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Mini Flyaway When Not Connected to App??!!!!!
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4327 246 3-6 04:13
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Anno
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Hi Peeps.

This is my first post and unfortunately it's an unhappy one.....
I recently purchased a Mavic Mini and had flown it for a couple of weeks. On a recent trip I realised I had left my cable at home, so I was unable to connect my controller to my phone. However, I was aware that I could still fly the drone without the app so I proceeded to. It's a mistake I won't be making again!!!!
After a few minutes of flying the drone proceeded to fly away from me and it kept going........and going......and going..........until it was gone, for good.
I tried all I could to locate it but of course without a GPS connection this was nigh-on impossible. I understand it was a newbie mistake but I was obviosly disappointed as there was no way for me to obtain any logs to prove the reason for the flyaway.
I have now purchased a new Mini (and ANOTHER Care Refresh to go with it but that's another issue.....).
Has this happened to anyone else or does anyone have any thoughts on why this happened or whether I do have any way of escalating it with DJI?
Any suggestions appreciated, but for now I will take it as a lesson never to fly without the app. ;)

Regards

Anno
3-6 04:13
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Nebuchadnezzar
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better use the cable mate !
3-6 04:21
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Anno
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Nebuchadnezzar Posted at 3-6 04:21
better use the cable mate !

Yes, that much I now realise!!
3-6 04:25
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Labroides
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After a few minutes of flying the drone proceeded to fly away from me and it kept going........and going......and going..........until it was gone, for good.
....
Has this happened to anyone else or does anyone have any thoughts on why this happened or whether I do have any way of escalating it with DJI?
Without the app, you have no flight data.

Without data you can't tell what was the cause of the loss of your drone, (but drones don't fly away).
You have no chance of escalating it with DJI because there is no way you could prove that the issue was due to a DJI problem.


3-6 04:27
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Anno
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Labroides Posted at 3-6 04:27
After a few minutes of flying the drone proceeded to fly away from me and it kept going........and going......and going..........until it was gone, for good.
....
Has this happened to anyone else or does anyone have any thoughts on why this happened or whether I do have any way of escalating it with DJI?

Well they do fly away because mine did! I was flying away from myself at the time.
I thought there was a limit on the distance it could be away from me while flying with just the controller, but I guess the RTH can't function if you haven't connected it to the app either.
I figured I wouldn't have any comeback through DJI which is why I purchased another Mini, although I was disappointed I couldn't transfer my nearly-new Refresh to the new one.
Thanks
3-6 04:34
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Labroides
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Anno Posted at 3-6 04:34
Well they do fly away because mine did! I was flying away from myself at the time.
I thought there was a limit on the distance it could be away from me while flying with just the controller, but I guess the RTH can't function if you haven't connected it to the app either.
I figured I wouldn't have any comeback through DJI which is why I purchased another Mini, although I was disappointed I couldn't transfer my nearly-new Refresh to the new one.

Well they do fly away because mine did! I was flying away from myself at the time.
All you know about what happened is that you lost your drone.
You don't know what caused it so you can't say what happened.
I've analysed hundreds of flight incidents and still haven't found a case where the drone flew away.

I thought there was a limit on the distance it could be away from me while flying with just the controller,
Can you find any mention of this in the manual?

but I guess the RTH can't function if you haven't connected it to the app either.
The Mini will RTH if control signal is lost ..... unless the wind is too strong, or the return path is blocked or the battery is too low or if GPS is lost.

3-6 04:58
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Anno
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Labroides Posted at 3-6 04:58
Well they do fly away because mine did! I was flying away from myself at the time.
All you know about what happened is that you lost your drone.
You don't know what caused it so you can't say what happened.

The drone is gone and there is no way of finding out why, but just because you haven't seen a log showing a fault doesn't mean it's not possible.

I read somewhere that range was less withouth the app, but maybe that's incorrect.

As I said before, I didn't think RTH would work without the app due to no GPS, but maybe that's also incorrect.

Anyway, without the logs we will never know why it happened but clearly it's a rare event so I will just learn from it and move on.
3-6 05:32
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thE29
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What I dont get is the "and going and going"...

Were you still able to control it or not, when you were at this point?


But yeah, without the app you dont have any feedback...
3-6 05:40
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Labroides
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Anno Posted at 3-6 05:32
The drone is gone and there is no way of finding out why, but just because you haven't seen a log showing a fault doesn't mean it's not possible.

I read somewhere that range was less withouth the app, but maybe that's incorrect.

Anyway, without the logs we will never know why it happened but clearly it's a rare event.
People losing their drones for all kinds of reasons is not rare at all.
People losing their Minis is even more common.
3-6 05:56
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Anno
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thE29 Posted at 3-6 05:40
What I dont get is the "and going and going"...

Were you still able to control it or not, when you were at this point?

No, I don't get it either hence my post. I was flying it away from me and then no inputs on the controls made any difference and the drone kept flying away. Wind was minimal. I guess it kept flying until it ran out of power and then landed, but that just left too big an area to even consider covering.
3-6 06:00
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hallmark007
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thE29 Posted at 3-6 05:40
What I dont get is the "and going and going"...

Were you still able to control it or not, when you were at this point?

If you have Rth set once you lose app drone will Rth, this is a feature of mini .
3-6 06:22
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hallmark007
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Anno Posted at 3-6 06:00
No, I don't get it either hence my post. I was flying it away from me and then no inputs on the controls made any difference and the drone kept flying away. Wind was minimal. I guess it kept flying until it ran out of power and then landed, but that just left too big an area to even consider covering.

You have flight logs that will tell you exactly why drone flew away .
3-6 06:23
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Anno
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hallmark007 Posted at 3-6 06:23
You have flight logs that will tell you exactly why drone flew away .

DJI have said it isn't possible to get logs if the drone isn't connected to the app.
3-6 06:30
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Anno
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hallmark007 Posted at 3-6 06:22
If you have Rth set once you lose app drone will Rth, this is a feature of mini .

It's my understanding that you can't set a home point if you aren't connected to the app, and therefore RTH will not work.
3-6 07:19
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big lou
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not having the satt.. you were in atti mode, the mini drifted with the wind.
3-6 07:49
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InspektorGadjet
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Yeah without GPS and app, drone was in Atti mode, some videos around showed clearly what happens when drone is in Atti mode, with little wind or not at all (flying indoors), the inertia of basic movement is capable of making the drone move, and not hoover.

Have a look at this video that shows clearly how the drone easily drifts even indoors:
https://forum.dji.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=203535
3-6 09:03
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Ice_2k
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i don't think you guys are right, I see no reason for the drone to be in Atti mode, that app itself doesn't provide GPS to the drone.
3-6 09:10
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Anno
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InspektorGadjet Posted at 3-6 09:03
Yeah without GPS and app, drone was in Atti mode, some videos around showed clearly what happens when drone is in Atti mode, with little wind or not at all (flying indoors), the inertia of basic movement is capable of making the drone move, and not hoover.

Have a look at this video that shows clearly how the drone easily drifts even indoors:

Yes, no doubt flying it without the app is not as safe but I still didn't expect it to just go, it was almost as if the throttle was stuck. Unfortunately I was in a position that didn't enable me to follow it so I watched helplessly as it disappeared......
Always fly with the app Lesson learned.
3-6 09:13
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hallmark007
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Anno Posted at 3-6 07:19
It's my understanding that you can't set a home point if you aren't connected to the app, and therefore RTH will not work.

That’s not correct, but it would be impossible to know if drone set a homepoint without app,
3-6 09:16
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hallmark007
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Anno Posted at 3-6 06:30
DJI have said it isn't possible to get logs if the drone isn't connected to the app.

That’s true, why wasn’t drone connected to app ?
3-6 09:17
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Anno
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Ice_2k Posted at 3-6 09:10
i don't think you guys are right, I see no reason for the drone to be in Atti mode, that app itself doesn't provide GPS to the drone.
I hadn't heard of Atti mode until now so I don't know much about it.
I was hoping that the drone contained an independent GPS locator that I could access once I returned with my phone, but it seems that isn't the case as the GPS needs to be active through the app in order to show the last location.
Its a pity it can't be pinged at any time, but then if you are flying with the app I guess you wouldn't need that option.
3-6 09:18
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InspektorGadjet
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Anno Posted at 3-6 09:13
Yes, no doubt flying it without the app is not as safe but I still didn't expect it to just go, it was almost as if the throttle was stuck. Unfortunately I was in a position that didn't enable me to follow it so I watched helplessly as it disappeared......
Always fly with the app Lesson learned.

Lo siento por la dura lección compañer@ !
3-6 09:18
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InspektorGadjet
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Ice_2k Posted at 3-6 09:10
i don't think you guys are right, I see no reason for the drone to be in Atti mode, that app itself doesn't provide GPS to the drone.

Nobody can tell without fly log... but guessing you take off without app and not waiting for GPS, if the drone is out of VPS Range then is probable but again, just a guess.
3-6 09:19
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Anno
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hallmark007 Posted at 3-6 09:17
That’s true, why wasn’t drone connected to app ?

As I said in the original post I simply left the cable at home. I purchased a new longer one for a screen holder but didn't pack it. I wasn't going to fly it but then found out that I could still operate it without the phone. Clearly not very well.
3-6 09:21
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hallmark007
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Anno Posted at 3-6 09:21
As I said in the original post I simply left the cable at home. I purchased a new longer one for a screen holder but didn't pack it. I wasn't going to fly it but then found out that I could still operate it without the phone. Clearly not very well.

Well an expensive lesson to learn .
3-6 09:25
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Ice_2k
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Anno Posted at 3-6 09:18
I hadn't heard of Atti mode until now so I don't know much about it.
I was hoping that the drone contained an independent GPS locator that I could access once I returned with my phone, but it seems that isn't the case as the GPS needs to be active through the app in order to show the last location.
Its a pity it can't be pinged at any time, but then if you are flying with the app I guess you wouldn't need that option.

the drone *does* have its own GPS receiver, that's how it flies and knows where it is. The information is transmitted to the remote and the remote passes it to the app via the cable. The app knows how to save the last known GPS position of the drone. Without the drone, there was nobody there to store the information the drone was sending. The remote received the information but had no way to store it. Also, if what you're saying is correct about the drone flying away (possibly being carried away by some powerful wind), having the app wouldn't help with the latest location as the connection most likely dropped before the drone landed.
3-6 10:45
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Ice_2k
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InspektorGadjet Posted at 3-6 09:19
Nobody can tell without fly log... but guessing you take off without app and not waiting for GPS, if the drone is out of VPS Range then is probable but again, just a guess.

I was replying to the assertion that simply flying the drone without the app means it's flying in ATTI mode because it doesn't have GPS. That is clearly not true as the GPS receiver is within the drone itself. Whether this particular drone in this particular instance had a stable GPS connection, that's a separate matter which indeed can't be discussed without a flight log.
3-6 10:47
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m80116
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Mavic Mini has no Attitude mode. It surely acquired GPS and as soon as it tried to maintain position using that started drifting away...

Why may you ask?

The compass wasn't calibrated for that zone and/or the inizialazation was accomplished in a magnetically distorted area.
That's why you use the app. MM can fly very limited without app, and to me makes very little sense to fly in that condition.
3-6 10:50
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Ice_2k
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m80116 Posted at 3-6 10:50
Mavic Mini has no Attitude mode. It surely acquired GPS and as soon as it tried to maintain position using that started drifting away...

Why may you ask?

Every dji drone has ATTI mode, it’s the default when gps/vps is not available. You just can’t enable ATTI mode manually.
3-6 11:00
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Anno
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m80116 Posted at 3-6 10:50
Mavic Mini has no Attitude mode. It surely acquired GPS and as soon as it tried to maintain position using that started drifting away...

Why may you ask?

A lesson I have definitely learned. ;-)
3-6 13:11
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Labroides
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Anno Posted at 3-6 06:00
No, I don't get it either hence my post. I was flying it away from me and then no inputs on the controls made any difference and the drone kept flying away. Wind was minimal. I guess it kept flying until it ran out of power and then landed, but that just left too big an area to even consider covering.

There are so many suggestions that are completely wrong in this thread.

I guess it kept flying until it ran out of power and then landed, but that just left too big an area to even consider covering.

If you take your hands off the joysticks the drone stops and hovers, waiting for your signal.
If you lose signal, the drone stops and soon after, will RTH, unless one of the conditions I mentioned previously prevents it. lose signal.
The drone does not fly away.

3-6 13:18
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Labroides
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Anno Posted at 3-6 07:19
It's my understanding that you can't set a home point if you aren't connected to the app, and therefore RTH will not work.

It's my understanding that you can't set a home point if you aren't connected to the app, and therefore RTH will not work.
You have very little understanding of how your drone works.
The drone records a home point very soon after you power it on, whether you have the app connected or not.
3-6 13:21
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Labroides
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big lou Posted at 3-6 07:49
not having the app. you were in atti mode, the mini drifted with the wind.

not having the app. you were in atti mode, the mini drifted with the wind.
That's complete nonsense.
How can you fly your drone when you have such a poor understanding of how it works?
3-6 13:23
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Geebax
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m80116 Posted at 3-6 10:50
Mavic Mini has no Attitude mode. It surely acquired GPS and as soon as it tried to maintain position using that started drifting away...

Why may you ask?

'The compass wasn't calibrated for that zone and/or the inizialazation was accomplished in a magnetically distorted area.'

That's not true. You do not have to calibrate the compass for each area you are flying in, and you have no way of knowing if the aircraft was launched from an area with magnetic influence.
3-6 13:24
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Labroides
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InspektorGadjet Posted at 3-6 09:03
Yeah without GPS and app, drone was in Atti mode, some videos around showed clearly what happens when drone is in Atti mode, with little wind or not at all (flying indoors), the inertia of basic movement is capable of making the drone move, and not hoover.

Have a look at this video that shows clearly how the drone easily drifts even indoors:

Yeah without GPS and app, drone was in Atti mode
No ... do you have any basic understanding of how the drone works?
Why do you think his drone had no GPS?

Nobody can tell without fly log... but guessing you take off without app and not waiting for GPS, if the drone is out of VPS Range then is probable but again, just a guess.

Again .. this is nonsense, the only part that's correct is that it's just a guess.
Why does it say Captain after your name?
If you just make guesses without any knowledge of what happened or how a drone works, they will probably be wrong.
3-6 13:29
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m80116
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Geebax Posted at 3-6 13:24
'The compass wasn't calibrated for that zone and/or the inizialazation was accomplished in a magnetically distorted area.'

That's not true. You do not have to calibrate the compass for each area you are flying in, and you have no way of knowing if the aircraft was launched from an area with magnetic influence.

True, untrue, your're WRONG, you don't KNOW... HOW DO YOU DARE FLYING !? What has it got into these people minds!? How the heck can you relate to others with such an ATTITUDE !?
I think you could use a course of good manners.


Now... to better let understand our newly come fellow MM pilot Anno I indicated the Mini w/out ATTI mode, because well... perhaps he doens't know that several DJI drones have that flying mode (among P, S, C) that you can freely recall. The Mini relies to ATTI when it's inevitable and will always try to grab hold of the GPS and GLONASS satellite signals.

The Earth magnetism dear Geebax have a natural bias depending on where you're in the globe and even local morphology have an effect. Now... for what I've understood from my MM experience a calibration is triggered every time you move away from the last recorded position a certain amount, let's say something like 50 to 100 Km (just plain speculation), and this makes perfect sense. In addition to that, there's always the possibility according the the most knowledgeable people on Forums that the magnetic field sensor is incorrectly initialized. Because presumably the last calibration point distance throshold just serves to correct a small offset in the Earth magnetic field, but compass initialization is far more important and establishes the absolute cardinal points with which the GPS guidance is based.


That's also why, unless somebody proves otherwise, the compass data is ignored in Attitude mode, and begins to be processed by the Flight Controller once the GPS lock is aquired: that's what happens with many fly aways due to distorted magnetic field at lauch site. Once the drone gets up in the air the magnetic interference is ceased and the newly acquired heading differs from what the IMU calculated one is at. The same I believe can happen if the drone has no GPS (bacause ATTI doens't use compass), immdiately after GPS lock compass data is taken into account and if it's not accurate the drone starts to drift away (although manual ovverride should still be possible).


Should everything be fine, i.e. perfect GPS lock without an MD (mobile device) the homepoint is still set as soon as the drone locks the satellite positioning, hence it would not have drifted away...


3-6 14:29
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hallmark007
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m80116 Posted at 3-6 10:50
Mavic Mini has no Attitude mode. It surely acquired GPS and as soon as it tried to maintain position using that started drifting away...

Why may you ask?

Mavic mini does have atti mode, it has 3 modes, gps, opti, and atti . But I bet those pointing out right from wrong will get downvoted ;+):::
3-6 14:30
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m80116
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Your guess is CORRECT.

Mavic Mini can select just P (Position), S (Sport), C (Cinematic). It is quite obvious if you don't have GPS the drone will use ATTI mode to control the flight... there's no way to lock it.
3-6 14:44
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hallmark007
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m80116 Posted at 3-6 14:44
Your guess is CORRECT.

Mavic Mini can select just P (Position), S (Sport), C (Cinematic). It is quite obvious if you don't have GPS the drone will use ATTI mode to control the flight... there's no way to lock it.

No guess and drone will only choose atti when opti is not available.

Cinematic and sport and P are speed modes different than flying modes .
3-6 14:49
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m80116
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Go tell this to DJI

I think you should call it quits to make a complete ATTI of yourself.
3-6 14:56
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