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Ronin-s smooth orbit shots not possible? HELP!
2191 16 2-4 05:43
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CaptainFantastic
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Flight distance : 48868 ft
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Hi

maybe this needs a TLDR:
If you have a ronin could you please watch this video and answer my question real quik?

shot 1 - with autotune and all axis show exellent shot 2 - with way to high settings 50 stiffness and 50 strength (it works only that way but other modes like sport just shake violently with these settings)   
Can you do shots like this (moving gimbal in on direction and use the thumbstick controller to
pan in the opposite direchtion) with normal (autotuned) settings? Is it smooth for you guys or do
you also habe these weird stop and go movements? I really need to know asap if i have to return it
or look for something else (my old zhiyun haven't had that problem). THANKS.


long version:
What i'd like to know is if my unit is faulty or if it's a flawed design. Which i can't almost believe since there are so many happy users.

What i often do are orbit shots. So i move in one direction while panning with the gimbal in the other
(with thumgstick-controller) so we get that nice parallax effect everyone knows and likes.

With my ronins i can't do it with normal settings.
Normal panning is fine (there is always a small speedbump at the beginning with panning though),
but as soon as i move the gimbal at the same time i get these jerky stop and go movements.Tilt axis hasn't this problem at all...

I tried everything, all old firmwares, all possbile settings. Only one way to get it smooth is with
stiffnes/strenght at 50. But then recenter and sportmode are so vigorous that it can't be
good for the gimbal (shakes like crazy sometimes). If Motorsettings would be independent per Usermode then i could workaroundit, bit like this  it's not possible unfortunately.

Camera is a light old blackmagic pocket with lumix 12-35mm btw.

Here is a video demonstrating the problem. shot 1 is with autotune and all axis = exellent.
Shot 2 is with Strenght&Stiffness at high/50 (above that it starts to shake violently).
https://www.dropbox.com/s/sga4ud3b48ctlau/Problem-Ronin-s.mp4?dl=0

Can anyone confirm that these kind of shots work for them with normal settings? thanks.





















2-4 05:43
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fans1924925f
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United States
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Mine does the same. It’s jerky. I’m super dissatisfied with this gimbal so far.

We need a firmware update ASAP.
2-9 06:27
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DGBarar
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Hi All,

I am considering purchase of a Ronin-S for use with my 5D Mark IV.  My goal with this gimbal is to shoot smooth orbit shots.  So I would like an answer on this as well before I make the purchase.  if the Ronin-S is not able to do these orbit shots, then what is the best product to accomplish this goal.

Don Barar
2-11 18:04
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fans1924925f
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United States
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So far my cheap Zhiyun Crane handles the pan axis better.

I am desperate for a new firmware update.
2-11 19:07
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CaptainFantastic
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Flight distance : 48868 ft
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I explained the problem like 4times already to the support. They still aks me basic stuff to rule out user error which i can understand but it‘s a bit tedious since it‘s a problem
that takes you 3min to find out if it‘s just a small number of units or all of them.

step1: turn of smoothtrack on all axis

step2: turn down pan speed of controller to something like 10 (to rule out it‘s a user error to not pan at a steady pace). So you push the controller fully.

step3:move the gimbal to one side and pan with the thumbstick to the other side. look for a visual mark in the frame and try to keep it steady. if you got the timing you‘ll see if its smooth or if it‘s impossible to hold something in place due to the pan axis jumping/jerky movements.

As i said for a temporal workaround set stiffness&strenght of the pan axis to 50. And it will work like it should. I just dont think these high settings are good in the long run.
2-14 08:58
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CaptainFantastic
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CaptainFantastic Posted at 2-14 08:58
I explained the problem like 4times already to the support. They still aks me basic stuff to rule out user error which i can understand but it‘s a bit tedious since it‘s a problem
that takes you 3min to find out if it‘s just a small number of units or all of them.

Support told me that they could not replicate the jerky pannings  and i could the send gimbal back.
I'd feel more confident about it if someone from the forum would have confirmed that
his unit works as it should... not fond about having it sending in and recieve on with the same error... as time is money for me in this case.
2-20 04:15
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Stanley James
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No way to do a smooth orbit at this time. I had no problems doing this with my Crane. I gave up on them with the Ronin S and just do a partial orbit then slow it down in post and cut to another clip before the jerkiness of the Ronin S kicks in. It would be impossible to do a smooth full 360 orbit with my Ronin S.
2-24 22:13
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CaptainFantastic
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Stanley James Posted at 2-24 22:13
No way to do a smooth orbit at this time. I had no problems doing this with my Crane. I gave up on them with the Ronin S and just do a partial orbit then slow it down in post and cut to another clip before the jerkiness of the Ronin S kicks in. It would be impossible to do a smooth full 360 orbit with my Ronin S.

It is possible with the settings i posted... but those just don't feel healthy for the gimbal.
I need this thing for work and i'm hesitant to send it back just to get a unit with the same problem.
Funny is that it's only with the joystick and not with smoothtrack. But without joystick it's just not
precisely enough for what i do...

From support i just got generic answers. They told me 3times they'll forward it to a technician,
but i havent spoke with someone that had a real understanding of the matter.

Still would love if someone could jump in and confirm that there are units that work as other gimbals.
I asked in the blackmagicpocket4k facebook group and either they didn't use the joystick at all or they
had the same problems -_-
I guess a lot of people are just happy with the basic smooth-track follow function.
2-25 01:37
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DGBarar
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CaptainFantastic Posted at 2-25 01:37
It is possible with the settings i posted... but those just don't feel healthy for the gimbal.
I need this thing for work and i'm hesitant to send it back just to get a unit with the same problem.
Funny is that it's only with the joystick and not with smoothtrack. But without joystick it's just not

Hi All:

Getting ready to make my gimbal purchase.  With firmware updates since this post are any of you truly satisfied with the orbit shots that you can obtain with a Ronin S?

Don Barar
6-2 17:35
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DJI Calam
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Philippines
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This is happening to me unto this day. Any fix? Admins? I'm seriously bummed about the Ronin S right now.
6-3 06:24
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fans40e98a55
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Exactly the same problem. And with smoothtrack too. Totally no way to get clean orbit shot.
6-28 15:38
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DGBarar
Second Officer
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fans40e98a55 Posted at 6-28 15:38
Exactly the same problem. And with smoothtrack too. Totally no way to get clean orbit shot.

Hi,

Try the following:

- Roll.  Smooth Track Off.
- Tilt.  Smooth track on.  Speed = 100, Sensitivity = 100, Dead band 1.
- Pan.  Smooth track on.  Speed = 100, Sensitivity = 100, Dead band 1.

Capture at a minimum of 60 FPS.  Then slow down.  If using FCPX, turn on Optical Flow to reduce any "flicker".  I believe other video editing programs have something similar to Optical Flow.

Seems to work for me.  Let me know how you make out.

Don Barar
6-28 16:58
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CaptainFantastic
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DGBarar Posted at 6-28 16:58
Hi,

Try the following:

It has nothing to do with smooth track... i have a settings with smoothtrack off, just to be able to have perfect joystick/remote control when the gimbal is on a slider (for close up macro shots).
controls work perfect with the gimbal/camera still, but as soon as the thing is in motion the movement gets jerky...
I'll have to look for another gimbal.. while everything else was worse on my old zhyun, this wasn't a problem.
9-19 09:23
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DGBarar
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CaptainFantastic Posted at 9-19 09:23
It has nothing to do with smooth track... i have a settings with smoothtrack off, just to be able to have perfect joystick/remote control when the gimbal is on a slider (for close up macro shots).
controls work perfect with the gimbal/camera still, but as soon as the thing is in motion the movement gets jerky...
I'll have to look for another gimbal.. while everything else was worse on my old zhyun, this wasn't a problem.

Hi Captain Fantastic:

I agree the Ronin S seems to have difficulty with the orbit shot--there is some issue with the PID (or lack of one) control algorithm.

As someone suggested placing the strength/stiffness at 50 on the pan axis helps but it also seems to cause some stress on the motors.

I have been working with the following Smooth Track settings and have been getting better results with little or no "jerking":

- Sensitivity = High.  The rationale is that with an orbit shot, one is constantly changing direction so the Ronin S needs to pick up this change in direction quickly.
- Dead Band = 1.  Same rational as with sensitivity.
- Speed = Low.  With higher speeds the Ronin S seems to move too quickly and over corrects.  At a speed setting of low this behavior appears to be tamed.
- Tuning Settings = Mid.  I tried both high and low.  This did not seem to make a difference.

I know that you do not believe the Smooth Track settings help (again there are issues with DJI's PID control algorithm).  But please try anyways as I would like to get your confirmation if you are seeing the same improvements that I am.

Don Barar


10-7 12:10
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CaptainFantastic
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DGBarar Posted at 10-7 12:10
Hi Captain Fantastic:

I agree the Ronin S seems to have difficulty with the orbit shot--there is some issue with the PID (or lack of one) control algorithm.

thx for the input. i'll give it a try as soon as i'm back in the office (on the road right now).
you're trying to do the orbit with the joystick right? because with my settings i can do a smoothtrack orbit
it's the more precise (often macro shots) orbits where i need to use the joystick where my problems are.

best , cf
10-8 02:11
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DGBarar
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CaptainFantastic Posted at 10-8 02:11
thx for the input. i'll give it a try as soon as i'm back in the office (on the road right now).
you're trying to do the orbit with the joystick right? because with my settings i can do a smoothtrack orbit
it's the more precise (often macro shots) orbits where i need to use the joystick where my problems are.

Hi CF,

No joystick.  I look forward to finding out your results.

Don
10-8 06:02
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DGBarar
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CaptainFantastic Posted at 10-8 02:11
thx for the input. i'll give it a try as soon as i'm back in the office (on the road right now).
you're trying to do the orbit with the joystick right? because with my settings i can do a smoothtrack orbit
it's the more precise (often macro shots) orbits where i need to use the joystick where my problems are.

Hi CF,

No joystick.  I did my tests fairly close to a lamp I set up in the middle of a room.  Look forward to seeing your results.

Don
10-8 06:04
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