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Mavic 2 Pro gone crazy
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SK
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Wow!
http://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer/TWE5QPMRO78VOE6HA4V9/#

What do you think happend?

Please take a look at 16 min 22.4 sec:

Flight Mode - Tripod
Speed - 48.7 mp/h.

No need to assure you, that the controls were in ZERO positions. Again, please see the log file.

Are you kidding?

DJI, what is going on?

I am terribly sorry for the emotions; however, it is quite undestandable at what kind of stess I am right now.
As far you can see at the map, the drone was just a couple of meters from the very busy road when it decided to turn back and crash somewhere in the woods.

I am considered myself as the luckiest person on the planet today because my drone didn't go to that road and didn't crashed into upcoming cars. Do you steell remember the speed of the drone? It was 48.7 mp/h!!!

Please also pay attention, that the drone was supposed to flight slow (in TRIPOD MODE) more that 100 meters away from the roads when it went crazy and flew away.




2018-12-17
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SK
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What did I do during those 15 seconds from the moment the drone went crazy to the moment it crashed?
Many things:
1. Get surprised seeing my drone went away with the increasing speed in spite of the fact that it was in tripod mode and the controls was at zero positions. 2 seconds.
2. Tried to lift it up by pushing the left controller knob forward - no reaction from the drone. It continues to go away from me. 1 second.
3. Check that the controller knobs are in the neutral position. 1 second.
4. Check that the controller knobs are not stuck in any position different from zero. 2 seconds.
5. Look at the screen and watch the picture of chaotic movement of everything (falling drone). 2 seconds.
6. Rushing to the spot where I saw my drone went to the woods. 5 seconds.
7. Switch off the motors. 2 seconds.

Most probably, I should switch the motors much earlier - as soon as the drone went from the above the water. May be, the next time I will try that.
And, by the way, please pay attention:
1. This is my second drone (after the excellent Phantom 4 Pro which fine except the jello effect).
2. 26 hours at the air and more than 221 km after 82 flights.

It means that I knew what I am doing (flying in the tripod mode), It means that I am familiar with the RC and there were NO PILOT ERRORS.
The controls are in the zero. The drone must stay on the current position. Period.

Okay, I can confess, the water running below might confuse the vision position system. Okay. The drone can be confused and mistakanly tried to compensate the illusion of the moving surface below (the running water). But. As soon as the drone reaches the edge of the water (river) and observes the stable surface, it must stop. Period. It also must stop (being in the tripod mode - all the sensors active) as soon as it reaches the woods.

What did the drone this time? It acselerates up to the record speed of more than 70 km/h. Being in the tripod mode. And it crashed.
2018-12-17
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2018-12-18
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Oracle Miata
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Need flight logs...
2018-12-18
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SK
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Oracle Miata Posted at 12-18 04:44
Need flight logs...

Did the link in my first message stop working?
2018-12-18
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hallmark007
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Looking at your log and the envoirment you were flying in , it looks like you came into contact with a tree , at 16.24 motor obstructed to close to obstacle, usually means you hit something. Regarding speed you will notice that log shows 47mph but Aircraft is not moving very far this can be seen in the change of distance from homepoint.

Your VPS altitude shows you were flying pretty low maybe you can shed more information on the envoirment you were flying in ?
2018-12-18
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KlooGee
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Were you recording video or doing a screen capture at the time this happened?  If so, can you share?  It would help to be able to sync up what we see in the logs with what the aircraft was seeing.
2018-12-18
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SK
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KlooGee Posted at 12-18 06:39
Were you recording video or doing a screen capture at the time this happened?  If so, can you share?  It would help to be able to sync up what we see in the logs with what the aircraft was seeing.

During the abnormal part of the flight (the last 15 seconds) the recording was off.
2018-12-18
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SK
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hallmark007 Posted at 12-18 06:25
Looking at your log and the envoirment you were flying in , it looks like you came into contact with a tree , at 16.24 motor obstructed to close to obstacle, usually means you hit something. Regarding speed you will notice that log shows 47mph but Aircraft is not moving very far this can be seen in the change of distance from homepoint.

Your VPS altitude shows you were flying pretty low maybe you can shed more information on the envoirment you were flying in ?

The abnormal flight started at 16 min 14.4 sec when the speed increased up to 6.8 mp/h.
My questions are:

How it was possible in the tripod mode?

How it was possible with the right controler knob in zero position?
10 seconds later, as you notice, the drone hit something the first time.

2018-12-18
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SK Posted at 12-18 06:49
During the abnormal part of the flight (the last 15 seconds) the recording was off.

That is unfortunate timing.  It looks like you stopped recording just before it started going wild around the 16m14s mark.  I had a very brief look in the logs and don't see a smoking gun right away.  Maybe some of the others on here with a bit more time than I currently have can see something I've missed.

In the meantime, if you haven't already, I'd highly recommend opening a conversation with DJI's support team.  You can contact them via email, phone, or online chat at https://www.dji.com/support

Best of luck finding what happened and getting back up and flying again soon!  Definitely keep us in the loop as you work with the support team.
2018-12-18
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SK Posted at 12-18 06:56
The abnormal flight started at 16 min 14.4 sec when the speed increased up to 6.8 mp/h.
My questions are:

Again if you could explain a little more about envoirment, tripod mode needs exceptionally good gps you also had some sensor warnings ,

Looking at your log at 16.20 you received warning of obstacle above you, this appears to be where your problems started.
Where was the aircraft at 16.20 was it under tree cover ?
2018-12-18
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hallmark007 Posted at 12-18 07:48
Again if you could explain a little more about envoirment, tripod mode needs exceptionally good gps you also had some sensor warnings ,

Looking at your log at 16.20 you received warning of obstacle above you, this appears to be where your problems started.

Okay. Briefly.
1. 16 minutes of flight. Everything is okay. The drone is above the middle of a small river. 30 meters from the Home Point. It just completed a small (12 seconds) pass along the river making recordings. It just completed the u-turn and was going to make another pass in (kind of) direction to the Home Point (to me). Hovering and waiting my command. As it has done this many times during previous 16 minutes of flight.
2. Then suddenly, the drone started moving backward increasing it's speed. 16.13.53. Then it went to the wooden area. 16.18.9

Let me be disagree with you and state that the problem started at 16.13.5 when the drone started moving without any commands.
2018-12-18
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hallmark007
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SK Posted at 12-18 08:19
Okay. Briefly.
1. 16 minutes of flight. Everything is okay. The drone is above the middle of a small river. 30 meters from the Home Point. It just completed a small (12 seconds) pass along the river making recordings. It just completed the u-turn and was going to make another pass in (kind of) direction to the Home Point (to me). Hovering and waiting my command. As it has done this many times during previous 16 minutes of flight.
2. Then suddenly, the drone started moving backward increasing it's speed. 16.13.53. Then it went to the wooden area. 16.18.9

Yes the speed of aircraft started to change at 16.14, but it certainly looks like it was amongst the trees , I’m thinking flying this low over trees that when speed increased involuntary that correct procedure was left stick up to gain altitude to clear trees, but I was asking why upward obstacle warning came at 16.20 and where was craft at this time.

Don’t get me wrong I’m just trying to help you find out how and why it crashed, I’m not saying it was pilot error or ami saying it was a malfunction.
2018-12-18
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hallmark007 Posted at 12-18 08:36
Yes the speed of aircraft started to change at 16.14, but it certainly looks like it was amongst the trees , I’m thinking flying this low over trees that when speed increased involuntary that correct procedure was left stick up to gain altitude to clear trees, but I was asking why upward obstacle warning came at 16.20 and where was craft at this time.

Don’t get me wrong I’m just trying to help you find out how and why it crashed, I’m not saying it was pilot error or ami saying it was a malfunction.

I would be happy to figure out that it was the pilot error. I can learn the lesson and then fly with confidence that everything is under my control.

Could you please switch your log viewer to the map view and see that the drone was just above the middle of the river? The satellite view (google maps) was created not from straight above point and confuses the users.
2018-12-18
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SK
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2018-12-18
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hallmark007 Posted at 12-18 08:36
Yes the speed of aircraft started to change at 16.14, but it certainly looks like it was amongst the trees , I’m thinking flying this low over trees that when speed increased involuntary that correct procedure was left stick up to gain altitude to clear trees, but I was asking why upward obstacle warning came at 16.20 and where was craft at this time.

Don’t get me wrong I’m just trying to help you find out how and why it crashed, I’m not saying it was pilot error or ami saying it was a malfunction.

Yes. At the first moment - from 16.14.3 to 16.15.3 I did exaclty you thinks would be correct procedure - hit the left stick up to gain altitude.
Do you see this from the log?

What was the result?
The result was not good. The drone reacted as it should do in tripod mode - it gains altitude very slow - just 2.3 feet in one second. Please see the log.

At that moment I realize that the drone is criticaly close to the woods (ironicaly, it continued moving with the speed well above the tripod mode limits) and there was no chance to gain altitude to be above the trees before it was going to hit something.

That is probably why I stoped hitting left stick up. I saw and predicted that the collision is unavoidable as well as the falling down the drone.
So that the opposite behaviour should be better - to low the drone so that it eventually falled from the lowest height as possible to minimize the impact.

Honestly, I don't remember such kind of rational change in my actions to the opposite. I spent the next couple seconds looking at my RC and checking if I accidently hitting any sticks. I also remember that I spend a second or so checking my RC if any of stick stucked in any position different from zero.

As far as you can see from the log neither of them was true. No hitting the sticks. No stacked sticks. Everything was at zero.

Most probably, the ideal behaviour was to wait the drone leave the water and reach the ground and then immediatly perform the engine shut down procedure.

Why I didn't do this? First, I wasn't prepared. Second, I believed that in the tripod mode the drone would stop as soon as it reached the woods. Third, I still couldn't accept that the drone could move by itself without any reason.
2018-12-18
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Hello and good day SK. I am sorry to know what happened to your previous fight with your DJI Mavic 2 Pro. Since there was a crash that happened please contact DJI Support at https://www.dji.com/support for additional help and analysis on what happened. Please sync the flight records as well using your DJI Go 4 application for further investigation on what happened. Thank you.

2018-12-18
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SK Posted at 12-18 09:22
Yes. At the first moment - from 16.14.3 to 16.15.3 I did exaclty you thinks would be correct procedure - hit the left stick up to gain altitude.
Do you see this from the log?

I see where you tried to raise AC but only for approx 1 sec, a better option would have been to simply press pause or switch to sport or P mode this would have allowed you to increase altitude much quicker, but hey it’s easier to say sitting in my armchair.
2018-12-18
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SK Posted at 12-18 09:22
Yes. At the first moment - from 16.14.3 to 16.15.3 I did exaclty you thinks would be correct procedure - hit the left stick up to gain altitude.
Do you see this from the log?

Hi SK,

Had a look into your flight too.

Problem in this flight started earlier, at 16m 06s.
Before that time your MP was flyinng heading 231.6 (this since 15m 43s)

At 16m 06s heading changed (anti clockwise) from 231 to 57 with no yaw input!

What happend after that is the question, MP must be confused and correcting position....
Need more time to look into your file.

Another weird thing is your gimbal is offsett, normally gimbal heading (pointing) is drone heading.Gimbal offsett early in flight (see id 1000) (purple drone hdg, gimbal blue)

cheers
JJB
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2018-12-18
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SK
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JJBspark Posted at 12-18 10:02
Hi SK,

Had a look into your flight too.

Thank you, JJBspark.
Hm. I was thought that it was me who made the drone u-turn. At least I was going to. The log shows that there was no RC input, so I must confess, that there was an issue with that too. Weird.
For now it looks like there were two parts:
1. Normal. The drone responded to the commands from RC as it should do in the tripod mode. We can see from the log file my attempt to gain altitude (from 16.14.3 to 16.15.3). It was kind of normal (less than 1 meter for 1 sec.).
2. Abnormal. Without any commands, the drone made a u-turn, then moved backward-rightside accelerating up to max speed (more than 60 km/h). While doing that it yawing (?) and finally made kind of circle crashing into the woods.
2018-12-18
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SK Posted at 12-18 11:55
Thank you, JJBspark.
Hm. I was thought that it was me who made the drone u-turn. At least I was going to. The log shows that there was no RC input, so I must confess, that there was an issue with that too. Weird.
For now it looks like there were two parts:

If you play back the flight at approx you will see left stick movements Left stick forward and left this would correspond with the movement of the craft, this movement started a 16.06, and while it doesn’t show in the text log it does show these movements when flight is played back.
You will also notice that stick at neutral is yellow but when pushed forward colours change to orange then red , I’m thinking this movement is causing craft to go up and yaw.
This can be seen with aircraft changing altitude from 16.05 .
2018-12-18
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SK Posted at 12-18 11:55
Thank you, JJBspark.
Hm. I was thought that it was me who made the drone u-turn. At least I was going to. The log shows that there was no RC input, so I must confess, that there was an issue with that too. Weird.
For now it looks like there were two parts:

Hi SK,

I have the idea that wind played a crucial row!

After that yawing to 060 your MP tried to keep position, MP pitched down to about 23 degrees.
As in TriPod mode the responce of the drone is less fanatic than in normal of sport mode that 23 degrees pich down was not enough to bring her back to position, if flew backwards with nose down. IMO the only explanation for high speed flying backwards with nose down attitude is fighting against a head-wind.
And 10 degrees left roll, even harder to fly back.
The only thing mayby what could have do the trick is leave TriPod mode and enter Sport mode. Ofcourse easy to say behind my desk....

So the main question remains ; can the wind turn a MP into a different heading? guess yes when in slow response TriPod mode.
If you replay in the phantom help you will not see a yaw input. I never seen RC input not written into a flightrecord file (and why just at a point we have questions about and not in the beginning of the flight....)

See my chart for RC input and drone flying heading/moving.

cheers
JJB

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2018-12-18
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SK
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JJBspark Posted at 12-18 12:38
Hi SK,

I have the idea that wind played a crucial row!

Hi JJBspark!

I cannot pretend that I understood what you just saying. Could you please translate this from aerial (drony/pilot) to english?

I believe that we are on the right track and can resolve this mystery.

The fact is that after a short checking and a short testing, the drone looks surprisedly okay. I tested it just after the accident. I tested it today and so far cannot find any damage. Of course, 3 propellers have cracks. I replaced two of them (goes with the Mavic in the box). The last will be replaced later.
2018-12-18
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SK Posted at 12-18 12:52
Hi JJBspark!

I cannot pretend that I understood what you just saying. Could you please translate this from aerial (drony/pilot) to english?

Oops, uhh  oke, wich part don`t you understand?

When a drone gets no RC input it will hover in place and hold position. (in GPS mode ofcourse)
With no wind pitch and roll angles are flat.
Wind blowing to the nose means that the craft drifts backwards, to keep position it needs to pitch down a bit.
More wind, more pitch down (nose down). Too much wind, max nose down achieved and craft fly`s backwards.

In each mode there is a max nose down attitude, thus a max wind to flight against to hold position.

Hope it make sense now.
Good to read that your MP is flying again with no problems!!
cheers
JJB

2018-12-18
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SK Posted at 12-18 12:52
Hi JJBspark!

I cannot pretend that I understood what you just saying. Could you please translate this from aerial (drony/pilot) to english?

I think you will see at 16.12 left stick 100% forward right stick 100% down in tripod mode, causing aircraft to go up and back , did you lose sight of AC as it went over trees, as it seems you may then have been disoriented?
2018-12-18
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2018-12-18
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hallmark007 Posted at 12-18 13:10
I think you will see at 16.12 left stick 100% forward right stick 100% down in tripod mode, causing aircraft to go up and back , did you lose sight of AC as it went over trees, as it seems you may then have been disoriented?

Nope.
At this time everything was normal. At least I didn't see any problem. If you switch to the map mode, you can see that the AC was above the middle of the river. I was preparing to the next pass and adjusted the AC position, by lifting it up and moving just a little bit back. At that moment I clearly saw the AC at the distance of 30 meters away.
Just after that small correction the AC started moving by itself. I could see the AC for a few seconds before it went to the woods.
2018-12-18
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SK
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16.13.4
I released both sticks and was surprised that AC was still moving.
In one second (at 16.14.4) I tried to lift the AC. This coincidented with the speed jump (from 1.6 mp/h to 6.8 mp/h).
2018-12-18
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SK Posted at 12-18 13:38
16.13.4
I released both sticks and was surprised that AC was still moving.
In one second (at 16.14.4) I tried to lift the AC. This coincidented with the speed jump (from 1.6 mp/h to 6.8 mp/h).

Well I’m inclined to agree with the theory that wind was a factor, and no stick movements to counteract act, however I think you should open a case with dji, they will be able to extract more information from your dat file.
2018-12-18
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JJBspark Posted at 12-18 12:59
Oops, uhh  oke, wich part don`t you understand?

When a drone gets no RC input it will hover in place and hold position. (in GPS mode ofcourse)

Okay. After the second reading I started to understand. Thank you.
My confusion is that there was no wind warnings.
Okay, let the wind be (was). The drone couldn't compensate it and was drifting backward. But in the woods? What forced the AC to continue in the woods accelerating and forgetting about the Tripod mode (all sensors on)?
With all my drones I consider the tripod mode as the saftiest one. The AC see the obstacles and stop moving in spite all commands from RC.
2018-12-18
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SK Posted at 12-18 13:50
Okay. After the second reading I started to understand. Thank you.
My confusion is that there was no wind warnings.
Okay, let the wind be (was). The drone couldn't compensate it and was drifting backward. But in the woods? What forced the AC to continue in the woods accelerating and forgetting about the Tripod mode (all sensors on)?

There was a drop in satellites from 19 to 11/12 , tripod needs very good gps to get good hold, this could be one reason for this extreme behaviour.
2018-12-18
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hallmark007 Posted at 12-18 14:04
There was a drop in satellites from 19 to 11/12 , tripod needs very good gps to get good hold, this could be one reason for this extreme behaviour.

Yes. However, it happened way after the troubles started. Say 10 seconds after the AC started moving by itself.
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SK Posted at 12-18 14:55
Yes. However, it happened way after the troubles started. Say 10 seconds after the AC started moving by itself.

Well that could be a sign of some malfunction.
2018-12-18
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Oh, Happy you found it again. I was under the impression you lost it in the woods.
So, any visible damages on the drone? Gimbal ok?
2018-12-18
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SK Posted at 12-17 22:47
What did I do during those 15 seconds from the moment the drone went crazy to the moment it crashed?
Many things:
1. Get surprised seeing my drone went away with the increasing speed in spite of the fact that it was in tripod mode and the controls was at zero positions. 2 seconds.

It remind me the way I lost my first MAvic Air in urban environment at night!
But I will open a new thread one day.
I hope you find a solution!
And thanks God none was harmed!
2018-12-18
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SK Posted at 12-18 14:55
Yes. However, it happened way after the troubles started. Say 10 seconds after the AC started moving by itself.

Hiya,

True, GPS count was oke, only at the very end (close to trees) it dropped! But 11, 12 is OK for a stabilized flight.

Btw, all GPS position modes need good GPS sats + reception, TriPod does not need less, more or much more than P-GPS or Sport mode.

If a drone cannot fight against the wind (to hold position) it does not have the power to stop the movement. So when obstacle are sensed, software think "i have to stop that motion" but cannot do that.

So yes, TriPod is very safe flight beacuse all obstacle sensors are active (if i am right they are in track mode and tripod, but do not have a MP2 myself (yet)) but the drone has to have power in reserve to stop the motion when it sees an obstacle. If flying at or above wind limits (for that flight mode) facing the drone it cannot do that.
Probably an eye-opener for you and mayby others on this forum.
cheers
JJB
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2018-12-19
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JJBspark Posted at 12-18 12:59
Oops, uhh  oke, wich part don`t you understand?

When a drone gets no RC input it will hover in place and hold position. (in GPS mode ofcourse)

I think you will find that tripod mode needs both good light and good gps signal to work optimally.
You will also see it’s pitch is limited in tripod mode, there are specific warnings in the manual regarding tripod mode, so as not to be just confused with all other modes.
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hallmark007 Posted at 12-19 02:41
I think you will find that tripod mode needs both good light and good gps signal to work optimally.
You will also see it’s pitch is limited in tripod mode, there are specific warnings in the manual regarding tripod mode, so as not to be just confused with all other modes.[view_image]

Yes, but but the need for good GPS is the same as in any postion mode. so your text "needs very good gps..." can be read that it needs better GPS than the other position modes. Nope.

Speed is also angle limited, cause speed = angle = drone sensors not sensing the right angle.
And ofcourse speed has a relation with stopping distance in TriPod mode; great to spot an obstacle at some distance and your stopping distance is some distance + 1  

cheers
JJB
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JJBspark Posted at 12-19 04:54
Yes, but but the need for good GPS is the same as in any postion mode. so your text "needs very good gps..." can be read that it needs better GPS than the other position modes. Nope.

Speed is also angle limited, cause speed = angle = drone sensors not sensing the right angle.

I bring your attention to highlighted paragraph below, tripod mode was first introduced in P4Pro , in order to get optimum results it is recommended that it be used only with Strong gps, and in this situation gps was at 11 which is minimum safe for pups mode, as someone who uses tripod mode and particularly for long exposures, the stronger your gps the steadier your craft will hold.
Myself and another member Sparksbird did some tests on this for longer exposures, I can’t seem to find the post if I do I will enter it.
But you will see from P4Pro manual, using tripod mode is only advisable with Strong GPS, And it is in a specific warning section.
I’m sure that if tripod mode had no characteristics of its own, it would be just called Slow Mode, but I believe there are reasons other than marketing for calling it Tripod mode.
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hallmark007 Posted at 12-19 06:03
I bring your attention to highlighted paragraph below, tripod mode was first introduced in P4Pro , in order to get optimum results it is recommended that it be used only with Strong gps, and in this situation gps was at 11 which is minimum safe for pups mode, as someone who uses tripod mode and particularly for long exposures, the stronger your gps the steadier your craft will hold.
Myself and another member Sparksbird did some tests on this for longer exposures, I can’t seem to find the post if I do I will enter it.
But you will see from P4Pro manual, using tripod mode is only advisable with Strong GPS, And it is in a specific warning section.

Thanks for the P4P pro update, only now we need is a definition of strong GPS....
11 sats will not bring the craft in OPTI / ATTI, so imo Tripod mode will work OK and will not show this effect on the OP drone. (and 11 sats at the very end of this flight, the weird behaviour started earlier with more than 15 sats)

What do you mean by long exposures? seconds? ofcourse the more stable the craft flys the better pictures can be taken, unstable in this sense is moving around few inches around the hover spot or 10 feet left/right/fwd/aft ?

Copy Paste MP2 manual ; so P-GPS needs strong GPS too, and TriPod as in P-GPS. (so no specials for TriPod). Shooting more stable in TriPod because the drone reacts slowler to user input. (so mainly for video recordings, for pictures with high shutter speed moving of the drone is not so important)

cheers
JJB

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2018-12-19
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