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The max altitude Mess
1127 29 2023-11-3
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SpikeHuelva
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So I have a mini 3 pro. I also have sat the courses and have my licenses. I believe I understand the rules. All I want to do is fly from the bottom of a hill to film and photograph castles on the top. I will not be more than 120 m above the ground below the drone but I will be way more than 120 m above the ground at my take off point. At the moment my firmware allows this with a warning...and that is fine. But now DJI is going to impose a C0 version of the firmware. Of course I can not connect it to the internet but I suspect there is a ticking time bomb in there anyway. So how to future proof my drone against DJI making it unusable for me?  I have asked support and I received a nonsense reply.
2023-11-3
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SeehawerB
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Has anyone tried Profile -> Settings -> Notification and Privacy ->  Scroll down to Notifications -> Switch off?
2023-11-3
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digibud
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I think there's an auto update setting somewhere and if so, turn it off but yeah...ticking time bomb was a good anaology.  At some point you may be forced to update.
2023-11-3
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DJI Wanda
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Hello, there. Sorry for the inconvenience. May we know through which channel you contacted our support? About the question, we will consult with our teams first.
2023-11-3
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Bashy
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If you allow the app to update then you're also allowing the forced FW update when the time comes, its the app that does it.

BTW, you could already be too late and the app version that will initiate this is already installed. The way around that is to remove and install an earlier version, far easier when using the N1/2 RC but then it begs the question, which app version has the kill switch, god only knows (and DJI of course lol).

This is why i have not updated my Mini 3 Pro or app since erm, wow, not got a clue, beginning of the year sometime, but then I'm not affected either as I'm in the UK, but, it will come here too so.....
2023-11-3
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SeehawerB
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If anyone knows for sure which box to tick in the DJI RC to disable any updates and update notifications it would be appreciated to give us a hint.
I have F/W V01.00.0700 from september on the M3P and the V01.03.0600 on the RC and drawn a virtual freeze baseline on both devices, will not update any further. But that means to disable any future update and even the update notifications, I don't want to be pested by that anymore. So I want to switch that off. There has to be a possibillty to do so, I hope...
2023-11-4
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SpikeHuelva
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DJI Wanda Posted at 11-3 17:11
Hello, there. Sorry for the inconvenience. May we know through which channel you contacted our support? About the question, we will consult with our teams first.

Hello. I used Chat and then because my question was too complicated it was sent to support and Brendan answered. I have read the notice about how to remove the C0 sticker and change the software on the mini 4 pro and this also deals with the mini 3 pro. That is all OK. My question is that if under the support contract you send me another mini 3 pro as a replacement.....which you have had to do twice now under warranty.....then will that come with firmware limiting me to 120 m from take off point or can I downgrade the firmware to non C0 compliant? So long as there is a route to downgrade to non C0 compliant then the issue is fixed for me and many others.
2023-11-4
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Manitobahunter
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SeehawerB Posted at 11-4 02:57
If anyone knows for sure which box to tick in the DJI RC to disable any updates and update notifications it would be appreciated to give us a hint.
I have F/W V01.00.0700 from september on the M3P and the V01.03.0600 on the RC and drawn a virtual freeze baseline on both devices, will not update any further. But that means to disable any future update and even the update notifications, I don't want to be pested by that anymore. So I want to switch that off. There has to be a possibillty to do so, I hope...

Just turn off the wifi connection in it and it will never know there is an update.
2023-11-4
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SeehawerB
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... and your flight ststistics in your profile are coming to an end.

That cannot be the only solutions.
2023-11-5
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DJI Wanda
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SpikeHuelva Posted at 11-4 23:42
Hello. I used Chat and then because my question was too complicated it was sent to support and Brendan answered. I have read the notice about how to remove the C0 sticker and change the software on the mini 4 pro and this also deals with the mini 3 pro. That is all OK. My question is that if under the support contract you send me another mini 3 pro as a replacement.....which you have had to do twice now under warranty.....then will that come with firmware limiting me to 120 m from take off point or can I downgrade the firmware to non C0 compliant? So long as there is a route to downgrade to non C0 compliant then the issue is fixed for me and many others.

We recommend users stick to the local laws and regulations.
2023-11-6
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nikonya
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That was never the question but there are situations where 120m limit is honestly ridiculous, like flying somewhere in middle of nowhere where you are definitely not endangering anyone.
I know that DJI doesn't have a saying in EU regulations but I'm still hopping that this C0 opt-out would be possible also in the future, even for next versions.
2023-11-6
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SpikeHuelva
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DJI Wanda Posted at 11-6 01:14
We recommend users stick to the local laws and regulations.

The point is Wanda that DJI have a screwed up interpretation of the regulations. I bought the mini 3 pro with no C0 certificate. I have A1 A3 licenses. I am perfectly entitled to fly 120m above local ground as opposed to from take off point. If you do not understand that then think about flying up a hill from the bottom. The hill may be 300 m high. The 120 m above the ground below the drone allows you to fly up that hill. The DJI enforced 120 m above take off point prevents you doing that. So you guys coming up with 'We recommend users stick to local laws' is useless when you, DJI, are acting as the policeman and you, DJI, do not understand the laws.
2023-11-6
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SeehawerB
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You nailed it, thank you!
2023-11-6
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LV_Forestry
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SpikeHuelva Posted at 11-6 07:59
The point is Wanda that DJI have a screwed up interpretation of the regulations. I bought the mini 3 pro with no C0 certificate. I have A1 A3 licenses. I am perfectly entitled to fly 120m above local ground as opposed to from take off point. If you do not understand that then think about flying up a hill from the bottom. The hill may be 300 m high. The 120 m above the ground below the drone allows you to fly up that hill. The DJI enforced 120 m above take off point prevents you doing that. So you guys coming up with 'We recommend users stick to local laws' is useless when you, DJI, are acting as the policeman and you, DJI, do not understand the laws.

DJI enforces the law as it should. EU2019/945 requires manufacturers of class C0 drones to restrict them to a maximum height of 120m from the take-off point. That's all.

For over a year now, users of the mini series have been widely calling for the C0 label. And where were you?

DJI seems to have understood the problem because they offer the possibility of removing the C0 label thus being able to do 120m AGL instead of 120m from the take-off point. And it is announced that a C1 certification will be available.

What else do you want ?

Start by reading the law in detail, and then come back with solid arguments to say that DJI or else did not understand. Because at the moment the impression is that it's the grumpy people who haven't understood anything. Are you grumpy?
EUR-Lex - 32019R0945 - EN - EUR-Lex (europa.eu)
EUR-Lex - 32019R0947 - EN - EUR-Lex (europa.eu)

2023-11-6
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SpikeHuelva
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LV_Forestry Posted at 11-6 09:13
DJI enforces the law as it should. EU2019/945 requires manufacturers of class C0 drones to restrict them to a maximum height of 120m from the take-off point. That's all.

For over a year now, users of the mini series have been widely calling for the C0 label. And where were you?

Where is it announced that C1 will be available for the mini 3 pro?
I didn't buy a C0 drone.
I have read about how to downgrade from a C0 for product bought before 1.1.24, my question is about what happens with replacement drones....so for warranty or DJI care.
And yes I am grumpy. I took the classes, I follow the rules, I have A1 A3 A0 and all I want to do is follow the contour of the ground and stay within 120 of ground below the drone and that is being taken away from me.
2023-11-6
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LV_Forestry
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SpikeHuelva Posted at 11-6 11:03
Where is it announced that C1 will be available for the mini 3 pro?
I didn't buy a C0 drone.
I have read about how to downgrade from a C0 for product bought before 1.1.24, my question is about what happens with replacement drones....so for warranty or DJI care.

Well if you have A1 A3 A0 its a good things
1.png
This is for Mini 4 Pro.

For Mini 3 pro I haven't seen a statement from DJI, I would be surprised if the procedure is different.

In your case you received a drone without a label, so I don't even see where the problem is, what is certain is that A3 -> 120m AGL is good. And A1, article 20... legacy drone... ask your CAA to be sure.

2023-11-6
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primeshooter
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SeehawerB Posted at 11-5 01:38
... and your flight ststistics in your profile are coming to an end.

That cannot be the only solutions.

Why do you care about statistics being uploaded? Just fly the drone, take images, take video. Disable it all.
2023-11-7
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primeshooter
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SpikeHuelva Posted at 11-6 07:59
The point is Wanda that DJI have a screwed up interpretation of the regulations. I bought the mini 3 pro with no C0 certificate. I have A1 A3 licenses. I am perfectly entitled to fly 120m above local ground as opposed to from take off point. If you do not understand that then think about flying up a hill from the bottom. The hill may be 300 m high. The 120 m above the ground below the drone allows you to fly up that hill. The DJI enforced 120 m above take off point prevents you doing that. So you guys coming up with 'We recommend users stick to local laws' is useless when you, DJI, are acting as the policeman and you, DJI, do not understand the laws.

Yeah of course, and I'm with you but you've forgotten the other rules. Line of sight...which means, you will not be flying the drone more than say 200m absolute max from you  (and probably less with the new rules) so flying up a hill would by the second, not first rule you'd be breaking in that instance, technically speaking.

I don't agree with any of this, drones can be flown safely and effectively without all this nonsense but just stating fact.
2023-11-7
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SpikeHuelva
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primeshooter Posted at 11-7 04:56
Yeah of course, and I'm with you but you've forgotten the other rules. Line of sight...which means, you will not be flying the drone more than say 200m absolute max from you  (and probably less with the new rules) so flying up a hill would by the 2nd, not first rule you'd be breaking in that instance, technically speaking.

I don't agree with any of this, drones can be flown safely and effectively without all this nonsense but just stating fact.

Yes you are of course correct
2023-11-7
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SpikeHuelva
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LV_Forestry Posted at 11-6 11:12
Well if you have A1 A3 A0 its a good things
[view_image]
This is for Mini 4 Pro.

Well I had missed the C1, thanks for that
2023-11-7
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Bashy
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nikonya Posted at 11-6 02:13
That was never the question but there are situations where 120m limit is honestly ridiculous, like flying somewhere in middle of nowhere where you are definitely not endangering anyone.
I know that DJI doesn't have a saying in EU regulations but I'm still hopping that this C0 opt-out would be possible also in the future, even for next versions.

You evidently misunderstand the reason for the 120m law.

Being in the middle of nowhere does not mean there will be no manned aircraft as well.
2023-11-7
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LV_Forestry
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SpikeHuelva Posted at 11-7 05:37
Well I had missed the C1, thanks for that

I urge you to be careful with this information. This is an announcement from DJI. They changed their minds quickly without warning on other matters in the past.

Personally I would wait until this C1 is official and active before doing anything. Because let's be honest, 120m from the take-off point is not much more handicapping than 120AGL.
2023-11-7
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LV_Forestry
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Bashy Posted at 11-7 08:07
You evidently misunderstand the reason for the 120m law.

Being in the middle of nowhere does not mean there will be no manned aircraft as well.

Unfortunately there are a lot of people like that.
The example of Slovenia is well chosen because the airspace has some restricted areas starting from the ground + Zones that can be activated on NOTAMs.

Suffice it to say that you can come across anything in the air above 120m, especially in the middle of nowhere.


1.JPG
eAIS Package SLOVENIA (sloveniacontrol.si)

2.JPG
Geographical restrictions for UAS (caa.si)
2023-11-7
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The Saint
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Sorta off topic but years ago I warned the drone community in Europe (and even in the UK although this specific instance does not apply) to get control of your government and the rules else you'll eventually pay later for letting them run loose.  You think this is bad, wait until what is coming later!  Now is the time to get involved and not hammer on DJI for obeying what they perceive to be the laws but to take back control from your government who are dreaming up these stupid laws that not only don't make sense because they are unclear but also don't enhance safety at all.

I get it, you are not free in your country like we are here in America but you have to at least fight back else you deserve the government you get.  I understand because it's hard enough to motivate the American drone community to push back against the FAA and besides, flying a drone is not a right, it's a privilege.  But we are going down the wrong path in the wrong direction and things are about to get worse before they get better.  Now is the time to get involved because everyone starts to believe that drones are the enemy and the hobby is destroyed.
2023-11-7
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Sean-bumble-bee
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The Saint Posted at 11-7 08:45
Sorta off topic but years ago I warned the drone community in Europe (and even in the UK although this specific instance does not apply) to get control of your government and the rules else you'll eventually pay later for letting them run loose.  You think this is bad, wait until what is coming later!  Now is the time to get involved and not hammer on DJI for obeying what they perceive to be the laws but to take back control from your government who are dreaming up these stupid laws that not only don't make sense because they are unclear but also don't enhance safety at all.

I get it, you are not free in your country like we are here in America but you have to at least fight back else you deserve the government you get.  I understand because it's hard enough to motivate the American drone community to push back against the FAA and besides, flying a drone is not a right, it's a privilege.  But we are going down the wrong path in the wrong direction and things are about to get worse before they get better.  Now is the time to get involved because everyone starts to believe that drones are the enemy and the hobby is destroyed.

"you are not free in your country like we are here in America"

How are Americans any more free than folks across the pond?

You are supposed to comply with you laws just as Europeans are supposed to comply with theirs.
2023-11-7
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Bashy
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The Saint Posted at 11-7 08:45
Sorta off topic but years ago I warned the drone community in Europe (and even in the UK although this specific instance does not apply) to get control of your government and the rules else you'll eventually pay later for letting them run loose.  You think this is bad, wait until what is coming later!  Now is the time to get involved and not hammer on DJI for obeying what they perceive to be the laws but to take back control from your government who are dreaming up these stupid laws that not only don't make sense because they are unclear but also don't enhance safety at all.

I get it, you are not free in your country like we are here in America but you have to at least fight back else you deserve the government you get.  I understand because it's hard enough to motivate the American drone community to push back against the FAA and besides, flying a drone is not a right, it's a privilege.  But we are going down the wrong path in the wrong direction and things are about to get worse before they get better.  Now is the time to get involved because everyone starts to believe that drones are the enemy and the hobby is destroyed.

We did in the uk, we all had our say and hence the C classes of drone were removed so as not to follow the EU regs, and the legacy drone rules extended to Jan 26, the only problem there is, the CAA are now looking at the whole range of drone regs including sub 250g.

I do not know if the EASA did the same and gave the drone pilots a voice or not, but you say to get control of our governments, thats a joke, since when do we really have a say, what we want and what they do are 2 different things, i see you managed that just fine with your FAA, ah, nope, you failed too what with the RID an all that. Whilst the EASA and CAA are rather strict, the FAA are not far behind, there isn't much more you guys can do that we cannot. I mean, you have the 400ft and VLOS limits too.
2023-11-7
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The Saint
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Bashy Posted at 11-7 17:38
We did in the uk, we all had our say and hence the C classes of drone were removed so as not to follow the EU regs, and the legacy drone rules extended to Jan 26, the only problem there is, the CAA are now looking at the whole range of drone regs including sub 250g.

I do not know if the EASA did the same and gave the drone pilots a voice or not, but you say to get control of our governments, thats a joke, since when do we really have a say, what we want and what they do are 2 different things, i see you managed that just fine with your FAA, ah, nope, you failed too what with the RID an all that. Whilst the EASA and CAA are rather strict, the FAA are not far behind, there isn't much more you guys can do that we cannot. I mean, you have the 400ft and VLOS limits too.

keep pushing back; keep fighting
2023-11-7
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SeehawerB
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SeehawerB Posted at 11-3 10:34
Has anyone tried Profile -> Settings -> Notification and Privacy ->  Scroll down to Notifications -> Switch off?

According to another thread

https://forum.dji.com/forum.php? ... D776%26typeid%3D776

there is a new firmware update for the DJI RC remote. I just switched it on and let it rest for some minutes with active WiFi connection. No firmware update notification. So it might be that the disabling of notifications is a solution for making the M3P immune to future updates that may carry a 120m height restriction I do not want to have.
2023-11-16
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gnirtS
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Bashy Posted at 11-3 18:32
If you allow the app to update then you're also allowing the forced FW update when the time comes, its the app that does it.

BTW, you could already be too late and the app version that will initiate this is already installed. The way around that is to remove and install an earlier version, far easier when using the N1/2 RC but then it begs the question, which app version has the kill switch, god only knows (and DJI of course lol).

Fly App isnt a big issue for anyone using android.
APKMirror etc have every single version of the app to download so you can just go back a year or whatever to pick one.

Firmware is more sinister - it cant be undone.  Do not auto update firmware.

As the drone is basically feature complete now i really see no reason to update that ever again.
2023-11-18
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Bashy
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gnirtS Posted at 11-18 21:52
Fly App isnt a big issue for anyone using android.
APKMirror etc have every single version of the app to download so you can just go back a year or whatever to pick one.

Thats where the issue lies, knowing which one has the kill switch, having to go back too far could lose some functions
2023-11-19
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