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Downfall - battery suddenly dropped from 50% to 7%
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Jorgehlopezc
lvl.4
Flight distance : 4957293 ft
Colombia
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DJI-Bruce Posted at 2015-6-18 16:37
Our supporting staff will definitely give you, our valued customer, a good answer. But I read all  ...

Dear Bruce, his statement is contradictory because if a fully charged battery performs its update, the battery reaches 95 or 96%, because we have measured with others. Really I feel sorry truly a company that is so recognized today deny such an obvious guarantee such a poor argument, you have based all the research show that the flight began at 95% which is also not prohibited in any part of the manual user in any chapter (annex the text of the manual).Transcribe here what the manual says about it:
"If the battery level is above 95%, turn on the battery before charging" (Page 21 from Users manual)
It is not even the value of the damage, because very mild, it is for the honor, for the truth, because even you do not explain to the community the reason for the sudden charge drops battery which make our flights are unsafe.
You really have not told the whole truth of the problem of batteries and now want to blame users.
For those who work with their drones this is really a shame.
It is an act of irresponsibility high.
2015-6-21
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jimhare
Captain
Flight distance : 239035 ft
Australia
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hammerdrone Posted at 2015-6-19 08:25
I`m a potential new pilot and I'm doing my research here. I have to ask- whats the deal with these b ...

Hey Hammerdrone,

Try to not get too caught up in the forum when it comes to negative issues.   

Believe me when I say that those having trouble are in the vast minority.

Think about it, if you bought a dishwasher and it was working perfectly would you go on the forum and create threads about how great it is?   Not nearly as likely as reporting an issue.

Here's a post I made a week ago, there are many more just like it.

http://forum.dji.com/forum.php?m ... 8&fromuid=21263
2015-6-21
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Michael Starley
Second Officer

United States
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InspirelessAggy. I hope you live in Georgia. I would like to buy you a beer sir.
Thanx for the laughs..  
Jimhare with all due respect. Minority and Majority  are relative terms.Everyone knows or has heard about DJI's acquisition of a much larger repair facility.You,this forum, and  everyone else knows that an unplanned business expense is caused by an unplanned problem.(Inspire1s).
Let's say for speculation purpose. Random number..say..75.000.00 units sold.
Another random number-35.000.00.In repair.I Repeat These Numbers Are Random.

Clearly 40.000.0 inspire owners have not had a problem.....yet.
That leaves 35.000.00 defective units in the world.
35.000. In this hypothesis is clearly the minority.

My question is because 35.000.0 are in minority does that let this company off of the hook?
Answer.        Hell No

Hammerdrone-Personally I say wait...if you can.      Search out a post called A swing and A Miss....Your answer is in that post.

jimhare No intent of disrespect. Love your work and your willingness to share with and teach us . Honestly you are one of my benchmarks here. I Love your videos.
At this time I am using one of your videos that you posted here as one of my standards. I know...that sounds like a lot of ass kissing....It is not.....I am sincere.
Just this morning I left the house early to gather morning nature footage . Footage inspired by your tutorials. So please do not see this as an attack.
2015-6-22
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InspirelessAggi
Second Officer

United States
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Michael Starley Posted at 2015-6-22 23:59
InspirelessAggy. I hope you live in Georgia. I would like to buy you a beer sir.
Thanx for the laugh ...

I need a beer.....i've been trying to get my refund back from DJI .   They've had the return for 10 days now and I've had to file a complaint with paypal.    Paypal needs verification that it has been returned and DJI isn't returning emails from them?  I'm still in the circle of disgust.  Tracking has confirmed that it was deliverd 10 days ago.   I need two beers!   No, not in Georgia.  I'm in Texas.   
Purchased on the 5th of June and it's now three weeks later and I still don't have a my returned funds or an inspire.   This is painful and really not necessary.   
2015-6-22
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Michael Starley
Second Officer

United States
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Wow sorry to hear about that . If this company doesn't watch it, a group of people will get together with documentation and present this companies business practices to the National Media.
After that, Better Business Bureau, then FAA. If the FAA alone were aware of the lack of social conscience and willingness to provide the public with an unsafe product they just might not be too happy.

Best wishes on that refund . If I were still on the road . I would stop in and buy you a Ten Gallon Hat full of beer.  I know you could use it.
2015-6-22
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InspirelessAggi
Second Officer

United States
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I normally contact the BBB when the customer gets dicked around.  I'm just not in the mood to mess with it.   I may check their ratings.       Normally, with the BBB, you get to complain and that's it.   Not much becomes of it.  It's a financial concern right now and Paypal is on it.
2015-6-22
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Jorgehlopezc
lvl.4
Flight distance : 4957293 ft
Colombia
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What a shame to have to share with all who have been interested in this distressing case, which until today 17 days after the accident, DJI has refused to respond to the guarantee, the face of such obvious and so well documented problem. His final argument was supposedly poor management of battery, when just ten days before final incident, they had been diagnosed with the same battery as good and functional.  
Not even for money, because the damages are few, only a broken arm, but I was just looking to DJI telling the truth about the problems of smart batteries to fly with confidence because I have another 8 batteries of the same. This is another guarantee DJI evasions.
2015-6-24
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InspirelessAggi
Second Officer

United States
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I sympathize with you on this.   I supposed they will look for an out if they can.   Not really interested in keeping a customer base.    I guess you will know that on future purchases.  
2015-6-24
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Mbarnidge
lvl.2

United States
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I would say the battery folks have a good class action lawsuit if this is how DJI is treating the issue. A 95% battery is insufficient for take off. In that case the app should ground you if the percentages are really so inaccurate and the battery at any time can drop to critical. It's a bug either in the power management software or the battery or a defective hardware issue. Either way Dji needs to own up and fix it. It's not like he took off at 20% battery. He was at 95 percent!  Ridiculous and disappointing response dji!
2015-6-24
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bvinisky
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United States
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Mbarnidge Posted at 2015-6-25 08:42
I would say the battery folks have a good class action lawsuit if this is how DJI is treating the is ...

Yes, very much agreed. Taking that line of thought a step further, if there hasn't been proper "battery maintenance" after 10 charge/discharge cycles and if this step is so critical to accurately estimating the charge, don't allow the battery to be used for flight or even re-charged until it's been drained down to the recommended level for recalibration. From my standpoint, it's way better safe than sorry.

I've been afflicted by this bug (IMHO this is a software bug) and am very lucky to have only lost two props in the process of trying to frantically land on a non-ideal mountain side instead of losing the whole craft. The battery dropped from 55% to 7% in an instant. For me, this problem didn't occur until early May, not too long after a firware update. The firmware update felt very timely too, since it wasn't until that release that I recall any kind of "smart battery" reminder mechinism being present for performing deep cycle charges. It's too bad, prior to that one the April release (rough timing, going off memory here) had things finally operating rock solid and feeling like a true production ready setup. At that point I had no more gimbal twitch / PGPS -> ATTI spastic episodes and I felt like I gained a few minutes of flight time instead of waiting minutes to let those issues shake out each round. In hindsight, I'd much rather take those predictable behaviors over the unpredictable, "will it fall from the sky?" due to battery maintenance shenanagins. I used to routinely fly short flights for a few minutes to get the shot I was after, turn off the craft, hike a short distance/time to a new location and then reuse the same battery with no problems. Well, not anymore, at least with any kind of comfort.
From a troubleshooting perspective, it's too bad so much has changed in the past few months. From firmware on the craft & batteries to using up more battery life cycles (many batteries are hitting their stride with an increased liklihood of reaching the 10x charge/discharge recalibration point) to more batteries being available and in use. Personally, I'm now working with 8 batteries and have a greater chance of prepping, but not always using them all with each outing.


I'm suspicious of whether this issue could be tied to the auto discharge logic. I'm not aware of a good way to know if a battery is in this auto discharge state. If a battery has been sitting untouched beyond the configured threshold and starts auto draining, how do you know? While in an auto discharge, what happens if the battery is used? Though common sense would generally say not to fly in this state, if there's no easy way to tell its state, how do you know? Does the auto drain impact the accuracy of the voltage and % left prior to recharing? What happens if you press the battery indicator button? Does it stop discharging or continue? What happens if after starting an auto discharge the battery is plugged in and topped off? Does the auto discharge cancel itself or continue after being recharged?
2015-6-24
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Jorgehlopezc
lvl.4
Flight distance : 4957293 ft
Colombia
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DJI-Bruce Posted at 2015-6-12 11:28
I saw Jorge's flight log and he really started using the battery from 95% with the cell voltage of ...

Dear Bruce,
Please could you reconsider my case? It is absurd that anyone charge the batteries until 95% risking the aircraft. Please investigate the real causes of the problem. Although not give me a guarantee, I have nine batteries and need real answers for what to do. I read the manuals, forums, inspirepilots, etc, because I fly a lot and need to care my birds. I am the person who brought the first inspire 1 in my Country Colombia, and with my promotional video ( ) I had many buy this brand.
My company Viewdrone.co was born with your drones, it is all that I'm so sad with the answer you gave to my case.
Again I beg you Please find the correct response to the fall of battery charge. It is for the good of many inspire pilots.


Thanks.

Jorge López
General Manager Viewdrone Colombiahttp://www.viewdrone.co

2015-6-30
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DJI-Bruce
lvl.3

Hong Kong
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Jorgehlopezc Posted at 2015-7-1 12:47
Dear Bruce,
Please could you reconsider my case? It is absurd that anyone charge the batteries unti ...

Hi Jorge,
As long as you charge the battery fully, it will minimize the risk of any accidents related to batteries and power level. We really value customers like you and take seriously investigations into any user cases that reported back to DJI. As for your case, I have all your flight logs even from the very beginning when you used your Inspire 1. I tracked all your records and found on that day you had the crash. The second battery you used is definitely not fully charged. It started discharging at 96%. This 96% means the time when you put the battery into the Inspire 1 and turned it on, then the flight log started to record everything about the Inspire 1.
Of course, the battery being not fully charged is to some extent not totally your fault. But our current technology tells us that if the battery is not fully charged, it has certain probability to experience power drop during a flight, usually drop to 7% of the power level. This is determined by the algorithium inside the battery gas gauge IC. This is the limitation of the technology so far and as a part of DJI we are trying best to push the tech forward. We have been working hard on improving the accuracy of the battery level calculations. Hopefully in the coming months, we could have some new versions of firmware released.

Again, Jorge, I feel sorry about the accident and I believe our DJI support team has given you a satisfactory feeback and repair already. I will keep following up your cases and hope you all the best in your future flights. Please rememer to charge the battery fully.
2015-6-30
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david.p.mann
First Officer
Flight distance : 14554101 ft
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DJI-Bruce Posted at 2015-7-1 14:07
Hi Jorge,
As long as you charge the battery fully, it will minimize the risk of any accidents relat ...

DJI-Bruce,

This is frightening.  I'm VERY concerned. Is the official DJI position that starting a flight with a battery level indication of 96% (96 percent!) is NOT acceptable and a potentially dangerous situation?

If that is the case, the DJI Pilot app should flash up a message saying - "WARNING - your battery is not FULLY charged to 100% - Do NOT attempt to START a flight!"  Your latest response does not suggest that the 96% battery level was an incorrect reading due to any improper battery maintenance and that the actual battery level may have been, for example, 50%. No, you are suggesting that starting a flight with a battery reading anything less than 100% is NOT recommended by DJI because it is a potentially unsafe situation. Am I understanding you correctly?

Frankly, I don't know that I've ever seen a 100% battery level reported by the DJI Pilot app by the time I power-up the aircraft and complete compass calibration and other basic system checks prior to take-off.  Or, is it only necessary that the battery say 100% the instant the Camera page of the DJI Pilot app pops up on the screen and the props have not yet been started? If 96% is not acceptable, how about 97%, 98% or 99%?  

Must the first battery level indication shown in the DJI Pilot app Camera page be exactly 100% on power-up of the Inspire battery or the flight should be abandoned and another fresh, fully-charged battery inserted in the Inspire?

There is DJI Pilot app option that will display the battery voltage as well as the battery percentage on the Camera page. It seems that with the very real possibility of an inaccurate battery percentage being displayed, is there, perhaps, a recommended minimum battery voltage level that Inspire pilots should confirm is present prior to beginning a flight?  

Is battery voltage level a more reliable indicator of battery charge than the battery percentage level that is displayed, or is the battery voltage level also potentially inaccurate if the battery is not "fully charged"?

Please - these are important questions for Inspire Pilots.  Your detailed answers would be greatly appreciated.
2015-7-1
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InspirelessAggi
Second Officer

United States
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This is what I am taking away from this experience.  Because I do have a phantom 3 still and still use that.

1.  Always fly your batteries at 100% and freshly charged.   The battery gauge is not reliable enough because of limited technology to tell us what the actual percentage is.   It's probably more accurate on a battery that has been freshly charged rather than one starts at 95-96%.  Which will not make sense to most people.  People think 95% is absolute when in fact it is not.
2. Rely on voltage per cell.  This is really the actual charge per cell you see.    Most lipos start at 4.2 volts per cell at max charge.    If he started at 3.89 volts per cell, then he is not far from fully discharged value of 3.5  volts.   I know when I recently ran my phantom 3 battery down to 5%, it was at 3.5 volts.   That was to cycle the battery.   When I fly my helicopters, I always check the the cells with a little meter I have in my pocket.  It doesn't tell me percentages, it tells me volts per cell and I want to see 4.2 volts per cell across the board, or I send it back to the charger for a balanced charge session.  All it takes is one cell to botch the battery.
3.  Do not let a battery sit for day fully charged and then go fly.  Charge them up that day, prior to flying.  That means activating or starting the battery and topping it off to 100% until the battery shuts off in the charge process
4.  Do not update firmware and then go fly.   You won't have a battery that is 4.2 volts per cell
5.  Do not calibrate the IMU and then go fly.   You won't have 4.2 volts per cell
6.  Do not let your battery sit in excessive heat or cold and then go fly.   

DJI,  It is your responsibility to educate your customers on Lipos and their characteristics if you build a battery that has autologic.   Standard use of lipos like in applicaiton of helis, will show up during flight.  Evidenced by lower response in RPM and flight characteristics.    ESCs also will let you know when a battery is not ready to fly.   You have a responsibility to educate your customers on this.   If we look at a battery and see it's 95%.....almost all of us will think it's good to go and will go fly when it's not.   You have the ability to build in failsafes in the pilot app to monitor these things.   If it says safe to fly, we take it at that value and go fly.    I'm sure he didn't get a warning that it would go from 50% to 7% so quickly.  How could he have known?   ....and you do have some responsibility on this case to get the customer going again.

if you value his efforts to bring the inspire 1 to Colombia and value him as a customer.  TAKE CARE OF HIS WISHES.   This company needs to take care of people like this because they have the money to buy your expensive product and will keep doing so as long as they are cared for.  But when you make batteries (smart batteries)  we rely on the technology to inform us.  We rely on the pilot app to inform us.   We rely on you as a company, to inform us on these caveots of the battery and the limitations of the battery.  Not after the fact.  Not after we have had a mishap that crashed the investment!

So, in conclusion for those who have read this fully.   Charge to 100% prior to any flight.  Do so by activating the battery and topping it off.   Otherwise you are at risk of the battery bottoming out too quickly.    Look at volts per cell and monitor those.   Monitor all your cells and make sure they are balanced in the pilot app battery readout.   

Had it not been for this post, I'd know none of this.   DJI< you also need to make more failsafes built into your product.   Provide a load tester for the batteries, so we can put them through a cycel from time to time to test the batteries.  It would be a smart thing to do.    Privide for a battery back up solution for the inspire.   A secondary battery to act as a failsafe in case the main battery bottoms out.  Jut something light enough to control and land or a cargo space for a full second battery.  This should be a priority on your INSPIRE 2.     People shouldn't have to have their inspires fall out of the sky because of this.  They just shouldn't

Most importantly.  Take the time to use this issue to explain and educate the public.  Take care of your customer.  Call him on the phone.  Educate him on how to care for his batteries and take care of him.  you will have a customer for life...and at what cost?  I dont' know what materials to make one of these in China but It's probably nothing near what he paid for it.     Keep putting off your customers and keep distancing yourself and giving shitty customer service,  people whom have the cash, won't spend it for long on your stuff.  

Jorge,  I'd suggest that if you don't feel like you have been treated correctly, then introduce Columbia to a different brand of Drone.   



2015-7-1
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Jorgehlopezc
lvl.4
Flight distance : 4957293 ft
Colombia
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DJI-Bruce Posted at 2015-7-1 14:07
Hi Jorge,
As long as you charge the battery fully, it will minimize the risk of any accidents relat ...

DJI-Bruce: You told me verbatim:
"I tracked all your records and found on that day you had the crash. The second battery you used is definitely not fully charged. It started discharging at 96%. This 96% means the time when you put the battery into the Inspire 1 and turned it on, then the flight log started to record everything about the Inspire 1"

There's the answer to your big mistake. I do not use a second battery, was the same battery which after updating the firmware, turned it off and turn again to initialize properly in the new update,  s
o the two records that you found in the same time of the incident.

Then it is proved that his argument mishandling of my batteries is absolutely false and that should give me full guarantee that this case clearly only your responsibility.

I've also been tested with the batteries in my Phantom 3 Pro and when the battery is at 96% charge is not allowed.

In addition it is also false that I have received good feedback from you because until now you have not sent the spare parts for the repair even, making me lose a month's work.
Finally, I just want to say that in-flight battery is discharged instantly 50% to 7% can not be called intelligent but dangerous or risky. Rather a crude battery.

2015-7-2
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Jorgehlopezc
lvl.4
Flight distance : 4957293 ft
Colombia
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david.p.mann@ea Posted at 2015-7-1 22:42
DJI-Bruce,

This is frightening.  I'm VERY concerned. Is the official DJI position that starting a ...

Thank you for participating in this important discussion and for supporting me in this injustice. Dji has not wanted to directly acknowledge his fault, just to the sides
2015-7-2
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Jorgehlopezc
lvl.4
Flight distance : 4957293 ft
Colombia
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InspirelessAggi Posted at 2015-7-2 01:26
This is what I am taking away from this experience.  Because I do have a phantom 3 still and still u ...

I agree with you, unfortunately this is what happens when there is a dominant position in the market. What other brand could bring to Colombia?
2015-7-2
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SimonMW
lvl.3
Flight distance : 361263 ft

United Kingdom
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I saw your video, you started your flight at a power level of 95%, the battery is not fully charged. Every time you wanna fly the inspire after you put the battery aside over days, please fully charge the battery before use.


Most of these issues appear to be happening with TB48's. Also if the battery is at 95% the charger will not charge AFAIK.
2015-7-3
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SimonMW
lvl.3
Flight distance : 361263 ft

United Kingdom
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Right now, it's really a need basis.  If you need it for business, then buy it.  But I'd wait.  

Wait for how long? IF the Inspire 2 ever gets released in the next year will you be advising not to purchase that and instead wait for the Inspire 3?!
2015-7-3
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InspirelessAggi
Second Officer

United States
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SimonMW Posted at 2015-7-3 19:18
Wait for how long? IF the Inspire 2 ever gets released in the next year will you be advising not to ...

Wait until they have worked out their repair process.   Rumor has it they are moving to either a larger facility or adding an additional one in the next few months.  What good does having it now do if you crash it or have a defect needing repair?  You'll have to wait 6-7 weeks for repair time alone.  Not to mention shipping time and time it takes to check it into their system.  Figure no less than 8 weeks door to door.   That's not earning you money if it's on a need basis.  So answer is, wait until the repair times get better whether it be inspire 2 or inspire infinity
I ordered my inspire over a month ago and mine failed on day 3 of possession.   3 weeks later,  I still don't have a refund.  Why would the inspire appealing right now given the mentality of DJI and their customer service.   This doesn't look like good customer service to me.
2015-7-3
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Jorgehlopezc
lvl.4
Flight distance : 4957293 ft
Colombia
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SimonMW Posted at 2015-7-3 19:18
Wait for how long? IF the Inspire 2 ever gets released in the next year will you be advising not to ...

I think that with this problems we are gonna have to wait to much time
2015-7-3
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Jorgehlopezc
lvl.4
Flight distance : 4957293 ft
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InspirelessAggi Posted at 2015-7-3 21:16
Wait until they have worked out their repair process.   Rumor has it they are moving to either a la ...

I would like to know what happen with yours...
2015-7-3
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david.p.mann
First Officer
Flight distance : 14554101 ft
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DJI-Bruce Posted at 2015-6-12 11:28
I saw Jorge's flight log and he really started using the battery from 95% with the cell voltage of ...


Jorge, Bruce -

After rereading this entire forum thread again carefully, I believe the key piece of information in diagnosing the cause of the sudden drop in reported battery charge percentage from 52% to 7% that Jorge (and other Inspire pilots) have experienced is the following information from the flight log that was reported by DJI-Bruce:

"I saw Jorge's flight log and he really started using the battery from 95% with the cell voltage of only around 3.89V, which is far from fully charged."

Unfortunately, the discussion then turned to implying it was unwise, improper practice to begin a flight when the battery charge percentage is less than 100%.  This is not a productive or helpful line of discussion.  Instead, the focus, I believe, should be on the accuracy of the battery charge percentage reported by the DJI Pilot app (based on calculations done by the battery firmware) vs. the actual battery charge level.  AND - what can Inspire pilots do to ensure/confirm that their batteries are, in fact, fully charged prior to a flight. Or, more precisely, how can we access if the reported battery percentage is accurate and reliable.

My four TB48 batteries report a voltage of 4.29-4.31 volts when fully charged.  I just checked one of my partially used TB48 batteries, which is blinking the third LED, and when it was inserted in the Inspire 1 and powered on, the DJI Pilot app reported a 60% charge and 3.92 volts.  I left the Inspire 1 powered on for 10 minutes and the battery level fell to 57% and 3.89 volts.

Thus, if Jorge's battery for his fateful second flight was reporting a 95% charge, but it only had a charge level of 3.89 volts, the reported battery percentage was clearly inaccurate.  The charge level was probably less than 60% based on the very limited reference data above from my own batteries. Every battery is a little different, that's why DJI has built some intelligence into the batteries to calibrate each battery between in its minimum and fully charged voltage levels.  Unfortunately, this "fuel gauge IC," as DJI refers to it, is occasionally subject to some major errors, particularly immediately after a firmware update.

Jorge reported that he fully charged this battery before use and when he powered it on, the battery firmware was updated.  So, he restarted the battery, and it then reported a 95% charge.  I believe him. I don't know how long this update process took or how much real battery percentage was consumed by the firmware update.  In my experience, it only takes a couple minutes to update battery firmware, which should not consume much battery percentage.  More likely this disconnect between reported battery charge level percentage and battery voltage level was related to the recent firmware update. However, updating the firmware of any electronic "smart" device is potentially risky as the entire control software has been rewritten and any historical voltage data that may be stored in the battery non-volatile memory has likely been lost or possibly corrupted.  

So, what can Inspire pilots do to insure what happened to Jorge (and others) won't happen to them. I humbly suggest the following recommendations:

1) Activate the "Show Voltage on Main Screen" option in the Aircraft Battery Menu.  This will display the live battery voltage and percentage in the upper right corner of the Camera screen.
2) Check the battery voltage prior to beginning a flight, particularly if you believe the battery is "fully charged" or nearly so. If the reported percentage is >95%, but the battery voltage is significantly less than 4.3 volts, the percentage level figure is highly suspect.  DON'T TRUST THE REPORTED BATTERY PERCENTAGE LEVEL BLINDLY!
3) Get in the habit of monitoring both battery percentage and battery voltage when flying and learn what battery voltages levels are typical for your batteries when fully charged and with, say, 20% charge left.
4) My advice - be VERY suspicious of battery percentage levels reported the first one or two battery cycles IMMEDIATELY FOLLOWING A BATTERY FIRMWARE UPDATE.  Consider performing a controlled battery power cycle after every battery firmware update to reset the battery's fuel gauge IC calibration.

DJI Requests:
1) Battery firmware and the "fuel gauge IC" function need more fine tuning. A battery voltage of 3.89 volts should NOT have been calculated/reported to be equivalent to a 95% battery charge as reported in the flight log examined by DJI-Bruce.  A battery voltage of 3.89 volts should not have been calculated/reported as even greater than a 75% charge.  Please FIX this.
2)There should be a separate check of current battery voltage level vs. reported battery percentage after each power-on.
3) If calculated battery percentage is >90% but the battery voltage is less than, say, 4.15 volts, the battery voltage and percentage should start blinking and a warning message should be displayed and spoken by the nice female computer voice: "WARNING! Battery percentage level MAY be incorrect, battery is NOT fully charged!"
4) If a firmware update includes an update to the battery firmware, include a strong CAUTION/WARNING in the firmware notes indicating that reported battery percentage levels may be very inaccurate until a complete battery power cycle from fully charged to fully discharged to fully charged has been completed.
5) Whenever the battery firmware is updated, I suggest that DJI reset the calibration data in the battery to "typical" average values for fully charged voltage and fully discharged voltage.  Ensure that any historical battery voltage data stored in non-volatile memory in the battery electronics is wiped clean prior to resetting the calibration to typical reference values.

- Dave
2015-7-3
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InspirelessAggi
Second Officer

United States
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Jorgehlopezc Posted at 2015-7-4 01:50
I would like to know what happen with yours...

Enjoy the read.    http://forum.dji.com/thread-19582-1-1.html

Hasn't been updated until I get the final result.   But I'm having to get a resolution with paypal and having my bank involved
2015-7-3
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Michael Starley
Second Officer

United States
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Sharing experiences that we as pilots have is what this forum is here for .                       http://forum.dji.com/thread-23242-1-1.html

This was my experience yesterday with my phantom 2 smart battery . Knowing that many manufacturers use the same vendors to supply parts for a wide range of product...........
Is it possible that this could explain a lot of the inspires battery woes as well ?
2015-7-3
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Sky Ninja
lvl.4

United States
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hammerdrone Posted at 2015-6-19 08:25
I`m a potential new pilot and I'm doing my research here. I have to ask- whats the deal with these b ...

Sorry GUYS but, I'm BACK....for a minute.

hammerdrone- KEEP YOUR MONEY!!!!!!!

Until anyone can see the true numbers on these things with concerns to sales, actual returns, refunds, faulty units, bad batteries, deplorable GPS lock, availability of parts and/or a turn around time that meets the need of the average consumer, stop being so enamored with an unproven piece of plastic and carbon fiber.

Any one who wants to argue- I challenge you to put forth some real, trustworthy numbers of unit sales vs return/repairs and how many of you can obtain parts for this unit classified as a 'hobby/ semi-pro-sumer class' UAV. How many hooby stores can offer to make repairs, but have thier hands tied, due to lack of parts? The I-1 is really not that complicated where basics are concerned. This supposed 'Magic Jig' that is needed to align the motors is like believeing that there is a pot of gold at the end of every rainbow. Heck! We all know it's a yellow brick road...full of exictement and danger.

It still makes no sense as to why the need for such a large repair facility and a bump in 200 personel, is required for the supposedly trustworthy Inspire units. Even if this includeds the P3, the P3's can be repaired by the other listed location within the DJI website and there aren't that many of them coming back. So again-
If it's hobby class, where's the repair parts?
-Secretly tucked away in China, California (where no one is allowed to visit) and couple of other places, not in the US.
If it's pro or semi-pro-sumer, how can it be repaired in the field?
-It can't, send it back.
Ok, so what went wrong with it?
-Don't worry, you're on a need to know basis. If it's a DJI problem, it'll be fixed by us.
I need details.
-Why? We fixed it.
What if it happens again?
-Send it back...again.

The only time they offer an explanation- is when they think YOU are at fault.

Ask yourself the following, sir-
WHO are you honestly trying to impress? Clients, friends or yourself...
WHAT do you seriously plan on using it for?!!? If you are an established professional, maybe. If you just find it cool, stick with the LaTrax 'ALIAS'- it's cheaper and parts are available.
WHERE are you going to safely fly this possibly hazardous unit? If it gets away on a full charge, it has a travel capability that allows for 20 miles in all directions, unubstructed.
WHY
do you need it? If you are not already an established professional (and even if you are) ask yourself again, WHY?

Call a local hobby shop- if they try to sell you this thing above all else, they, like DJI, are profit mongers and full of TIHS, spelled backwards. If they prove to be typical sales persons, hell bent on selling you what you WANT, not what you NEED, walk away! They are no different than a bad, used car salesman.

After all that you have read, would logic not dictate that you are looking at a serious heart ache should this 'Siren of the Sky' steal away your money?!!?

How's this for customer service improvements- ask yourself why there have not been any other US authorized repair facilities that have been allowed to come back on line. And the comment that is is due to "lack of customer service," is pure horse puckey. Nice of them to basically say, the authorized repair facilites you are supposed to trust with your investment are not worthy, but...keep buying our product...it's great...trust us.

As to one of their trusted facilites, STC ELECTRONICS of NYC are the true reason why I tried so hard to stick it out while going through all I did. Sam and his crew are honestly, some of the MOST knowledgeable persons you could ever have the pleasure of speaking with. Their turn around time is amazing AND their knowledge of the Inspire reaches far beyond the somewhat canned responses given within this forum. They are professionals.

Call your local authorized dealers and ask them how DJI has been treating them. Make friends and you'll find that, behind the scenes, they are back stabbing and making false promises to the very persons and businesses who promotes their product. It's true, I have no reason to lie. Call around and ask them yourself.  An honest store won't try to sell you anything they can't back up. So, ask them about parts availability, service and locations of a local, authorized repair facilities and you'll find that most (except the fan boys) would agree, there is MINIMAL CUSTOMER SERVICE AT BEST. Be prepared when making your inquiry, as some may get a bit testy. Put them on the spot, after all, it's your money!

That said, if you don't do due dilegence- go ahead, throw your money away. You'll find when your 'toy' breaks, and it will as they ALL do, you'll be out time, money and like the rest who experience it, love for the product. Being left with nothing but buyers remorse, sucks. We've all been there.

Don't be fooled, DJI NORTH AMERICA is far from being an AMERICAN style run or owned company.  Red through 'A SWING...and A MISS!" It may seem redundant but, it'll offer insight as to how things are handled throughout 'DJI-land'.

Stop waiting for it to get better and instead, make it better. Do your research, there are other products out there with such incredible offerings at a much friendlier cost.

This mans case is a prime example that batteries are not the ONLY thing broken within DJI.

My apologies Mr. Jeroge H Lopez, I FEEL YOUR PAIN, sir. I truly do.

-S.N.
2015-7-4
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Sky Ninja
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Jorgehlopezc Posted at 2015-7-3 00:16
I agree with you, unfortunately this is what happens when there is a dominant position in the mark ...

DJI is only as dominant as we allow them to be.

YUNEEC may be an answer, my friend. They have been building real planes and flight systems for nearly 30 years. Their customer service is incredible and their product, though it doesn't travel at 60mph, it does offer incredible options where filming is concerned. IMHO- YUNEEC's team seems a bit more intuitive about actual flight systems and invoke the "ease of use" concept, thus allowing for more concentration to be emphasized on the subject(s) being filmed or photographed. The range can be easily and inexpensively modified to reach up 13,000+ ft with FPVLR antennas, while the flight times easily reach 22-23 minutes per flight, when filming.

DJI and their fans can say what they wish but, I have flown both and find the YUNEEC Q500+ product to be extremely versatile and stable. As such, I have ordered their Q500 4k w/1080p @120fps unit, as well. Though I can not speak for the latter of the two, I expect it to perform, like the Q500+, extremely well, when it arrives.

Every unit has it's pros or cons. However, as you know, sir- it is up to the individual to decide what those parameters are and should be.

Respectfully,

Sky Ninja
2015-7-4
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Rockeyes
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Jorgehlopezc Posted at 2015-6-12 22:58
This is inconceivable, now DJI wants to evade responsibility for trying to blame improper handling  ...

Fully agree with you. It is a bug that is a safety issue and needs to be addressed. I've grounded my unit as I have lost confidence in DJI. Maybe some articals written to the press would help them get a grip
2015-7-4
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Rockeyes
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InspirelessAggi Posted at 2015-6-19 08:45
Wait.   The service isn't keeping up with demand.   Give it 6 months.    Maybe the inspire 2 will be ...

Well if the Inspire 1 can't be fixed what confidence would anyone have in purchasing another product from DJI?  I certainly won't for the foreseeable, not that it matters to them as I'm just another sucker.
2015-7-5
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Rockeyes
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InspirelessAggi Posted at 2015-6-19 08:45
Wait.   The service isn't keeping up with demand.   Give it 6 months.    Maybe the inspire 2 will be ...

Well if the Inspire 1 can't be fixed what confidence would anyone have in purchasing another product from DJI?  I certainly won't for the foreseeable, not that it matters to them as I'm just another sucker.
2015-7-5
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Jorgehlopezc
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david.p.mann@ea Posted at 2015-7-4 02:11
Jorge, Bruce -

After rereading this entire forum thread again carefully, I believe the key piece  ...

David your analysis has been very serious and profound worth consider. Thank you for taking your time to comment on this important issue. God bless you.
2015-7-6
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Jorgehlopezc
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Sky Ninja Posted at 2015-7-5 14:36
Sorry GUYS but, I'm BACK....for a minute.

hammerdrone- KEEP YOUR MONEY!!!!!!!

Thanks for your words.
2015-7-6
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Jorgehlopezc
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Sky Ninja Posted at 2015-7-5 15:00
DJI is only as dominant as we allow them to be.

YUNEEC may be an answer, my friend. They have been ...

Thanks again for your suggestion.
2015-7-6
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sunflovver
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I second Dave on his conclusions:

1. After a battery was sitting for a while and gotten discharged a bit - there is a danger that % may read higher than it is. The Solution is damn simple - Charge it before you use it!!!

2. Majority of power drops happen just above 50% and you always get 7% left. (7% is a fat cussion before the total loss)

3. Check your voltage. 3.89 - corresponds to below 60%  charge on my set. If you are not reading 4.2 volts - you don't have a full battery.

4. Somehow all these fails happen right after firmware updates on partially charged batteries.

All the pilots here who is stressing out - if you understand these points, you don't stress.
If you didn't charge your battery yesterday, but still have to fly on it - just remember:  when the battery goes less than 60% - fly within 100m of landing .
Because it may drop to 7%.
The 7% is plenty enough to bring the bird down from 100m away.

I had this happen to me. the battery was not charged right before the flight. The update firmware on battery was happening in flight - I didn't understand it was updating. now I know) 320m up and 180m away the reading dropped from 51% to 7%.  Fortunately, I got it back to me on the 7%.  Once I got back the reading was 1%. By the time I turned the props off and came to the drone - it was 0%)

Another 2 times I had this happen : I was messing with settings and testing new tablet with goggles. Inspire 1 on my table with props off. It was also after a recent firmware update.  The power dropped from 52% to 7%. I actually waited out to see when the drone will shut down.  Well just like with Jorge - shortly after 0% it was out.
It was a weird pleasure to see the battery fail on my desk - not in the air ))

To all that blame DJI to be the Evil corp:
the reason why you own the Inspire 1 is because you selected the best thing on the market. There is nothing like it. It is the bleeding edge of innovation. You can't expect it to be perfect.
I'm quite sure they are working on the solution as we whine about it here.
2015-7-26
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Jorgehlopezc
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sunflovver Posted at 2015-7-26 17:31
I second Dave on his conclusions:

1. After a battery was sitting for a while and gotten discharged  ...

Thanks for your comments, I agree with you and is important to consider the suggestions.
2015-7-27
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Sky Ninja
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sunflovver Posted at 2015-7-26 17:31
I second Dave on his conclusions:

1. After a battery was sitting for a while and gotten discharged  ...


Had it, won't have it again.
Umpteen failures are not acceptable for such a piece of equipment.

Yuneec, now there's the answer. Have had zero of the mentioned issues with this piece of equipment as experienced while owning the un- Inspire -d. Being the most expensive doesn't make it the best. There are others out there who have made their point and taken the stand only to hold true.

Say what you will, but it's a hobby and a business therefore, I challenge you to find your parts anywhere but California, under the guise of the Imperial ones.

Still a fan? Ask them why their North American Sales Mgr left with such great haste. That'll stir the pot a bit.

Humbly,
-S.N.
2015-7-29
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Paul Joy
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As stated if DJI are now advising that any flight started with a battery at less than 100% charge can cause this behaviour then it needs to be supported in the app and more information about it supplied to customers who are potentially risking serious incidents.
Each time I've read about this dropping to 7% issue it's been related to the TB48 batteries and often involves the inserted memory card holding a firmware bin file. Just out of interest was that the case in this incident?

2015-7-30
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sunflovver
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Paul Joy Posted at 2015-7-30 17:26
As stated if DJI are now advising that any flight started with a battery at less than 100% charge ca ...

100%. all incidents happened with the firmware on SD. Erasing mine now.
2015-7-30
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Farnk666
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Flight distance : 1711394 ft
Australia
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Hey folks - been watching developments on the battery issues with interest, have not experienced any anomalies myself until now.
Had not used the Inspire for a few weeks, batteries (1x47, 2x48) were packed away and stored at 40%. Firmware is current.

Last weekend, went out and did a bit of flying to test out the auto panorama app beta that is the subject of another thread.
Charged everything up Sunday morning and headed out to fly.
No issues in flight, but returned back with one 48 @100% full, the other 48 @65% full and the 47 down to 30-35%

Not wanting to store the batteries in this state, I did some indoor hovering to bring the 48s down to a safe storage level. I started on the 65% full one.
All pre-flight checks were conducted excepting GPS status as I was indoors. Battery levels looked good - just as expected for a battery with that level remaining.
Within 3-4 minutes of a stable hover, the Inspire altered me that it had reached critical battery levels and was attempting to auto land.
(still showing 65% remaining and the battery gauge at that level)

I cancelled this and kept it 30 or so cm from the floor with landing gear down while I watched the percentage indicator on the main app screen.
Lo and behold, 65% immediately dropped to 7, then quickly down to 3 and then 0. All of this occurred in the space of a couple of minutes.

So I take from this that the couple of weeks storage was definitely enough to trigger the auto discharge process.
This left the battery in an indeterminate state that a full charge was not sufficient to resolve with accuracy.
A full discharge and recharge cycle will happen shortly and I will see if the full capacity / reliability of the remaining capacity indication is restored.  

I am also reflecting on my good luck in that the first 35% of that particular battery's flight time on Sunday was capturing panoramas whilst hovering at 100m AGL!
Not sure that I would have got it down safety in a couple of minutes from that height.
   
2015-8-3
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amorrison
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david.p.mann@ea Posted at 2015-7-4 02:11
Jorge, Bruce -

After rereading this entire forum thread again carefully, I believe the key piece  ...

Dave - I think your suggestions are excellent. I had not even realized that displaying that voltage was an option so I am doing that right away. Also, I am going to generally monitor voltages and flight times in case they change significantly. It's nice to have DJI make all these capacity calculations but I feel much more comfortable with an "old-style" monitoring of voltage and flight time as a cross-check. In the case of the OP here, the battery was exhausted after 8 minutes of flight. Either it was not fully charged, or it was VERY defective. I suspect that the drastic drop in percentage was the capacity calculation algorithm finally correcting itself. It wouldn't surprise me if this "false" charged capacity readout was the problem in all the capacity drop scenarios.
2015-8-4
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