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Audio Input Too Hot
349 20 2022-11-29
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Iancraig10
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Trying a whole series of lavaliers, I have found the audio input on the Action 3 a bit loud. Mostly ok but on peaks, there is some clipping. Could the input gain on the camera be lowered via a firmware update? Even better, an in-camera gain control in order to access a wider range of mics.

The only way to get around this is to use a mic with less sensitivity like the one I'm using in this video. Trouble is, being an on camera shotgun mic, it requires a cage with a coldshoe to mount it. (Which is why I want to use lavs) So it is a gain thing on the audio input side.


2022-11-29
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Fishycomics
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o Pro, you chosen to Lower the gain to 0 Db, if that is not g good get a gain control cable, DJI listens that is about all
2022-11-29
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Iancraig10
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Do you know of a gain control cable that works Fish?

I'm thinking that the camera has 'auto' gain so lowering it on the input side or using a mic with lower sensitivity might just cause its preamp to gain up more, causing a bit more noise. Not so noticeable on say, a motorbike, but not great for normal speech. Once the preamp in the camera is at maximum I guess then it could be controlled, but probably a lot of preamp noise.

I was wondering if the auto gain in the camera could be just backed off a bit so that it doesn't bypass zero on peaks. The better the mic, the more it shows because you get a lot more fast peaks in the audio wave form. Those are the ones, I think, that cause the peaking.

Might have to use a separate recorder, but it would be nice to be able to get clean(ish) audio into the camera.


2022-11-29
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johansenfoto
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When I get my OA3 back, I need to try it with my cheap lav-mic I bought from ebay since it is not too powerful like my new BOYA mic.

If only DJI could come out with a way to pull down mic input.
2022-11-29
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Iancraig10
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It must have an enthusiastic auto gain, so having a mic with less sensitivity will just cause the auto gain to go higher, bring those peaks back again and raising preamp noise in the process.  All they need to do is lower the level at which the audio gain is set internally. It can always be gained up in post and for action people, it wouldn’t notice that much if they did it anyway.
Cheaper mics tend not to produce such high peaks but it would be nice if we could get really good audio into the camera with better mics too.

Lav mics can be really sensitive and lively which could well cause problems with the A3 internal gain.
2022-11-29
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Fishycomics
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I have an older style on e, here is a Cable, ifits simple technology this will work, is like mine but I have a lot longer cable 1m

option will be yours

https://amzn.to/3iaystt

All DJI has to do is offer a High Med and low audio setting like Yi technology did they will not
2022-11-29
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Iancraig10
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Fishycomics Posted at 11-29 04:29
I have an older style on e, here is a Cable, ifits simple technology this will work, is like mine but I have a lot longer cable 1m

option will be yours

That looks great. Thanks. What concerns me is that lowering the gain from the mic side will force the camera preamp to work at maximum, which might cause noise. Perhaps I’ll try one because I could attach a nice posh mic then!

The gain must have been set internally, so it can’t be difficult to lower it surely? You are right, three settings would fix it.
This camera is right on the edge of being one of the best with a few tweaks. This one is pretty minor.
2022-11-29
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Montfrooij
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This is really annoying. I have the same with my Nikon D750.
I hope they will fix this (for you)
2022-11-29
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Iancraig10
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Montfrooij Posted at 11-29 04:49
This is really annoying. I have the same with my Nikon D750.
I hope they will fix this (for you)

The D750 audio input is too hot as well? Wow…… when are camera manufacturers going to wake up to decent audio?

I have a few mirrorless cameras, and the internal preamps aren’t the best.

But clipping is another lower level and it must be an easy fix on the Action!
2022-11-29
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Montfrooij
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Iancraig10 Posted at 11-29 04:56
The D750 audio input is too hot as well? Wow…… when are camera manufacturers going to wake up to decent audio?

I have a few mirrorless cameras, and the internal preamps aren’t the best.

I'm not sure what the issue is, but the D750 handles audio quite bad. Even with the internal mic, I often get clipping (at auto).
Something did not get the attention that was needed (or my camera was just bad, I don't know, but more people complain about this).
2022-11-29
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Iancraig10
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What a pity. Good optics as well, spoilt by poor audio. Sounds like a cheap preamp inside, probably to cut costs.

I'm guessing that you are getting distortion or something, but not in 'manual'? Normally with DSLR's the complaint is preamp hiss!


One solution that many use, is to have a shotgun mic with its own preamp so that a boosted signal goes into the camera, allowing you to get the 'in camera' gain right down. That way, the mic does most of the gain staging and cuts down the work for the camera. Even my Canons work 'fairly' well like this.


Unfortunately, there's no way you can do this with the Action! It would be fantastic for audio if there was.....
2022-11-29
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Fishycomics
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Yep no matter the mc the board makes the sound
2022-11-29
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lutzmix
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Smallrig W1-C
verry low output

wrong settings
must try it again
mic has 4 steps for noise reduction

2022-11-29
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Iancraig10
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If you normalise the audio, does hiss appear? The auto gain on the camera must be at max because on this recording, you’re way down below zero and it's not being boosted.
2022-11-30
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lutzmix
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Iancraig10 Posted at 11-30 00:03
If you normalise the audio, does hiss appear? The auto gain on the camera must be at max because on this recording, you’re way down below zero and it's not being boosted.

+20db is the max camera gain
2022-11-30
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Iancraig10
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Thanks. Yes, that’s why I’m wondering about the hiss levels. Preamps at the top of their range tend to be noisy. Especially cheap ones.

Now that the image appears better after the update, I might try a few mics out with it to see what happens….

It looks like it’s becoming a much more viable camera all round.
2022-11-30
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lutzmix
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smallrig wave  
the mic has 4 steps for noise canceling
rtfm
I will try it
2022-11-30
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AndyAusmAquarium
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thanks for information, Dude.
2022-11-30
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Iancraig10
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For good audio, the camera preamp needs to be right rather than adjust the mic. Otherwise the camera preamp is just working at maximum while the mic sorts the amount of input gain. Lowering the mic gain too much will give distortion free audio but probably more preamp noise from the camera.

Ideally, we want a low gain in the camera and a high gain in the mic.
2022-11-30
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lutzmix
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Kamera mic gain is now
-12db to +20db
2022-12-1
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Iancraig10
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Potential for lots of ‘pumping’ with such a wide variation. I made a video this morning and I did notice a little ‘pumping’ in the audio while I used a lavalier. It’s such a pity that DJI won’t allow us to set an internal input gain so that we can get a better match.

I just keep the lavalier away from me which kind of defeats the object of good audio. Dead giveaway if you mix Action footage with other cameras.
2022-12-1
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