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moirè effect
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Tony62
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[media=x,970,580]https://vimeo.com/294121386[/media]



But is it possible to work with this moiré effect?
2018-10-9
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Tony62
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2018-10-9
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Tony62
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Is dji planning to solve this problem?
2018-10-9
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DJI Paladin
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Sorry for the trouble. May I know what SD card and firmware version you are using? Kindly back up you files and format your SD card directly to a PC and try it again. You can also reset the camera settings to factory defaults. Please check the attachment below.

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Tony62
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I have formatted the card both from the PC and with the mavic, the firmware is version 01.00.0000, is the one that gives me DJI Assistant 2 for Mavic
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OverTheEdge
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I have a thread concerning this issue as well for my M2Z; and an open email chain with DJI support where I linked sample vids of the problem. I just received an email this morning assuring me that DJI is still reviewing the vids that I showed them. I will try Paladin's suggestion.

Are you shooting in 4k or 1080p? The clear vids that I have seen were shot in 4k. My vids and another YT vid with the moire effect were shot in 1080p.
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Tony62
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OverTheEdge Posted at 2018-10-9 06:37
I have a thread concerning this issue as well for my M2Z; and an open email chain with DJI support where I linked sample vids of the problem. I just received an email this morning assuring me that DJI is still reviewing the vids that I showed them. I will try Paladin's suggestion.

Are you shooting in 4k or 1080p? The clear vids that I have seen were shot in 4k. My vids and another YT vid with the moire effect were shot in 1080p.

Turned to 1080p, I tried the suggestion of DJI Paladin, I reformatted the sd with pc, I reset the settings of the room, nothing to do the problem remains
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Tony62
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DJI Paladin Posted at 2018-10-9 04:18
Sorry for the trouble. May I know what SD card and firmware version you are using? Kindly back up you files and format your SD card directly to a PC and try it again. You can also reset the camera settings to factory defaults. Please check the attachment below.

[view_image]








I have formatted the card both from the PC and with the mavic, the firmware is version 01.00.0000, is the one that gives me DJI Assistant 2 for Mavic
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Montfrooij
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Tony62 Posted at 2018-10-9 07:04
Turned to 1080p, I tried the suggestion of DJI Paladin, I reformatted the sd with pc, I reset the settings of the room, nothing to do the problem remains

This is obviously caused by the way DJI downscales the stream from the sensor to a FHD size.
Nothing you can do about it and DJI should know that.
The only solution is to get to the 4K mode that is slightly zoomed in (I don't remember how they call it) but that is a true 4K readout without any downscaling in the M2P
You can do the downscaling yourself with an editor.
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Tony62
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Montfrooij Posted at 2018-10-9 13:49
This is obviously caused by the way DJI downscales the stream from the sensor to a FHD size.
Nothing you can do about it and DJI should know that.
The only solution is to get to the 4K mode that is slightly zoomed in (I don't remember how they call it) but that is a true 4K readout without any downscaling in the M2P

The problem exists in all formats in both 4K and 2K and 1920x1080, it is only reduced when turning at 25 or 30 fps
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HedgeTrimmer
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Montfrooij Posted at 2018-10-9 13:49
This is obviously caused by the way DJI downscales the stream from the sensor to a FHD size.
Nothing you can do about it and DJI should know that.
The only solution is to get to the 4K mode that is slightly zoomed in (I don't remember how they call it) but that is a true 4K readout without any downscaling in the M2P

Thought there was only one way to prevent Moire pattern effect - anti-aliasing filter installed at factory on layers glass above camera sensor.




Moire pattern effect can be reduced afterwards using programs like Photoshop (pictures) or AfterEffects (videos).

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Montfrooij
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Tony62 Posted at 2018-10-9 20:07
The problem exists in all formats in both 4K and 2K and 1920x1080, it is only reduced when turning at 25 or 30 fps

Did you check both 4K modes?
I believe you have 2.
One is slightly cropped and is a true 4K readout of the sensor.
That should have less moiré effect.
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Montfrooij
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HedgeTrimmer Posted at 2018-10-9 20:48
Thought there was only one way to prevent Moire pattern effect - anti-aliasing filter installed at factory on layers glass above camera sensor.

[/img]https://wolfcrow.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/CameraFilters1.jpg[/img]

Yes, very true.
Blurring the image will reduce the risk on moiré and this anti aliasing filter does just that.
Using another sensor layout is also an option (the bayer pattern is repetitive)
But another reason is the skipping of pixels that some camera's do to reduce the resolution from the sensor.

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Tony62
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HedgeTrimmer Posted at 2018-10-9 20:48
Thought there was only one way to prevent Moire pattern effect - anti-aliasing filter installed at factory on layers glass above camera sensor.

http://dslrmodifications.com/xsmod028.jpg[/img]https://wolfcrow.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/CameraFilters1.jpg[/img]

but is it normal that you have to resort to third party programs to reduce the moiré effect? It makes no sense, DJI should solve the problem. I feel teased
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BrianKushner
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Tony62 Posted at 2018-10-9 03:20
Is dji planning to solve this problem?

I believe this is part of the not using the whole sensor issue.
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Tony62 Posted at 2018-10-9 22:55
but is it normal that you have to resort to third party programs to reduce the moiré effect? It makes no sense, DJI should solve the problem. I feel teased

but is it normal that you have to resort to third party programs to reduce the moiré effect?

It depends...  

Some DSLR cameras for purposes of increasing sharpness and slight improvement in resolution have been manufactured minus Anti-Aliasing filters.  With manufactures making buyers aware up-front that some pictures would need editing to reduce moire effect.

My understanding is, with advent of 40+ Megapixel cameras and recently semi-affordable digital Medium format cameras; due to higher resolution Anti-Aliasing filters can be left off.  The few times Moire effect does show up with higher resolution cameras, Moire effect is reduced during editing.

For medium and lower resolution cameras, I would say it is not the Norm.


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fans589cba4b
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sharpness -1 and when you tap focus switch to manual focus and pull it back 1 bar. you wont notice it being any more blurry but it will back off from the peak a bit and solve for the big amount of moire your seeing. it's a patch.
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Tony62
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DJI Paladin Posted at 2018-10-9 04:18
Sorry for the trouble. May I know what SD card and firmware version you are using? Kindly back up you files and format your SD card directly to a PC and try it again. You can also reset the camera settings to factory defaults. Please check the attachment below.

[view_image]

DJI Paladin you asked me some questions I answered, can you tell me yours now how to solve the problem?
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Tony62
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fans589cba4b Posted at 2018-10-10 19:02
sharpness -1 and when you tap focus switch to manual focus and pull it back 1 bar. you wont notice it being any more blurry but it will back off from the peak a bit and solve for the big amount of moire your seeing. it's a patch.

ok, I try, thanks
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AlansDronePics
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Tony62 - if you read from this link, it will explain the reason you are seeing this pattern. It is just one of those things that can happen in certain circumstances. You cannot blame DJI or the roof tiles, in your case, from what I saw in your video. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moiré_pattern
2018-10-11
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eYeSkYeYe
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Guys, even 50k+ usd pro studio cameras will show moire effect under right circumstances. You will NEVER see small patterned cloth (stripes, small squares etc...) on any TV host or guest exactly for this reason.
Getting rid of moire should be done in post-processing. And yes, roof tiles are very well known to produce really strong and noticeable moire. So, i would say it's perfectly normal.
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A CW
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Excellent video.     
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El Diablo Posted at 2018-10-11 04:12
i am getting moire with my +3000€ DLSRs, not surprised it can be seen on a little 1" sensor. We don't know if the Mavic is using an anti-aliasing filter (AA) because it will affect image quality. i personaly prefer more resolution at the cost of aliasing effects in repeating patterns like the tiles you are showing here...

We don't know if the Mavic is using an anti-aliasing filter (AA) because it will affect image quality.

Based on what I have seen, Mavic 2 Pro is not using anti-aliasing filter or it's AA filter is weak (insufficient to prevent Moire Pattern).

How many cases of (actual) Moire pattern have we seen repored with Mavic Air?  Mavic Pro?


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Tony62
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El Diablo Posted at 2018-10-11 04:17
on the 1st video you can only see the moire effect in a 'disturbing' way in a specific house wich tiles have a specific angle in relation to the sun. The rest of the footage is fine, the same as with your 2nd video sample. If your main use of the M2P is going to be flying over houses you will need to factor that in. Normally you will not see moire so exagerated like in your videos.

and you tell me that in the video at 120 fps the image is fine? it's just useless, no not flying on the houses, I made those shots because it's a condition that gives a sense of what I wanted to say
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OverTheEdge
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From what I have seen, the moire issue is with DJI, and they have done nothing about it, except offer resetting and reformatting suggestions that do nothing to solve the issue.

In the video below at the 6:10 mark, the Mavic 2 zoom is compared with the Anafi at 1080. In the M2Z shots, your can clearly see moire / aliasing around the left fence and "top" fence border. You do not see this with the Anafi shots.

So how is it that the M2Z cost twice as much, and produce inferior results at 1080p?

We have to hold DJI accountable as opposed to making excuses saying that other cameras have the same issue; or telling people to reduce the sharpness.



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Tony62 Posted at 2018-10-10 19:56
DJI Paladin you asked me some questions I answered, can you tell me yours now how to solve the problem?

Via  email, DJI suggested that I reduce the sharpness to -1, I then sent them video links showing users at  sharpness +1 who did not have the issue in their vids. DJI says that they are looking into this.

In my thread concerning this issue, DJI Stephen suggested that I use an ND filter (which DJI conveniently sells for an extra $100).

With that said, I don't think that DJI plan on doing anything about it.
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