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Certification of DJI drones in the EU?
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vg1
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Is anything known about the certification of DJI drones in terms of the new regulations in the European Union that were introduced on January 1, 2021? Due to the weight of the AIR 2, it is now virtually impossible to fly legally (over 500g). After obtaining a certificate in class C1 (up to 900g), you will be able to fly it with the qualification in subcategory A1 (simple online exam). Otherwise, until you get AIR 2 certification, you must have the A2 subcategory, which costs a lot, is much more difficult to obtain and very time-consuming.
1-9 10:47
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MySky
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It is even more worse.
As i checked the new app for flight restriction zones (Droniq) from the German aviation authorities, i was shocked how heavily the restricted areas have been extended.
The most areas i was usually flying or interested in, it is now even not allowed to fly the Mini 2 nor with the big expensiv license.
1-9 13:45
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DAFlys
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Part of the issue is that the EU doesn't yet have a process to get classification, and they have already said that they will not allow retrospective certification.   For existing drones the only way to get classification is through a remanufacture process, which again is not available yet.  And will no doubt cost some money as youd have to send the drone back to the manufacturer for some work to be done.
1-10 00:46
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virtual
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Very unclear at the moment. There was a statement from DJI moderator that MA2 will be certified as soon as possible plus rumors that there will be possible to certified retrospectively. But it seems that rules are not finished yet so no certification can be done.
I said before - very bad work on implementation of these new rules!
DAFlys: MA2 is equiped with all requested features like remote ID, OA sensors, GPS NFZ restriction ect. AFAIK only tripod mode speed is higher than bureaucratic requirement (sounds funny) which cen be changed by sw. upgrade.
1-10 02:06
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Michii
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At the moment it is pretty clear. According to regulation 2019/947 Article 22 there is a transitional period of two years for existing UAS.

https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal- ... p;qid=1610274284534

After that time no manifacturer will ever modify an existing drone. They'll have their new drones ready with certification.
1-10 02:35
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BR0D4CZ
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Yesterday I’ve pass A2 exam. So easy compare to uavo vlos exams we have to pass in Poland to fly commercially.
I don’t get what is time consuming in a2 exam, basic knowledge about drones and meteorology.
1-10 05:41
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vg1
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I wonder who will buy the Air 2 and others now, except the Mavic Mini, if it is still without certification. The scope of certification is already published along with EU regulations, and EU backward certification has also been provided for current drones. Now everything is on the side of DJI if they feel like it.

Can someone from DJI say something about it? Someone reading the posts?
1-10 11:09
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MySky
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vg1 Posted at 1-10 11:09
I wonder who will buy the Air 2 and others now, except the Mavic Mini, if it is still without certification. The scope of certification is already published along with EU regulations, and EU backward certification has also been provided for current drones. Now everything is on the side of DJI if they feel like it.

Can someone from DJI say something about it? Someone reading the posts?

All current drones are classified as lagacy drones in A3, even the Mini and Mini 2 are lagacy drones unless  they will be sold with the C1 sticker by DJI. Both Minis do have lower restrictions but they are legacy drones and have to be registered due to it's onboard camera.
And until DJI will not get an agreement with the EASA for a reverse certification for the Mini, Mini 2 and the MA2, which already will BTW fit the A1/C1 classification requirements, the only conclusion for me now is not to buy any drone anymore from DJI or any other manufacturer until there is a classification sticker on the drones.

1-10 11:42
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Montfrooij
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So far there is no definite answer.
I have read there is NO way get it done without releasing a new version of the product.
But also there are rumor about retrospective classification. Not sure what is true

It was the reason why I sold my MP.
I did not want to be restrained.
1-11 00:08
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Montfrooij
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MySky Posted at 1-10 11:42
All current drones are classified as lagacy drones in A3, even the Mini and Mini 2 are lagacy drones unless  they will be sold with the C1 sticker by DJI. Both Minis do have lower restrictions but they are legacy drones and have to be registered due to it's onboard camera.
And until DJI will not get an agreement with the EASA for a reverse certification for the Mini, Mini 2 and the MA2, which already will BTW fit the A1/C1 classification requirements, the only conclusion for me now is not to buy any drone anymore from DJI or any other manufacturer until there is a classification sticker on the drones.

Exactly.
There are tons of people that don't care (hence the reason for more strict rules....)
But it is my reason to sell the MP and buy a M2
1-11 00:09
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NBW
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MySky Posted at 1-10 11:42
All current drones are classified as lagacy drones in A3, even the Mini and Mini 2 are lagacy drones unless  they will be sold with the C1 sticker by DJI. Both Minis do have lower restrictions but they are legacy drones and have to be registered due to it's onboard camera.
And until DJI will not get an agreement with the EASA for a reverse certification for the Mini, Mini 2 and the MA2, which already will BTW fit the A1/C1 classification requirements, the only conclusion for me now is not to buy any drone anymore from DJI or any other manufacturer until there is a classification sticker on the drones.

I agree. I started my research to extend my range of filming techniques for my YouTube channel and saw drones as the way to go. I was prepared to buy more than one drone (probably Mini 2 and M2Pro or MA2) but my research showed that I would be wasting my money. I am happy to pay for whatever courses I need but I must have drones that are certified.

If it is the EU's failure then I have great sympathy for DJI as they really are the leading company in the world as far as I am concerned. The sooner we get an update and some firm planning dates the better.

Peter
1-11 03:37
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vg1
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Montfrooij Posted at 1-11 00:08
But also there are rumor about retrospective classification. Not sure what is true

1-11 12:37
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vg1
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1-11 12:44
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BaynhamPhoto
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It's not really retrospective classification it's classification as a new model as change via manufacturer or official support center. The process is under discussion DJI state the process & the class requirements are still yet to be agreed. DJI state they will not mark aircraft either new or current until this changes.

The bottom line is if you want to fly A2 with MA2/MP line you need to gain A2CofC cost of which appears to vary across the EU & in the UK.  If you decide not take the A2 course you are restricted to A3 staying 150m away from residential, industrial and recreational areas.

I agree the current transitional for the Air2 is poor but that's the current regs in force both EASA & CAA in UK.

Until DJI confirm class specs are agreed their aircraft remain legacy at this time with transitional regs in force. This is the response from DJI on the MA2

_20210108_183047.JPG
1-11 13:25
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Mike Lammers
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I've passed the A2 exam, it is really not that hard.
1-11 13:35
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Montfrooij
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I have seen that, but that is not confirmed so far.
1-11 23:33
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djiuser_8sCBbhbiivQ6
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Mike Lammers Posted at 1-11 13:35
I've passed the A2 exam, it is really not that hard.

... it's only 100 m less distance from people. A1 gives you more ;)
1-12 10:53
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pagi_pl
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djiuser_8sCBbhbiivQ6 Posted at 1-12 10:53
... it's only 100 m less distance from people. A1 gives you more ;)

sure. The alternative is to pass the exam for Specific Category + statment of operation in accordance with the standard scenario.
1-12 12:57
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Mike Lammers
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djiuser_8sCBbhbiivQ6 Posted at 1-12 10:53
... it's only 100 m less distance from people. A1 gives you more ;)

Also got A1/A3 :-)
But MA2 is an A2 drone..
1-13 05:23
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MySky
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Mike Lammers Posted at 1-13 05:23
Also got A1/A3 :-)
But MA2 is an A2 drone..

Nope, the MA2 sold 'til now is categorised as lagacy in A3 until it will be ofiicially categorised some day in A1/C1 as it will already fit the required specs.
And hopfully it will be also categorised retrospectively.
The only chance meenwhile to operate in A2 will be to do CofC.
1-13 08:54
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djiuser_8sCBbhbiivQ6
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A good solution would be to launch a series of batteries with a reduced weight ( - 70 grams)
1-14 02:25
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virtual
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What a shame how much energy (of drone owners and manufactures) is wasted to conform stupid bureaucratic rues*!

*Note that machine of MA2 size and weight will be in A1 (when certified) so why is now virtually banned (forced to fly far from people)? I don't believe that there would be a "carnage" if the rules for transition period  were softer (A1 similar) for drones under 1kg.
1-15 03:12
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vg1
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Is there any official DJI position on the certification of current drones? Is it like a road map?
1-17 09:06
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rocazac
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I got my MA2 in December, I have the possibility to return it back until 1st of February, and I really do not know what to do, shall I return it or shall I hope the MA2 will get the certification? hmm
1-19 04:30
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vg1
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rocazac Posted at 1-19 04:30
I got my MA2 in December, I have the possibility to return it back until 1st of February, and I really do not know what to do, shall I return it or shall I hope the MA2 will get the certification? hmm

If you have the possibility to return it, then you have got rid of the problem that MA2 is currently. If DJI would like to certify some drones, then I would consider whether it is worth buying something from them. Currently, it is not worth buying anything.
1-19 12:00
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MySky
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vg1 Posted at 1-19 12:00
If you have the possibility to return it, then you have got rid of the problem that MA2 is currently. If DJI would like to certify some drones, then I would consider whether it is worth buying something from them. Currently, it is not worth buying anything.

100% signed.
1-19 13:50
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virtual
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vg1 Posted at 1-19 12:00
If you have the possibility to return it, then you have got rid of the problem that MA2 is currently. If DJI would like to certify some drones, then I would consider whether it is worth buying something from them. Currently, it is not worth buying anything.

got rid of the problem that MA2 is currently

BTH I don't think it is real problem (at the moment in our country) if You avoid flying in city centre and over crowds of people as a registered operator with A1 online training.
1-20 02:43
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WebParrot
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Has any European drone company (like Parrot with the Anafi?) addressed your issue?   There are a number of legacy commercial aircraft that will be required to comply.  It would seem to all producers benefit to resolve as the cost of replacing would br a huge capitol investment.  I’m optimistic that true trickle down tech will eventually resolve.
1-20 09:21
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Mike Lammers Posted at 1-11 13:35
I've passed the A2 exam, it is really not that hard.

I passed A1/A3 in Cyprus but where did you pass A2?
1-20 13:18
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Andy Uk
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MySky Posted at 1-10 11:42
All current drones are classified as lagacy drones in A3, even the Mini and Mini 2 are lagacy drones unless  they will be sold with the C1 sticker by DJI. Both Minis do have lower restrictions but they are legacy drones and have to be registered due to it's onboard camera.
And until DJI will not get an agreement with the EASA for a reverse certification for the Mini, Mini 2 and the MA2, which already will BTW fit the A1/C1 classification requirements, the only conclusion for me now is not to buy any drone anymore from DJI or any other manufacturer until there is a classification sticker on the drones.

The Mini and mini 2 remain A1 legacy beyond Dec 2022.  The transition peirod only applies to drones over 250g.
1-21 08:01
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Andy Uk
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virtual Posted at 1-15 03:12
What a shame how much energy (of drone owners and manufactures) is wasted to conform stupid bureaucratic rues*!

*Note that machine of MA2 size and weight will be in A1 (when certified) so why is now virtually banned (forced to fly far from people)? I don't believe that there would be a "carnage" if the rules for transition period  were softer (A1 similar) for drones under 1kg.

With A2CoC the MA2 can fly A2, in congested areas 50m from univolved people.  The test in the Uk is all online and really quite basic.  Some of our RAEs are doing the A2CoC for £49
1-21 08:03
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WebParrot
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virtual Posted at 1-15 03:12
What a shame how much energy (of drone owners and manufactures) is wasted to conform stupid bureaucratic rues*!

*Note that machine of MA2 size and weight will be in A1 (when certified) so why is now virtually banned (forced to fly far from people)? I don't believe that there would be a "carnage" if the rules for transition period  were softer (A1 similar) for drones under 1kg.

Those rules that you consider stupid and bureaucratic are a result of the need to improve aircraft and public safety.  Setting some reasonable standards that apply to everyone only makes sense as ANY technology or product becomes popular.  Just learn the rules, follow the rules, and if you don't like them, don't play the "game."
1-21 10:59
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djiuser_8sCBbhbiivQ6
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True, but the problem is that the  JJRC 17 for example... is treated in the same way as the Mavic Air 2 under the provisional regulations. The bureaucrats have not done a proper risk assessment!
1-21 13:51
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virtual
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WebParrot Posted at 1-21 10:59
Those rules that you consider stupid and bureaucratic are a result of the need to improve aircraft and public safety.  Setting some reasonable standards that apply to everyone only makes sense as ANY technology or product becomes popular.  Just learn the rules, follow the rules, and if you don't like them, don't play the "game."

You can't be serious! We had very reasonable rules with no incidents and as a long time RC modeller I know them very well.
What "need to improve" condemned poor MA2 to fly only far from people that can not be in european populated space truly accomplished? Do You know that You can not fly over protected natural area that is almost every small creek or river bank? "Need to improve public safety" was changed for word ban with no reason. These new rules were made by uninformed dilettantes!
1-22 02:25
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WebParrot
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virtual Posted at 1-22 02:25
You can't be serious! We had very reasonable rules with no incidents and as a long time RC modeller I know them very well.
What "need to improve" condemned poor MA2 to fly only far from people that can not be in european populated space truly accomplished? Do You know that You can not fly over protected natural area that is almost every small creek or river bank? "Need to improve public safety" was changed for word ban with no reason. These new rules were made by uninformed dilettantes!

Why can't I be 'serious'?  :-)   Of course I am serious.
I don't believe you can "condemn" an aircraft, btw.  Condemnation is reserved for humans.
Perhaps something is lost in translation.
In the US we have the same protections for "protected natural area(s)" and in many instances it included manned aircraft.  Perhaps your issue is with the areas that are described as 'natural areas' rather than the prohibitions associated with the regulations.
Improving public safety is an obvious positive objective.  Consider the massive intrusion of traffic control lights at intersections and the benefit to public safety.  Would you prefer that only intersections with documented injuries be required to install traffic lights.  Perhaps only the death of a child in front of a schoolhouse crossing would be required to have a marked pedestrian crossing.  On the highway we are required to stop our cars for a stopped school bus..... any school bus.  Not just a school bus that has previously been involved in an injured child.
If you don't like the rules that you claim were "made by uninformed dilettantes".. you should make your efforts and facts known to those persons... inform them of the facts.
1-22 06:58
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vg1
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The rules should be, but this topic is about DJI doing nothing to adapt its drones to the new rules.
1-22 11:28
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WebParrot
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vg1 Posted at 1-22 11:28
The rules should be, but this topic is about DJI doing nothing to adapt its drones to the new rules.

I believe your issue is with  @virtual's post.  It was them that raised the rules as a topic, mine was simply to reply and correct his presumptions :-)

And, FWIW, I truly don't know what to expect of a manufacturer whose product no longer complies with ever-changing, sometimes unclear, most times different between regions, states and countries.

In my part of the world, the flight rules change from state to state, park to park.

FWIW ... I've been flying since the only options were to be tethered to the aircraft with two wires/strings and to fly in circles.  There were rules then, too. Many of which were mitigated by .... joining a club (which seemed to be the only way to learn about rules for flying).  I also fly stunt kites, and depending on the beach, or field, my flights are also regulated.  When I fly (kites) at the university football fields I get warned by the uni-cops that I'm, too close to a hell-pad.  I argue that my lines are only 100ft long and they retort that the rules apply to "all kites."  
1-22 12:02
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WebParrot Posted at 1-22 12:02
And, FWIW, I truly don't know what to expect of a manufacturer whose product no longer complies with ever-changing, sometimes unclear, most times different between regions, states and countries.

Yes, only here is it about adapting drones to the new regulations in Europe, which are in force from January 1, 2021, and not around the world, or in individual states in the US.
1-23 13:19
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DAFlys Posted at 1-10 00:46
Part of the issue is that the EU doesn't yet have a process to get classification, and they have already said that they will not allow retrospective certification.   For existing drones the only way to get classification is through a remanufacture process, which again is not available yet.  And will no doubt cost some money as youd have to send the drone back to the manufacturer for some work to be done.

From the EASA December Q&A > A. The market regulation in general does not allow to retrofit products already in the market. However the EU Commission recently finalised a procedure to allow the retrofit for drones. The procedure may only be activated by the drone manufacturer.
1-24 00:29
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DAFlys
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EmpieDrone Posted at 1-24 00:29
From the EASA December Q&A > A. The market regulation in general does not allow to retrofit products already in the market. However the EU Commission recently finalised a procedure to allow the retrofit for drones. The procedure may only be activated by the drone manufacturer.

Thats right,  its a remanufacture process so you would have to have a supplier that was willing to offer this and then you'd have to ship the drone back to the manufacturer. They have a powerpoint slide on the this.
1-24 01:40
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