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Still photo quality from P3
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cbarrettcampbel
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As a DSLR user, I am sure I had my expectations too high for still photographs, but I am still a little underwhelmed by the quality. Has anyone here printed photos taken from the P3P, and if so, to what size?

I am curious to hear y'all's thoughts on the photo quality coming from the drone - and if you have any tips to get the best quality. I am shooting in RAW.

Thanks!


2015-6-10
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PhantomHelp.com
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Check out this video for some good tips:






www.PhantomHelp.com
Find the latest must-haves, fixes, mods, how-tos, guides, and accessories for your Phantom.
Phantoms in stock and ready to ship worldwide! (see availability)
2015-6-10
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giant
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You can't compare a dsrl with a drone cam. With DSLR you can work with  bokeh and depth of field.  The drone on the other hand profides you with spectacular standpoints and an overal quite sharp image. The image is 12 MP so you can print it in a DIN A3 sheet.
2015-6-10
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Mark97564
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I am 100% happy and satisfied with my P3P and it's camera...  
2015-6-10
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scott7161
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I think the Phantom 3 has a pretty decent camera - even for night shots.  Here's one I shot with a 4 second exposure the other night while hovering.  
My photo
2015-6-10
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Total
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scott7161@gmail Posted at 2015-6-11 05:05
I think the Phantom 3 has a pretty decent camera - even for night shots.  Here's one I shot with a 4 ...

Very nice picture , how do you set the exposure to 4 seconds ?
2015-6-10
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GeneralToner
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Once you get past it not being a DSLR you'll be happy.  I shoot D800 among other cameras for hobby, so I'm used to quality images. That said, below are shots from both P3P and Inspire which use same sensor.

P3P Daytime
https://www.flickr.com/photos/generaltoner/18636789822/in/dateposted-public/

P3P Philly Night
https://www.flickr.com/photos/generaltoner/17667952133/in/dateposted-public/

Inspire 1 Missouri Capitol Night
https://www.flickr.com/photos/generaltoner/16594275508/in/dateposted-public/


2015-6-10
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BobbyB
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GeneralToner Posted at 2015-6-11 07:10
Once you get past it not being a DSLR you'll be happy.  I shoot D800 among other cameras for hobby,  ...

Are you saying those shots are straight out of the camera or a little post manipulation, maybe?
2015-6-10
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GeneralToner
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Will find a post originals.  I don't recall what was done on them.  Big thing is, you can get quality out of this tiny sensor.  And stability...

I did not think the P3P could compare to Inspire in stability but it's excellent.  Inspire has more options, but the P3P is a great quad (and very close image quality).

Below shows P3P stability in hover.


  
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GeneralToner
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Original images for two of three above shots.  Shows latitude in raw files from these cameras.

Both shot manual exposure on each craft.

Field - Phantom 3 Pro - Unedited
https://www.flickr.com/photos/ge ... /dateposted-public/

Missouri Capitol - Inspire 1 - Unedited
https://www.flickr.com/photos/ge ... /dateposted-public/

Other stills on flickr and video from crafts on you tube.
2015-6-10
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BobbyB
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GeneralToner Posted at 2015-6-11 09:57
Original images for two of three above shots.  Shows latitude in raw files from these cameras.

Both ...

Ummmm, yeah, a few post tweaks.

2015-6-10
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toddyplex
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I agree that the stills are pretty average. Possibly I haven't set the camera up right but I believe it is. Some folks have been talking about manual mode. I can't find the control for manual. Would anyone have a link for more info on manual? I would like to be able to change the Fstop if possible.
The two following photos are taken from the same place. One is a screen grab from the video file, the other is the unedited DNG file. I copied them both down to a smaller JPG for sharing. From what I can tell, the stills are not very good without a bit of post processing love.  
Any advice or tips on how to get the best out of stills would be appreciated.  Cheers.



2015-6-12
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FantomDK
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Todd, I posted some advice here that I might as well copy in here:
TIPS FOR HDR / BRACKETS-PHOTOGRAPHY

I almost always take "5-bracket"-photos, meaning I take 5 photos rapidly with varying exposure (dark/light). I then combine these photos into a HDR-image. This gives a lot more flexibility regarding lighting - and you can keep detail in both the light areas / sky - and in the dark areas (ground). I think this is the way forward to get maximum quality out of the P3 camera for stills.

There is also a built-in HDR-mode (hold down the shutter button in the Pilot App in order to open the circular menu where you can select various shooting-modes including HDR, brackets (3 or 5), Timer) the Phantom will create the HDR-image itself resulting in just one HDR-photo.

I have not experimented much with the "built-in" HDR (that people might also know from iPhones and other smartphones which can shoot HDRs as well and it is quite seamless). What I do is, I shoot brackets (if light difference is hefty (like shooting towards the sun at sunset) I will go for 5-brackets where it shoots 5 pictures with varying exposure. I then manually combine those into one HDR-photo. I do this in Adobe Lightroom (only newest can do it).

This leaves me maximum flexibility with regards to exposing shadows and highlights etc and adds extra detail. You need to shoot static objects though as there is a little time between each shoot. Also, it takes maybe 10 seconds for it to capture a 5-bracket photo in DNG (raw) so it takes a little effort and patience. But it is well worth it. Both for creating more naturally looking images or fairly extreme HDR-photos where the effect is very pronounced (which is a matter of taste and preference).

I end up shooting all my photos in mostly 5-brackets - because it gives me that extra flexibility and maximum quality in the photos I take. The drawback can be that you don't get to shoot a ton of photos (because it takes a while every time).


TIPS FOR GRABBING STILL PHOTOS FROM 4K VIDEO

But what I've found out is that if I need some extra photos from a flight, and I've shoot most of the the flight where I am not shooting photos in 4K video, I can do pretty nice screengrabs from the 4K video in the full 3840x2160 resolution (about 8-megapixel photos) . These are fairly compressed and don't handle zooming in a lot too well, but they work well for some uses.

The way I create screengrabs from 4K video is I import the video in Lightroom, view the video and pause where I want a screengrab/still photo. I click the little gear-button and select Screen Capture. Then it saves a full 4K resolution still to disk. I can then open edit that further afterwards. If you don't have Lightroom, the free videoplayer VLC ( http://www.Videolan.org ) will also do screengrabs. It is important not just to do screenshots of your monitor (unless you have a 4K screen I guess) to get the full resolution of the 4K video source.


I've written some more Tips and Tricks on my website (click here)

Hope that'll help you out!
2015-6-12
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Lonestar
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BobbyB Posted at 2015-6-11 10:20
Ummmm, yeah, a few post tweaks.

I've seen this same topic covered repeatedly in the photography forums for the last 8 years. If the photo is enhanced is it true photography or not. The way I see it, it's your art. How you present it to the world is up to you. Most photographers try to get it as right as they can in the camera with lighting and composition but use post production to bring the subject to life. You can't compare this to a DSLR by any means but this platform gives us perspective options that were never available before. I shoot a D800 & D700 and a host of pro lenses and still everything I release for public viewing gets enhanced in one way or another. Things like noise reduction, sharpening, cropping, hue, saturation.. I can go on and on. Even with the most sophisticated and state of the art cameras on the market, you still tweak your art to give it the feel that you want to share with the world.

Cameras are nothing more than a device for capturing light. How you get the light on your subject and into the camera is where the photographers skill comes into play.  Capturing that light without motion blur in low light is a lot harder than it looks. Its what turns ordinary snapshots into something stunning.

I bought this system for the camera because it opens up a lot of new possibilities for me. I like to have my work critiqued by my peers so I know where I can improve. I respect any photographer who is willing to put his art before the world for that critique.
2015-6-13
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Lonestar
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FantomDK Posted at 2015-6-13 15:05
Todd, I posted some advice here that I might as well copy in here:
TIPS FOR HDR / BRACKETS-PHOTOGRAP ...

This is a great tutorial! Thank you for the effort you put into making this. I looked at your page and see me learning the baby steps all over again lol

I shoot manual most of the time in the DSLR world and just need to find my way around the menu system on the Phantom. I typically shoot 7 shot HDR images but had no idea I could do that with the phantom. I'm wondering if my phantom is stable enough to give me a solid platform for HDR. Guess I will have to go play!!

Are you using Photoshop or Photomatix for your HDR merge?
2015-6-13
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Spankybear
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GeneralToner Posted at 2015-6-11 07:10
Once you get past it not being a DSLR you'll be happy.  I shoot D800 among other cameras for hobby,  ...

Here are the full sized pic of yours. Hope you don't mind I post the links

https://www.flickr.com/photos/generaltoner/18636789822/sizes/o/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/generaltoner/17667952133/sizes/o/
More grain that I would have thought for ISO 200


https://www.flickr.com/photos/generaltoner/16594275508/sizes/o/
This seem to have less grain than above and was shot at ISO 800??!?!?
2015-6-13
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Lonestar
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Spankybear Posted at 2015-6-14 01:40
Here are the full sized pic of yours. Hope you don't mind I post the links

https://www.flickr.com/ ...

I think all of these look really good. Is your first shot of the field with a ND filter? Love the contrast of colors.
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BobbyB
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Lonestar Posted at 2015-6-14 01:11
I've seen this same topic covered repeatedly in the photography forums for the last 8 years. If th ...

Thanks for the commentary but I wasn't talking to you.  
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Nick Martin
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toddyplex Posted at 2015-6-13 14:56
I agree that the stills are pretty average. Possibly I haven't set the camera up right but I believe ...

If you're shooting still images in 'RAW' format ( as you should for the best quality ) then you've got to get your head around the RAW file format.

As the name suggests, in RAW the camera is taking the photo and not adding any colour tweaks to it, sharpening it, compressing it etc as it would do with a JPEG.

This means that the resulting files looks flat and desaturated, HOWEVER it has in fact retained lots of detail that you can bring out when processing it in ACR or similar software.

You can then tweak exposure, white balance, saturation, sharpness, shadows and pretty much anything else you choose, although it does help to get the image as correct as possible to begin with exposure wise which is why its important to turn on the histogram option in the DJI Pilot app.

Hope this helps a little,

Nick
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FantomDK
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Lonestar Posted at 2015-6-14 01:20
This is a great tutorial! Thank you for the effort you put into making this. I looked at your page ...

Lonestar, I totally agree that photography (and videography) is art. I think enhancing the photos from the Phantom 3 is a must. And shooting 'brackets' gives a lot more data to work with, to get the proper lighting and avoiding too much noise etc.

I almost always do a bit of sharpening and tweaking of white balance, exposure, clarity and contrast etc.

When doing the HDR/brackets, there is a risk of "overdoing it" to get that very HDR-y look. Sometimes I like that, but often I will mostly use it to 'capture the maximum amount of beauty'   I think HDR were very much in fashion a few years ago and not as much any longer - but I find it very useful to capture better images with the P3 without necessarily going for an extreme HDR-look.

I'm using Lightroom. They introduced HDR (and Panorama) merge in version 6. I think it works well. It is a process for each photo. But the advantage is, that you might end up with some photos you are proud of - rather than just a whole lot of photos - like most of us have on our smartphones

PS: Did I mention I shoot in LOG-mode? Again seeking maximum editing-freedom and dynamic range. Our P3 cameras are not big expensive DSLRs so we need to push every drop of quality out of it I think
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CapitAn
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l've always taken video. My last flight was the only one l've actually taken a couple of pictures. l was okay with the quality. l girl-ied this one up a bit and brought out the pinks in the sky.http://imgur.com/BtZVdTE
2015-6-13
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FantomDK
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CapitAn Posted at 2015-6-14 09:24
l've always taken video. My last flight was the only one l've actually taken a couple of pictures. l ...

I like it!

Sometimes we need to be brave enough to experiment. So much more ambience in that photo than had it been vanilla. Very artistic.

Did you do brackets and create a HDR? If you have not experimented with that I suggest you look into it.
2015-6-13
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arives
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I took some HDR and multiple shots with my P3 and they  showed up on my computer as one picture each, not the three or five as I expected. Is the P3 processing them into one picture, or am I missing something? Your help is appreciated.
2015-6-13
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toddyplex
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Thanks for the info folks. New to the Phantom and just getting my head around its camera and controls. A more comprehensive manual would be nice.
From what I can tell this is the functions and limitations.

* HDR mode does its own thing internally and create one pic.
* AEB mode (accessed by holding down the camera icon in the app) will bracket 0.7EV, so at most, 5 shots give a +/- 1.4 EV bracket with a +/-0.7 in-between.
* F stop is 2.8. Always.
* In manual mode (accessed by pressing the bottom right 3 horizontal lines icon) we can adjust shutter speed and ISO on the app, and EV win rolling the remotes right side wheel.
* Exit manual mode by swiping the settings left. If you press the icon again it reverts to Auto mode.
* DNG shots come out pretty dull at a glance, but are highest quality for post processing.

Assuming I got those features and controls right, well OK, I can work with that. Would prefer wider EV bracketing but could work around with the wheel to get up to a max of +/-2 EV if what the controller is telling me is correct, or more is the app is just set to display a limit when in manual mode. I assume Auto mode is limited to 2EV. Would have liked to be able to change F stop, but mostly wide open at 2.8 will be the best choice.

Appreciate the help everyone.
Any links to further info or adding more on top of what I have learned would be appreciated.
Also any tips or tricks to get the most out of stills on the Phantom are appreciated.

Cheers.
2015-6-13
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FantomDK
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arives@capecod. Posted at 2015-6-14 15:15
I took some HDR and multiple shots with my P3 and they  showed up on my computer as one picture each ...

Yup,  when you select HDR (Hold down Shutter Button to access the menu where you can select various photo shooting modes) the P3 makes a HDR by itself. I've found this slightly buggy - when shooting right at the sun. I will do more tests - but I do prefer shooting brackets and then doing the merging myself; retains the maximum quality.

When shooting HDR/brackets it is important that the subject is still and the Phantom is still in the air as there is a delay between each exposure.

@Toddyplex
I agree with the wider EV bracketing. But when you do 5-brackets (takes a while for each shot when shooting DNG raw) the EV-bracketing is wider than if shooting 3-brackets.

I've not tried doing "manual brackets" how you describe but it is not a bad idea. It would take longer though. But I suppose you could even more extreme than the 5-brackets, shooting more brackets and going more extreme in EV+shutter speed to get ultra-dark and ultra-bright images in your series of images.

Did I mention I love my "tripod in the sky"?
2015-6-14
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toddyplex
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I gave the manual HDR a crack. +/- 2 EV.  Not too bad I reckon.

2015-6-29
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dmwierz
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The HDR mode inside the P3's camera isn't a true HDR - it really only boosts some of the exposure and processing settings, like saturation, etc. There is no comparison to the HDR feature in one of my DSLR's (Canon 5D MkIII), which actually DOES take multiple images at different EV levels then combines these into one shot within the camera.

Most pro level stills editing programs like PhotoShop, have an HDR feature, or buy something like PhotoMatix. Take multiple images at different exposure levels, as set within the Pilot App.

Speaking of DSLR's, I own 7 of them, including the 5D3 and a Canon 1Dx, and I find the P3's still image quality to be acceptable, especially considering this is a FLYING CAMERA, then entire system costing less than any of my lenses cost alone. Does it compare to what I get from even my least expensive DSLR and cheapest lens? Of course not.

Manage your expectations. If you want DSLR quality, get a heavy lifter like a S1000 and strap on a 5D3...but be prepared to spend thousands and thousand of dollars - more than $3,000 on just the camera and lens.

BTW, if you shoot RAW (DNG), try the DJI DNG Cleaner v1.1 software, available for free download here, although I can't, for the life of me, figure out how to read the resulting "cleaned" files:

http://www.dji.com/product/phantom-3/download
2015-6-29
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toddyplex
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The above picture was taken with multiple exposures spanning a +/- 2 EV range and was processed in photomatix, so no different to any other HDR process regardless of DSLR or DJI. It was processed in PS, cleaned with a Topaz plugin, and touched up global stuff in lightoom. The heavy saturation is my taste, not something the camera has done.
I have a MK3 as well as other SLR's, so on one hand I know what you mean, and generally I am very happy with the overall kit, and I agree its great for the price. On the other hand, I am still disappointed in the still quality regardless, which to my eye is no better than a raw version of the video stream minus all the video compression. I don't want the size and bulk of a SLR carrying rig because I hike with my gear, and would happily pay more for a higher res DJI camera on stills. There are higher res mobile phones, so it's not too much to hope for that DJI bring out a camera that caters to those whose primary interest is still photography, not video. If they put their mind t it it would not be hard to improve, but I doubt their focus is on stills so I won't be holding my breath.
2015-6-29
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