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Mavic air dive in saltwater. I lost completely my drone.
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4260 53 2019-3-9
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Manuel F.
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Hello,

Im new in DJI Forum, so i will try to explain my bad experience in the best way.

Last afternoon i made a normal flight over the water, and for some reason the Mavic air decided to dive in the Salt water. I dont have touch the joystick, and this is clear visible on the flight record.
Before it act like crazy it give me a message about the detecting of propellers guards.(i attach the picture ). I dont use the propeller guards.
I already make an email to DJI support explaining this.
Now i have several doubts.
- Will be DJI analyze my flight records and even if i dont have DJI Care, can they give me a new one ( if it prove that is was not my fault)?
- I need to understand what happens, because im sure it was not any mistakein the flight from my side.
- If DJI will not give me a new one, i want to buy only a new drone, where can i buy it?

Any comments or help are welcome.

Thank you.

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2019-3-9
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*DM*
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It says 'no propeller guards detected'...
2019-3-9
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Manuel F.
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*DM* Posted at 3-9 01:58
It says 'no propeller guards detected'...

Yes. Thats a  strange message on the middle of the flight. I dont use propellers guards. The most of us dont use it. Anyway I dont know the cause of the crash.
2019-3-9
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JJB*
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Hi Manual,

If you like to find out more what happend upload your flightrecord, using
this link > https://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer/Upload/

After upload post your link on here.

cheers
JJB


2019-3-9
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Manuel F.
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Mavic air log fileJJB* Posted at 3-9 02:43
Hi Manual,

If you like to find out more what happend upload your flightrecord, using

Here it is.
https://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer
/D4ZE9Y708GT48NRRTDGJ/
Thank you for the help
2019-3-9
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Manuel F.
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Mavic air log file crash
2019-3-9
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Manuel F.
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https://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer/D4ZE9Y708GT48NRRTDGJ/
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JJB*
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Manuel F. Posted at 3-9 03:05
https://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer/D4ZE9Y708GT48NRRTDGJ/

Hi Manual,

Last part of the flight your MA was heading 060 but drifting hdg 285.
No RC input, MA could not hold postion, needed more power to hold postion and height!

So it dropped height from approx 35 meters to 7 meters, moving speed increased.
Switched into ATTI mode for less than second (don`t know why), and into an autolanding.
So what happend, not sure but looks as there was too much wind for this flight.
This explains for me the dropping of height, but not for the ATTI and autolanding.

Autolanding will be excecuted in ATTI and disconnected after few seconds though.

cheers
JJB
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Manuel F.
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JJB* Posted at 3-9 03:29
Hi Manual,

Last part of the flight your MA was heading 060 but drifting hdg 285.
[Image]

Thanks for the analyze. It was very low wind, maximum 5 knots , it dont give any wind warning during all the flight. Someting more append for sure. Lets see what DJI suport say.
2019-3-9
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JJB*
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Manuel F. Posted at 3-9 03:43
Thanks for the analyze. It was very low wind, maximum 5 knots , it dont give any wind warning during all the flight. Someting more append for sure. Lets see what DJI suport say.

Hi manual,

In the beginning of the flight all looks OK, i see indeed less wind.
At the end your  MA starts to drift away, no errors for GPS compass ect, so my guess is wind.

Hope DJI can help you out!

cheers
JJB

2019-3-9
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jacksonnai
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Sorry to read that mate
2019-3-9
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Manuel F.
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I open a thread on Mavicpilot forum and on member make a detailed analyze about it.
Here the link.
Detailed analyze on Mavicpilot https://mavicpilots.com/threads/mavic-air-act-like-crazy-and-dive-in-the-water.60675/#post-690805

2019-3-9
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DJI Paladin
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Hi Manuel F, you have our sincere apologies for the inconvenience. This is not what DJI's wants you to experience. I managed to check your email and I will follow up this to our designated team. Also, please note that DJI will not perform data analysis for cases occurring after the expiry of the warranty period. Again, sorry for all the inconvenience and thank you for your support.
2019-3-9
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HereForTheBeer
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JJB* Posted at 3-9 03:29
Hi Manual,

Last part of the flight your MA was heading 060 but drifting hdg 285.

i put his log into airdata and wind speed on weather report was 11.1 MPH   hardly too much wind, something else wrong
2019-3-9
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Manuel F.
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DJI Paladin Posted at 3-9 11:32
Hi Manuel F, you have our sincere apologies for the unpleasant experience. This is not what DJI's wants you to experience. I managed to check your email and I will follow up this to our designated team. Also, please note that DJI will not perform data analysis for cases occurring after the expiry of the warranty period. Again, sorry for all the inconvenience and thank you for your support.

I bought the drone in Jan 2019, it still inside the waranty (I belive). If you need any new information, log files, DAT files, let me know.
Will wait for your feed back about this case.
Thank you.
2019-3-9
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DJI Paladin
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Manuel F. Posted at 3-9 12:10
I bought the drone in Jan 2019, it still inside the waranty (I belive). If you need any new information, log files, DAT files, let me know.
Will wait for your feed back about this case.
Thank you.

You're welcome and thank you for your prompt response. This concern has already been forwarded to our designated team. I will notify you once we receive an update about this. You can also check your email from time to time. Appreciate your patience and support.
2019-3-9
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Manuel F.
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DJI Paladin Posted at 3-9 12:13
You're welcome and thank you for your prompt response. This concern has already been forwarded to our designated team. I will notify you once we receive an update about this. You can also check your email from time to time. Appreciate your patience and support.

Only a information, I already send yesterday a email to DJI suport. I received a reply with the identificaton number of the request suport : 2014798.
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Manuel F.
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HereForTheBeer Posted at 3-9 11:43
i put his log into airdata and wind speed on weather report was 11.1 MPH   hardly too much wind, something else wrong

Thank you for the analyze. Yes.. It was not windy at all.
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Manuel F. Posted at 3-9 12:20
Only a information, I already send yesterday a email to DJI suport. I received a reply with the identificaton number of the request suport : 2014798.

Yes and I've seen that email. Please wait for the response from our related team, also, I already requested a follow up for your ticket.
2019-3-9
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maddox
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Sorry to read that buddy
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JJB*
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HereForTheBeer Posted at 3-9 11:43
i put his log into airdata and wind speed on weather report was 11.1 MPH   hardly too much wind, something else wrong

yes, you could be right. But no info/error in this flightlog shows abnomalities, except less power to keep position. And wind can be very local and higher above water parts.
Did not check the weather condition, but if motors were spinning max speed mayby some icing on the rotors? (can happen with the right temperature + humidity)
Hope OP will hear the real story of this flight from DJI.

cheers
JJB
2019-3-10
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hallmark007
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It does look like your aircraft was out of control, although your log shows Atti mode @3.8 seconds, you can clearly see that your craft went crazy @3.37 seconds, looking at speeds created they match noting only Atti mode, so from @3.38 seconds I believe your craft was in Atti mode and eventually this caused the crash.What happened.
Well from your logs it’s impossible to know, and this might not help you with dji, so be prepared because you don’t have flight log from craft dji will have to judicate your warranty based on log from device.
For me it looks on the face of it a malfunction, could it be gps module, who knows.
Good Luck.
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HereForTheBeer
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JJB* Posted at 3-10 03:08
yes, you could be right. But no info/error in this flightlog shows abnomalities, except less power to keep position. And wind can be very local and higher above water parts.
Did not check the weather condition, but if motors were spinning max speed mayby some icing on the rotors? (can happen with the right temperature + humidity)
Hope OP will hear the real story of this flight from DJI.

temps suggesting 55F ( 13C ), so no ice should form, no wind warnings in logs, and he mentions wasn't windy at all, winds from log vs weather data suggesting 11 MPH ( 5 m/sec)  so wasnt flying in excessive winds even if he was i have flown in strong winds and even in strong winds shouldnt freak out too much to trigger failure.  and his max recorded speed is 79.59 MPH which means something catastrophic occurred sending it diving into water.    the telemetry suggests and atti mode, but the user mode data was suggesting position mode.

lot wrong with this one, DJI needs to jump on this, i beleive he owed a replacement unit and i think dji should consider more firmware updates and optimizations.. this has happened sparatically with mavic air, but i feel enough times dji should look into adding another softwsre level safty function to help prevent this, somehow..  given amount of info and telemetry these drones gather, i imagine dji could identify signitures in telemtry indicating something is wrong and failsafe out of it..
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Manuel F.
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HereForTheBeer Posted at 3-10 09:21
temps suggesting 55F ( 13C ), so no ice should form, no wind warnings in logs, and he mentions wasn't windy at all, winds from log vs weather data suggesting 11 MPH ( 5 m/sec)  so wasnt flying in excessive winds even if he was i have flown in strong winds and even in strong winds shouldnt freak out too much to trigger failure.  and his max recorded speed is 79.59 MPH which means something catastrophic occurred sending it diving into water.    the telemetry suggests and atti mode, but the user mode data was suggesting position mode.

lot wrong with this one, DJI needs to jump on this, i beleive he owed a replacement unit and i think dji should consider more firmware updates and optimizations.. this has happened sparatically with mavic air, but i feel enough times dji should look into adding another softwsre level safty function to help prevent this, somehow..  given amount of info and telemetry these drones gather, i imagine dji could identify signitures in telemtry indicating something is wrong and failsafe out of it..

No matter how hard DJI or other drone maker work on there products, situations like this will always be exist. It Electronic and mechanical components, they will never be 100 % failure free. They must be prepared to replace aircrafts when they crash because of technical problems, and for sure they are prepared for worst cenários. Because in these case the drone dive in the water.. But imagine it dives on roads and collides with cars or people and causes serious injuries.
After my case..it let me think a lot. I will be scrary when I fly again a drone on higher distances.
Lets see what DJI will say to my case.
Thank you for your analyze.
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JJB*
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HereForTheBeer Posted at 3-10 09:21
temps suggesting 55F ( 13C ), so no ice should form, no wind warnings in logs, and he mentions wasn't windy at all, winds from log vs weather data suggesting 11 MPH ( 5 m/sec)  so wasnt flying in excessive winds even if he was i have flown in strong winds and even in strong winds shouldnt freak out too much to trigger failure.  and his max recorded speed is 79.59 MPH which means something catastrophic occurred sending it diving into water.    the telemetry suggests and atti mode, but the user mode data was suggesting position mode.

lot wrong with this one, DJI needs to jump on this, i beleive he owed a replacement unit and i think dji should consider more firmware updates and optimizations.. this has happened sparatically with mavic air, but i feel enough times dji should look into adding another softwsre level safty function to help prevent this, somehow..  given amount of info and telemetry these drones gather, i imagine dji could identify signitures in telemtry indicating something is wrong and failsafe out of it..

yeah, weird data it is!  Speed max by calculate LAT LON versus time = 41 MPH at the end.
APP speed data is incorrect when there is IMU errors etc. (although none in the file)

Another non logic issue ; If drone was for a longer period in ATTI (mayby Hallmark is correct) mode with no RC input the pitch and roll values are flat values ; not in this flight. But with 4 degree pitch down and 14 right you don`t fly a speed of 30 mph !!

Within few seconds after increasing speed the NotEnoughPower error is there....and loosing height with average descend speed of 5.5 m/s.

And if in ATTI why loosing height ?  and not just drift away on the wind.....

Too much questions, i just don`t know the answers.
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hallmark007
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HereForTheBeer Posted at 3-10 09:21
temps suggesting 55F ( 13C ), so no ice should form, no wind warnings in logs, and he mentions wasn't windy at all, winds from log vs weather data suggesting 11 MPH ( 5 m/sec)  so wasnt flying in excessive winds even if he was i have flown in strong winds and even in strong winds shouldnt freak out too much to trigger failure.  and his max recorded speed is 79.59 MPH which means something catastrophic occurred sending it diving into water.    the telemetry suggests and atti mode, but the user mode data was suggesting position mode.

lot wrong with this one, DJI needs to jump on this, i beleive he owed a replacement unit and i think dji should consider more firmware updates and optimizations.. this has happened sparatically with mavic air, but i feel enough times dji should look into adding another softwsre level safty function to help prevent this, somehow..  given amount of info and telemetry these drones gather, i imagine dji could identify signitures in telemtry indicating something is wrong and failsafe out of it..

I think speed you read at 79.8mph is not a true speed, easiest way to measure this is to speed per ft per second and at 80mph he would be covering approx 120ft per second ,at 80mph his drone was only covering 70ft, which is about correct for top speed in Atti or Sport mode for Mavic Air 45mph, so although log was showing 80mph, this was not the speed the craft was travelling at, it’s just an incorrect reading.
So I don’t think there was anything strange in what happened with Aircraft going to Atti mode, the strange thing was how craft lost height so rapidly, I wonder if there was a problem with barometric pressure which caused other problems with craft.
I worry because it’s normal if no proof of malfunction can be proved in the mobile logs, dji have usually gone with no fault and offered 30% discount, we shall wait and see.
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HereForTheBeer
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hallmark007 Posted at 3-10 13:02
I think speed you read at 79.8mph is not a true speed, easiest way to measure this is to speed per ft per second and at 80mph he would be covering approx 120ft per second ,at 80mph his drone was only covering 70ft, which is about correct for top speed in Atti or Sport mode for Mavic Air 45mph, so although log was showing 80mph, this was not the speed the craft was travelling at, it’s just an incorrect reading.
So I don’t think there was anything strange in what happened with Aircraft going to Atti mode, the strange thing was how craft lost height so rapidly, I wonder if there was a problem with barometric pressure which caused other problems with craft.
I worry because it’s normal if no proof of malfunction can be proved in the mobile logs, dji have usually gone with no fault and offered 30% discount, we shall wait and see.

i think 80mph was his drone diving
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JJB*
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HereForTheBeer Posted at 3-10 21:54
i think 80mph was his drone diving

avg down speed 5.5 m/s times 2.2 to get mph.
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Manuel F.
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I already received from DJI  an email requesting all the information. Lets see what will be the conclusion. Its insteristing to see all your analyze of my data about this flight. Thank you.
2019-3-11
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HereForTheBeer
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JJB* Posted at 3-10 23:54
avg down speed 5.5 m/s times 2.2 to get mph.

makes me wonder what my old spark's log would have shown for how i achieved 72 mph... cuz that was a nose dive straight down and i dont think the logs measured that correctly and measured it as horizontal speed.  unfortunately i no longer got the log from it laying around to examine again.  
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BKahuna
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A little after 3 minutes, looking at the radar screen, you can see the drone is rolled heavily to one side.  There is no input from the sticks at that point so it's not something the pilot is doing.  Either the drone is rolled to the right because it's trying to fight the wind or it's rolled to the left for no good reason but explains why its direction and heading differ.  I don't know how to read the radar screen well enough to know which way it's rolled.
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cutis
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i was warned by forum even though wind is calm zero on takeoff it does not mean up at elevation the same zero windspeed is same.
and i was also informed, that when solar warming initiates at dawn or unveiled cloud cover permitting heating, the wind can speed up, i would assume rush INWARDS from the COLD sea toward the warming land. i can understand hot balloon rising upwards, analogous to cold ocean air being sucked toward land because the air above the land had risen upwards consequently drawing vacuum for cold ocean air to move inwards equalizing the drawn vacuum
in tragedy's situation, there are two distinct land masses, one is infinitely larger than the other land mass appearing as some offshore island.
but recall the cold temperatures recorded. such record is from craft. but is there any indication of dynamic temperature change?
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JJB*
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HereForTheBeer Posted at 3-11 07:20
makes me wonder what my old spark's log would have shown for how i achieved 72 mph... cuz that was a nose dive straight down and i dont think the logs measured that correctly and measured it as horizontal speed.  unfortunately i no longer got the log from it laying around to examine again.

I think that the speed is derived from the X and Y movements, so in the horizontal path.

horizontal en vertical speed is 'easy' to calculate ; horizontal the distance moved (lat lon postions) versus time, vertical the barometric height difference in time steps of 0.1 second.

When all works great the speed indication in the app equals the calculated speed (LatLon<>time)
When the IMU get confused (weird input data) i see the speed values starts to differ.

cheers
JJB
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JJB*
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BKahuna Posted at 3-11 08:33
A little after 3 minutes, looking at the radar screen, you can see the drone is rolled heavily to one side.  There is no input from the sticks at that point so it's not something the pilot is doing.  Either the drone is rolled to the right because it's trying to fight the wind or it's rolled to the left for no good reason but explains why its direction and heading differ.  I don't know how to read the radar screen well enough to know which way it's rolled.

yes, roll right it was.

MA heading 060 in P-GPS mode, no stick input, so trying to keep position.
For this pitch down 11 degree and roll right 16 degree.
MA cannot keep postion and moves with some speed in the direction 283.

If not the wind than something else is going terrible wrong. If it is ATTI than with no RC input the pitch and roll angles must be flat.

Guess we need to see the DAT file for more data, speed of the 4 motors, guess they were running at their max rpm, so not enough power to keep position en height.

As said, i do not really understand this flightlog....wind was moderate, so MA should be able to keep postion and height!  Why not??


cheers
JJB
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Manuel F.
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JJB* Posted at 3-11 09:23
yes, roll right it was.

MA heading 060 in P-GPS mode, no stick input, so trying to keep position.

Hi JJB, here the DAT file.https://www.dropbox.com/s/9h49apm9j9tq0su/19-03-08-06-20-00_FLY004.DAT?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/9h49apm9j9tq0su/19-03-08-06-20-00_FLY004.DAT?dl=0
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cutis
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The 2nd flight log pic shows "ting active track"
What's that suppose to mean?
Did he actuate some modular softdriven activity called "active track"?
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JJB*
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Hi manual,

I see some fatal erors in your DAT file, errors just after you stopped the active tracking.

MA had some problems with keeping it level, followed by tilt and heading excursions.
After that compass interference, magn hdg errors.
MA in random fly 'mode', not in control, executed autolanding.

And indeed high revs on the motors at the end.
My guess is that DJI will help you out.

cheers
JJB

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Manuel F.
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JJB* Posted at 3-11 13:09
Hi manual,

I see some fatal erors in your DAT file, errors just after you stopped the active tracking.

I hope you are right.
Thank you for the analyze.
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Manuel F.
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I get answer from DJI:

" The unfortunate incident that occurred to your aircraft has been confirmed as a warranty case according to our data analysis.

If the aircraft cannot be recovered, we would like to offer you a replacement, Mavic Air (Onyx Black) without the remote controller and battery charger. ..."

With this i can only say: Good work DJI. It was  quick and precise on the answer. Lets see if the replacement MA will arrived also quick.

I will Ask DJI if they  find the exact failure (for curiosity) and if i can choose White color ,because the black ones have suicidal tendencies ;-)

Thanks to all members from this forum that "waste" some time to analyze my data and share the reports.
2019-3-14
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JJB*
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Manuel F. Posted at 3-14 01:26
I get answer from DJI:

" The unfortunate incident that occurred to your aircraft has been confirmed as a warranty case according to our data analysis.

Hi Manual,

Good news from DJI !

happy many landings with your new MA.

cheers
JJB
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