Please select Into the mobile phone version | Continue to access the computer ver.
Faulty Drone - Propellers Stopped
12Next >
1131 66 2-4 02:59
Uploading and Loding Picture ...(0/1)
o(^-^)o
klitos
lvl.2
Flight distance : 31962 ft
Cyprus
Offline

Hi Guys,

I recently buy the mavic mini from DJI Cyprus store.

During my last flying, the aircraft propellers stopped by him self without any recently warning and fell into the sea.

The DJI support says that was pilot fault because of a strong air!
Am living in Cyprus with a perfect weather condition. As you can see the from weather information for the specific day was perfect for flight (attached image/ Source:https://en.climate-data.org/travel/january/cyprus-1).
Also i find out videos from other pilots in YouTube that flying with 57 km/h (source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_jdC0_rnE8). Cyprus wind that day was maximum 12,8 km/h. DJI says again that maybe was a blast "
Maybe it was just a blast, we don´t know but it was there when you were flying
".


Why hasn't resist in order to come back? No one answers me in that question.

Weather

Weather


After all that they offer me 15% which is not, is not even 3%. "
In that case i can make an offer with 15% discount on a Mavic Mini without RC. This would be around 329,80€. The offer is valid for 4 weeks starting today."



The starting price with all the below things inside, is 360€. And DJI says me to buy ONLY the aircraft for 329,80€. What’s the point? If i buy all whole package and sell it separately it would be much cheaper.


Aircraft x 1
Remote Controller x 1
Intelligent Flight Battery x 1
Pair of Spare Propellers x 1
Micro USB Cable x 1
Gimbal Protector x 1
RC Cable (Micro USB connector) x 1
RC Cable (USB-C connector) x 1
RC Cable (Lightning connector) x 1
Pair of Spare Control Sticks x 1
Spare Screw x 6
Screwdriver x 1

Am very disappointed from the support also from that company that promise so much about their products.

I've loose my trust for buying new drone. Who tell's me that it will not fell again?

Again, am living in Cyprus and if i can't flying a drone here you cannot flying this thing nowhere.


Thanks,
K.



2-4 02:59
Use props
Ice_2k
Second Officer
Flight distance : 160007 ft
Romania
Offline

Can you post the flight log? Also, how do you know the propellers stopped and the drone just dropped from the sky? Seems like a weird thing for DJI to blame on wind.
2-4 03:23
Use props
Ingo Sundowner
Second Officer
Flight distance : 155069 ft
United Kingdom
Offline

Finally received my charging hub today and believe me, I love the mini but I will never ever buy anything dji related. They're useless
2-4 03:28
Use props
klitos
lvl.2
Flight distance : 31962 ft
Cyprus
Offline

Ice_2k Posted at 2-4 03:23
Can you post the flight log? Also, how do you know the propellers stopped and the drone just dropped from the sky? Seems like a weird thing for DJI to blame on wind.

Because DJI support has told me: "Conclusion: pilot's fault, no warranty. The accident was caused due to the improper flight environment. Please do not fly in strong-wind condition."

Below is the log file as I uploaded to the airdata.

https://app.airdata.com/share/LPxxJy
2-4 03:47
Use props
klitos
lvl.2
Flight distance : 31962 ft
Cyprus
Offline

klitos Posted at 2-4 03:47
Because DJI support has told me: "Conclusion: pilot's fault, no warranty. The accident was caused due to the improper flight environment. Please do not fly in strong-wind condition."

Below is the log file as I uploaded to the airdata.

"the aircraft descended into the sea because proplusion was affected by the strong wind" means that the wind was so strong that the propellers cannot fight (work) against the wind and the aircraft decended into the water. The motors were simply not strong enough what means there was a lot of wind and not just a bit. Maybe it was just a blast, we don´t know but it was there when you were flying no matter what the weather table say about the whole day for a big region.

That was the answer from support
2-4 03:54
Use props
Ice_2k
Second Officer
Flight distance : 160007 ft
Romania
Offline

Let's wait for others better at reading logs but to me it looks very much like the drone's fault. We've seen dozens of examples of the Mini being blown away by wind and in this case it's perfectly holding position but then drops 20ft in half a second?! It doesn't make sense and it's really disappointing to know DJI will just blame wind like that....
2-4 04:03
Use props
Mizzu
lvl.4
Flight distance : 65148 ft
Germany
Offline

Ice_2k Posted at 2-4 04:03
Let's wait for others better at reading logs but to me it looks very much like the drone's fault. We've seen dozens of examples of the Mini being blown away by wind and in this case it's perfectly holding position but then drops 20ft in half a second?! It doesn't make sense and it's really disappointing to know DJI will just blame wind like that....

Yeah. Maybe they also don't have a fitting answer for all the drops at the moment. But then they should at least be fair and say "we will investigate these cases"
2-4 07:04
Use props
JJB*
Captain
Flight distance : 1546099 ft
Netherlands
Offline

Hi Kitos,

Had a look at your flight.

It does not look like your MM struggled with heavy wind conditions.
This is another example for an unwanted descent, see my chart.
Red line for the height line is were MM descends without a command from you to do so.

My advice is to ask for a second opinion from DJI.

But you had few times a messages likeStrong winds, Lower altitude immediately, manually return to home, Lower altitude immediately and manually return to home!
But at the end flying at low altitude, there must be enough power just to hover, not to ditch into the water.
As seen in other files, pitch and roll kind of oscillating.
So i am not convinced about their conclusions.

Good luck with that.

cheers
JJB
analysis1.png
analysis2.png
2-4 07:43
Use props
RBI
First Officer

Philippines
Offline

klitos Posted at 2-4 03:47
Because DJI support has told me: "Conclusion: pilot's fault, no warranty. The accident was caused due to the improper flight environment. Please do not fly in strong-wind condition."

Below is the log file as I uploaded to the airdata.

Did you also send the log file to DJI for analysis?
I uploaded your log to https://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer and don't see any environmental problem in your log.

https://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer/8M994FHV3Y3Z352MOUQD/

2-4 07:52
Use props
Ice_2k
Second Officer
Flight distance : 160007 ft
Romania
Offline

drone also appears to be almost perfectly flat during the descend and yet maintaining position, how can DJI claim it was wind that brought it down? Seems like the entire concept of warranty means nothing if they can just claim "improper flight environment" with no proof of this...
2-4 08:19
Use props
Eka
lvl.4
Flight distance : 849446 ft
Serbia
Offline

Sad to hear when someone loses a quad this way, specially after DJi gives an answer like they just did. I am sorry, klitos. This is repeaing too many times, very similar cases, almost identical (ESC Errors and then uncommanded decent). Wonder if this is the first time you are getting ESC errors in flight.. Did you have them in your recent flights as well or this is the first time they are showing in a log?
2-4 08:23
Use props
InspektorGadjet
Captain
Flight distance : 413376 ft
Spain
Offline

Sorry for your loss and really hope DJI changes their conclusion and send you a replacement.
This is why I'm grounding my mini until next FW upgrade...

I made a nice bike trip today and was about to fly in a open awesome area, felt some wind and made me scared, guess what, no photos or video of such an awesome location...
2-4 08:29
Use props
klitos
lvl.2
Flight distance : 31962 ft
Cyprus
Offline

Mizzu Posted at 2-4 07:04
Yeah. Maybe they also don't have a fitting answer for all the drops at the moment. But then they should at least be fair and say "we will investigate these cases"

They investigate the case but the conclusion was about the strong air!
2-4 09:29
Use props
klitos
lvl.2
Flight distance : 31962 ft
Cyprus
Offline

JJB* Posted at 2-4 07:43
Hi Kitos,

Had a look at your flight.
[Image]

This is what am saying! Those was just a warnings before the felling! At the moment that the drone fell into the water was clear! Actually i was able to see from phone the dive of my drone..
2-4 09:33
Use props
klitos
lvl.2
Flight distance : 31962 ft
Cyprus
Offline

RBI Posted at 2-4 07:52
Did you also send the log file to DJI for analysis?
I uploaded your log to https://www.phantomhelp.com/LogViewer and don't see any environmental problem in your log.


Off course i’ve sent them the log! After they saw the logs, answer me about the air..
2-4 09:35
Use props
klitos
lvl.2
Flight distance : 31962 ft
Cyprus
Offline

Eka Posted at 2-4 08:23
Sad to hear when someone loses a quad this way, specially after DJi gives an answer like they just did. I am sorry, klitos. This is repeaing too many times, very similar cases, almost identical (ESC Errors and then uncommanded decent). Wonder if this is the first time you are getting ESC errors in flight.. Did you have them in your recent flights as well or this is the first time they are showing in a log?

I didn’t have any other problems in my flights, but we are talking about 8 flights! Was brand new! The only problem i had it with the distance.. maximum distance was around 400meters and then i getting a warning or auto return
2-4 09:40
Use props
klitos
lvl.2
Flight distance : 31962 ft
Cyprus
Offline

InspektorGadjet Posted at 2-4 08:29
Sorry for your loss and really hope DJI changes their conclusion and send you a replacement.
This is why I'm grounding my mini until next FW upgrade...


I understand you my friend! That day i was near to the beach with friends and trust me i took an amazing videos and photos.. now all lost with the card inside the drone..
2-4 09:43
Use props
InspektorGadjet
Captain
Flight distance : 413376 ft
Spain
Offline

klitos Posted at 2-4 09:43
I understand you my friend! That day i was near to the beach with friends and trust me i took an amazing videos and photos.. now all lost with the card inside the drone..

Sad... none has their footage, at least I have the mini... but this makes you fly scared, not good at all.

The thing here is, I noticed the drops and reported here inmediately, lots of debate, but after many other users reported their drops, it seems a known issue regardless of DJI coming and admiting it.

What scares me of this behaviour is exactly what happened to you... I was flying VLOS at all times and not far, only 150-200 meters away, and the drop hapened quick and quite drastic, once the drone went from the sky line of the horizon in to vegetation I could not see it, so this let me thinking, what if I loose connection? will it drop? since you cannot see it, or the video feed may be gone too you basically have to rely and trust 100% the RTH feature, but if the mini is going down it will end on a tree or worse like you under the sea... that is not just unacceptable but very risky.

Really hope DJI reconsiders what happened to you.
Wish you good luck!
2-4 11:06
Use props
grahamjohnson10
lvl.4
Flight distance : 215581 ft
United Kingdom
Offline

klitos Posted at 2-4 03:47
Because DJI support has told me: "Conclusion: pilot's fault, no warranty. The accident was caused due to the improper flight environment. Please do not fly in strong-wind condition."

Below is the log file as I uploaded to the airdata.

Please could you upload and share the link to the .DAT file from your mobile device.


2-4 11:53
Use props
klitos
lvl.2
Flight distance : 31962 ft
Cyprus
Offline

grahamjohnson10 Posted at 2-4 11:53
Please could you upload and share the link to the .DAT file from your mobile device.

Hi graham, the link is the same as i have posted on a previous message..

https://app.airdata.com/share/LPxxJy
2-4 12:05
Use props
at2marty
lvl.1
Flight distance : 76358 ft
United States
Offline

Looking at your log file it looks very similar to what happened to me.  I got similar messages and a sudden loss of altitude though I was lucky and the drone ended up crashing into a tree on my property.  The damage at the moment appears to be just the props getting nicked up.
2-4 12:31
Use props
klitos
lvl.2
Flight distance : 31962 ft
Cyprus
Offline

at2marty Posted at 2-4 12:31
Looking at your log file it looks very similar to what happened to me.  I got similar messages and a sudden loss of altitude though I was lucky and the drone ended up crashing into a tree on my property.  The damage at the moment appears to be just the props getting nicked up.

Unfortunately i was not so lucky and i lost it into the sea.
Drive safely, away from water!!
2-4 12:59
Use props
hallmark007
Captain
Flight distance : 4797602 ft
  • >>>
Ireland
Offline

Tip: the author has been banned or deleted automatically shield
2-4 13:20
Use props
Zelmani
lvl.2
Flight distance : 358245 ft
Germany
Offline

Hi klitos,

did you have the propguards mounted? Your battery drained quite quickly and the bird started spreading a long series of ESC error messages ("not enough force") from 12 minutes on. This is a typical pattern that usually occurs when flying with propguards, although there might be other causes to explain this. Did you realize the ESC error messages on your mobile screen during flight? I'm a little bit surprised by your decision to fly out to the sea at the end of the flight with only 25% battery left and lots of errors and warnings telling you to return home!? Nevertheless, being careless is no justification for the sudden stop of the motor without any previous battery state warning. Strongs winds, to me at least, seem the most implausible cause of your loss.
2-4 14:35
Use props
grahamjohnson10
lvl.4
Flight distance : 215581 ft
United Kingdom
Offline

I'm experimenting with an .DAT file of my own.

When converted to a CSV file using CsvView there are 3 sensors on the MM that read altitude in meters.

1) Column AFS = GPS ASL
2) Column AN = Barometer ASL
3) Column CS = VPS

There is also a column CT "Relative Height" but I think it's calculated from one or more of the above.  

There has been talk that only the barometer and VPS control the MM height but what has stuck me is the GPS unit also reports altitude ASL very accurately.

I'm totally crap with Excel so maybe someone with to much time on their hands could help make charts of this data.

OBTW the manual does state that once you have GPS lock the VPS system is not used, even though it will still show values.      
2-4 18:10
Use props
grahamjohnson10
lvl.4
Flight distance : 215581 ft
United Kingdom
Offline

klitos Posted at 2-4 12:05
Hi graham, the link is the same as i have posted on a previous message..

https://app.airdata.com/share/LPxxJy

The .DAT file is not the same as the ,txt log.

The .DAT gives a lot more info about what is going on inside your Mavic Mini.
2-4 18:19
Use props
Geebax
Captain
Australia
Online

grahamjohnson10 Posted at 2-4 18:10
I'm experimenting with an .DAT file of my own.

When converted to a CSV file using CsvView there are 3 sensors on the MM that read altitude in meters.

DJI do not use the GPS to read altitude because the readings are usually quite innacurate. Try Googling 'GPS altitude' and you will find that it can be out by as much as 122 Metres or 400 feet.

They use the VPS at 30 Metres altitude or lower, above 30 Metres the VPS is not able to work accurately. Two types of VPS have been used, the older system used ultrasonics, which were quite accurate, the later ones use visual systems, or cameras, and can be useless in the dark, or over featureless terrain such as sand or water.

The barometer is the prime device for measuring altitude, however the VPS and barometer do NOT measure altitude as ASL (Above Sea Level) because neither of them have a clue about where sea level is located.

The barometer shows the altitude above the point where the aircraft was powered on, and the VPS shows the altitude above the terrain directly below it.


2-4 18:51
Use props
grahamjohnson10
lvl.4
Flight distance : 215581 ft
United Kingdom
Offline

2-4 19:38
Use props
grahamjohnson10
lvl.4
Flight distance : 215581 ft
United Kingdom
Offline



So next time we need the .DAT file.
This will tell us if it's a barometer problem or firmware issue.

Sorry for the double post.
2-4 19:41
Use props
virtual
lvl.4
Flight distance : 37661 ft
Czechia
Offline

grahamjohnson10 Posted at 2-4 19:41
[view_image]

So next time we need the .DAT file.

And files are stored in device only if sync is disabled, right?
Is there a guide for begginers how to read flight data?
2-5 01:43
Use props
Ice_2k
Second Officer
Flight distance : 160007 ft
Romania
Offline

Zelmani Posted at 2-4 14:35
Hi klitos,

did you have the propguards mounted? Your battery drained quite quickly and the bird started spreading a long series of ESC error messages ("not enough force") from 12 minutes on. This is a typical pattern that usually occurs when flying with propguards, although there might be other causes to explain this. Did you realize the ESC error messages on your mobile screen during flight? I'm a little bit surprised by your decision to fly out to the sea at the end of the flight with only 25% battery left and lots of errors and warnings telling you to return home!? Nevertheless, being careless is no justification for the sudden stop of the motor without any previous battery state warning. Strongs winds, to me at least, seem the most implausible cause of your loss.

Considering he was less than 100m away from the HP, I wouldn't really call that "careless" with a 25% battery life on a 30-min drone. It would take less than 15s to get back. With a non-malfunctioning drone that is.

As far as the ESC errors are concerned, I don't think anyone can be blamed for ignoring them. They appear so damn often that you can either learn to ignore them or not use the drone at all. Everytime I give it full forward and climb in S-mode I get this error...
2-5 02:07
Use props
JJB*
Captain
Flight distance : 1546099 ft
Netherlands
Offline

Geebax Posted at 2-4 18:51
DJI do not use the GPS to read altitude because the readings are usually quite innacurate. Try Googling 'GPS altitude' and you will find that it can be out by as much as 122 Metres or 400 feet.

They use the VPS at 30 Metres altitude or lower, above 30 Metres the VPS is not able to work accurately. Two types of VPS have been used, the older system used ultrasonics, which were quite accurate, the later ones use visual systems, or cameras, and can be useless in the dark, or over featureless terrain such as sand or water.

hi Geebax,

About not knowing where the sea is...true, but   barometric sensor measure air pressure wich is calculated to a height according to the standard athmosphere values, 1013,25 hPa with temp of 15 degrees centigrade.

In the DAT file this calculated height can be found, and changes during height changes in flight.
At take-off the indicated baro height is set to zero, during flight height values are plus or minus values ; flying above or under the takeoff point as the zero ref height.

cheers
JJB
2-5 02:47
Use props
JJB*
Captain
Flight distance : 1546099 ft
Netherlands
Offline

Ice_2k Posted at 2-5 02:07
Considering he was less than 100m away from the HP, I wouldn't really call that "careless" with a 25% battery life on a 30-min drone. It would take less than 15s to get back. With a non-malfunctioning drone that is.

As far as the ESC errors are concerned, I don't think anyone can be blamed for ignoring them. They appear so damn often that you can either learn to ignore them or not use the drone at all. Everytime I give it full forward and climb in S-mode I get this error...

Hi Ice_2k,

Yesterday i stressed my MM at his top, so much wind it could not hover at position as the wind blew it backwards. (why. just testing out)

I could even fly forward with 100% pitch. BUT not a single errror about power etc.

So why do have some MM so much errors and why not all MM?
I have not a single clue! wish someone could give the answer!!

I use the latest firmware and a FlyApp is up to date. (plus all battery were updated after updaing fm and app)


cheers
JJB

2-5 02:53
Use props
Christian U
Second Officer
Flight distance : 189659 ft
Germany
Offline

Does the OP has somewhere telled with what Firmware he flys ?
Ive never have seen ESC errors after 1.0.4

Maybe DJI Support is trained for 1.0.3 firmware? Tere ESC Errors could be an indicator for to high winds.
2-5 03:22
Use props
m80116
lvl.4
Flight distance : 1233320 ft
Italy
Offline

I am saddened for your loss but according to historic data the ground wind was 2 m/s which was likely to be about 3 times higher at 50 meters and about twice that at 100 meters.

So you're likely to have flown with steady 12m/s wind at 380ft (just on the edge of 13m/s for sport mode) with gusts much higher than that. Your Mini registered more than 100 ESC  - Not enough force warnings. The drone drifted backwards and succumbed to winds with 22% battery.

I am afraid you should be far more aware about the wind dynamics at sea, check your propellers thoroughly before departing and never fly above water in such challenging conditions with less than 30% battery.
2-5 04:03
Use props
Ice_2k
Second Officer
Flight distance : 160007 ft
Romania
Offline

JJB* Posted at 2-5 02:53
Hi Ice_2k,

Yesterday i stressed my MM at his top, so much wind it could not hover at position as the wind blew it backwards. (why. just testing out)

I would love to know that as well. I am also running latest firmware on drone+batteries and latest app version. I am using the FCC version, I assume you have the CE version. Although I doubt that would make a difference for this....
2-5 04:15
Use props
Ice_2k
Second Officer
Flight distance : 160007 ft
Romania
Offline

m80116 Posted at 2-5 04:03
I am saddened for your loss but according to historic data the ground wind was 2 m/s which was likely to be about 3 times higher at 50 meters and about twice that at 100 meters.

So you're likely to have flown with steady 12m/s wind at 380ft (just on the edge of 13m/s for sport mode) with gusts much higher than that. Your Mini registered more than 100 ESC  - Not enough force warnings. The drone drifted backwards and succumbed to winds with 22% battery.

Can you please explain how wind not strong enough to blow the drone away (as it was maintaining position) can cause it to descend all the way into the sea? Keep in mind the descent didn't stop once the drone got to lower altitude, it just kept going down and down until it "drowned". I honestly don't understand how wind can cause that.
2-5 04:17
Use props
grahamjohnson10
lvl.4
Flight distance : 215581 ft
United Kingdom
Offline

JJB* Posted at 2-5 02:53
Hi Ice_2k,

Yesterday i stressed my MM at his top, so much wind it could not hover at position as the wind blew it backwards. (why. just testing out)

Thanks JJB, a very interesting test.

It's worrying that you had no errors and so many others are.

Only a thought but could it be something like tight motors or related to the battery.

Would be interesting to see how many amps the motors where pulling.  
2-5 04:25
Use props
RBI
First Officer

Philippines
Offline

JJB* Posted at 2-5 02:53

So why do have some MM so much errors and why not all MM?
I have not a single clue! wish someone could give the answer!!

I think that is related to the quality variation of the individual battery cells.

2-5 04:34
Use props
Cal Evans
lvl.3
Flight distance : 52963 ft
United States
Offline

Ingo Sundowner Posted at 2-4 03:28
Finally received my charging hub today and believe me, I love the mini but I will never ever buy anything dji related. They're useless

While I'm not down overall on DJI, I am kinda disappointed in the charging hub. it's very slow. Still, I plan when I'm going out to fly so it's easy to make sure I have batteries charged.

Cheers!
=C=
2-5 04:41
Use props
12Next >
Advanced
You need to log in before you can reply Login | Register now

Credit Rules