Hi all.

I've had my first drone now for about a month, and touch wood, had no problems with collisions, lost signals etc. Needless to say, I'm loving it.

As I understand it, you have to be able to see your drone at all times during flight. Yet on so many clips and pictures I see, even on tutorials and blogs, it's so obvious the drone couldn't  be seen from the controller.. As I'm getting more confident, I want to take shots from places I can't reach, but am limited by the rules as I understand them.

Why is the drone built with such distance and height capabilities anyway, if they can't be used legally?

Are all those shots I've seen from illegal flights, or am I misunderstanding the rules?

Keep safe everyone

In the US as a hobbyist flyer you have to have VLOS...yes you are seeing a lot of illegal flights.

Rustic17 Posted at 7-13 09:08
In the US as a hobbyist flyer you have to have VLOS...yes you are seeing a lot of illegal flights.

Thanx for the reply Rustic17. I’m in the UK but understand it to be the same. So why build the drone with such distance and height capabilities?

There is a way you can have an observer co-located with the pilot and equipped with binoculars which would give you more range. Still not the range some fly to.  Maybe it’s a marketing thing.  Maybe it’s for those who don’t care to follow rules.

Jezbot Posted at 7-13 09:21
Thanx for the reply Rustic17. I’m in the UK but understand it to be the same. So why build the drone with such distance and height capabilities?

Because if you have a PfCO you can apply for special permission from the CAA to fly the drone beyond the rules of the drone code. Why are cars allowed to drive at 200mph when the legal speed limit on a motorway is 70mph?

Also if you take off from the bottom of a 200m hill and set your altitude to 250mAGL in the app the drone would still only be 50mAGL over the top of the hill despite the app showing an altitude double the legal limit. The altitude reading is based on the home point (from where the drone takes off) and not the surface of the earth below the drone in flight.

I think you will find that almost everyone who has flown a drone has done so beyond VLOS at some time.

Rustic17 Posted at 7-13 09:35
There is a way you can have an observer co-located with the pilot and equipped with binoculars which would give you more range. Still not the range some fly to.  Maybe it’s a marketing thing.  Maybe it’s for those who don’t care to follow rules.

Not in the UK - VLOS must be unaided when flying in line with the drone code.

A J Posted at 7-13 10:26
Not in the UK - VLOS must be unaided when flying in line with the drone code.

[view_image]

I forgot about that...although it doesn’t matter as I always fly VLOS when I’m in Europe.

Jezbot Posted at 7-13 09:21
Thanx for the reply Rustic17. I’m in the UK but understand it to be the same. So why build the drone with such distance and height capabilities?

When I’m in a completely uninhabited area I don’t worry about VLOS....

Rustic17 Posted at 7-13 10:34
When I’m in a completely uninhabited area I don’t worry about VLOS....[view_image]

Same here!

A lot of the video examples we see online are flaunting more than just the VLOS rules in their jurisdictions but that’s not really helping the OP.

In Ireland, Europe and I’m guessing the UK the distance limits probably kick in before you loose visual contact. We’re limited to 300m range with unaided visual contact. You can use observers though and if you’re smart about deploying them then you can cover quite a distance. If you have only one observer for instance, have them locate about 500m down track of your planned path. Make sure your in constant contact and get them confirm the see the drone themselves before it reaches you limits. In this example when the drone is 300m away from you it’s 200m away from them. You can then continue over them and out to their 300m limit.  It’s now 800m away but you still have VLOS via the observer. If they spot any problems they can instruct you accordingly. Loss of voice contact or them loosing visual with the aircraft should prompt a manual RTH on your part.  

Smashey1 Posted at 7-13 10:54
A lot of the video examples we see online are flaunting more than just the VLOS rules in their jurisdictions but that’s not really helping the OP.

In Ireland, Europe and I’m guessing the UK the distance limits probably kick in before you loose visual contact. We’re limited to 300m range with unaided visual contact. You can use observers though and if you’re smart about deploying them then you can cover quite a distance. If you have only one observer for instance, have them locate about 500m down track of your planned path. Make sure your in constant contact and get them confirm the see the drone themselves before it reaches you limits. In this example when the drone is 300m away from you it’s 200m away from them. You can then continue over them and out to their 300m limit.  It’s now 800m away but you still have VLOS via the observer. If they spot any problems they can instruct you accordingly. Loss of voice contact or them loosing visual with the aircraft should prompt a manual RTH on your part.

VLOS up to 500m in the UK - also note my reply to the OP regarding the UK drone code - the words 'You and yours' are stated regarding VLOS - not your mate half a KM away...

illegal as in the millions of videos showing cars and motorcycles apparently exceeding the speed limit?  why are you singling out drones?  that's not the "problem."

in order to be illegal, a law must be broken.  could someone please provide a link to the law that says it is illegal to post a video of a drone flight bvlos?

You asked this question:  "Why is the drone built with such distance and height capabilities anyway, if they can't be used legally?"

I'm curious, do you ask the same question of other objects you own?  

I'm not sure what vehicle you own (if any), but I would venture to guess that even if you bought the cheapest vehicle on the market, it can vastly exceed any sort of speed limits set by your local governments.  

I could go on with other products that are every day products in every day life that have a legal and normal usage, but that can also be used in dangerous or illegal ways.

It is up to the user of a product to ensure they are using it within the regulations of their local authorities.  

Thanks for all the replies everyone

Hello there Jezbot. Thank you for reaching out and for the inquiry. Being able to actually see your drone,  without the use of any visual aids, binoculars is considered as Visual Line of Sight ( VLOS ). If you can not longer see the said drone in flight, that is simply beyond your VLOS. I would highly recommend to follow the rules and regulations when flying your DJI Drones to avoid an untoward incidents. Thank you and have a safe flight always.  

Most of the illegal BVLOS flights you've seen you probably didn't see the pilot doing it in the video, making it very hard to be prosecuted.   The same way when you see only the speedo and road of a car speeding on YouTube.

Jezbot Posted at 7-13 15:34
Thanks for all the replies everyone

You're welcome

Jezbot Posted at 7-13 15:34
Thanks for all the replies everyone

You're welcome

A J Posted at 7-13 10:59
VLOS up to 500m in the UK - also note my reply to the OP regarding the UK drone code - the words 'You and yours' are stated regarding VLOS - not your mate half a KM away...

Thanks AJ
I stand corrected

With my Firehouse Arc's, my VLOS at night is pretty far.  Even on cloudy days or sunrise/sunset flights I get some good extended VLOS.  Using different colors I can even "pass" the orientation requirement as well.  During a bright, sunny day, I'm not sure I get that much more distance, but maybe a little.

Smashey1 Posted at 7-14 07:18
Thanks AJ
I stand corrected

Only in the UK

"Why is the drone built with such distance and height capabilities anyway, if they can't be used legally?"

In reagrds to "capabilites"...

Imagine it is to insure reliable flight and control when drone is kept within VLOS.  
Be very difficult and risky to design a drone to where it is only capable of flying VLOS height and distance away.  Plus, people's vision varies from Eagle-eyed to Mr. Magoo.  
Then there is issue of transiet radio interference, like trees or spurious radio transmissions.


In regards to limits...
Most people can keep a Mavic Pro sized drone in VLOS when it comes to Max altitude of 400-feet.
Can not say same about distance with VLOS.  But user can set a distance limit, which I do.

Smashey1 Posted at 7-13 10:54
A lot of the video examples we see online are flaunting more than just the VLOS rules in their jurisdictions but that’s not really helping the OP.

In Ireland, Europe and I’m guessing the UK the distance limits probably kick in before you loose visual contact. We’re limited to 300m range with unaided visual contact. You can use observers though and if you’re smart about deploying them then you can cover quite a distance. If you have only one observer for instance, have them locate about 500m down track of your planned path. Make sure your in constant contact and get them confirm the see the drone themselves before it reaches you limits. In this example when the drone is 300m away from you it’s 200m away from them. You can then continue over them and out to their 300m limit.  It’s now 800m away but you still have VLOS via the observer. If they spot any problems they can instruct you accordingly. Loss of voice contact or them loosing visual with the aircraft should prompt a manual RTH on your part.

Remember to do what you’re saying you must be in direct contact with spotter, using phone or radio is not considered direct contact, so how far does the spotter need to be for you to hear him clearly.
This is the rule for flying in Ireland , rules will change when EASA bring new rules in on January 1st so distance will increase unless IAA decide to keep old distance rule. They have said they will operate under the auspices of EASA.

I can still see my Mini even 2 miles away....and that's what I will say in court ;-)

My old American muscle car can do 160 MPH. They must have designed it for export to the German market.

Jezbot Posted at 7-13 09:21
Thanx for the reply Rustic17. I’m in the UK but understand it to be the same. So why build the drone with such distance and height capabilities?

" So why build the drone with such distance and height capabilities? "

IMHO,  as the mfg....forward thinking would be to build your device to stay ahead of the governing laws.  Eventually the laws and restrictions may catchup to our 3 to 6 mile flying drones.....but in the mean time be confident that your drone should maintain a solid signal easily out to a mile.

As an RPIC in commercial use,  I am never more than a few hundred yards from my AC.  Although I was at 8700ft distance in a S.A.R. operation a few months ago......signal was solid!!

Randy
Aerial Traffic

Not every country has drone laws that require VLOS, also yes most people are technically flying them illegally. However, if you are below air traffic altitude and are not over people then its kind of a judgement call. I look at it as the same as speeding provided those 2 things are met, so that it wont endanger anyone. Just be smart and use common sense and you will be fine.

just my opinion that's all

Rustic17 Posted at 2020-7-13 09:35
There is a way you can have an observer co-located with the pilot and equipped with binoculars which would give you more range. Still not the range some fly to.  Maybe it’s a marketing thing.  Maybe it’s for those who don’t care to follow rules.

You are NOT allowed to have the drone in sight with any visual aids other then prescription glasses or contact lenses. Whoever told you this is wrong