok, I give you a little hint ;-) As you have probably noticed, all important DJI announcements about e.g. new products, new competitions and new firmware versions are sticked to the top of the forum page to make sure that nobody will miss them. In particular the announcements about firmware updates are important for new users because the devices frequently ship with outdated firmware since production date was before the release of a new firmware. Until yesterday the announcement for the May Mavic Air firmware update has been also there, but it is no longer. Then go to forum page 3 and watch it further dropping down in order to get out of sight. Now what does this tell you? ;-)

Now what does this tell you?

It was old news, been up there long enough, everyone had seen it, thus un-sticked by an Admin.

Or someone decided it was not a great idea to keep reminding those customers having problems with and stuck on .0400.

Or stickies have an optional expiration date, and that one expired.

Wachtberger Posted at 2018-9-12 11:57
Ok, I give you a little hint ;-) As you have probably noticed, all important DJI announcements about e.g. new products, new competitions and new firmware versions are sticked to the top of the forum page to make sure that nobody will miss them. In particular the announcements about firmware updates are important for new users because the devices frequently ship with outdated firmware since production date was before the release of a new firmware. Until yesterday the announcement for the May Mavic Air firmware update has been also there, but it is no longer. Then go to forum page 3 and watch it further dropping down in order to get out of sight. Now what does this tell you? ;-)

Good job, hope your right, but it won’t stop those who have no vested interest in trying to dampen any hope for others.
For some the glass will always be half empty.

hallmark007 Posted at 2018-9-12 12:25
Good job, hope your right, but it won’t stop those who have no vested interest in trying to dampen any hope for others.
For some the glass will always be empty.

Thank you, we shall see ;-)

Ok people, if I had known what a heated discussion this would have become I might have phrased my original post differently.
It is now very clear that the responses originated from the novice (ignorant) side as well as from the more experienced side with one or two other obnoxious interferences.
However amongst all of these there were one or two level headed people patiently leading me to knowledge. Specifically I would like to thank Captain Wachtberger for his positive attitude and sharing his experience with me. Captain HedgeTrimmer's last comment opened up a new world of understanding for which I gladly give credit. Finally I thank Charissa for her support and inputs. IMHO this matter has been argued enough and should be brought to a close.
Good night to those who are in the same time zone as myself, good morning to those who are getting ready for their day and good day to those who are somewhere in between.

I would love to see this drone get all the support it deserves. Please release a firmware update and show that you still care about this amazing drone DJI

Wachtberger Posted at 2018-9-12 08:18
Good news for those who have been desperately waiting. I just found a strong indicator that the release might be imminent.

And when happens, so will begin my situation of.... should I upgrade. Hahaha. Like those that had no issues prior to .0400, I have had no issues with .0400. I would then fear upgrading to the next version would introduce issues.

The old "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". I'll probably upgrade anyways.

DJKOR Posted at 2018-9-12 18:44
And when happens, so will begin my situation of.... should I upgrade. Hahaha. Like those that had no issues prior to .0400, I have had no issues with .0400. I would then fear upgrading to the next version would introduce issues.

The old "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". I'll probably upgrade anyways.

I also had no issues with .400 and shall definitely update when it comes.

HybridAlien Posted at 2018-9-12 18:35
I would love to see this drone get all the support it deserves. Please release a firmware update and show that you still care about this amazing drone DJI

It most definitely is a great machine

DJKOR Posted at 2018-9-12 18:44
And when happens, so will begin my situation of.... should I upgrade. Hahaha. Like those that had no issues prior to .0400, I have had no issues with .0400. I would then fear upgrading to the next version would introduce issues.

The old "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". I'll probably upgrade anyways.

Oh my
Decisions, decisions