I hear in some of the reviews that Airsense is not being included at launch for the Air 2 outside of the USA,  is there any suggestion when this will be added for the rest of the world.

Yeah, i also want to know when we can order a version with that hardware....

Hi DAFlys and Sbonev.  Mavic Air 2 units equipped with AirSense ADS-B will initially only be available in North America. Currently, we are working hard on promoting the AirSense technology globally. Thanks for your attention.

I think you won’t see until later in the year, it’s a pity but I don’t see much use for it here in Ireland, if I want to know what’s flying in my area I can get an app, most small manned aircraft don’t even use it and it can’t spot drone to drone.
In UK you have many more airports military recreation etc you might use it more, I think we will see M3P later this year maybe and that will be my excuse to buy that, I just sold my zoom and bought the Air2 I just think the price is really good.

hallmark007 Posted at 4-29 01:55
I think you won’t see until later in the year, it’s a pity but I don’t see much use for it here in Ireland, if I want to know what’s flying in my area I can get an app, most small manned aircraft don’t even use it and it can’t spot drone to drone.
In UK you have many more airports military recreation etc you might use it more, I think we will see M3P later this year maybe and that will be my excuse to buy that, I just sold my zoom and bought the Air2 I just think the price is really good.

We have quite a few helicopters flying around here (Police/Ambulance mainly) and they can appear almost from nowhere so advance notice that they are coming would be really nice for me.  It just helps being a bit more responsible.

We are lucky in Europe, we pay more for a incomplete version

castormalin Posted at 4-29 02:01
We are lucky in Europe, we pay more for a incomplete version

Ahh you may blame the good old EU for the high taxes on Chinese imports for that one .

What AirSense ADS-B means?

DJI Gamora Posted at 4-29 01:50
Hi DAFlys and Sbonev.  Mavic Air 2 units equipped with AirSense ADS-B will initially only be available in North America. Currently, we are working hard on promoting the AirSense technology globally. Thanks for your attention.

This may be a silly question but if I were to ship the drone to the US and then import it to the UK. Would the AirSense feature work?

Debugger Posted at 4-29 02:31
What AirSense ADS-B means?

https://www.dji.com/it/flysafe/airsense

djiuser_rmSylfrDaVk7 Posted at 4-29 03:20
This may be a silly question but if I were to ship the drone to the US and then import it to the UK. Would the AirSense feature work?

Yes it would, but if you needed to have your drone repaired or warranties used you would be faced with the task of shipping to US and also having to pay shipping, catch 22

Debugger Posted at 4-29 02:31
What AirSense ADS-B means?

It means you can see the plane all your friends are on flying to Acapulco while you stay at home because you spent all your money on a drone lol.....

DJI Gamora Posted at 4-29 01:50
Hi DAFlys and Sbonev.  Mavic Air 2 units equipped with AirSense ADS-B will initially only be available in North America. Currently, we are working hard on promoting the AirSense technology globally. Thanks for your attention.

i think everybody can read, we understand that initially it will be only available in USA, the question is: is there any roadmap as to when the european version will have it - months, half a year, year??? also why is the EU version more expensive than the US version when lacking hardware???

sbonev Posted at 4-29 04:07
i think everybody can read, we understand that initially it will be only available in USA, the question is: is there any roadmap as to when the european version will have it - months, half a year, year??? also why is the EU version more expensive than the US version when lacking hardware???

Dji drones have always been more expensive in EU because of taxes last year this changed because of US tariffs which are now gone.

They say its due to component shortages (i guess the ADS-B receiver/SDR) so its not going to be a firmware upgrade.  It'll need a new controller or drone depending where the receiver is.

Its not THAT useful anyway.  Inside the US it'll be moderately useful as ADSB is in theory mandatory although there are thousands of GA aircraft that could conflict that still aren't so wont show.

Outside that, ADS-B is majority only commercial aircraft fitted and very few GA/Rotary/military will have it.  So most of the traffic that could conflict wont show anyway.

You *could* use an app like Fr24 if desperate but that (i) wont show non ADS-B aircraft (ii) only aircraft within range of a receiving station which for low altitude is likely only popuated areas only and (iii) the aircraft aren't on an opt-out list for tracking.

If someone really wants it you can just buy a DVB-T stick/SDR for about $20 and build your own ADS-B receiver.

There is a danger with this of people flying more recklessly/high/further because ADSB is telling them no aircraft in range when in reality there could be several that just aren't transmitting it.  Especially so outside north america.

hallmark007 Posted at 4-29 01:55
I think you won’t see until later in the year, it’s a pity but I don’t see much use for it here in Ireland, if I want to know what’s flying in my area I can get an app, most small manned aircraft don’t even use it and it can’t spot drone to drone.
In UK you have many more airports military recreation etc you might use it more, I think we will see M3P later this year maybe and that will be my excuse to buy that, I just sold my zoom and bought the Air2 I just think the price is really good.

Like you said, ADS-B sounds better than it actually is, especially outside the US.

The latest figures i can find for the US are admittedly  from Sept 2019 say only 44% of GA aircraft have ADSB fitted despite it being mandatory (although you can still fly without it with an approved plan which is what a lot are doing).

The takeup is far higher for commercial/business but these aircraft are the least likely to be buzzing around at low altitude to conflict with a drone.

From Pilot and Plane, Dec 2019:-

"None of those factors are true for most of the GA fleet, and the FAA doesn’t stipulate the fleet size anywhere in its data, leaving it up to interpretation how many light GA planes are ADS-B ready. But if one uses the ballpark figure of 200,000 GA planes operating in the United States, that makes the ADS-B compliance rate around 50%, counting business aircraft. Remove bizav from the equation and you’re left with a 40 percent compliance rate."

Outside North America where ADS-B isnt "mandatory" the takeup rate for GA/business is far lower again so its even less useful.

App are available but have even more limitations such as where you fly needing to be in a coverage zone and the fact any company or owner can remove their aircraft or fleet from displaying on tracking.

This is a curious omission.

Renato61 Posted at 4-29 03:24
https://www.dji.com/it/flysafe/airsense

Thanks a lot

gnirtS Posted at 4-29 04:54
They say its due to component shortages (i guess the ADS-B receiver/SDR) so its not going to be a firmware upgrade.  It'll need a new controller or drone depending where the receiver is.

Its not THAT useful anyway.  Inside the US it'll be moderately useful as ADSB is in theory mandatory although there are thousands of GA aircraft that could conflict that still aren't so wont show.

Most of the new radios that smaller aircraft use are now coming with ADSB transmitters built in,  a friend of mine flys small aircraft and just had to upgrade the radio due to a frequency change happening.   You can also use an SDR radio and free software to receive ADSB in the UK and the air space is quite busy with it in use.

gnirtS Posted at 4-29 05:04
Like you said, ADS-B sounds better than it actually is, especially outside the US.

The latest figures i can find for the US are admittedly  from Sept 2019 say only 44% of GA aircraft have ADSB fitted despite it being mandatory (although you can still fly without it with an approved plan which is what a lot are doing).

I do realize that in some countries it may be of more benefit, here in Ireland apart from novelty of it it’s really of no use to me and for regulation it’s not needed but remote I’d is and drone is equipped , I think if it ever reaches the stage that it can track drone to drone it might be of interest, I also think we might see an M3P sometime this year and I’m sure that will have it, so trying to be a realist but maybe selfish, I do like the spec of the MA2 particularly for travel so I will be getting it.

Part of me thinks releasing a crippled M2A in Europe is purely because its not EASA certified so will be legacy (so huge restrictions in 2 years or so) anyway. Quite simply this is a launch designed to target the US market.

Generally the Air 1 was a test bed for some features for the M2 and this is likely the same.

I cant see them releasing a full, world wide top end drone until the EASA certification is finalised and complete.

Drone to drone would be useful for sure.  If i want ADS-B i'll plug a DVB-T stick into my phone or tablet (or RaPi) and build my own for near no money. But its simply not useful to me as its not going to show the majority of traffic likely to conflict with a drone.

Other than America - ADSB really isnt that widespread outside commercial airlines and even IN the USA it appears 50% of GA isnt equipped.

gnirtS Posted at 4-29 06:49
Part of me thinks releasing a crippled M2A in Europe is purely because its not EASA certified so will be legacy (so huge restrictions in 2 years or so) anyway. Quite simply this is a launch designed to target the US market.

Generally the Air 1 was a test bed for some features for the M2 and this is likely the same.

Almost no features from Mavic Air moved to M2, I think APAS apart from the usual AT2 but AT has been around since P4 just like OA Quickshots from spark and Mavic 1 Orignal MA1 was packed with features M2P was devoid thankfully of features in fact there was uproar regarding some features left out of M2P, my belief is MA2 is packed with features for those not to serious about professional stuff but enough to keep them interested.

I do agree it was to keep US market sweet, but with 77% of the market share they haven’t been hit hard by any other drone companies and I think a lot thinking of getting Evo or waiting for skydio will be sucked back in to dji, price is way to good, I haven’t seen a better value drone on the market in the last 5 years .

APAS, Active track, the hardware data bus, some of the flight modes, some of the image processing and SOCs.  There was a LOT tested on the MA that made the M2.

DJI still have the luxury of there being zero viable competition and thats not changing any time soon.

I suspect MA2 is an interim release designed for the US, In 3-4 months will get MA2 with ADSB but also, critically CE certification (but functionally and physically identical) then next year an M3 type device.

Ulimately they need to release drones but its a terrible time to release a drone in Europe.

hallmark007 Posted at 4-29 02:06
Ahh you may blame the good old EU for the high taxes on Chinese imports for that one .

Which high taxes are you refering to?
The Tax depends on the type of drone, and if it is a toy, (video)camera or helicopter.
Depending on that the tax differs between 4,1% and 7%.
I don´t think that this is explaining the price difference between US$ and Euro?
799 USD = 736,56€
736,56€ * 1,07 = 788,12€
Price in the german store for the Mavic Air2 = 849€ = a differnce of 60€
That I can not explain by the EU import taxes, do you?

Ulli01 Posted at 4-29 08:35
Which high taxes are you refering to?
The Tax depends on the type of drone, and if it is a toy, (video)camera or helicopter.
Depending on that the tax differs between 4,1% and 7%.

I think you will find that drones in Europe have always been more expensive and this has been consistent for the last 5 years, how dji price their drones according to currency fluctuation I don’t know but I’m certain it’s a big factor, while the euro might be strong or weak today dji obviously have to make allowances when they decide to introduce their drone to market, I’m not fully qualified to know all tax laws and trade agreements China have with Europe and US, but I can tell you whatever the difference in price between Europe and US dji have always said this was a tax cost coming from Europe.

The consistency of this was shown over the last 12/16 months when the US added extra tariffs to Chinese imports when we seen drones like M2 being cheaper in Europe than US, I’m also certain that import taxes in Europe are not exactly the same as US import taxes as you are implying .

gnirtS Posted at 4-29 07:29
APAS, Active track, the hardware data bus, some of the flight modes, some of the image processing and SOCs.  There was a LOT tested on the MA that made the M2.

DJI still have the luxury of there being zero viable competition and thats not changing any time soon.

Its a terrible time globally to release new products.  But a delay for EU would allow them to know better what the regulations are going to be, and working with movements at the moment for non essential things is pretty much shut down.

gnirtS Posted at 4-29 07:29
APAS, Active track, the hardware data bus, some of the flight modes, some of the image processing and SOCs.  There was a LOT tested on the MA that made the M2.

DJI still have the luxury of there being zero viable competition and thats not changing any time soon.

I think you're spot on Gnirt.  
No ADS-B
No CE Certification.

So whilst the specs sound great, the MA2 is missing a fundamental aircraft safety module element that DJI promised would be on all >250g drones from 2020 onwards, and is also missing certification that will allow it to be used in most places after the new EASA regs come into force throughout Europe including the UK.  This will have a massive impact on usability as the CAA have made it clear existing drones cannot be retrospectively certified even if they meet all the criteria.

Feeling a tad shafted....  
Is ADS-B is actually required on new drones in the USA in the future? (ie will I be able to fly my MA2 in the USA if I visit?)

Ian

gnirtS Posted at 4-29 07:29
APAS, Active track, the hardware data bus, some of the flight modes, some of the image processing and SOCs.  There was a LOT tested on the MA that made the M2.

DJI still have the luxury of there being zero viable competition and thats not changing any time soon.

Active track has been on dji drones for donkeys years so is well tested it was active track 2 but we all know how it works, I suppose same could be said od AT1 it was trialed on MP1 for spark, I think you’re stretching it with that, what flight modes, only thing I can think of is quickshots but these had already been tested on spark and MP1, tapfly, AT etc all came from P4.

Mavic Air was designed more as an upgrade to the spark and for a different market than pro users, but like all dji drones the hope that many would eventually upgrade to pro series.
Drones like spark, mini, Air all outsell the pro models and have their own separate market and of course from phantom 1 there is a natural progression of technology, but I’m certain dji are not putting drones out there as guinea drones particularly if those drones are out selling what you imagine are their flagships.

Ian in London Posted at 4-30 00:01
I think you're spot on Gnirt.  
No ADS-B
No CE Certification.

I’m sure ADSB is not a requirement for new EASA rules not sure of CAA, I attended a meeting last week regarding new EASA rules and it looks like they will now be put off until first date December 2020 and the two year rule for certification will come in from new date, but it’s now most likely this won’t happen until 2021 at which time it looks like CAA will be pulling up sticks from EASA so the CE certification will not matter anymore.

I do agree that dji pulled a fast one in not announcing this and also it very much looks like all their influencers failed miserably to let anyone know (very shady)
Regarding US FAA have already said they won’t be needing or using ADSB, it is not used by most light weight Manned Aircraft in US Europe or UK.

I also believe it will almost never be used, and I don’t think you would be allowed without SOP from CAA to fly above legal height or in NFZ, so no change just because you have ADSB, so basically it becomes a toy that will be used by the plane spotters and they already use apps for the same thing.

I do think we will see new M3P late this year and that will most likely have it, or wait until the next tranche of MA2 come along with Airsense.

hallmark007 Posted at 4-30 01:29
I’m sure ADSB is not a requirement for new EASA rules not sure of CAA, I attended a meeting last week regarding new EASA rules and it looks like they will now be put off until first date December 2020 and the two year rule for certification will come in from new date, but it’s now most likely this won’t happen until 2021 at which time it looks like CAA will be pulling up sticks from EASA so the CE certification will not matter anymore.

I do agree that dji pulled a fast one in not announcing this and also it very much looks like all their influencers failed miserably to let anyone know (very shady)

Good points on the ADSB, but the CAA are still pretty clear that CE certification won't be retrospective and legacy drones will be forced to fly in A3 open category  This means 150m from any residential, commercial or recreational area and with no one uninvolved in the area.  
It doesn't seem to make it clear if that's also a 150m horizontal distance from people or just under the flight area.... But either way, in 2 years the places you can fly will be greatly restricted for this model becuase of no CE cert....  

Ian in London Posted at 4-30 02:36
Good points on the ADSB, but the CAA are still pretty clear that CE certification won't be retrospective and legacy drones will be forced to fly in A3 open category  This means 150m from any residential, commercial or recreational area and with no one uninvolved in the area.  
It doesn't seem to make it clear if that's also a 150m horizontal distance from people or just under the flight area.... But either way, in 2 years the places you can fly will be greatly restricted for this model becuase of no CE cert....

Yeah as I said I haven’t been keeping an eye on the CAA because it looked initially it would be superimposed by EASA, also UK is packed with airports big and small military lots of Helicopters so in UK ADSB would obviously be of more use than here in Rep of Ireland.

Don’t get me wrong I think we were all played by dji here, which is very underhanded, for me it makes very little difference but I can see others believe they were getting it were paying for it but dji were extremely sly in making sure it was not in any of there propaganda leaks or announcements.
And obviously it will have effect on UK drone flying.

hallmark007 Posted at 4-29 08:55
I think you will find that drones in Europe have always been more expensive and this has been consistent for the last 5 years, how dji price their drones according to currency fluctuation I don’t know but I’m certain it’s a big factor, while the euro might be strong or weak today dji obviously have to make allowances when they decide to introduce their drone to market, I’m not fully qualified to know all tax laws and trade agreements China have with Europe and US, but I can tell you whatever the difference in price between Europe and US dji have always said this was a tax cost coming from Europe.

The consistency of this was shown over the last 12/16 months when the US added extra tariffs to Chinese imports when we seen drones like M2 being cheaper in Europe than US, I’m also certain that import taxes in Europe are not exactly the same as US import taxes as you are implying .

It might be, that DJI is telling the people that the reason for the higher price in Europe results in higher taxes, but if you have a look in the numbers, it reveals that this is just not true.

The regular taxes in the major markets are comparable. US has now the additional tariffs, as far as I know also still in force for that kind of product, and therefore I would expect the price much higher in US than in Europe.
But it is not, even with the tariffs!
So we get a product with less equipment, and, as far as I know at this time, even without the ID-System required in Europe for a drone like the Air2 starting out of January 21, for a remarkable higher price!

Ulli01 Posted at 4-30 03:49
It might be, that DJI is telling the people that the reason for the higher price in Europe results in higher taxes, but if you have a look in the numbers, it reveals that this is just not true.

The regular taxes in the major markets are comparable. US has now the additional tariffs, as far as I know also still in force for that kind of product, and therefore I would expect the price much higher in US than in Europe.

It’s something you probably need dji to answer, all I can tell you is when tariffs were abound all dji products had increased in price many above EU price this has changed now that tariffs have been sorted out from what I know.

djiuser_rmSylfrDaVk7 Posted at 4-29 03:20
This may be a silly question but if I were to ship the drone to the US and then import it to the UK. Would the AirSense feature work?

Hey, I think airsense is based on global positioning, so it can be applied across regions

So, what is the estimated delivery time of the untruncated version in Europe ?

stephjant Posted at 4-30 09:50
You do realise this would result in you having to pay 20% import tax duties on top of shipping costs

Not if you get a friend to buy it and send it to you as a gift

bluebubble Posted at 4-30 05:59
Hey, I think airsense is based on global positioning, so it can be applied across regions

It's a hardware module that needs to be fitted, so if your Air 2 ships without it, you're never going to get it....

castormalin Posted at 4-30 07:35
So, what is the estimated delivery time of the untruncated version in Europe ?

Still waiting to hear an answer for that.

DAFlys Posted at 5-1 01:06
Still waiting to hear an answer for that.

yep me too, it appears they don't know and probably it won't be soon. The other annoying thing is how you can be sure if the model you order has it, as this is not mentioned anywhere in the specs. i think i saw at one place the ads-b was only mentioned on the box, but there is no way you can know what does the box look like if ordering online, and it will be months before this is available physically in shops.

sbonev Posted at 5-1 01:13
yep me too, it appears they don't know and probably it won't be soon. The other annoying thing is how you can be sure if the model you order has it, as this is not mentioned anywhere in the specs. i think i saw at one place the ads-b was only mentioned on the box, but there is no way you can know what does the box look like if ordering online, and it will be months before this is available physically in shops.

The other issue is that it doesn't have a classification for the EU, so it will fall into the legacy category soon limiting where it can be used.