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UPDATE. Osmo Pocket mic problem that's reproducible
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David_Harry
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Hi.
I'm now able to reproduce this external microphone problem. I would very much appreciate it if anyone could see if this problem effects them. Here is the blurb that I have in my YouTube description.

BTW. The focus problem in this video is the Pocket, it was in face track all the time in AFC, even following my slight movements at times but never once focused. I was fully lit with my lights as well.

Serious problem with DJI Osmo Pocket microphone adaptor it changes sound quality

This video shows a clear reproducible audio problem with the DJI Osmo Pocket microphone adaptor. When changing settings on the Pocket's interface, for instance changing the audio level from auto to low or any other setting and then back to auto. The audio quality changes even when set back top where it was set when it sounded OK.  The results of the problem are that the audio level drops and the tone of the microphone's audio changes, even though the settings are back to where they were.


The only way I can work out to avoid this problem is if you switch off the Osmo Pocket and do a complete power cycle with the microphone or external preamplifier if necessary.  I can also reproduce this problem with microphones that are powered direct from the Osmo Pocket.  As you can see, this situation is unworkable. What makes this worse is the fact that even if you don't change microphones and don't change levels. After a power cycle of the Pocket, which it may do itself anyway as part of its power saving function, the Pocket may not switch back on in the same audio level mode that you left it in. I've actually seen other people make mention of this on the DJI Osmo Pocket forum.


If any Osmo Pocket owners come across this video on my YouTube test channel or if anyone on the Osmo Pocket forum sees this video and they have the mic interface. Would you mind testing what I've described and see if it effects your Osmo Pocket and external microphones.


Hopefully it's just my Osmo Pocket and microphone adaptor that has this issue and would mean others would be fine. If however this issue is not just isolated to my setup, I will do a full video for my main YouTube channel reproducing the issue in a number of setups and microphone combinations.


Cheers, Dave.






3-29 14:03
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DJI Stephen
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Hello and good day Dave. Thank you for reaching out and for these information you have shared with us today. I hope that our DJI members and customers who uses the DJI 3.5mm mic adapter can give out there experience on this matter. Thank you for your support.
3-29 14:47
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AleX Spin
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Hi Dave, are mic settings on Auto?
3-29 15:53
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David_Harry
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DJI Stephen Posted at 3-29 14:47
Hello and good day Dave. Thank you for reaching out and for these information you have shared with us today. I hope that our DJI members and customers who uses the DJI 3.5mm mic adapter can give out there experience on this matter. Thank you for your support.

Hi Stephen.

Thanks for the response. I'm hoping that it's simply an issue with my Pocket or adaptor and that may well be confirmed if others have not seen this issue.

Cheers,
Dave.
3-29 16:07
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DJI Stephen
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David_Harry Posted at 3-29 16:07
Hi Stephen.

Thanks for the response. I'm hoping that it's simply an issue with my Pocket or adaptor and that may well be confirmed if others have not seen this issue.

Thank you for the additional information Dave. Please keep us post regarding this matter. This will be a very big help to all our DJI Forum Members who owns that DJI Osmo Pocket. Thank you for your valued support.
3-29 16:14
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David_Harry
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AleX Spin Posted at 3-29 15:53
Hi Dave, are mic settings on Auto?

Hi Alex.

Yes, I'm in auto. This is absolutely necessary for the vast, if not all, of the considerable amount of mics that I've tested.

In any of the fixed gain modes there simply isn't enough input gain to record an appreciable level. Also, in auto gain the Pocket will apply a lot more of its dynamics processing, most notably AGC. Although it's not usually a good idea to have a recording device take control of the decision making process for gain staging and dynamics. In the case of the Pocket it's the excessive processing that usually results in a louder recording, and with the amount of dynamics processing going that's altering the perceived EQ/tone of the input, it also helps in this particular instance. But I must stress that this is not how to record audio properly, it's just that it's the only way to get anything appreciable out of the Pocket with regard level and tone, maybe this will change with future FW updates.

I have a number of examples of this issue but I don't want to start making videos about it unless I find out that the issue is something effecting other Pocket owners, in which case it won't simply be a one off with my setup.

Cheers,
Dave.     
3-29 16:14
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BobWinNV
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Mine still seems to be acting the same Dave.  What is the battery charge level on the OP? Perhaps plug-in-power is lower then normal due to the Pockets battery level.
3-29 16:16
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BobWinNV Posted at 3-29 16:16
Mine still seems to be acting the same Dave.  What is the battery charge level on the OP? Perhaps plug-in-power is lower then normal due to the Pockets battery level.

Hi Bob. Thanks for joining in.

I'm externally powered. Even if it were internal the amount of current needed to drive a typical ECM is so low that the battery would have to be nearly dead in order to not power a typical ECM.

When you say seems to be acting the same. Are you noticing the same mic changing its tone, even recording slightly lower, even though you've not changed anything physically?

Cheers,
dave.
3-29 16:21
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DJI Stephen Posted at 3-29 16:14
Thank you for the additional information Dave. Please keep us post regarding this matter. This will be a very big help to all our DJI Forum Members who owns that DJI Osmo Pocket. Thank you for your valued support.

Hi Stephen.

Will do buddy and you are welcome.

Cheers,
Dave.
3-29 16:24
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BobWinNV
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David_Harry Posted at 3-29 16:21
Hi Bob. Thanks for joining in.

I'm externally powered. Even if it were internal the amount of current needed to drive a typical ECM is so low that the battery would have to be nearly dead in order to not power a typical ECM.

Dave,
I will try to keep a more critical eye on things this weekend and see if I notice anything strange.
Bob
3-29 17:11
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Oh-no
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Hmm.... bad news ....

Guess it is either a software or hardware problem ...... have you try to clean the plug contacts with a camera lens blower?
3-30 00:22
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Ray-CubeAce
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Hi Dave.
To be clear, you are inside, Osmo Pocket in auto volume level with noise reduction off and recording at the same frame rate?

Is there anything in the background that has changed audio wise? Heating on, oven in the next room? Dimmer switch position variation or position of LED lighting?
Anything magnetic that is not shielded?
Even with noise reduction off, I'm not noting a drastic change in audio output. It makes me question how off is off? For sure, in some of my non-pro gear, off is never fully off but rather more like, reduced in the hope  I don't notice.
There are times when the noise reduction kicks in when I'm using my Pocket and haven't noticed why. Then it turns out a light breeze causing a low-frequency noise I don't notice which has kicked off the noise reduction.  It seems random to me but probably isn't.
Have you checked for any low frequency, low volume noise in your recordings?
Because apart from what I've noticed above I haven't had that much difference in the recordings that I've noticed, but then again I've only been doing background noise recording so far listening to the variation in high frequencies as I walk past various sources. All I've noticed is a low bit depth version of phasing for longer length high pitched sounds such as seagulls, but next to nothing on sharp transients such as dropped spanners.


3-30 04:50
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David_Harry Posted at 3-29 16:24
Hi Stephen.

Will do buddy and you are welcome.

That is great to know Dave. Have a safe and happy filming always.
3-30 13:04
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David_Harry
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Oh-no Posted at 3-30 00:22
Hmm.... bad news ....

Guess it is either a software or hardware problem ...... have you try to clean the plug contacts with a camera lens blower?

Hi.

Everything is clean.

Cheers,
Dave.
3-30 23:30
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Ray-CubeAce Posted at 3-30 04:50
Hi Dave.
To be clear, you are inside, Osmo Pocket in auto volume level with noise reduction off and recording at the same frame rate?

Hi Ray.

There are no external factors at play, the issue is the Pocket and/or the adaptor. I'll post an example later.

Cheers,
Dave.
3-30 23:33
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Udo13
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Due to the many discussions and problems with the audio adapter, I have stopped my order of the audio adapter.
The results shown with different external microphones, I think not good.
There seems to be a lot of trouble with the adjustments of the different microphones to the pocket.

For this reason, I prefer the compactness of the Pocket and will film without external microphone.

Maybe DJI will eventually make more detailed information on the entire subject of audio recording.
3-31 01:41
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Udo13 Posted at 3-31 01:41
Due to the many discussions and problems with the audio adapter, I have stopped my order of the audio adapter.
The results shown with different external microphones, I think not good.
There seems to be a lot of trouble with the adjustments of the different microphones to the pocket.

Hi Udo.

I think you've made the right decision. I will show a quick example later today how the Pocket compares with the GoPro Hero 7 with the same external microphone.

Cheers,
Dave.
3-31 02:18
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David_Harry Posted at 3-31 02:18
Hi Udo.

I think you've made the right decision. I will show a quick example later today how the Pocket compares with the GoPro Hero 7 with the same external microphone.

Hi Dave, I just discovered from this video https://youtu.be/qIv0rA75XUk that there is a correct and incorrect way of insertion of the adapter in the osmo pocket.
Unfortunately, the user manual is too small for my eyes and I did not read it...
May be that's the cause of your problems?
Cheers
AleX
3-31 03:07
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AleX Spin Posted at 3-31 03:07
Hi Dave, I just discovered from this video https://youtu.be/qIv0rA75XUk that there is a correct and incorrect way of insertion of the adapter in the osmo pocket.
Unfortunately, the user manual is too small for my eyes and I did not read it...
May be that's the cause of your problems?

Hi Alex.

Thanks. That is not the problem I'm having as the adaptor hadn't been moved during these issues.

Also and despite the fact that I have the adaptor orientated the same way as the advise in that video. I'm not entirely sure that the advice is correct. The whole point of USB C is that it is reversible and if simply inserting a peripheral the wrong way round could damage anything, then there are going to be a lot of damaged units out there. I doubt very much that DJI would take that risk of damage to their own product and break protocol with USB C.

Cheers,
Dave.  
3-31 03:32
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Ray-CubeAce
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AleX Spin Posted at 3-31 03:07
Hi Dave, I just discovered from this video that there is a correct and incorrect way of insertion of the adapter in the osmo pocket.
Unfortunately, the user manual is too small for my eyes and I did not read it...
May be that's the cause of your problems?

Hi Alex.
I have just spent the best part of an hour looking for the references in that video and can't find either a DJI comment within a video about which way around the connector should be and as to date only one version of the manual has been available and again I can't find anything relating to a 'correct position' for the audio adapter. In fact, I have had my audio adapter facing the exact opposite way since I've used it. Alway the opposite way around because I made an adapter for the audio adapter to form an extension to the Osmo Pockets body to make sure I couldn't damage the Osmo Pockets USB-C port. The whole point of USB-C is it doesn't matter which way round you put the plug into the port. I would be very interested in finding either the manual or the video where he says he found this information.  The Mods here have not mentioned this fact.
I know this is not your fault but I'm asking here if anyone else has seen this information directly from a DJI link.
What I did find is this sentence within the last firmware update which may be relevant.

'Optimized the audio in some scenes.'

Which can be found here.  Release notes

So it would seem that not all functions have an on/off option.


The only official notes I can find on the adapter are found here. Audio Adapter
3-31 04:26
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David_Harry
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Hi.

I'm now able to reproduce this external microphone problem. I would very much appreciate it if anyone could see if this problem effects them. Here is the blurb that I have in my YouTube description.

BTW. The focus problem in this video is the Pocket, it was in face track all the time in AFC, even following my slight movements at times but never once focused. I was fully lit with my lights as well.

Serious problem with DJI Osmo Pocket microphone adaptor it changes sound quality

This video shows a clear reproducible audio problem with the DJI Osmo Pocket microphone adaptor. When changing settings on the Pocket's interface, for instance changing the audio level from auto to low or any other setting and then back to auto. The audio quality changes even when set back top where it was set when it sounded OK.  The results of the problem are that the audio level drops and the tone of the microphone's audio changes, even though the settings are back to where they were.

The only way I can work out to avoid this problem is if you switch off the Osmo Pocket and do a complete power cycle with the microphone or external preamplifier if necessary.  I can also reproduce this problem with microphones that are powered direct from the Osmo Pocket.  As you can see, this situation is unworkable. What makes this worse is the fact that even if you don't change microphones and don't change levels. After a power cycle of the Pocket, which it may do itself anyway as part of its power saving function, the Pocket may not switch back on in the same audio level mode that you left it in. I've actually seen other people make mention of this on the DJI Osmo Pocket forum.

If any Osmo Pocket owners come across this video on my YouTube test channel or if anyone on the Osmo Pocket forum sees this video and they have the mic interface. Would you mind testing what I've described and see if it effects your Osmo Pocket and external microphones.

Hopefully it's just my Osmo Pocket and microphone adaptor that has this issue and would mean others would be fine. If however this issue is not just isolated to my setup, I will do a full video for my main YouTube channel reproducing the issue in a number of setups and microphone combinations.

Cheers, Dave.


4-2 13:09
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Hi Dave.

Are you using an Andriod phone or iPhone?
I ask because I'm using an Android device and so far I haven't had any settings change that I've set.
I've always left the volume on auto though but use MP4 video settings and Auto white balance which it keeps as well as my raw file setting in photo modes. I won't really be doing much audio critical work until the 15th.  Then it will get a real workout with a mixture of music and commentary in a variety of environments.
4-2 13:41
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Ray-CubeAce Posted at 4-2 13:41
Hi Dave.

Are you using an Andriod phone or iPhone?

Hi Ray.

I don't use my iPhone or Pixel to control it after a couple of settings changes that can only be done via Mimo, I mostly use it on its own.

If you've got critical audio to do at some point I'd recommend fully testing whatever your audio options are going to be before doing it properly.

Cheers,
Dave.
4-2 14:14
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BobWinNV
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Dave,

Dave,

I will run some structured tests on a few of my microphones later this evening and send you links to the raw audio files.
One file per microphone starting with power up in auto then cycling through the levels back to and ending with auto. At completion of each microphone I will power down change microphone and power back up in auto for the next test.

Be looking for PM in a few hours.

Bob
4-2 14:41
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Hi Bob.

That'd be great thanks.

I think I may have noticed the same or similar problem on your TakStar test.

As the start you have the Pocket on auto and the TakStar set to 0db. As you you drop the gain on the Pocket and then proceed through the various gain options on the Pocket and also some on the mic at end, none of the settings sound as good as the first take before you changed the Pocket. Even with the TakStar set to +10db and the Pocket on auto, the level isn't as loud as it was at the start even without the the gain on the TakStar and the end takes didn't have the same tone either.

This is fairly much what I'm talking about in this example. If you go back to your edit and just jump between the two the change may be easier to hear.

Cheers,
Dave.

4-2 15:13
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I do think that there is some sort of "bug" in the way the OP deals with the mic settings. I can replicate similar behavior, but unplugging the adaper and re-plugging it seems to resolve it. I've yet to find any setting that "sounds" better to my ears than "auto" by the way...
4-2 17:52
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txtechnonerd Posted at 4-2 17:52
I do think that there is some sort of "bug" in the way the OP deals with the mic settings. I can replicate similar behavior, but unplugging the adaper and re-plugging it seems to resolve it. I've yet to find any setting that "sounds" better to my ears than "auto" by the way...

Hi.

Thanks for that information. It does sound very similar, if not the same, as the problem I'm describing.

While switching the camera off and on may resolve certain audio issues, in my use it doesn't always come back with the same setting for audio gain. The most success I have is also using auto, although this will apply very excessive dynamics processing and result in the side effects of such processing, pumping, noise etc.

The big problem I'm finding is that it's just not practical using external mics if you're out and about trying to film stuff, as you're constantly Second guessing the audio setup and having to check it visually to see if anything's changed. Plus if your thinking too much about the setup you're not concentrating on shooting and if you're concentrating on shooting, as you should be, you may miss an audio setup.

I have a feeling that there is an issue and it's more than simple  isolated incidents.

Cheers,
Dave.
4-2 19:21
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David_Harry Posted at 4-2 19:21
Hi.

Thanks for that information. It does sound very similar, if not the same, as the problem I'm describing.

In my opinion, it is now high time that the developers of DJI comment on this topic.
4-3 01:09
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BobWinNV
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David_Harry Posted at 4-2 15:13
Hi Bob.

That'd be great thanks.

Hi Dave,

I sent you 4 audio clips from my testing.  One was just the audio from the previous SGC598 test and then three new tests with Clippy EM172 Lav, Edutige ETM001 omni, and EM172 cartridge test.  All start by powering up the Osmo Pocket with the adapter and mic to test already plugged in.  I then cycle through from Auto to low to moderate and back to low at which point I power down to change microphones by disconnecting the previous mic and the audio adapter then connecting the new mic and audio adapter before turning on the Osmo Pocket for the next test.

The Osmo pocket was always shut off in Auto gain and it always came back up in Auto gain.  So I did not have the gain switching problem.

I did notice lower audio levels on the second Auto level setting on each of the tests when compared to the levels seen when testing Auto gain after Osmo Pocket power up.  Not good.

Were you able to get the files that I sent links for?  They are all .wav 48K and sitting in my Dropbox account.

Bob
4-3 10:10
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BobWinNV Posted at 4-3 10:10
Hi Dave,

I sent you 4 audio clips from my testing.  One was just the audio from the previous SGC598 test and then three new tests with Clippy EM172 Lav, Edutige ETM001 omni, and EM172 cartridge test.  All start by powering up the Osmo Pocket with the adapter and mic to test already plugged in.  I then cycle through from Auto to low to moderate and back to low at which point I power down to change microphones by disconnecting the previous mic and the audio adapter then connecting the new mic and audio adapter before turning on the Osmo Pocket for the next test.

Hi Bob.

I've not downloaded the files yet I'm just in the middle of an edit but will download them as soon as I've finished this edit. Thank you very much.

Unfortunately, what you have observed yourself is the same thing that I've described. What's probably worse is the fact that you gave the system every opportunity to get the setup right by power cycling etc. and it still didn't manage to get it right.

I will do a video soon about this problem as it's something that does effect the Pocket system and users should be aware of this before buying into anything to do with external audio and their Pocket.

I'll have a video up later that you may find interesting that's comparing the Pocket to a GoPro and specifically stereo recording.

Thanks again for taking the time to upload the files.

Cheers,
Dave.  
4-3 10:48
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Udo13 Posted at 4-3 01:09
In my opinion, it is now high time that the developers of DJI comment on this topic.

Hi Udo.

I totally agree. There are far too many issues that have to be explained to the users and if these issues are going to be fixed via software updates.

Cheers,
Dave.
4-3 10:51
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BobWinNV
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David_Harry Posted at 4-3 10:48
Hi Bob.

I've not downloaded the files yet I'm just in the middle of an edit but will download them as soon as I've finished this edit. Thank you very much.

The first Auto after each power cycle looked good.  All bets are off once you change audio input settings after that though.
4-3 11:18
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BobWinNV Posted at 4-3 11:18
The first Auto after each power cycle looked good.  All bets are off once you change audio input settings after that though.

Hi Bob.

I think it's fair to say that it's all a bit of a mess. I've had it change between takes without anything changing, with power cycles and when altering the menu.

The simple fact is that these problems effectively make the audio adaptor and external microphones fairly useless as you can't guarantee the results.

My money is on DJI being able to fix this with updates but like Udo has said, DJI need to come clean right now with Pocket owners and inform them as to what exactly is going on with the adaptor and what it can and can't do.

Cheers,
dave.
4-3 11:42
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BobWinNV
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David_Harry Posted at 4-3 11:42
Hi Bob.

I think it's fair to say that it's all a bit of a mess. I've had it change between takes without anything changing, with power cycles and when altering the menu.

Dave,

Oh, didn't they explain everything in the instruction manual?

I just hope that all of the testing that has been done by users like yourself is getting passed on to the engineers.

I am looking forward to your next video.

Bob
4-3 11:50
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BobWinNV Posted at 4-3 11:50
Dave,

Oh, didn't they explain everything in the instruction manual?

Hi Bob.
Here's the instruction manual.

I think this is where the misguided idea about which way around the adapter should fit came from. Clearly, it's shown that way around to ensure people know it's the DJI adapter and for little other reason. The only other warnings are about using the wrong type of connector from the microphone into the adapter.  Presumably so as not to send any voltages down the wrong path.  The example above is a 10:1 scale reproduction. (Yes larger than the original.)
4-3 12:13
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BobWinNV Posted at 4-3 10:10
Hi Dave,

I sent you 4 audio clips from my testing.  One was just the audio from the previous SGC598 test and then three new tests with Clippy EM172 Lav, Edutige ETM001 omni, and EM172 cartridge test.  All start by powering up the Osmo Pocket with the adapter and mic to test already plugged in.  I then cycle through from Auto to low to moderate and back to low at which point I power down to change microphones by disconnecting the previous mic and the audio adapter then connecting the new mic and audio adapter before turning on the Osmo Pocket for the next test.

Hi Bob.

I've just had a listen to the clips, thanks for sharing them.

Here's what I noticed.

The drop in level in anything other than auto is really far too much and unusable for most people as most people wont be able to correct such things in post. The tone also changes in the fixed gain settings.

When returning to the auto setting every mic tested had much lower levels compared to the start of each take where it started off in auto. This is completely wrong, when returning to any given setting it should always be the same. Can you imagine if this happened with certain picture functions such as white balance, shutter, frame rate, resolution etc. People would be returning their Pocket's.

When working as you think it should, auto is the only setting that's of any use. But this is extremely problematic due to the excessive dynamics processing being applied but is the only way to get anything out of the Pocket that can sound OK.

This is all unacceptable for a peripheral that's designed for microphones and is the only one available. The only use this adaptor has is for people with some audio experience as they're likely to be the only ones who can get anything usable out of it due to post processing or gain matching with the appropriate  microphone that's required. Add to this the price of the adaptor and the whole thing becomes totally outrageous.

On the plus side. That example with the Clippy lav sounds great, I'm guessing you're really happy with it?

Maybe to give Pocket owners a very good option for a mic for the Pocket, DJI may want to consider a link in the Pocket forum to the MicBooster site for this lavalier, as it's one of the best mics so far tested for the Pocket.

BTW, Bob. You may want to do a full on video with all these examples, I think it'd be great for Pocket owners.

Thanks again for giving me access to the examples.

Cheers,
Dave.
4-3 12:44
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BobWinNV
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David_Harry Posted at 4-3 12:44
Hi Bob.

I've just had a listen to the clips, thanks for sharing them.

Thanks Dave,

I totally agree with all of your statements.

Yes, I am totally happy with the Clippy EM-172 Mono Lav and with the support that I received from the good folks at micbooster.com.

I will redo my test and add in a couple of other popular microphones for a new video in the format that I have been using with Audacity.  When I post the link here I will also index the start time of each microphone test.

It would sure be handy to be able to hear and see the audio record levels before we mash the record button.  I would be happy to plug my phone in for level tests at the beginning of a shoot if necessary.  I also feel that a continuous level adjustment level is necessary.  0 to 100 in steps of 1 is fine but something that one can relate to for future recording sessions with the same microphone and is adjustable over a useful range.

Thanks for all your efforts in testing the Osmo Pocket and the Audio Adapter it is nice to have someone as knowledgeable as yourself to bounce my own findings off of.

Bob

4-3 13:03
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BobWinNV
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Ray-CubeAce Posted at 4-3 12:13
Hi Bob.
Here's the instruction manual.
[view_image]

Sorry Ray-CubeAce I didn't really need the manual I was being rhetorical in that the manual really doesn't say anything useful.

Thanks for providing a copy though.

Bob
4-3 13:07
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HI
I'm no expert at all but I would expect the adapter to work out of the box and even though I wouldn't get it as good as you guys it should be better than the internal Mic
I have tested mine today with a Rode Wireless Go and a cheap non powered Lav mic.
I had the pocket connected to my iPhone and at some points it wasn't registering audio at all and then would suddenly start working without me changing anything but even when it did work the sound was far too quiet. If I increased the gain on the Rode it helped but still wasn't great.
I wanted to do some video next weekend using this set up but now I don't trust it at all.
Whats most annoying is the fact that DJI are not stepping in and owning up to a known problem and their online support just seem to read off scripts and can't help with anything vaguely technical
6-23 12:06
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CFGHvqwXJkJy
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United Kingdom
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Another update from me, after the latest Firmware update it seems to be even worse.
Maybe I didn't notice it before but there is an icon to show the adapter is connected but then it randomly shows that the microphone is connected but sometimes it never connects and when it does it can take an age.

DJI need to get their act together. Why isn't anyone from DJI acknowledging that there is an issue?

DJI have now offered to send me a replacement, this to me suggests that they do know there is a problem but are still not directly owning up to it
6-25 13:18
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