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How do you make everything sharp around the image?
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AntDX316
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How do you make everything sharp throughout the image like the M2Z and X3 camera at f/2.8?  I know if you increase to f/11 it's like that but it gets significantly darker.  How can you make it where everything is sharp at f/2.8??  The constant auto focusing sucks when you change perspective distance.  When you get closer it's blurry.  When you get further, it's blurry.  You can do AFC but it's not smooth.

Perhaps real-time tracking-AF needs to happen in future drones?
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Geebax
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Hint, go do a photography course and find out. The question you ask is one of the most basic fundamentals in photography, and simply underlines your complete lack of knowledge.
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AntDX316
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Geebax Posted at 10-8 13:20
Hint, go do a photography course and find out. The question you ask is one of the most basic fundamentals in photography, and simply underlines your complete lack of knowledge.

You can't because a setting in the drone does not exist or the lens isn't designed to do it.  You can't AF/MF w/ the X3 and the Spark.  Everything is the same sharpness.  When you click the screen, it just exposure locks whatever you tapped on.
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Labroides
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AntDX316 Posted at 10-8 13:26
You can't because a setting in the drone does not exist or the lens isn't designed to do it.  You can't AF/MF w/ the X3 and the Spark.  Everything is the same sharpness.  When you click the screen, it just exposure locks whatever you tapped on.
Aren't you the guy who dismisses knowledge and experience?
But you seem to be wanting to get the information you lack from those that have it from learning and experience?
I don't feel moved to help except to say that what you are asking probably isn't what you mean at all.

Perhaps if you had some basic photographic understanding you might be able to frame your question to properly ask what you really want to know.
Your second post reveals you to have an understanding of photographic principles similar to any 8 year old.



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AntDX316
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Labroides Posted at 10-8 15:17
Aren't you the guy who dismisses knowledge and experience?
But you seem to be wanting to get the information you lack from those that have it from learning and experience?
I don't feel moved to help except to say that what you are asking probably isn't what you mean at all.

Perhaps you don't understand there is nothing we can do from a photographer settings operator to get it to work like an f/2.8 from the factory where everything is in focus w/o driving up the f stop to f/6.3+ but at night this is what you do Not want to do.  What is your proposed solution?

If you have the solution or answer to this in detail I will respect you more.
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Labroides
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AntDX316 Posted at 10-8 19:46
Perhaps you don't understand there is nothing we can do from a photographer settings operator to get it to work like an f/2.8 from the factory where everything is in focus w/o driving up the f stop to f/6.3+ but at night this is what you do Not want to do.  What is your proposed solution?

If you have the solution or answer to this in detail I will respect you more.

Perhaps you don't understand
You're joking ?

there is nothing we can do from a photographer settings operator to get it to work like an f/2.8 from the factory where everything is in focus w/o driving up the f stop to f/6.3+ but at night this is what you do Not want to do.  What is your proposed solution?
My solution would be to think again.
For a start, you aren't talking about sharpness at all.
You really mean focus.

If you want your camera to work like a fixed focus, fixed aperture camera because you think that's better, you don't know much.
There's nothing better about the Mavic 2 zoom or the X3 camera.
If you really like them, my proposed solution would be that you buy them and use them and leave the more complicated cameras to real photographers.

To go back to your original opost, you said:   I know if you increase to f/11 it's like that but it gets significantly darker.
There's a big gap in your understanding.
Real photographers have a secret way to prevent the image getting darker when they stop down to a smaller aperture.
Geebax had a good suggestion in post #2
Do a photography course and learn something about basic photography.


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Montfrooij
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f/2.8 on a small sensor will get sharp images from the distance a drone will usually take pictures.
You probably don't need f/11 for that.
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AntDX316
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Labroides Posted at 10-8 20:34
Perhaps you don't understand
You're joking ?

When you shoot at night, the f/2.8 on the X3 was better than the P4 at f/2.8.  How come?  Because the focus blur was insanely bad (There are videos I don't post for a reason).  If you try to MF or AF some of the little lights you have available that aren't registering, it says blurred.  With the X3, you do not have this issue and can fly everywhere while everything is in focus.  If you fly slow enough while turning it does not matter.  If you look at one spot in the horizon high-up and continue that direction, it does not matter.  If you want to look at everything dynamically w/o refocusing, things Will be blurred.

I used to fly the P4PV2.0 at C4K60 for some night shots when I first got it and the blurring was a hit or miss due to the crappy quality compared to the M2, still better than the Spark.  Sometimes I focus out far to where I'm going but where I am is blurry.  If I focus what is near, it's sharp but when I look up and fly away things are blurry.  It turns the footage from 4K into 240p until you refocus but then you get the distortion warp effect when it goes out super blurry then sharp with the click-click sound.

You can add blur in post with motion tracking.  I do not want blur, therefore, the X3 seems to be ideal.

P4PV2.0

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Labroides
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AntDX316 Posted at 10-8 23:10
When you shoot at night, the f/2.8 on the X3 was better than the P4 at f/2.8.  How come?  Because the focus blur was insanely bad (There are videos I don't post for a reason).  If you try to MF or AF some of the little lights you have available that aren't registering, it says blurred.  With the X3, you do not have this issue and can fly everywhere while everything is in focus.  If you fly slow enough while turning it does not matter.  If you look at one spot in the horizon high-up and continue that direction, it does not matter.  If you want to look at everything dynamically w/o refocusing, things Will be blurred.

I used to fly the P4PV2.0 at C4K60 for some night shots when I first got it and the blurring was a hit or miss due to the crappy quality compared to the M2, still better than the Spark.  Sometimes I focus out far to where I'm going but where I am is blurry.  If I focus what is near, it's sharp but when I look up and fly away things are blurry.  It turns the footage from 4K into 240p until you refocus but then you get the distortion warp effect when it goes out super blurry then sharp with the click-click sound.

You'd probably be better off with the crummy old 12MP X3 camera.
That would be ideal for you.
It doesn't have any focus or a controllable aperture.
Those things are just like experience and understanding, very over-rated and not at all necessary when you're a genius like you.
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AntDX316
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Labroides Posted at 10-8 23:37
You'd probably be better off with the crummy old 12MP X3 camera.
That would be ideal for you.
It doesn't have any focus or a controllable aperture.

How do you make it where things have no focus or controllable aperture on any sensor?

You are missing the point because you fly and photograph in controlled conditions.  I like to fly around and observe on-demand.  This does not work when you have the wrong equipment at the wrong settings.  You have to clip in post when you have to refocus.  The idea is Not to clip that area out.
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AntDX316
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Labroides Posted at 10-8 20:34
Perhaps you don't understand
You're joking ?

"To go back to your original opost, you said:   I know if you increase to f/11 it's like that but it gets significantly darker.
There's a big gap in your understanding.
Real photographers have a secret way to prevent the image getting darker when they stop down to a smaller aperture.
Geebax had a good suggestion in post #2
Do a photography course and learn something about basic photography."


Increasing the ISO and decreasing the shutter speed won't work when you are locked at the Max possible ISO and shutter speed is as fast as the frame rate and you cannot go any lower.  You tell me how it can be done w/o changing the optics.
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Labroides
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AntDX316 Posted at 10-9 00:43
How do you make it where things have no focus or controllable aperture on any sensor?

You are missing the point because you fly and photograph in controlled conditions.  I like to fly around and observe on-demand.  This does not work when you have the wrong equipment at the wrong settings.  You have to clip in post when you have to refocus.  The idea is Not to clip that area out.

How do you make it where things have no focus or controllable aperture on any sensor?
You are missing the point because
... there is none?

Geebax had a good suggestion in post #2
Do a photography course and learn something about basic photography.
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AntDX316
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Labroides Posted at 10-9 01:58
How do you make it where things have no focus or controllable aperture on any sensor?
You are missing the point because ... there is none?

I don't think you know the answer either.
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Labroides
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AntDX316 Posted at 10-9 02:38
I don't think you know the answer either.

Don't know the answer?
You haven't explained what the problem is (if there is a one).
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Sick Dawg
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You will never learn the skills with your Know it All attitude Ant.
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AntDX316
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Do you even try to read what I'm trying to answer or you are all messing around and know it cannot be done unless you change lenses?  When I did FPV I used different lenses to have zoom and all focus.  All focus was bad but you could increase the FOV while on the ground.
I made a post in another group about nitrogen-filled tires for track racing and people kept doing the run-around.  I've never been to the track but later on found out it's a common thing to have a nitrogen option at the track.
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AntDX316 Posted at 10-9 11:32
Do you even try to read what I'm trying to answer or you are all messing around and know it cannot be done unless you change lenses?  When I did FPV I used different lenses to have zoom and all focus.  All focus was bad but you could increase the FOV while on the ground.
I made a post in another group about nitrogen-filled tires for track racing and people kept doing the run-around.  I've never been to the track but later on found out it's a common thing to have a nitrogen option at the track.

Perhaps you should try a nitrogen filled lens.
I hear that does great on the track.
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Sick Dawg Posted at 10-9 10:15
You will never learn the skills with your Know it All attitude Ant.

I have more drone experience w/ various drones than all of you combined.
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I look forward to seeing your name on the list now Ant, its my early morning entertainment See if this will shed some light on your technical difficulties?
The f2.8 that your wanting to use wont make much difference on a drone shot due to the distance from the subject. If you want a light image, then you need to do one of 3 things, up the ISO but you can only really go so high with that before too much noise or adjust the aperture, will only do so much, or and this is the biggy, lower the shutter speed, problem there is, lower the speed, the more chance of it being OOF, there fore night flying in much more than a light breeze shouldnt be done, a 5 seconds should be good enough for the gimbal if theres a breeze, top wack if there isnt...

It pretty much applies to video too with less fine tuning i spose, your issue if its with video, is wind, less wind, better outcome, moving at speed is also classed as wind, the gimbal can only do so much....


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AntDX316
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Bashy Posted at 10-9 17:16
I look forward to seeing your name on the list now Ant, its my early morning entertainment  See if this will shed some light on your technical difficulties?
The f2.8 that your wanting to use wont make much difference on a drone shot due to the distance from the subject. If you want a light image, then you need to do one of 3 things, up the ISO but you can only really go so high with that before too much noise or adjust the aperture, will only do so much, or and this is the biggy, lower the shutter speed, problem there is, lower the speed, the more chance of it being OOF, there fore night flying in much more than a light breeze shouldnt be done, a 5 seconds should be good enough for the gimbal if theres a breeze, top wack if there isnt...

It's not.  It has something to do w/ the lens but how does the lens make everything in focus?
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AntDX316 Posted at 10-9 16:20
I have more drone experience w/ various drones than all of you combined.

Of course you do.
That's why you are helping so many other users with their questions.
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AntDX316 Posted at 10-9 17:37
It's not.  It has something to do w/ the lens but how does the lens make everything in focus?

I still can't work out what your problem is.
The lens on the old X3 doesn't make everything in focus at all.
It just has no adjustable focus which isn't a big issue since the lens/sensor combination has so much depth of field.
And unless you focus your P4 pro lens too close, it also has more depth of field than you'll ever need.
Having good focus all over the image is not a problem you should be having at all, genius.
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AntDX316
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Labroides Posted at 10-9 18:57
I still can't work out what your problem is.
The lens on the old X3 doesn't make everything in focus at all.
It just has no adjustable focus which isn't a big issue since the lans/sensor combination has so much depth of field.

It's like having no glasses on compared to the X3 using the P4PV2.0 at night.
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Labroides Posted at 10-9 18:57
I still can't work out what your problem is.
The lens on the old X3 doesn't make everything in focus at all.
It just has no adjustable focus which isn't a big issue since the lans/sensor combination has so much depth of field.

Because not much of this madness makes any sense, I can only wildly speculate what is the problem:

1. The poster just recently acquired second hand Inspire 1 with X3 camera.
2. X3 camera lens is of fixed 2.8 aperture and of focus fixed on infinity.
3. Therefore only ISO and shutter speed are available to determine proper exposure, eventually with a help from ND filters for daylight video shooting.
4. Although good enough for average daylight photography, X3 camera will perform poorly in low light (night) situations due to limited ISO sensitivity. To get proper exposure both ISO and shutter speed must be set to absurd values, delivering very noisy and blurred (not sharp) video.   
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RedHotPoker
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That was helpful Mathew. Thanks.



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AntDX316
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Matthew Dobrski Posted at 10-9 23:52
Because not much of this madness makes any sense, I can only wildly speculate what is the problem:

1. The poster just recently acquired second hand Inspire 1 with X3 camera.

f/2.8 aperture future on infinity is great.  I wish this was possible for any setup but it's not.  : (
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RedHotPoker Posted at 10-10 12:03
That was helpful Mathew. Thanks.

Oh, unexpected but welcomed guest on Inspire's territory! Finally somebody with common sense ...
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Matthew Dobrski Posted at 10-10 18:27
Oh, unexpected but welcomed guest on Inspire's territory! Finally somebody with common sense  ...

I sometimes think folks like to argue just for the sake of being difficult. Haha



Hope you are well.



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AntDX316 Posted at 10-10 16:18
f/2.8 aperture future on infinity is great.  I wish this was possible for any setup but it's not.  : (

Why this is not possible for any setup? You can set wide open aperture and focus on infinity with any modern DJI aerial camera. Only X3 and P3Pro camera were limited to fixed aperture and fixed focus on infinity, I believe. What's the problem?
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RedHotPoker Posted at 10-10 18:35
I sometimes think folks like to argue just for the sake of being difficult. Haha

Unfortunately this is not exactly the case here, with Ant316 it's more complex issue ...

BTW, what's your definition of "being well" ?
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AntDX316 Posted at 10-10 16:18
f/2.8 aperture future on infinity is great.  I wish this was possible for any setup but it's not.  : (

f/2.8 aperture future on infinity is great.  I wish this was possible for any setup but it's not.  : (
You know nothing.
You get a crazy and incorrect idea and take it from there.
You don't inderstand how ridiculous your complaint is.
And you don't understand when people who do know try to explain to you.
You are a useless waste of space.

If you can't get clean, sharp focus across your image with the P4 pro at any aperture, you are either:
only a metre from your subject .. or a complete idiot.
You haven't mentioned anything about close focus so I guess that eaves one option.



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Matthew Dobrski Posted at 10-10 18:46
Unfortunately this is not exactly the case here, with Ant316 it's more complex issue ...

BTW, what's your definition of "being well" ?

Yes, there is a deeper answer to discover.

Being well, is where your health is adequate for our ages, but you still have joy, in your heart and life.

The day you bought me lunch, fabulous dinner it was, You seemed pretty content, and that tells me your mind is in the right place. Life is treating you “well”. ;-)


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AntDX316
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Matthew Dobrski Posted at 10-10 18:40
Why this is not possible for any setup? You can set wide open aperture and focus on infinity with any modern DJI aerial camera. Only X3 and P3Pro camera were limited to fixed aperture and fixed focus on infinity, I believe. What's the problem?

so I go into MF and do infinity on the focus?
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AntDX316 Posted at 10-10 19:31
so I go into MF and do infinity on the focus?

It would be better to focus where your subjects are rather than infinity.
You'll find your lens has plenty of depth of field and a large area closer and further from the point of focus will be in focus.
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AntDX316
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Labroides Posted at 10-10 21:18
It would be better to focus where your subjects are rather than infinity.
You'll find your lens has plenty of depth of field and a large area closer and further from the point of focus will be in focus.

yeah but it's not real-time tracking autofocus so when you start flying closer or far away, within a few seconds or less the sharpness in-focus is gone

I was introduced to it when I was looking at the Sony A6400 and how people were freaking out about the feature.  I was going to get it as a starter to filming.
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Matthew Dobrski
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AntDX316 Posted at 10-10 19:31
so I go into MF and do infinity on the focus?

with what camera?
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AntDX316
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all cameras
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There he goes again, talking out his tailpipe.
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Matthew Dobrski
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Than my answer is NO. Focus, please. I mean, listen to what I'm saying, again:

1. Some older DJI aerial cameras (X3 including) aren't offering focusing feature. The lens optics are designed to provide sharp image at the distance from few meters to infinity, usually sufficient for this application. Other words, it is always in focus.
2. Newer DJI cameras/lenses can be focused (X5 and above, Phantom 4 not sure, Phantom 4 Pro for sure, Mavic ... hell, I don't know, you tell me) either automatically or manually. The depth of field (area in focus before and beyond the target) is aperture dependent. Other words, the smaller aperture opening, the deeper field of focus.
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AntDX316
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Matthew Dobrski Posted at 10-10 21:44
Than my answer is NO. Focus, please. I mean, listen to what I'm saying, again:

1. Some older DJI aerial cameras (X3 including) aren't offering focusing feature. The lens optics are designed to provide sharp image at the distance from few meters to infinity, usually sufficient for this application. Other words, it is always in focus.

I need to see about messing w/ the upper part of the MF.  I never really thought of that because I think it will make everything closer blurry but I never really found out.  How come you guys don't realize most of the things I've said were after I did them successfully not before.  I'm not looking for bs advice.
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