There is this  wet-land location I want to fly that is within 5 miles of a commercial airport.  It's ~4 miles away, it's not inside DJI's GEO NO Fly Zones, so DJI allows to fly there, with the caution.

I'm confused on calling the airport/tower rules.   I'm only going to fly under 100M (actualy closer to 50M, and have set to 120M max)  to take some nature video / pics.

Does the tower have to let me fly or allowed to stop me - do I need to call everytime I fly there?

For the purpose of full disclosure and kindness I would call, if they keep seeing your radar signature they may think it is a glitch, then when they find you, may get annoyed and end poorly. ATC is a stressful job, just my thoughts.
Regards,
-d.

I recently took the FAA Part 107 test and every question referred to getting towers "permission" not giving them "notification". If it's a small airport, they likely have a position called "Airport Manager" that you should call and speak to first to get the 411 on best way to contact ATC. It's also listed in the "Chart Supplements" guides from the FAA, but the may be more in the weeds than you want to go.

bunny too Posted at 2017-2-13 12:51
For the purpose of full disclosure and kindness I would call, if they keep seeing your radar signature they may think it is a glitch, then when they find you, may get annoyed and end poorly. ATC is a stressful job, just my thoughts.
Regards,
-d.

LOL @ radar signature!  

right. People are so scared of the boogeyman they say ANYTHING.
radar signature of something SMALLER THAN MOST BIRDS IN THAT AREA.

ATC controller: "theres something on my screen. It's either a drone, a bird, or wait...its actually dust on my monitor"   

Just go online and check who controls the airspace, it's whoever controls the airspace that you need to contact for permission to fly, if they give you permission to fly it's then you need to contact ATC.

fans90d4f438 Posted at 2017-2-13 13:20
ATC controller: "theres something on my screen. It's either a drone, a bird, or wait...its actually dust on my monitor"

You almost got me this time, but hey it is what you do ;staying home sick from school today?

DRONE-flies-YOU Posted at 2017-2-13 13:17
LOL @ radar signature!

The airport might not have dopplar radar, however even the inexpensive planes... Never mind buddy,  never mind.

Is this a large city airport or a smaller facility?

Can you share the specific airport are you talking about?

The FAA rules require you to "receive authorization" from ATC prior to flying within a controlled airspace. The extent of controlled airspace it typically beyond the boundaries of any No Fly Zone and may extend in odd shapes beyond a 5-mile radius.  Instrument landing pathways and associated radio beacons are typically in these areas.  In the two circumstances I've need to operate within the controlled area, I've called the local ATC and stated the approximate time frame, location and altitude of my activity.  The response I've gotten has always been "thank you".  Only once was I cautioned to stay below 400 ft.  

My take is this: no matter how safe you think your planned flight will be, there may be factors unknown to you - special air operations, communications equipment in an area - things ATC will be aware of.  Also, nowdays, if AirForce One is in your area, No Fly Zones are expanded with little notice.  ATC will know, DJI won't.  Call them. Ignorance will not excuse you in the event something goes very wrong.

Griffith Posted at 2017-2-13 13:59
The FAA rules require you to "receive authorization" from ATC prior to flying within a controlled airspace. The extent of controlled airspace it typically beyond the boundaries of any No Fly Zone and may extend in odd shapes beyond a 5-mile radius.  Instrument landing pathways and associated radio beacons are typically in these areas.  In the two circumstances I've need to operate within the controlled area, I've called the local ATC and stated the approximate time frame, location and altitude of my activity.  The response I've gotten has always been "thank you".  Only once was I cautioned to stay below 400 ft.  

My take is this: no matter how safe you think your planned flight will be, there may be factors unknown to you - special air operations, communications equipment in an area - things ATC will be aware of.  Also, nowdays, if AirForce One is in your area, No Fly Zones are expanded with little notice.  ATC will know, DJI won't.  Call them. Ignorance will not excuse you in the event something goes very wrong.

Very well stated Griffith, it is the unknown variable that may cost dearly.
Regards,
-d.

You must notify but they can't technically prohibit you from flying. However, if they disapprove and something bad happens, you may be looking at a more severe penalty.

"Can an airport operator object to model aircraft flights near an airport?"

Yes, an airport operator can object to the proposed use of a model aircraft within five miles of an airport if the proposed activity would endanger the safety of the airspace. However, the airport operator cannot prohibit or prevent the model aircraft operator from operating within five miles of the airport. Unsafe flying in spite of the objection of an airport operator may be evidence that the operator was endangering the safety of the National Airspace System. Additionally, the UAS operator must comply with any applicable airspace requirements. UAS FAQ

You should probably call the tower

Call.  I have called my airport manager with a question about some overlap of airspace with a private heleport.  He checked with ATC and even called me back with an answer.  My limited experience is they are helpful and want the same as all of us, safe airspace.

I just love the "Call the tower" type answers.  Many areas have no tower, not even an FAA employee in the area, other than a tech who maintains radio/nav-aids equipment.  Often, he is in a larger city with a very large area to cover when he gets called out.  The airport manager is all there is in cases like this.  I've spoken to ours and he basically doesn't care as long as it is outside the fence and clear of aircraft activity.

ATC is good people, no bureaucrats. They will help/advise if they can. When in doubt, contact. They might even publish a NOTAM for you and give you a timeslot when you can fly, i kid you not.
Civil grade PSR Radar will not see Mavic by the way.

I think if you fly without permission and if your found to have broken some rule, then you will find it's the first and last time to fly there. If you check out the rules and ask permission likelihood is they will be more understanding. Good luck..

Seriously? 'Found to have broken a rule and get caught'

Dude: NO one is checking or detecting drones at 401 feet high 4 miles from a class c airport. NO one. LOL

Calling the ATC can be a pain , but highly recommended. Image if you didn't and caused and issue in a certain air zone. The little airports with no CT are the pain. Trying to get ahold of the airport manager can be a pain

fans2b75c050 Posted at 2017-2-14 16:32
Calling the ATC can be a pain , but highly recommended. Image if you didn't and caused and issue in a certain air zone. The little airports with no CT are the pain. Trying to get ahold of the airport manager can be a pain

I'm a Part 107 commercial pilot you should NOT contact ATC you must submit a waiver via https://www.faa.gov/uas/request_waiver/ in advance to operate in Class B,C, D, E controlled airspace, which could or could not be within 5 miles of the airport, but likely the surface to at least 400 feet WILL be controlled airspace.  

You should not call or radio the ATC for drone operations in controlled airspace. You must apply for a waiver in advance of said sUAS operations via the online FAA portal https://www.faa.gov/uas/request_waiver/ this is Part 107 101.  

I'm a commercial sUAS FAA pilot.  

fansd4d394bb Posted at 2017-2-14 19:18
I'm a Part 107 commercial pilot you should NOT contact ATC you must submit a waiver via https://www.faa.gov/uas/request_waiver/ in advance to operate in Class B,C, D, E controlled airspace, which could or could not be within 5 miles of the airport, but likely the surface to at least 400 feet WILL be controlled airspace.

Flying For Fun (Recreational or Hobby)

fansd4d394bb Posted at 2017-2-14 19:20
You should not call or radio the ATC for drone operations in controlled airspace. You must apply for a waiver in advance of said sUAS operations via the online FAA portal https://www.faa.gov/uas/request_waiver/ this is Part 107 101.  

I'm a commercial sUAS FAA pilot.

have you read the very last page, bottom part of the 107 to see what types of crafts are excluded from 107?

This is where it can be tricky. If you are flying for commercial purposes, you obviously need a 333, or a Part 107, and you must get an authorization from the FAA to fly in controlled airspace. You cannot contact the tower for permission.

If you are flying for hobby, you are to notify the ATC if you are flying within 5 miles of an airport. They cannot give you permission, but they can tell you no. If something were to happen and they gave you permission, their butts would be on the line.

The "regulations" are different for hobby and recreational, which is where I think it causes a lot of confusion. The best advise I can give is to just be mindful of everything. If you are flying for hobby in controlled airspace, do everything you can to contact ATC (if they have one), don't fly too high, and keep a constant vigil out for other aircraft.

This is also a very helpful document to read and comprehend, as it pretty clearly outlines the FAA's scope of authority with regards to regulations/laws around model aircraft flown for recreational purposes

https://www.faa.gov/uas/media/model_aircraft_spec_rule.pdf

a key phrase:

"Section 336 also prohibits the FAA from promulgating “any rule or regulation
regarding a model aircraft, or an aircraft being developed as a model aircraft”
"Congress has restricted the FAA from promulgating regulations, from the date when the statute was enacted, specifically regarding model aircraft that meet the terms of the statute"



Read, understand, and know your rights. Don't fall for fear mongering/alarmist type of direction.

on the other side of the coin, the document above also goes into great detail that shows that any/all FPV flying? Is against existing REGULATIONS.
But yet, DJI is coming out with FPV goggles. AND THEY SHOULD.

MacIak Posted at 2017-2-14 13:52
ATC is good people, no bureaucrats. They will help/advise if they can. When in doubt, contact. They might even publish a NOTAM for you and give you a timeslot when you can fly, i kid you not.
Civil grade PSR Radar will not see Mavic by the way.

How does this work in the Netherlands?
I want to make a movie on the Ginkelse Heide, but it lies on the edge of Arnhem's CTR..
But it's outside of DJI's GeoFencing.. So i'm very confused as to the how and what...

K4Unl Posted at 2017-2-15 12:22
How does this work in the Netherlands?
I want to make a movie on the Ginkelse Heide, but it lies on the edge of Arnhem's CTR..
But it's outside of DJI's GeoFencing.. So i'm very confused as to the how and what...

In Europe we love rules and obey the faceless rulemaking gods sitting behind their desks. It is for a hobby droner almost impossible to get in touch with an ATC authority (centre/tower etc). Simple fact that you cannot find a phone number (bless the USA, a REAL aviation nation).
My personal advice (read: what i would do) would be to stay clear of the airport (5 mile radius).
If you stay below say 100' you can get closer as long as geofencing allows you to but you HAVE to respect the extended centreline of the runway and definitely do not cross it at any altitude within 5 miles.
Be familiar with the area and do a preflight check including weather and increased VFR activity.
Do not go above 400' AGL.

Edit: i see you worried about Deelen? Looking at the distance you should be just fine. Just stay below 400' and clear of the A12. Dont want to brick it overhead the motorway.

Hey folks, I'm entirely new to drones, and I'm a brand new Spark owner trying to get some education on this.  I'm a bit confused after reading some rules and regs plus this thread.

As a rank beginner, I used beginner mode and all the safety precautions that I could, and launched in my backyard, keeping everything low and close for the first several flights, just getting used to the virtual controls and Spark behavior.  My house is on a hillside, within 2 mi of a local small airport.  I discovered today on https://app.airmap.io/, that the airport declares flying over 100ft is hazardous at my location...which was real a surprise, since the hill that I live on is about 100ft from bottom to top by itself.  I haven't flown over that limit but I've certainly flown close to it - and that won't happen again in my backyard now that I know more.

But from my recent reading, I found nothing that said it's ok to take-off and fly at eye-level around my yard.  I found nothing that said it's ok to even take off and take a selfie without contacting both the airport manager and the tower, as well as a local medical helipad controller that's within 3mi radius.  For that matter, I found nothing that said it's ok to even fly indoors within the legal boundary...all of this seems a bit ridiculous to me, and I can't imagine the airport wants to hear from every Spark owner that is taking a selfie.  But then if the law requires it, it should be done.

Can someone with solid understanding help clarify?